Frommer article full of WDW misinformation

[minnie61650]

Perhaps if this thread were filled with nothing but unbiased corrections, you might have a point, but it's not, it's filled with as much opinion and bias as the original piece except that she gets paid for her opinion while we do not.

As AV says, Disney is a big company and is fully capable of correcting the author if it feels it's needed. It's in their interest to do so. Yet Disney has said nothing. I wonder why?

Not that you shouldn't correct people when they are wrong, but this thread is 18 page of people acting like she spit in their faces. That's insane.

That may be true but I guess you think it is Ok to have a book published about WDW and not have your facts correct in an article about WDW but it is not OK to be DIS'ner posting on the rumors board and make a mistake and call Cinderella Castle Cinderella's Castle with an apostrophe S.

From this thread:
http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1556542&page=7

Well, to be fair, she bought it at a discount from her father in law a couple of years ago. Then She lowered the quality of the food and doubled the price and made it impossible to get reservations.

That's neither here nor there. Mortgage jokes aside, do you have an answer to the question?

It's not Cindarella's Castle. It's Cindarella Castle. It's an important difference and fundimental to understanding why Disneyland and Walt Disney World became cultural icons. And understandfing that directly leads to why the Value resorts, whether you like them or not, aren't very Disney in thought and motivation.

Just my 2 cents

 

[mking624]

We're not the only ones here being supposedly "biased." We're not the only ones here contributing to an "insanely" long thread. We're not the only ones here writing with so-called "hateful and bitter" attitudes (though some of us have managed to keep those attitudes contained to only one site). And Disney isn't the only group/corporation/what-have-you who is allowed to be professionally criticized.

 

[YoHo]

That may be true but I guess you think it is Ok to have a book published about WDW and not have your facts correct and even put a photo of the Matterhorn in an article about WDW but it is not OK to be DIS'ner posting on the rumors board and make a mistake and call Cinderella Castle Cinderella's Castle with an apostrophe S.

From this thread:
http://disboards.com/showthread.php?t=1556542&page=7



Just my 2 cents

I don't feel that I berated anyone in that post. I pointed out that it was incorrect and why I felt it was important.
Of course, this is a free and open community, you and I and anyone else here can have a discussion, sometimes heated in a reasonable (such as it is manner). That was not the case at the beginning of this thread. People were insulting someone for what they wrote and patting themselves on the back for doing so.
The "internal" discussion on the appropriateness of the responses in this thread is perfectly fine.

And mking624, There were 10 pages of invective on this topic before it moved to the rumors board. Most of it insulting, very little of it correction of facts.
I would like an example of bias, hate and bitterness in something I've written. I've taken a strong tone and I certainly have called out what I see as rather silly behavior, based on 8 years being a part of this board and based on my experience as a Disney fan and an observer of Disney fans.

It isn't hateful to point out the degenerative activities of a social group. Such as excessive criticism of a writer for having an opinion contrary to the group's. It's not bitterness when one makes a sociological observation of a group.


As for things being contained on one site. I didn't realize that that was relevant. I've only discussed this topics on websites that are open to all to view and all to register and contribute to.


I'll even go so far as to say the travel column's advice isn't all that great. That doesn't justify the vilification of the author that went on in this very thread and THAT is what I'm on about.

 

[minnie61650]

I don't feel that I berated anyone in that post. I pointed out that it was incorrect and why I felt it was important.
Of course, this is a free and open community, you and I and anyone else here can have a discussion, sometimes heated in a reasonable (such as it is manner).

I never implied that you berated anyone and I agree we can have a discussion. After all this is an open discussion Forum.

That was not the case at the beginning of this thread. People were insulting someone for what they wrote and patting themselves on the back for doing so.
The "internal" discussion on the appropriateness of the responses in this thread is perfectly fine.
And mking624, There were 10 pages of invective on this topic before it moved to the rumors board. Most of it insulting, very little of it correction of facts.

I thought it was moved here before ten pages but I am not sure. I read the first few posts and since I did not really feel the inaccuracies were a concern of mine one way or the other I did not comment.
I only commented after a few poster's started saying there was a lot of hate on this thread....

The sheer amount of hate in this thread is fascinating.

I would like an example of bias, hate and bitterness in something I've written. I've taken a strong tone and I certainly have called out what I see as rather silly behavior, based on 8 years being a part of this board and based on my experience as a Disney fan and an observer of Disney fans.

I did not say you wrote anything with bias, hate and/or bitterness.

It isn't hateful to point out the degenerative activities of a social group. Such as excessive criticism of a writer for having an opinion contrary to the group's.

The day I feel the need to email a tarvel writer because they were somewhat inaccurate about my favorite Multi-Billion Dollar international media conglomerate's overpriced multibillion dollar Themeparks that have been in constant decline and have changed from a fundimental part of our national identity to a laughing stock akin to crazy cat ladies is the day I eat a bullet.

I did not think the OP or the others who responded to this article were any more excessive with thier criticism in this thread of the article than you were in the above quote about "my favorite Multi-Billion Dollar international media conglomerate's overpriced multibillion dollar Themeparks that have been in constant decline and have changed from a fundimental part of our national identity to a laughing stock akin to crazy cat ladies ."

I only see different opinions on this thread. I did not see the hate in the posts that you and AV claim are there.

I'll even go so far as to say the travel column's advice isn't all that great.

I would even go so far as to say that once the travel column's advisor corrected her mistakes the article was quite good.

Just my 2 cents

 

[Gonz Of Lancashire]

but it is not OK to be DIS'ner posting on the rumors board and make a mistake and call Cinderella Castle Cinderella's Castle with an apostrophe S.

At least you spelt Cinderella correctly.

 

[KKB]

I wish I were one...this thread has gotten completely off topic.

Yet, here I am...

We all make mistakes...here on the threads we will make errors because this is a hobby for us (OK, obsession for some of us)

BUT if you are a journalist or author, it is your JOB to be sure your facts are right. And I appreciate the public who will hold the media accountable for accuracy...as said before, I don't think it is happening enough.

 

[mking624]

Ok, so posting about differences in opinion on this topic is considered insulting (which, since you have kept stressing the article was based on opinion, then your thoughts of our posts are merely opinion as well)...but going to another site and posting about this thread and labeling people as freaks is considered respectful?

So what if we keep discussing it? As I said, if it bothers you that much, you're more than welcome not to participate in it. No one is forcing you to keep contributing to a thread that you find insanely long (yet your posts contribute to the "longness" of it). And why does the opposing side never acknowledge the bias on their part? Why do they never acknowledge the times I have said the insults came our way too? Why are those ignored? And why is it only ok to point out the flaws & faults about Disney but when it comes to something else, we're jumped on? I wonder if you'd be this way to us if the topic was regarding our criticisms of Disney.....

 

[Another Voice]

Finally, the photo originally used in this article pictured the Matterhorn, a ride at Disneyland in Anaheim.

Unless the author took the photographs themselves, 98% of the time they have nothing to do with the illustrations that acompany an article. That is the responsibility of the magazine's layout group or the page designer for a website. There is no indication the Evil Author selected the 'Matterhorn' to go along with her article. I know fans are exempt from fact checking - but at least direct the remarks at the party responsible.

And will you post a correction as well?

And why is it only ok to point out the flaws & faults about Disney but when it comes to something else, we're jumped on?

Because it's one thing to smash and harass people like me on the internet, it another thing to take that same attitude out into the real world. Yes - it is permissable and proper and actually desirable to challenge any media about any report. But this went way overboard and feels like it's very close to "Crying Britney Spears Guy on YouTube" territory. People are hurling personal insults, demeaning entire companies because of the price of a hot dog?

Does no one else see how petty that is?

Yes, we hear all kinds of statements about protecting the innocent Disney novice from hate and wrong information. So now we're appointing ourselves Defenders of the Realm?

 

[minnie61650]

Unless the author took the photographs themselves, 98% of the time they have nothing to do with the illustrations that acompany an article. That is the responsibility of the magazine's layout group or the page designer for a website. There is no indication the Evil Author selected the 'Matterhorn' to go along with her article. I know fans are exempt from fact checking - but at least direct the remarks at the party responsible.

And will you post a correction as well?

I stand corrected and I will take responablity for my error.
Going back to delete remark about the photo.

Please,For the record I never called the author evil. I would never say that.
As I posted I never even cared about one the article one way or the other. I just cared about the fact that you and others brought the HATE word into this thread.

The author made some mistakes . She could hire a proof reader to catch them.

I do not have a proof reader.

Unless of course you would to be mine.

 

[YoHo]

minnie61650, the difference in the above is that Disney is a corporation and as a corporation it is a multibillion dollar company and it has seen a decline and it's reputation has changed from a fundimental part of Americana into a kiddy park and hangout for Disney Nerds.
That's a comment on perception. Not an insult to a person though some might take offense as they may see themselves cast in the role of Disney Nerd.
Certainly, a 10 page thread on how the evil author misconstrued everything about a week trip to Disney World could be considered Nerdish behavior. Certainly I am such a nerd.


AS for the mysterious other thread. If you take issue with it, then go over to that forum and take issue with it there. As I recall, the thread had moved into the hypothetical future of Disney fandom and was playing a bit for comedy at that point.

 

[minnie61650]

minnie61650,.....Certainly, a 10 page thread on how the evil author misconstrued everything about a week trip to Disney World could be considered Nerdish behavior. Certainly I am such a nerd.

.

I think the only ones calling the author EVIL are you and Another Voice.

If I am mistaken please refer to me the post where someone calls the author EVIL.

As I stated before I would never use the word evil to describe the author. Misinformed or mistaken maybe but never EVIL that is not a word I take lightly. I would save that word to describe a mass murderer maybe. Even then I usually describe them as mentally ill, or sick not EVIL.

JMHO

 

[minnie61650]

Unless the author took the photographs themselves, 98% of the time they have nothing to do with the illustrations that acompany an article. That is the responsibility of the magazine's layout group or the page designer for a website. There is no indication the Evil Author selected the 'Matterhorn' to go along with her article. I know fans are exempt from fact checking - but at least direct the remarks at the party responsible.

And will you post a correction as well?

I did post my correction. When I edited my post I posted my reason in the reason for editing box.

.... Yes - it is permissable and proper and actually desirable to challenge any media about any report. But this went way overboard ....
Does no one else see how petty that is?....

I think you are not getting the point.
You are the one who brought the words HATE and EVIL into this discussion.
Now to me that is going way overboard.
To me that is very petty!

Disclaimer: I have been a lurker and very occassionly have posted on the rumors board for the last 2 years.
I have always admirred the amount of knowleadge you and YoHo and few others share on this board and the "other" Forum.

I just fail to see the hate on this thread that you and YoHo see.

JMHO

 

[YoHo]

We're calling a spade a spade. Of course nobody said evil, or hate or anything like that. If nothing else, that would violate the TOS. That doesn't mean that those feelings didn't come out in what people did say.

Why should there be 10 pages of people caring about what amounts to some minor corrections? why should there be 10 pages of people disgruntled at her opinion.

It's fine that people saw the error and corrected, but 10 pages of commentary on that? That's not cool.

 

[minnie61650]

We're calling a spade a spade. Of course nobody said evil, or hate or anything like that. If nothing else, that would violate the TOS. That doesn't mean that those feelings didn't come out in what people did say.

Why should there be 10 pages of people caring about what amounts to some minor corrections? why should there be 10 pages of people disgruntled at her opinion.

It's fine that people saw the error and corrected, but 10 pages of commentary on that? That's not cool.

I sometimes forget you mostly post on the rumors board . You should see how many pages of discussions we get on the resorts board. Or theme parks board.
Not to even mention the refillable mugs thread about the new YOAMD mug and
those who like it and those who wish they still had the old mugs with the resort names on them.
This is a discussion forum and we do discuss all types of things.
The resort FAQ threads have dozens of pages on them.

Most of this thread was just discussion.
A few posters had some strong feelings but you and AV have also posted your strong feelings. Strong feelings for or against an article or a subject does not = Hate and EVIL.

JMHO

 

[YoHo]

Oh, I venture out to the rest of the Dis on occasion. Most of those threads show some of the same core issues that popped up in this thread though in different forms.

More often though, I look at those threads as a comentary on the Disney Company and if DISers want to go on for 20 pages on refillable mugs, that's fine and dandy, but this was a case of the real world, people who aren't obsessed with Disney intruding on us and that makes it a bit more interesting.

 

[mla973]

I just left MSN an email with my two cents on the article.

 

[snyderla]

Yikes, I didn't read all 19 pages of responses, just a few on this page. But I'm almost afraid to reply. Almost...
I was just going to write that it bothers me when people print things that I fear might steer people away from what could be an absolutely wonderful vacation. In 54 days I will go to WDW for my 18th trip and haven taken kids ages 7 mos, 18 mos, and on up to 67 years old. My advice would have been much different than his! For example, I find it ridiculous that he would recommend they travel all the way from OK and only buy 3 day park passes. (Which is not a good value at all.) But that is just the beginning of where my advice would have been different. The more I go, the more tricks I learn about how to have a wonderful time.
Lori

 

[YoHo]

Well, to be fair, she recommends 3 day passes and then offers other activities, SeaWorld and Universal to fill in the remaining days. Buying longer stay passes is only a better value if you think spending more time at Disney is worth it. She did not.

Of course a Disney fan would probably suggest differently. In fact, I'm sure 10 people would respond 10 different ways.

 

[tearawayface]

I like how her first piece of advice is that for $41 baucks a night they can camp out at Fort Wilderness..I hope they have a camper

Awful article just plain bad, to think that restuarants have to take reservations..I thought the idea of reservations was for more convenience, as in they will save me a seat when I want to eat...

 

[YoHo]

to think that restuarants have to take reservations..I thought the idea of reservations was for more convenience, as in they will save me a seat when I want to eat...

Well sure, but that assumes the reservation system works and is in line with the way people want to use your restaurant. Having to call up months in advance at 7am and be one of the first 100 callers isn't a convenience it's a hardship. A particularly urksome hardship. It's one thing if we're talking one or 2 particular locations, but the food plan has essentially rendered the walkup as impossible. Days now must be planned weeks or months in advance. THAT is a hardship and given the reduction in quality and the high prices, it's not a hardship that's worth enduring.