Galaxy's Edge Performance and Evolution Discussion

[monkeymostpurple]

One thought on the "it wasn't busy/I didn't see a lot of cast members" ... this was something I noticed last Friday when we were there in EEMH. The place was pretty quiet at 6 am (LOL, bear with me), and while there may have been a stormtrooper walking around, *we* didn't see one until after breakfast, when the park opened up to all guests for the day. As SWGE filled up, we headed elsewhere in HS for some FastPasses, and when we returned, GE was packed. And it also had a TON of cast members in roles. We saw everyone. Rey, Finn, Chewbacca, Kylo Ren, storm troopers all over the place. Interacted with all of them more than once.

So either they're managing this in relation to crowd control, or it's more active at certain times of day ... but this could definitely be seen as a problem if one doesn't encounter enough of this entertainment element in the X amount of time one spends in the land.

(My kids loved all of that interaction; personally, I preferred the quieter SWGE at the top of the day, and look forward to returning so we can experience the end of the day for the same peacefulness.)

 

[sponica]

@monkeymostpurple I guess it sort of makes sense that a spaceport would be more lively during the day....rather than at dawn. If we take this immersion to the nth degree. The wee hours of the morning would be a slower time; shopkeepers are just opening up, the local "law enforcement" wouldn't be out en masse maybe just a couple observers...

But I can see if one only went at a time when Batuu was quieter, one might think that it wasn't this immersive space port...

 

[yulilin3]

One thought on the "it wasn't busy/I didn't see a lot of cast members" ... this was something I noticed last Friday when we were there in EEMH. The place was pretty quiet at 6 am (LOL, bear with me), and while there may have been a stormtrooper walking around, *we* didn't see one until after breakfast, when the park opened up to all guests for the day. As SWGE filled up, we headed elsewhere in HS for some FastPasses, and when we returned, GE was packed. And it also had a TON of cast members in roles. We saw everyone. Rey, Finn, Chewbacca, Kylo Ren, storm troopers all over the place. Interacted with all of them more than once.

So either they're managing this in relation to crowd control, or it's more active at certain times of day ... but this could definitely be seen as a problem if one doesn't encounter enough of this entertainment element in the X amount of time one spends in the land.

(My kids loved all of that interaction; personally, I preferred the quieter SWGE at the top of the day, and look forward to returning so we can experience the end of the day for the same peacefulness.)

Again, just to clarify, Finn is not in SWGE, you probably saw a character attendance with Rey or chewie

 

[EmJ]

There is a LOT of things I've been thinking about regarding the land and why it isn't going bonkers in popularity compared to Harry Potter stuff.

If we ignore the Disney vs. Universal bit (and realize that the lead imagineer actually came from Universal and had already worked on Harry Potter), and focus on the stories from both, IMO Harry Potter had the easier goals. There were less locations, more interactivity and more nice "town" stuff to fill with familiar things. The interactive wand experience was also very easy for guests to do and was built on an existing type of system.


SW:GE had a much higher difficulty. Several things were working against them:

1.) No one set location or even one set time period
2.) Many parts of Star Wars were not bright and shiny, but old and "lived in"
3.) There was no pent up wait for a Star Wars attraction or merchandise...Disney's had a Star Wars attraction since 1987 and merchandise, including many of the same high quality stuff we see in SW:GE
4.) If we go by the current timeline, a lot of the original characters have passed on
5.) There's a wide disparity between what casual fans expect vs hardcore fans

I agree with all of this. Assuming (1) Disney’s goal was to upend Potter, (2) Disney did not achieve this goal (both of which I believe but others here do not), I’ve wondered multiple times whether this was the wrong IP for this type of attraction.

I’ve seen a lot of defenses of SWGE along the lines that Disney took on a Herculean task in bringing SW to life and that SWGE was NEVER going to satisfy the masses the way Potter did because of the location, story, generational, overexposure, and fan problems that Potter didn’t have. But then why did Disney base a billon dollar land on an IP that was destined to come up short? The answer to me is that everyone—Disney and theme park enthusiasts alike—initially just focused on the fact that SW has a massive fan base, and didn’t stop to consider whether the IP could actually be leveraged the same way as the Wizarding World. Hindsight, as they say, is 20/20.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

The force isn’t mentioned much because by this time, the Jedi have been wiped out for over 30 years. The Empire did an excellent job at rewriting history before it fell and many don’t believe in the force or if they do, they may believe the empires lies that the jedi attempted to overthrow Palpatine and so have no reason to talk about the force in a positive manner. Also, Batuu is a very out of the way planet, practically out of the outer rim. Batuu was never involved much in galatic events, until now, and many of its inhabitants have never left. There hasn’t been much exposure to the force there. Which also explains the Jedi academy. Currently, there are no Jedi that we know of except for Rey- if she even qualifies. Kylo killed or converted all the younglings before the events of Ep VII.

have you read the Black Spire Outpost book? It covers the land when Vi first got there - in it there is quite a bit of mention of the Force related to Savi's and people with him. And the rest of the population (including Oga) know Vi is wit the Resistance and are ok with her being there / have seen the bad part of the First Order, etc.

 

[yulilin3]

So the Kylo Ren arrival show thing isn't on a set schedule, but why not?

The Force isn't mentioned almost at all in the land, but why not?

R2D2 and C3P0 aren't walking/rolling around in the land....why not?

There's no set shows or Jedi academy style stuff in the land...why not?

There's no march of stormtroopers that used to be in the front of DHS (Then it was cancelled a few months ago)

I think they're way too tied to the timeframe of the land and that prevents a lot of fan favorites from showing up and how we get a relatively unknown like Hondo


I also don't know of another land where there's a resistance or rebellion that fans are a part of against a space-fascist regime as part of the "FUN"

I'll answer your question from what I have learned knowing people that work in the land and how they are trained
The "show" is an organic thing, Kylo arrives in Batuu and comes out and demands from his commander and troopers to find the rebel spy. Same way as the Tree of Life awakening is also done "at random"
Batuu and BSO is set between Episode VIII and IX, by this point the Jedi are almost extinct, the phrase hasn't been used in years int he SW Universe. You will hear some Batuuans use the phrase though
R2 and other droids should be walking rolling around, this was in the original plan but due to budget or Disney not wanting to crowd the area it's not happening. You can see R2 rolling inside the droid depot. As to C3PO probably the most uncomfortable suit to wear, very little mobility, having him walk around is impractical and unsafe for both the performer and guests. If you have ever seen the performers coming out from backstage areas for Star Wars a Galaxy Far Far Away show you see all of them but R2 and C3PO, they are just hard to navigate around.
No Jedi show again because BSO is not that type of outpost, most of the inhabitants want nothing to do with the First Order or the Rebels, they would rather just continue their day to day life.
as to your last comment....that's SW. Also the guest can decide which side they want to be in.

 

[only hope]

have you read the Black Spire Outpost book? It covers the land when Vi first got there - in it there is quite a bit of mention of the Force related to Savi's and people with him. And the rest of the population (including Oga) know Vi is wit the Resistance and are ok with her being there / have seen the bad part of the First Order, etc.

Yep, loved it. I may buy it someday. My impression was that Savi and his workers had far more knowledge of the force than most Batuu...people. What is the plural? Battuans? Having read the book both helps me enjoy BSO and at the same time leaves me feeling like BSO at HS is way too small and lacking in important things like actual streets with vehicle traffic, apartments, non-humans, a real, full size space port, many more marketplace stalls, local children, gold dust, the second sun, etc., not to mention the outlying rural communities and ancient ruins.

 

[ChrisFL]

I find it funny that SW:GE is very specific about the timeline being near episode 8-9, yet walk a few steps away to Star Tours and the whole timeline is completely at random.

 

[rteetz]

I find it funny that SW:GE is very specific about the timeline being near episode 8-9, yet walk a few steps away to Star Tours and the whole timeline is completely at random.

Star tours isn’t part of the land though and likely won’t stay long term as it is.

 

[fatmanatee]

Just as an FYI, to give a little background as to why I started this thread ....

In the main News thread on the News and Rumor board a lot of discussion was happening after they removed the Star Wars sounding names from the food items and just overall the idea of stripping out the immersion level in Galaxy's Edge and the reasons why. That led to larger discussions about who the land is appealing to - or not appealing to and how the immersion is adding to or detracting to guests.

And if we feel Disney had the right view of what this would appeal to - or at least who would like it vs who would be ok with it ... perhaps minimizing the 5 of people who would realy be actively turned off by it

I had similar similar discussions elsewhere so wanted to consolidate all of the chatter here (and, to be honest, try to keep it out of the News Thread as that is where people go for news and small thoughts on that news, not large side conversations)

So that is the goal - discuss how we think the land is doing for DISNEY ... is it appealing to as large a group as they expected? If not, why not? This is a new type of land for them, is it working? Why not? If they try to appeal to everyone will they win up appealing to no one?

So I think, focus more on what is happening and how Disney (and the Disney executives) are viewing it or what the average guest is experiencing (and would want to or not want to) more than what "if I was in charge this is what I would want to see"

Hope this helps ... I really do enjoy the discussion!

Heh, I missed the food discussion, in part because I was at GE last weekend, and I saw that some people got testy about it but I have to say I think I support the change. I had gotten the Ronto Wrap for lunch because it seemed to be the highlight of the land and would be quick to scarf down (result: very good) but I also took a look at the menu for Docking Bay and thought the item names were distracting, like just tell me that it's chicken or ribs or whatever. It's a small thing but it'll definitely speed up people's decision making process because they're looking for things they want (again, chicken, ribs, etc) instead of seeing something called "tip-yip" and having to read the smaller print to figure out what tip-yip is. As far as immersion goes, I don't think it matters here. From what I'm seeing now it looks like DL and WDW are doing it differently, with WDW switching to standard menu names? I guess they might be testing it out but I wouldn't be surprised if the WDW version ends up being more successful.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Heh, I missed the food discussion, in part because I was at GE last weekend, and I saw that some people got testy about it but I have to say I think I support the change. I had gotten the Ronto Wrap for lunch because it seemed to be the highlight of the land and would be quick to scarf down (result: very good) but I also took a look at the menu for Docking Bay and thought the item names were distracting, like just tell me that it's chicken or ribs or whatever. It's a small thing but it'll definitely speed up people's decision making process because they're looking for things they want (again, chicken, ribs, etc) instead of seeing something called "tip-yip" and having to read the smaller print to figure out what tip-yip is. As far as immersion goes, I don't think it matters here. From what I'm seeing now it looks like DL and WDW are doing it differently, with WDW switching to standard menu names? I guess they might be testing it out but I wouldn't be surprised if the WDW version ends up being more successful.

I think your take is very important and sort of getting at the different type of guests that are coming to the land. As you put it " it'll definitely speed up people's decision making process " - which is likely important to the average guest. But those that are there for the immersion I am sure have done ton of research and know what everything is - or want to take the time to understand what everything is. "speeding up" is not what they want

but that is the challenge of this being part of a larger experience/park and not something that has it's own entrance cost so only people really looking for what *it* provides are there (like at a ren faire)

 

[monkeymostpurple]

Again, just to clarify, Finn is not in SWGE, you probably saw a character attendance with Rey or chewie

Ah! Okay, didn't know that. It was a young black man maybe with Chewie? I don't remember. And my kids totally thought it was Finn!

 

[yulilin3]

Ah! Okay, didn't know that. It was a young black man maybe with Chewie? I don't remember. And my kids totally thought it was Finn!

No worries, you're not the first to think that.

 

[ksromack]

I'll answer your question from what I have learned knowing people that work in the land and how they are trained
The "show" is an organic thing, Kylo arrives in Batuu and comes out and demands from his commander and troopers to find the rebel spy. Same way as the Tree of Life awakening is also done "at random"
Batuu and BSO is set between Episode VIII and IX, by this point the Jedi are almost extinct, the phrase hasn't been used in years int he SW Universe. You will hear some Batuuans use the phrase though
R2 and other droids should be walking rolling around, this was in the original plan but due to budget or Disney not wanting to crowd the area it's not happening. You can see R2 rolling inside the droid depot. As to C3PO probably the most uncomfortable suit to wear, very little mobility, having him walk around is impractical and unsafe for both the performer and guests. If you have ever seen the performers coming out from backstage areas for Star Wars a Galaxy Far Far Away show you see all of them but R2 and C3PO, they are just hard to navigate around.
No Jedi show again because BSO is not that type of outpost, most of the inhabitants want nothing to do with the First Order or the Rebels, they would rather just continue their day to day life.
as to your last comment....that's SW. Also the guest can decide which side they want to be in.

In the very least I think an alien or two in the Cantina would go a long way to making it feel like you were part of the Star Wars universe. It seems doable. I've been to BSO 4 or 5 different days and have never seen Kylo Ren. I guess we were never there at the right time.

 

[Helvetica]

The launch of Galaxy's Edge reminds me a lot of the launch of the Sega Saturn. Everyone was expecting a September Launch because that's what they said previously, that's what they told all of their developers, and their retailers. Sega has their press conference at E3 in May of that year and they're like, by the way, you guys can get a Sega Saturn right now.

It didn't work out so well for Sega. They angered their developers who didn't have their games ready yet, they upset their retailers, they lost some toy stores who refused to stock their product, they upset gamers, and Sony undercut them in price by $100 for their first Playstation console.

Now this is a very different situation and I think Galaxy's Edge will be successful in the long run, but by opening it up so early they upset a lot of people. They upset the people who were planning to be there in the Winter when it was originally scheduled to open and they upset people like me who were planning to get in one last trip before Galaxy's Edge. People plan their trips many months, sometimes years in advance. Most people can't just go to Disney World on such short notice.

Galaxy's Edge could very well be there 30-50 years from now. I know it didn't perform as well as they had hoped, but these are also months where they were expecting to make zero dollars. We're also talking about a land that opened without their "E" Ticket ride. Galaxy's Edge isn't done.

I wasn't around for the launch, but from my experiences this past trip I think the changes so far have been very good. I ended up buying more stuff than I was expecting and I really had a good time.

- Overall thoughts on performance of the land: What is working, what isn't?

Millennium Falcon: Smuggle's Run

This ride is awesome. I'm not just talking my personal ride experience, but the ride itself moves a lot of people through the que and it does so very efficiently with little to no downtime. I went as a solo, so I rode with a lot of different groups and the people who I rode the ride with really enjoyed the experience. The kids especially. I imagine that when coworkers talk to me about their next trip to Disney World that they will be talking about this ride the same way they do with Flight of Passage and Soarin'.

The Droid Playground

Who ever thought of doing this was a genius. It wasn't there at launch, but a couple of mats made a world of difference for kids with their new toys. There where so many little ones playing with their new toys that it was really cool to see. Seeing a little girl hug her new BB-8 on the playground is really what it's all about.

Relaxing of Costume Rules

I know that when it was first announced, that they said people couldn't wear costumes or anything. The days I've been there, the rule hasn't really been enforced at all. One day I saw some parents dressed up as Jedi with their baby dressed as a Porg. Obviously, they presented the poor child to Chewie. The child was not impressed, but it made for fun photos.

Food

I have to say, Docking Bay 7 is my new favorite quick service at Hollywood Studios. Which may not be saying much since every other quick service at DHS is bad, but it's a lot of fun and the food is pretty good. I also like the blue milk, the coke product bottles are adorable (1 snack credit for those on the dining plan) and I've heard really good things about the Cantina. I still haven't been, but hopefully in the next couple of days.

Cast Members

The cast member interacts that I've had have been very fun. I like that they're letting them be playful and allowing them to play with the droids. They had a cast member with a droid outside the droid depot that should shoot at all of the guests and she'd scold it for shooting everyone. It was really cute.

Characters

I love the character interactions in Galaxy's Edge. The storm troopers have gotten pretty creative when I've been there. They were sneaking up on janitors and being silly / fun. I do think they need to have more Rey and Kylo. I'd also like to see some Darth Vader, Yoda, etc around once in a while.

Timeline

I don't think the timeline really works. Hondo is Clone Wars / Rebels, so before the original trilogy. Just make it a Legends timeline where anything can happen. Including a dance off between Luke Skywalker and Anakin Skywalker.


- Who is the audience for this land? How might reality differ from what Disney was expecting?

The new kids. This land is mostly geared towards the kids growing up with Star Wars right now.

However, I don't think Disney expected the crowd who grew up with the original trilogy to have such a negative reaction. I do think they could do a little more to bring them into the fold. Maybe somehow add Harrison Ford to the pre-show of Smugglers Run? I don't know, but they need to do something.


- Immersion: Is it something guests want? Is there too much/too little? Thoughts on the removal of the Star Wars names for the food?

It's certainly a balance that they have to play. Personally, I don't have a problem with them calling fried chicken, fried chicken. It's still prepared in a really playful way and I'll admit that I might not have tried it if the fake name was on top. I like to know what it is I'm eating.

Going forward, Galaxy's Edge is going to have to find its own identity. I think they should try to embrace the fun side of Star Wars as much as they can. I'd like to see a return of Star Wars Weekends and the silly song and dance things they used to do.


I also think that Hollywood Studios is on the brink of being incredible when the two new attractions go live. It's already pretty great.

 

[monkyby87]

I agree with all of this. Assuming (1) Disney’s goal was to upend Potter, (2) Disney did not achieve this goal (both of which I believe but others here do not), I’ve wondered multiple times whether this was the wrong IP for this type of attraction.

I’ve seen a lot of defenses of SWGE along the lines that Disney took on a Herculean task in bringing SW to life and that SWGE was NEVER going to satisfy the masses the way Potter did because of the location, story, generational, overexposure, and fan problems that Potter didn’t have. But then why did Disney base a billon dollar land on an IP that was destined to come up short? The answer to me is that everyone—Disney and theme park enthusiasts alike—initially just focused on the fact that SW has a massive fan base, and didn’t stop to consider whether the IP could actually be leveraged the same way as the Wizarding World. Hindsight, as they say, is 20/20.

While I think you're right in terms of Star Wars having a massive fan base, I also think they knew that they had this incredibly popular, and profitable, IP on their hands. It would be kind of foolish to not do something with it. That's more or less what Star Wars Weekends was; Disney trying to capitalize on Star Wars in whatever ways they can. Now that they own Star Wars, they can finally bring a permanent presence into the parks. I don't know if they were really trying to upend Harry Potter so much as just take advantage of Star Wars as much as they can. After all, there are current Star Wars movies and shows in the works for the future, so the cross-promotion works in their favor. I do think, though, that Harry Potter at Universal indicated to Disney that an immersive, encompassing land could make for an incredible experience as opposed to just a few rides put in.

I don't think Star Wars is the wrong IP, but Harry Potter does lend itself to this type of experience better than Star Wars. Not to mention HP has had several years to grow in the parks. SW:GE hasn't been open for more than 4 months really across the board.

 

[yulilin3]

Harry Potter at Universal indicated to Disney that an immersive, encompassing land could make for an incredible experience as opposed to just a few rides put in.

100% agree with this

Just to touch on the comparison in a couple of points: WWoHP also seems busier from the get go because they had 3 attractions, 1 experience and the land (walkable paths for guests) are tiny compared to SWGE. Also remember that Universal only had to build Forbidden Journey, Flight of Hippogriff and Dragon Challenge were repurposed attractions that were already there, (compared to 2 brand new attractions and on 2 experiences) not knowing exact numbers I can bet that if we put the crowds from SWGE during last weekend into either WWoHP land it would've been extremely packed.

 

[nancipants]

I also don't know of another land where there's a resistance or rebellion that fans are a part of against a space-fascist regime as part of the "FUN"

Well, Voldemort is basically a wizard fascist.

 

[tlmadden73]

100% agree with this

Just to touch on the comparison in a couple of points: WWoHP also seems busier from the get go because they had 3 attractions, 1 experience and the land (walkable paths for guests) are tiny compared to SWGE. Also remember that Universal only had to build Forbidden Journey, Flight of Hippogriff and Dragon Challenge were repurposed attractions that were already there, (compared to 2 brand new attractions and on 2 experiences) not knowing exact numbers I can bet that if we put the crowds from SWGE during last weekend into either WWoHP land it would've been extremely packed.

Good point. that is what got me about SWGE .. how HUGE it was .. how WIDE the pathways are. Such a stark contrast to Toy Story Land which has three rides, a SMALL restaurant and bathrooms all crammed next to a very narrow one way pathway.

I wonder if Disney would ever expand it? I guess the Star Wars Hotel technically does that, but that doesn't help for your normal park guest.

Star Wars Galaxy's Edge could use -- in the future -- another ride or a regular "show" (or shows) to make the land feel more.

While it was fun to go there with just MFSR, for the non-Star Wars crowd, the land needs more to appeal to the casual fan that just aren't going to do the "experiences" that make the land great (like Savi's, Droid Depot or Oga's .. especially since all three of those are very expensive and require reservations (except maybe the droid depot).

 

[ChrisFL]

I do think it's important to point out that our numbers for attendance are a bit skewed because potential guests can visit the land on either coast. Also, since there's no FP on Smuggler's Run yet, that wait time can't be compared directly to other attractions that have FP.