First Time Runners - No Proof of Time

[DOOM1001]

Wow some of the comments are crazy! I thought the WISH board was here to encourage each other! Instead some of the nasty elitist runner only attitudes are popping up. My husband and I are also doing dopey and we have only ran in 2 half marathons. I have no doubt we will finish( by walking, running or crawling) and OP I know you will do it too! Don't let all the negative voices that have been saying you'll never be able to do this, you have no business even attempting this and your insulting the sport of racing get in your head! Get a good training program and listen to what your body is saying and you will do great!!!

I know people who are in better shape than me who are either avoiding or putting off running a full marathon and the feeling I get from talking to them is that if they signed up for one and it takes them over 5:30 that instead of feeling like they accomplished a great feat they might feel disappointed in themselves,in my opinion they should just worry about finishing one first.26.2 miles is a long way,just finishing that distance is a true accomplishment,no matter how anyone feels about it.I did the Disney full last year in 5:59,I'm going to try for 5:30 in 2014 but even if I can knock off one minute and finish in 5:58 I'll be jumping for joy and proud.I talk to a whole lot of others who feel like they could never even finish it and aren't looking to try.I saw an old video of the first Disney marathon from 20 years ago and it looked like there were way fewer recreational runners like myself,way less females and overall just not as fun an event as what the Disney marathon is today.If instead of the varied 25,000 runners that run the race today it would be 13,000 runners mostly looking to finish at an 8 minute pace the event wouldn't appeal to anywhere as many people as it does today.

 

[John VN]

I find your statement here extremely insulting. You do realize only the top 20% of runners run 8:30s or less right? That there is a reason this is near boston qualification territory right? I can run a 5k at about an 8:00 to 8:15 pace right now. On flat I can run a half at about 8:45-9:00 pace and it took me a long time to get there. On hills I run about a 9:20-9:35 pace. I ran my last training run today for a flat half in 3 weeks. I ran a gentle 13.1 in 2:06 (9:36 pace) and it had 2000 feet of climb do you think I jogged that? Are you saying I'm walking or jogging? Who the hell are you kidding? I'm consistently in the top 30% of runners fort he last year! In triathlon my strongest leg is the running leg. In my half iron I had people I passed in the water finish their bike ride 30 minutes ahead of me for me to pass them on the run and complete 20-30 minutes ahead of them. That is how fast a 9:20 pace can be in the running world. I worked really damn hard starting with a 12:00 something pace when I first started running. I'm going to shell out a ton of money this year with a coach to try to 1 finish my first marathon this fall with rheumatoid arthritis, and then Qualify for Boston next year before my joints completely crap out on me. At my age bracket thats a sub 3:35 or roughly an 8:10 pace. That is insanely fast I will likely be in the top 15% of the field I finish in to qualify if I dont go out of my way to go to a race notorious for qualifiers. Furthermore that would put me in the elite category of runners in many races at that point. You do realize there is a reason most races have more corrals for runners over 10 minutes right? The average pace of a runner is about 10-11 minutes a mile. Many people run walk these days and keep a pace of 12-14 minutes a mile. Very few run a sub 9 let alone bellow an 8:30.

I am an almost 63 year old guy with bad knees, wrists, a shoulder that should be replaced and a neck I broke 2 years ago in a bicycle crash who just feels that for myself my running achievement will be when I can do as I stated. My point is that the OP might feel that a 11mpm pace for a half marathon will be HIS running goal and that is fine as for me it will not be fine unless I can make it at 8:30mpm or less, SUBJECTIVE.

The OP has not stated how fast he and DW wants to run, so NOBODY can say for sure they will fail.

BTW, 6 days after competing in a 70.3 triathlon on March 24, I went for a workout....mile 1 in 10:22 speed walking, mile 2 in 9:34 jogging, mile 3 in 9:07 jogging and mile 4 in 8:29 in a running stride. Had I not raced 70 miles on Sunday just 6 days earlier, I am sure I would have been faster.

As stated, I feel the OP will complete with proper training and pacing.

 

[JoeKir]

camandjacksmom: really appreciate the kind words!

roomthreeseventeen: totally understand what you're saying, and it would have been disrespectful of us not to learn etiquette before running Disney. Thankfully we posted here and that was brought to our attention. Don't worry though, we'll get some races in before next January

Bephus: Wasn't looking for sunshine and glad you posted. Everyone has brought good info to the table and we find it both encouraging and helpful. Growing up in school we didn't all get A's just cause we wanted them, so why should things change when we're adults? Honest feedback is very much appreciated and we thank you for it.

 

[heyitsmejosh]

posted in wrong thread lol

 

[dumbo_buddy]

JoeKir, i gotta say, you're taking all this feedback in a pretty awesome way. nice job. the DIS boards are a hunting ground for naysayers and poo-pooers and this thread "should" have turned really ugly a long time ago. way to go!

if only all of us (me included) could have such nice thread-posting manners.

as far as etiquette when running (or jogging or walking, whatever!) the disney races, disney provides a pretty good list of the dos and don'ts. unfortunately even with all of that you still get some people who don't pay attention to their surroundings. like, 4 people running side by side or people getting their water and then just chucking it off to the side and not realizing that someone is next to them (btw, thank god it was just a cup of water i got in my face back in jan!!).

do a couple races, get a better corral placement. good luck.

 

[JCH]

Wow some of the comments are crazy! I thought the WISH board was here to encourage each other! Instead some of the nasty elitist runner only attitudes are popping up. My husband and I are also doing dopey and we have only ran in 2 half marathons. I have no doubt we will finish( by walking, running or crawling) and OP I know you will do it too! Don't let all the negative voices that have been saying you'll never be able to do this, you have no business even attempting this and your insulting the sport of racing get in your head! Get a good training program and listen to what your body is saying and you will do great!!!

We do encourage each other. If this person were signed up for a half, or even just the full, we would all be very encouraging. I truly believe anyone can do a half marathon with training, and if you have the commitment, you can do a full. If they were signed up for a half, you wouldn't see a single negative comment. If you they singed up for a full, there would be a few "here's what you are in for" posts, but nothing saying they couldn't do it.

But Dopey is called Dopey for a reason! It is not meant to be a first race ever. It is not meant to be a first marathon. It is meant as a "challenge" to serious runners. I just can't bring myself to encourage something if you really aren't ready for it. I say the same thing when people go out on a half course with only 3 miles of training. It's just dangerous.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

We do encourage each other. If this person were signed up for a half, or even just the full, we would all be very encouraging. I truly believe anyone can do a half marathon with training, and if you have the commitment, you can do a full. If they were signed up for a half, you wouldn't see a single negative comment. If you they singed up for a full, there would be a few "here's what you are in for" posts, but nothing saying they couldn't do it.

But Dopey is called Dopey for a reason! It is not meant to be a first race ever. It is not meant to be a first marathon. It is meant as a "challenge" to serious runners. I just can't bring myself to encourage something if you really aren't ready for it. I say the same thing when people go out on a half course with only 3 miles of training. It's just dangerous.

This, 100%. I do realize by naysaying we are just driving this person further into thinking they can do it.

 

[DoctorK]

As an outsider, I think what's interesting is the OP's question was "should I submit a proof of time" and the responses were generally that he "needed to be told" that he shouldn't run the races, calling it an insult that he even registered and suggesting that he asked for sunshine to blown up his butt about his ability to complete the challenge.

 

[ironz]

JoeKir....I'm more positive towards your journey after reading that you, at least, have experience of being on your feet/skates with hockey officiating all day. Because my major concern for you guys is the adaptation your bodies will have to go through to get to a point of doing 4 races (2 of them long) in 4 days. I'm a slow RUNNER (all due respect to JohnVN, who I have met and I like the guy a lot---notice, his pacing goals/terms he says are for HIM...and I don't think he is meaning to sound judgy)....and for the unofficial Dopey last year I was out there running and walking for about 11 hours total, because a) I'm slow; and b) the heat and my mind got to me during the full. That is a long time on your feet.

Anyway...the major things I think you will need to keep in mind between now and next January are:
1---stay injury free. The risk of an overuse injury when building from little running to distance is a real concern.
2-- learn all you can about race nutrition. Figure out how is the most efficient way to get calories in your body for the long efforts so that you can maintain that effort and your GI system doesn't hate you. You need to figure out what gels and/or sports drinks your body tolerates, and manage your electrolytes.
3--race etiquette--been talked about in previous posts.
4---MENTAL training. This effort is not going to necessarily be a walk in the park, and despite Disney advertising, there is not magic every mile. It can be hard, and despite my long running and tri experience, I still struggle with the mental game. You will need to learn on your long runs what it will take you to overcome the mind games that can occur. What will you tell yourself when you just want to stop and lie down and go home in the middle of a run that is going bad? There will be bad days in training, and sometimes bad days in racing. Be prepared to battle the self-doubts, etc. It may not happen, but it isn't rare.

Carry on!

 

[John VN]

JoeKir....I'm more positive towards your journey after reading that you, at least, have experience of being on your feet/skates with hockey officiating all day. Because my major concern for you guys is the adaptation your bodies will have to go through to get to a point of doing 4 races (2 of them long) in 4 days. I'm a slow RUNNER (all due respect to JohnVN, who I have met and I like the guy a lot---notice, his pacing goals/terms he says are for HIM...and I don't think he is meaning to sound judgy)....and for the unofficial Dopey last year I was out there running and walking for about 11 hours total, because a) I'm slow; and b) the heat and my mind got to me during the full. That is a long time on your feet.

Anyway...the major things I think you will need to keep in mind between now and next January are:
1---stay injury free. The risk of an overuse injury when building from little running to distance is a real concern.
2-- learn all you can about race nutrition. Figure out how is the most efficient way to get calories in your body for the long efforts so that you can maintain that effort and your GI system doesn't hate you. You need to figure out what gels and/or sports drinks your body tolerates, and manage your electrolytes.
3--race etiquette--been talked about in previous posts.
4---MENTAL training. This effort is not going to necessarily be a walk in the park, and despite Disney advertising, there is not magic every mile. It can be hard, and despite my long running and tri experience, I still struggle with the mental game. You will need to learn on your long runs what it will take you to overcome the mind games that can occur. What will you tell yourself when you just want to stop and lie down and go home in the middle of a run that is going bad? There will be bad days in training, and sometimes bad days in racing. Be prepared to battle the self-doubts, etc. It may not happen, but it isn't rare.

Carry on!

Betsy, very well put. You are an inspiration for me and seeing you when I needed something extra was great. Thanks for understanding where I am coming from. We all have our goals and I am NOT being judgemental of others, just for myself with regards to my personal expectations.

Rock on and stay healthy.

McFlurry John

 

[ZellyB]

JoeKir, i gotta say, you're taking all this feedback in a pretty awesome way. nice job. the DIS boards are a hunting ground for naysayers and poo-pooers and this thread "should" have turned really ugly a long time ago. way to go!

I second this! It sounds like you are taking both sides of the advice group (you can do it/you are crazy) seriously and staying really positive. That's hard to do and I congratulate you. If that's any sign of your mental attitude then at least on that front, you are well-positioned for the challenge. Best of luck to you and your wife.

 

[zeltoo]

We will not be bowing out as we will be completing the race. We appreciate all the information we've gotten from this thread, but definitely want to apologize to some of the long time runners as we definitely get the vibe that we've offended them. We like to dream big and wanted to go big - we love Disney (obviously) and couldn't be more excited to get as much Disney in as we could. If the fact that we weren't going to make any excuses to not participate in a full 4 days of magic offended anyone, we're sorry.

From my standpoint, it's more of a concern than offense. I like to see tears of joy at the finish. Last year we were very nervous watching a friend cross the line and go directly to medical. They got the bling but boy I thought we were gonna lose a friend or at the very least have a long night. Know your limitations, continue to research training and racing strategies, and if you can't make it this year then next is ok too.

Train smart. Finish strong. Give Mickey a high five. Keep the thought of a Disney race a magical one.

 

[FFigawi]

We do encourage each other. If this person were signed up for a half, or even just the full, we would all be very encouraging. I truly believe anyone can do a half marathon with training, and if you have the commitment, you can do a full. If they were signed up for a half, you wouldn't see a single negative comment. If you they singed up for a full, there would be a few "here's what you are in for" posts, but nothing saying they couldn't do it.

But Dopey is called Dopey for a reason! It is not meant to be a first race ever. It is not meant to be a first marathon. It is meant as a "challenge" to serious runners. I just can't bring myself to encourage something if you really aren't ready for it. I say the same thing when people go out on a half course with only 3 miles of training. It's just dangerous.

Did I miss the text on the runDisney site where it said that Dopey is not for first-time marathoners? Or something in the OP where he said he wasn't serious? And just because he's a first timer, who are any of us to say he won't be ready by January? There's no rule that says you have to have run a certain number of 10k or halfs before you can sign up for a full. Running Goofy isn't really any harder than running a full, and I'm certain that with proper training, running Dopey won't be that difficult either.

 

[JoeKir]

dumbo_buddy: Thank you! We're definitely very committed to our goals and very grateful to have any feedback we can get!

JCH & roomthreeseventeen: It's ironic but yes, you are pushing us. Not into "thinking we can do it" - we know we'll complete the race. But pushing us into being realistic that it will not be easy, we will be tired, and we are going to have to work our butts off and be smart over the next 9 months.

ironz: very much appreciated advice. We've spent a lot of time researching nutrition for runs and are going to use the next few months to find what works for us. (BTW the hockey skates thing is nothing lol - I worked for 4 years at a hockey training facility where I would be on the ice for 80% of my day and my skates were always on. My current job has me on my feet walking all day long every day.)

ZellyB: we know that success is 90% mental and that a negative attitude can crush any dreams. We're definitely not going to let that happen!

zeltoo: we appreciate the concern and understand that most people aren't here to just talk us out of it without good reason. We're not brushing it off and are going to be listening to our bodies very closely!

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

Did I miss the text on the runDisney site where it said that Dopey is not for first-time marathoners? Or something in the OP where he said he wasn't serious? And just because he's a first timer, who are any of us to say he won't be ready by January? There's no rule that says you have to have run a certain number of 10k or halfs before you can sign up for a full. Running Goofy isn't really any harder than running a full, and I'm certain that with proper training, running Dopey won't be that difficult either.

While there is no requirement to sign up for Goofy or Dopey, at least people who aren't somewhat experienced in distance racing won't be in a real corral.

But I do think you vastly overestimate people's judgment as far as being able to wake up 4 days in a row at 2am, get the proper rest and do it over three times.

 

[swimfly]

... despite Disney advertising, there is not magic every mile.

Loved everything you said but this really caught my eye. I'm pretty sure Tinkerbell was following me with pixie dust the entire way.

While there is no requirement to sign up for Goofy or Dopey, at least people who aren't somewhat experienced in distance racing won't be in a real corral.

This is rude. What is a "real" corral? Just can't bite my tongue this time. I'm so sad that you would discourage anyone from setting a goal and making healthy progress towards it. I hope OP and his wife kick your uh-huh. Although, I have to say his responses here have been so classy and positive. Karma's a ....

 

[JCH]

Did I miss the text on the runDisney site where it said that Dopey is not for first-time marathoners? Or something in the OP where he said he wasn't serious? And just because he's a first timer, who are any of us to say he won't be ready by January? There's no rule that says you have to have run a certain number of 10k or halfs before you can sign up for a full. Running Goofy isn't really any harder than running a full, and I'm certain that with proper training, running Dopey won't be that difficult either.

I'm not saying that they can't do it. Knowing now that at least the OP is a hockey ref and has a little more experience being on his feet for long periods of time makes it seem a little less crazy. There may not be a place where it specifically says no newbies, but they have made a system where it is highly discouraged by needing proof of any time under 3:15 half or 6:30 full.

Besides, if Disney wanted newbies to attempt it, they would have a beginner training plan like they do for the half and full. The only training plan they even give is for experienced runner, implying that Disney does not anticipate new runners attempting the challenge.

 

[roomthreeseventeen]

This is rude. What is a "real" corral? Just can't bite my tongue this time. I'm so sad that you would discourage anyone from setting a goal and making healthy progress towards it. I hope OP and his wife kick your uh-huh. Although, I have to say his responses here have been so classy and positive. Karma's a ....

It is NOT rude to expect people doing the Dopey to have experience running. Sorry.

 

[JCH]

Loved everything you said but this really caught my eye. I'm pretty sure Tinkerbell was following me with pixie dust the entire way.



This is rude. What is a "real" corral? Just can't bite my tongue this time. I'm so sad that you would discourage anyone from setting a goal and making healthy progress towards it. I hope OP and his wife kick your uh-huh. Although, I have to say his responses here have been so classy and positive. Karma's a ....

By "real corral", I think she means a corral of your appropriate pace. The last corral is going to end up being a hodge podge of random paces of everyone who didn't get a proof of time. Anyone who has run a race at all will be in a corral based on their time, even if it is a 15 minute mile corral.

 

[swimfly]

The only training plan they even give is for experienced runner, implying that Disney does not anticipate new runners attempting the challenge.

I completely understand where you are coming from. It never occurred to me until I read the OP that a newbie would attempt the Goofy or Dopey. It did surprise me and likely surprised a lot of people which is why we see some rather strong reactions on this thread.