Gap, Old Navy censor 'Christmas,'

[CTPinkPrincess]

That being said, I am completely confused by Oxfordcircus' comments. What do you mean there's no biblical warrant for celebrating the birth of Jesus? What about the birth narratives recounted in the Gospels? For me, Christmas is much more than an "nice, emotional time of year". While Easter is by far more important to the Christian story, there would be no resurrection without the birth. It is very important to understanding the trinity that most Christians uphold.

I'm sorry but I couldn't let that comment go unaddressed.

I believe what Oxfordcircus is trying to say is that the December 25 date for Christmas has no Scriptural basis, not that the birth of Jesus has no Scriptural basis (I apologize for the double negative).

IIRC, the date for Christmas has something to do with the pagan celebration for the Winter Solstice.

 

[photobob]

Along the same lines, I photographed some children for a Christmas card for an Institution that draws the majority of their funding from the State of Alabama. When I billed them (the Institution) they sent the invoice back to me and i had to remove the word Christmas from the invoice. They put a little bit of information about the institute on the back of the card so they say it is an informational card. Never mind that the children are working on Christmas ornaments on the front and has a Christmas Tree on the inside..

 

[Fitswimmer]

I believe what Oxfordcircus is trying to say is that the December 25 date for Christmas has no Scriptural basis, not that the birth of Jesus has no Scriptural basis (I apologize for the double negative).

IIRC, the date for Christmas has something to do with the pagan celebration for the Winter Solstice.

That's what I learned at my Catholic college anyway. The tree, the wreath and even the date are all from pagan rituals. That's why I say to towns-put up a tree, a menorah, a creche, candles for Kwanzaa and a Star and Crescent!! What a wonderful way to celebrate the diversity of the town!

 

[photobob]

From what I have learned the reason the Christmas date was chosen as December 25 is that it is shortly after the winter solstice the shortest amount of sunlight of the year. It's suppose to symbolize coming out of the dark and into the light..

 

[Disneyland1084]

 

[pansmermaidzlagoon]

Solstice: the reason for the season.....

well , the original one anyway!!!!

(saw the above on a cafe press t-shirt...couldn't help myself)

 

[LuvDuke]

December 5, 2006

Gap, Old Navy censor 'Christmas,' replace it with 'Holiday'

Gap, which owns Old Navy, Banana Republic, Forth & Towne and Piperlime, has become the latest politically correct retailer, intentionally censoring the use of "Christmas" in their in-store, online and printed advertising.

Instead of referring to the season as Christmas, Gap instead uses the word "holiday." As hard as we tried, AFA could not find a single instance in which Gap-owned stores use the term "Christmas." Not a single time!

When one Old Navy store manager was asked by AFA if the word Christmas was in his store, he answered, "We have a lot of Christmas gifts in our stores, but the word Christmas is not used here. Everything is 'holiday.'"

Gap wants you to do your Christmas shopping with them, but they don't want to mention the Reason for the season. Gap doesn't want to offend non-Christians by using Christmas. The fact that their censoring the use of Christmas might offend Christians seems to be of no importance.
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Pardon me while I find my checkbook.

If you don't like the Gap's policies, don't shop there. Start your own stores where it's all Jesus/Christmas all the time. End of story.

 

[Missy1961]

I totally agree with P&W's posts.

I don't really understand why saying "Happy Holidays" vs. "Merry Christmas" is such a big deal??? It just seems like the polite thing to do esp. when you have no idea what faith or no faith your customers in your store hold. If someone says "Happy holidays" to me, in my heart they are wishing me a wonderful holiday of my choosing, which happens to be Christmas. But my neighbor may not so she could "happy Holidays" to be a special wish for her own choice of holidays celebrated.

I feel the same way. Most people feel this way too.

 

[orljustin]

I dont know! It seems the secularization of at least the US has been going on for a while and each year they want to de-Christianize a little more. Take Christ out of Christmas? I, for one appreciate the work AFA (American Family Assoc) and the Catholic League are doing to at least keep these against Christmas honest.

Gerry

No one is against Christmas. "Happy Holidays" includes "Christmas".

The more secular the place is, the better off we'll be.

 

[oxfordcircus]

That being said, I am completely confused by Oxfordcircus' comments. What do you mean there's no biblical warrant for celebrating the birth of Jesus? What about the birth narratives recounted in the Gospels? For me, Christmas is much more than an "nice, emotional time of year". While Easter is by far more important to the Christian story, there would be no resurrection without the birth. It is very important to understanding the trinity that most Christians uphold.

I'm sorry but I couldn't let that comment go unaddressed.

The celebration of Christmas sheds no light on the mystery of the Trinity. Again, I celebrate Christmas, but not with the idea that I must do so to please God. I subscribe to the belief that Christmas is an invention of the church, a mere tradition without Biblical authority. My refusal to accept a church's contrivance doesn't harm my belief in the Trinity. I know the Christmas story, and yes there is a central truth therein (Christ if fully God and fully man), but this celebration we have bears little resemblance to that truth. Christmas is profane. I don't want it to be part of my theology. It's an earthly pleasure, and one that I enjoy on an emotional level only.

Here is a link on the subject. I'm not sure I agree with everything the author says, but an honest look at the Scriptures (which is the issue you've raised with me) as discussed in the link should make you at least question the importance of this holiday as it relates to one's faith. The Reformed view of Christmas

 

[basas]

Nope they are trying to capitalize off ANYONE who is willing to pay for their goods. Apparently, they have realized that there is also a market of people who are celebrating other holidays like Channuka (for example)

They are not removing Christ out of anything.

Except for the fact that some 90% of the shoppers are celebrating Christmas...

Similarily, about the same ammount would be shopping for Christmas gifts. I would think the store might be a little upset if everyone who celebrated Christmas decided to shop somewhere else.

You can dance around the fact, or try to be as PC as you want, but the numbers don't change. "Other religions" make up about 5% of the population. Sure you can have a few things that celebrate their religions too (nothing wrong with that), but the fact of the matter is that you aren't escaping Christmas if you live in North America so you might as well live with it. I assume with your thought process we should print all our signs in 200 languages too? After all...there are many other languages then just English (or even Spanish) being spoken in America and we wouldn't want to 'offend' them...

 

[basas]

I feel the same way. Most people feel this way too.

That's funny...everyone I know thinks it's ridiculous...especially when it's so incredibly "forced" and obviously censored. (ex: "Winter Celebration" Party. Dec 20. Dress up in winter colors!)

 

[oxfordcircus]

I believe what Oxfordcircus is trying to say is that the December 25 date for Christmas has no Scriptural basis, not that the birth of Jesus has no Scriptural basis (I apologize for the double negative).

IIRC, the date for Christmas has something to do with the pagan celebration for the Winter Solstice.

That's correct and thanks. I said there's "no scriptural basis for celebrating Jesus' birth." Not saying the Bible doesn't mention Christ's birth. It does - in 2 of the 4 gospels.

In the Old Testament, festivals were prescribed. The date, the length, the reason. There is no such Scriptural requirement, suggestion or otherwise regarding the celebration of Christ's birth. Some thinkers in the Reformation took the view that the church was allowed to celebrate only those holy days specified in Scripture. Others said as long as it's not forbidden, it's allowed. Calvin took the more narrow approach. There were lots of laws in Protestant lands that forbade observance of Christmas.

The view that we now have of Christmas is the creation of Charles Dickens married to Madison Avenue. That's fine with me. I'm not fighting it. But I'm not going to feel persecuted if people don't worship Christmas.

 

[oxfordcircus]

Except for the fact that some 90% of the shoppers are celebrating Christmas...

90% of Americans are Christian? Great!

More likely, American sentiment can be summed up thusly: "Aren't we forgetting the true meaning of Christmas? You know, the birth of Santa." Bart Simpson

 

[Bob Slydell]

Except for the fact that some 90% of the shoppers are celebrating Christmas...

How many of those 90% are simply celebrating the secular aspects of the holiday?

I still don't understand how a greeting that is supposed to be a friendly phrase is somehow ruining people's celebrations??

 

[pansmermaidzlagoon]

Except for the fact that some 90% of the shoppers are celebrating Christmas...

Similarily, about the same ammount would be shopping for Christmas gifts. I would think the store might be a little upset if everyone who celebrated Christmas decided to shop somewhere else.

You can dance around the fact, or try to be as PC as you want, but the numbers don't change. "Other religions" make up about 5% of the population. Sure you can have a few things that celebrate their religions too (nothing wrong with that), but the fact of the matter is that you aren't escaping Christmas if you live in North America so you might as well live with it. I assume with your thought process we should print all our signs in 200 languages too? After all...there are many other languages then just English (or even Spanish) being spoken in America and we wouldn't want to 'offend' them...

and of the 90% - how many are celebrating Christ's birth - and what percent are just putting up a tree and buying presents???

more importantly, what percentage thinks this is a big deal - and what percentage feels, as many Christians on this thread - that it is no big deal ..and it is better to be considerate of the other 10 %...

 

[pansmermaidzlagoon]

How many of those 90% are simply celebrating the secular aspects of the holiday?

I still don't understand how a greeting that is supposed to be a friendly phrase is somehow ruining people's celebrations??

we have to stop doing this - didn't we just post almost the same thought - at the same time over on the Cheney thread!!!!!

 

[DisneyGerry]

The more secular the place is, the better off we'll be.

In whose world? Perhaps a fun place--where secularism and relativism reign. Perhaps, this is the direction this country is heading toward.

But if there are repercussions for our actions with God/ a supreme being than this is not the direction we want to be heading toward.

 

[beachblanket]

The apparent DIS "PC" mindset on holidays:

And on that note, John Gibson was correct:

 

[beachblanket]

I feel the same way. Most people feel this way too.

Oh, really? I must have missed that Gallup study.