family restrooms?

[Hummingbird]

Try the flip side of this. My son was molested by a 10 year old boy at the age of 3. If my DH is not with us, DS who is now 6 goes into the restroom with me. Although he is a mature 6, we are a few years away from me letting him go into a mens room by himself. When he is with me, I go into the stall with him. If I have to go he goes into the stall next to me and must continually talk to me. I see nothing wrong with him going in there. No one knows my story but I dare someone to challange me about taking him in there.

I am so sorry for the ordeal you have faced and you're right no one knows your story and quite honestly if I saw a boy in the women's bathroom with his mom I would not say anything because I for one don't know their situation nor do I like confrontation and I would take my niece somewhere else or ask her can she hold it. I was simply pointing out that it can go both ways. No ones comfort is more important than the others to me however I do feel if there is a viable option such as companion restrooms that they should be utilized instead of taking a "I'm doing this so get over it" stance. I guess I just don't see why going to the companion restroom isn't what someone would choose rather than take the risk of impeding on someone else's privacy when they are in an area designated for them. What threads like this say to me is with there being so many visitors to a place like Disneyworld (many with disabilities, seen or unseen) maybe it would be beneficial to make more of the companion bathrooms. But then again you can not force people to use those either so I don't know I guess.

 

[AndreaA]

Whichever restroom and locker room they want? WTH? What a stupid, irresponsible law.

Well it specifically says, "those" (meaning transgender) students can pick which one they use. Since most transgender people are dressing like, acting like, and using a name associated with their non-biological gender, that seems like an AWFUL lot of work to go through just to use an opposite sex restroom.

I don't necessarily agree with allowing young children to transition, but if you're going to do it, then that law seems the only safe option. It would certainly be more dangerous for a person dressed as and acting as a girl to go into the boys' room just because their chromosomes are XY.

 

[itchin2go]

Whichever restroom and locker room they want? WTH? What a stupid, irresponsible law.

Another instance where one person's comfort is put above others.

I understand a "boy" who identifies as being a "girl" would be uncomfortable in the boy's locker room. But by the same token, there are probably many girls who would have a problem with that same person being in the girl's locker room.

It's a tough situation, but I don't think the quick fix is necessarily putting one person's comfort above others. I think you have to consider everyone's feelings. I don't know where that gets you.

And it's similar to how I feel in response to some of the previous posters who have proudly said they'll take their sons into any women's room and don't give a flying flip what/how anyone else thinks/feels about it ... putting one person's comfort above others.

 

[Hummingbird]

Also want to note I don't think I've seen anyone in the thread say they are not ok with the littles being in the women's room, they are talking about older boys. The OPs question is about a 9 year old boy.

 

[itchin2go]

Also want to note I don't think I've seen anyone in the thread say they are not ok with the littles being in the women's room, they are talking about older boys. The OPs question is about a 9 year old boy.

Yeah - it's hard to know where the cut off is, so I feel OP's pain (and understand her question). The older the boy is, the more uncomfortable it makes the situation for everyone else (including, quite possibly, the boy!).

 

[wilkeliza]

Whichever restroom and locker room they want? WTH? What a stupid, irresponsible law.

Another instance where one person's comfort is put above others.

I understand a "boy" who identifies as being a "girl" would be uncomfortable in the boy's locker room. But by the same token, there are probably many girls who would have a problem with that same person being in the girl's locker room.

It's a tough situation, but I don't think the quick fix is necessarily putting one person's comfort above others. I think you have to consider everyone's feelings. I don't know where that gets you.

And it's similar to how I feel in response to some of the previous posters who have proudly said they'll take their sons into any women's room and don't give a flying flip what/how anyone else thinks/feels about it ... putting one person's comfort above others.

The way the law was explained is over simplified. A transgender child or person doesn't "flip flop". They know they have the wrong parts and are actually the other gender. In situations in schools most children who are transgender and want to be respected as such at early ages live their every day lives as the opposite sex from what their body parts say. They don't not under any circumstance flip flop. If it is a woman to man transgender boy then that boy will always be a boy and will be kept to the same standards as a boy. They can't come dressed as a girl one day and a boy the next and swap as the please. Same for a boy to girl transgender. That little girl will have to follow the girl dress code for their school and be a girl at all times.

If someone "flip flops" they are actually called gender non-conforming and are not as adults allowed to use the same facilities as the opposite sex etc so if they are a gender non-conforming man dressed in a dress and pearls that day they still refer to themselves as a male and will go to the men's restroom. It is very complicated that is why a lot of bars and places here in NYC at least have 1 gender neutral bathroom. There is theater bar I've been to in NYC that all their bathrooms are gender neutral and all sexes share the sink area but there are only stalls with a toilet in urinal in each and floor to almost ceiling walls and doors so no peeking over.

 

[Crl1817]

I am so sorry for the ordeal you have faced and you're right no one knows your story and quite honestly if I saw a boy in the women's bathroom with his mom I would not say anything because I for one don't know their situation nor do I like confrontation and I would take my niece somewhere else or ask her can she hold it. I was simply pointing out that it can go both ways. No ones comfort is more important than the others to me however I do feel if there is a viable option such as companion restrooms that they should be utilized instead of taking a "I'm doing this so get over it" stance. I guess I just don't see why going to the companion restroom isn't what someone would choose rather than take the risk of impeding on someone else's privacy when they are in an area designated for them. What threads like this say to me is with there being so many visitors to a place like Disneyworld (many with disabilities, seen or unseen) maybe it would be beneficial to make more of the companion bathrooms. But then again you can not force people to use those either so I don't know I guess.

I think the problem here arises because there are posters on this thread asserting that the companion restrooms are ONLY for disabled use. A former CM has corrected this assertion, but people continue to make it. That leaves moms with boys with no option that satisfies everyone.

I think it is also likely many people don't know the companion restrooms exist at disney. We went in 2010 and I don't remember seeing them. (We had no need for them on that trip as dh was always able to take ds and dd was an infant.) I don't think they appear on the standard disney maps either.

Additionally, since people here are confused about what the signage on the restrooms means, it seems likely that people in real life are as well. I am familiar with that kind of signage as it appears on restrooms at restaurants in our area, but apparently it isn't common nationwide (and I've got no idea internationally)? So even if people see these restrooms, they may not understand from the signs that what disney describes as companion restrooms are for family use as well as disabled use.

 

[carmelhp]

I know that this won't satisfy the stubborn, but here goes, on a Disney owned site:

http://disneyparksmomspanel.disney.go.com/questions.aspx?pgm=2&pid=94&cid=97&qid=78340

 

[Altoqueenkelly]

The way the law was explained is over simplified. A transgender child or person doesn't "flip flop". They know they have the wrong parts and are actually the other gender. In situations in schools most children who are transgender and want to be respected as such at early ages live their every day lives as the opposite sex from what their body parts say. They don't not under any circumstance flip flop. If it is a woman to man transgender boy then that boy will always be a boy and will be kept to the same standards as a boy. They can't come dressed as a girl one day and a boy the next and swap as the please. Same for a boy to girl transgender. That little girl will have to follow the girl dress code for their school and be a girl at all times.

If someone "flip flops" they are actually called gender non-conforming and are not as adults allowed to use the same facilities as the opposite sex etc so if they are a gender non-conforming man dressed in a dress and pearls that day they still refer to themselves as a male and will go to the men's restroom. It is very complicated that is why a lot of bars and places here in NYC at least have 1 gender neutral bathroom. There is theater bar I've been to in NYC that all their bathrooms are gender neutral and all sexes share the sink area but there are only stalls with a toilet in urinal in each and floor to almost ceiling walls and doors so no peeking over.

 

[tinktinktink]

Considering there were disney and universal employees in the news tonight for inappropriate conduct I would keep my child with me as long as I felt like I needed to no matter what anyone thought. Safety comes first.

 

[wilkeliza]

I know that this won't satisfy the stubborn, but here goes, on a Disney owned site:

http://disneyparksmomspanel.disney.go.com/questions.aspx?pgm=2&pid=94&cid=97&qid=78340

I think it is hilarious that the dad pointed them to allears. He should have told them a list of these bathrooms is available at guest relations.

 

[wilkeliza]

Considering there were disney and universal employees in the news tonight for inappropriate conduct I would keep my child with me as long as I felt like I needed to no matter what anyone thought. Safety comes first.

Do you have a link to the news article? I can't find anything online about a recent report of a Universal or Disney employee being inappropriate.

 

[tinktinktink]

Do you have a link to the news article? I can't find anything online about a recent report of a Universal or Disney employee being inappropriate.

Wftv.com.
It didn't happen at the park. Employees were arrested in a child porn bust. And for going to a minors home for sexual misconduct. I think the boy was 13.

 

[dingleberry]

All this strife over taking a leak?

When I gotta go, I gotta go...doesn't matter who's around me. Jeez, go into the stall (even more private than our urinals!), relieve yourself, and get out of there. Why would anybody pay attention to anyone else in there? It's not a place to hang out.

All this 'rights to privacy' and 'infringing my rights' and 'making me uncomfortable' is so typical of our victim society. Buck up, people. It's a basic human function.

And it's ok to tell our little darlings to get over it once in a while in life. There's a little boy in the room? Great, now go into the stall where you can't see him, do your business, and let's go ride Peter Pan!

As for the 9 year old? Time for the men's room anyway. Or the sort-of-handicapped-somewhat-family-bathroom if you are not ready to let go yet.

 

[shepd]

If you have fears about the restroom (examples from this thread: Girls starting their first period, molested boys/girls), I hate to put it this way, but you would be considered the ones who aren't conforming to the usual standard level of washroom fear (whatever that may be).

That would mean that you should be using the companion restroom, since it is there for edge cases, not for the usual visitor. If you were to do so, you'd not need to fear anything, and more than that, the usual case at Disney (families with children that need to use the washroom) wouldn't have to worry so much. Mathematically, it only makes sense.

 

[itchin2go]

If you have fears about the restroom (examples from this thread: Girls starting their first period, molested boys/girls), I hate to put it this way, but you would be considered the ones who aren't conforming to the usual standard level of washroom fear (whatever that may be).

That would mean that you should be using the companion restroom, since it is there for edge cases, not for the usual visitor. If you were to do so, you'd not need to fear anything, and more than that, the usual case at Disney (families with children that need to use the washroom) wouldn't have to worry so much. Mathematically, it only makes sense.

Let me ask you this. What if a garden-variety woman feels uncomfortable with boys in the restroom?

I know there are people with other issues that have weighed in here, but what about regular women with no histories of abuse?

I don't think it's just a special type of person. Sure, there are some who will say, bring them on, it's a bodily function, we all do it, get over it. But by the same token, I think there are plenty that would rather not deal with boys in the ladies' room.

 

[Angel Ariel]

On the school situation, there are a couple of differences IME.

1. My son's schools have always been closed campus. Visitors are expected to report to the office, show id, sign in and wear a visitor's badge. Of course this system can be circumvented as we are talking about school personnel and buildings and not a highly secure prison. But there is some level of security.

There are incidents, too many sadly, where the perpetrators were school employees. The "security" you mention above does nothing to prevent those people from having access to a child. And that's not even counting the very many schools who do not have such protocols in place.

Please no one mistake me - I am in no way implying that teachers or school personnel are something to be afraid of in this regard. I'm just trying to point out the unfortunate truth that schools are not actually any safer than any other public place.

2. Children are sent to the restroom in pairs. They are not sent alone.

This hasn't been the case in any school I've taught in. And, regardless, as another PP had the horrible experience - sometimes the offender is another student.

The point of all of this is not to say schools are unsafe...just that they aren't any *more* safe than anywhere else.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Yes, but at least that girl's mother would be right there to help her. Apparently a boy in the same situation is supposed to tough it out on his own.

Because a dad would never be out with his daughter alone and run into a situation where she needed to use the restroom. Right.

That same daughter who was abused would be in the exact same situation as your child - either go into the ladies room by herself, or go into the men's room with her dad. I would expect the dad would have the same concern's about bringing her into the men's room, and the dad would also not be "right there to help her" if another mother took a son into the ladies room.

The same situation can happen to both boys and girls. But apparently girls are responsible for just sucking it up and dealing. I'm sorry, but that's not a message I want to send to my daughter.

 

[Angel Ariel]

Try the flip side of this. My son was molested by a 10 year old boy at the age of 3. If my DH is not with us, DS who is now 6 goes into the restroom with me. Although he is a mature 6, we are a few years away from me letting him go into a mens room by himself. When he is with me, I go into the stall with him. If I have to go he goes into the stall next to me and must continually talk to me. I see nothing wrong with him going in there. No one knows my story but I dare someone to challange me about taking him in there.

No one is talking about a 6 y/o boy here. We've been talking about 9-10 y/o boys. There's a big difference.

 

[Angel Ariel]

If you have fears about the restroom (examples from this thread: Girls starting their first period, molested boys/girls), I hate to put it this way, but you would be considered the ones who aren't conforming to the usual standard level of washroom fear (whatever that may be).

To be very clear...no one who was talking about periods here was talking about girls being scared to deal with it in a regular public restroom. No one mentioned fear in that scenario. Girls being embarrassed by their period when they first start getting it is *normal*. Adding a boy their age being nearby is what *could* take that embarrassment beyond the normal range.