Commercial renters almost always do choose studios. If someone wants to pay crazy high per point price for a 1BR or something I'm sure they will oblige. But they take studios at a significantly higher rate than the average member. If you don't believe that then I don't know what to tell you. There is a reason that most of the standing reservations up for rent from the commercial rentals are studios, they make the most money
Yep! And that was over a year ago.
I have surely rented a 2br, but most of the rentals I have done are studios.
Yes and no. I have seen people here struggle with page after page of inquiries on the rent/trade board, just to get $18pp on their OKW points that have $10 dues. Pages of handholding, availability requests, and deals not made. Might rather cut lawns.
When I had 18pts BW and 13 were very inconvenient for us to use, I poked into the RAT and found/booked a Mon & Tues night ~10 months (iirc) out. Waited until about 5 months out to list. It sat for a couple months. Plan B was lower to $350/nt if not sold before 2 month mark, but ended up selling 3 months out. $153 dues paid, $531 cleared. Broker tacked on another $5pp plus somewhere around $35 transaction fee. They cleared almost $120 on the 2 nights. I previously forgotten about that fee. Just looked and it sold at $45 per point, May 2024 9pt/nt.
Effort - Very Little: A couple minutes to fill a short form - name/contact info, res#, resort, price wanted. They called me to let me know the $pp was high. I confirmed yes, leave it, lol. A few months later I recv’d email, changed lead/guest names via chat, received payment via 2 electronic checks. Would you rather cut 10 lawns or take less than an hour total of your time to type a few times on a keyboard?
I don’t mean to harp what might seem like a unicorn rental. People are scoffing at $25pp rentals like it’s not reality. Tons of rentals are getting $30 to $40pp, even as high as $45pp.
For me and anyone else, there is no going back once you get your toes wet. Ease. Profit. I’ll look at the RAT and pluck the best current day(s) possible by their profit potential, with no regard if 2 days or Sept doesn’t cut it for me… I have the whole world to find a match. If I think something better’s possible, maybe even try waitlist.
The bigger point is pattern of use. This spec rental market exploded after being normalized post-covid. The main purpose of that activity is to find the highest profit margin bookings first, so you can sell them. On top of an already vibrant traditional rental market. If an owner holds many points and slamming spec rentals with yearly, how is someone going to defend it as personal use? I’m pretty sure DVC wants this junk gone yesterday. It doesn’t take much imagination to see the outsized impact that behavior brings to the system.
The thinking DVC applied in 2008 was 2 decades ago. Much has changed. Remember it is their sandbox. We discuss the finer points of the contract and individual examples, but doesn’t the entire contract matter? If one point is ambiguous, does it persist through the entire contract? And what else does the contract say?
DVC has been pushed to define how far rentals may go, and they left us to decide for ourselves after the reading the contract. Sounds to me like they want members to determine their own risk, and leave as much legal flexibility for themselves as possible. A slick way for DVC to continue holding the cards, because they have never come close to saying commercial use is allowed. It’s DVC’s sandbox. They get to run it.
Last year they said it ‘wasn’t widespread’. For all we know just another statement to protect themselves legally. What specifically was that regarding? Then try to define widespread
I never even thought about this - the fact the owners couldn’t see what was open to book before the online system was around.
Yep. Whenever I see a few days at a value or club room at AKV I grab them, then I have a hard time letting them go if I can't use them. It's tough
Did you pay your federal taxes? Both the California state tax and the rental tax each are 6% of the total amount so that’s $45 not the amount you got per point. And then of course pay your state income tax.Yes and no. I have seen people here struggle with page after page of inquiries on the rent/trade board, just to get $18pp on their OKW points that have $10 dues. Pages of handholding, availability requests, and deals not made. Might rather cut lawns.
When I had 18pts BW and 13 were very inconvenient for us to use, I poked into the RAT and found/booked a Mon & Tues night ~10 months (iirc) out. Waited until about 5 months out to list. It sat for a couple months. Plan B was lower to $350/nt if not sold before 2 month mark, but ended up selling 3 months out. $153 dues paid, $531 cleared. Broker tacked on another $5pp plus somewhere around $35 transaction fee. They cleared almost $120 on the 2 nights. I previously forgotten about that fee. Just looked and it sold at $45 per point, May 2024 9pt/nt.
Effort - Very Little: A couple minutes to fill a short form - name/contact info, res#, resort, price wanted. They called me to let me know the $pp was high. I confirmed yes, leave it, lol. A few months later I recv’d email, changed lead/guest names via chat, received payment via 2 electronic checks. Would you rather cut 10 lawns or take less than an hour total of your time to type a few times on a keyboard?
I don’t mean to harp what might seem like a unicorn rental. People are scoffing at $25pp rentals like it’s not reality. Tons of rentals are getting $30 to $40pp, even as high as $45pp.
For me and anyone else, there is no going back once you get your toes wet. Ease. Profit. I’ll look at the RAT and pluck the best current day(s) possible by their profit potential, with no regard if 2 days or Sept doesn’t cut it for me… I have the whole world to find a match. If I think something better’s possible, maybe even try waitlist.
The bigger point is pattern of use. This spec rental market exploded after being normalized post-covid. The main purpose of that activity is to find the highest profit margin bookings first, so you can sell them. On top of an already vibrant traditional rental market. If an owner holds many points and slamming spec rentals with yearly, how is someone going to defend it as personal use? I’m pretty sure DVC wants this junk gone yesterday. It doesn’t take much imagination to see the outsized impact that behavior brings to the system.
The thinking DVC applied in 2008 was 2 decades ago. Much has changed. Remember it is their sandbox. We discuss the finer points of the contract and individual examples, but doesn’t the entire contract matter? If one point is ambiguous, does it persist through the entire contract? And what else does the contract say?
DVC has been pushed to define how far rentals may go, and they left us to decide for ourselves after the reading the contract. Sounds to me like they want members to determine their own risk, and leave as much legal flexibility for themselves as possible. A slick way for DVC to continue holding the cards, because they have never come close to saying commercial use is allowed. It’s DVC’s sandbox. They get to run it.
Last year they said it ‘wasn’t widespread’. For all we know just another statement to protect themselves legally. What specifically was that regarding? Then try to define widespread
For someone to pay $30+ per point would suggest this individual is unaware of this site or any other DVC site where members openly and very publicly disclose a price per point FAR below $30. How is it such a person found a DVC owner to rent from but somehow missed the very forum DVC owners converse on?
For the dates that this works for, studios will be mostly unavailable right after the 11 month window for members renting their points on demand to go and book them. Their choice will be to pay $30 per point for a confirmed reservation for a studio or 18-20 per point on a 1BR which is around double the points as a studio. The studio at $30 per point is still cheaper than renting the 1BR still available (if there are any available) or a hotel room direct from Disney, so they take it. This doesn't work for all the seasons, just during the popular times at popular resorts with low point cost studios
When it comes to spec rentals: if they don't they are foolish, because studios have the largest gap between points cost and market rental rates.
Au contraire mon frere. Two points here.
I agree with you in principle, but where the rubber hits the road is if you limit it at say 400 points, some people will set up a few different entities that each have 350-399 points— Yes, there are a few giant entities, but there are dozens of people renting 1000-10,000 points a year in this manner who would be incentivized to find some shell owners if there are no rules below a certain threshold.
Honestly, given current technology they could probably scrape the major listing sites and social media pages and actually determine what people are trying to rent for with very limited human effort, that would be the most accurate—but I also think they could say that any rooms less than say 25 points per night cannot be spec rented, it would nip the problem in the bud if you can only change names on a confirmed reservation for the less profitable categories. By zeroing in on the area there is clear abuse, they could limit high profit rentals. Nobody is making $30/night renting 1Bed at most (all?) resorts.
I would be ok side, but the issue with this approach is that it’s very labor intensive for Disney.
I have seen people advertising rooms for such a high price that the cash side would be better as long as you had at least one of the discounts. Right now if you wanted to go this summer, it would be cheaper to buy an AP and get the AP rate for boardwalk and then rent some of the listings on the scalper sites.
I’m aware of the people who scalp reservations. But just like sites that scalp event tickets I won’t participate or give them my business. If I have to rent points, I’m either going to put them on the board below for 18- 20 a point or I’m going to list them on the board sponsor for $20 a point or less.
I'm either not a true die hard Disney fanatic or I'm too busy but either way, I've not once listened to Sorcerer Radio or have seen/heard of ANY DVC rental ads anywhere outside of this and one other forum.
