DVC eliminates perks for resale

[MommaBerd]

Newest part of this - yesterday resale agents were told any contracts submitted for ROFR before yesterday were grandfathered. Now late today, they went back on that and said the contract has to be closed before yesterday. Very unfair to those who signed a contract thinking they would be members with perks and now they are not. Not even getting a member card.

Just wow. Definitely a poor business tactic.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

Just wow. Definitely a poor business tactic.

It's just more to what I always harp on: the consumer - specifically the wdw consumer - is terrible.

They just keep
Buying no matter what they're sold/told. It's a broken model.

This should result in every person In contract discussions to back out - if only for the ticket incentives being pulled - every single one.
But I bet none of that happens.

 

[MommaBerd]

No - I'm sure none do. It is true that buying resale is STILL a better financial deal than buying direct. But, if I am buying DVC, I want to be IN THE CLUB. All of it is emotional, and when I'm welcomed home, I want to be a full member of the family, not the step-sister with no privileges. If it wasn't an emotional purchase of place AND perks, people would continue to rent hotel rooms!

I really foresee DVC resales being purchased more for rentals now. If there are no real benefits/perks to owning DVC (via resale), why would someone even purchase at all, except to rent and maybe take the occasional trip? The math doesn't really make sense otherwise.

And, the more who rent, the higher the risk of damages, which ultimately will impact all owners. I think Disney may have shot itself in the foot. DVC owners are some of THE best free advertisers of both Disney AND DVC. You make them disgruntled, and that is going to dry up. I just don't get it.

The only up-side I see to this is that the resale market dips, Disney massively exercises ROFR (because the cost has significantly decreased), thus Disney is able to reclaim more points to sell direct...at MUCH higher pp cost.

It is all just super-stinky!

 

[Ohana2011]

No - I'm sure none do. It is true that buying resale is STILL a better financial deal than buying direct. But, if I am buying DVC, I want to be IN THE CLUB. All of it is emotional, and when I'm welcomed home, I want to be a full member of the family, not the step-sister with no privileges. If it wasn't an emotional purchase of place AND perks, people would continue to rent hotel rooms!

I really foresee DVC resales being purchased more for rentals now. If there are no real benefits/perks to owning DVC (via resale), why would someone even purchase at all, except to rent and maybe take the occasional trip? The math doesn't really make sense otherwise.

And, the more who rent, the higher the risk of damages, which ultimately will impact all owners. I think Disney may have shot itself in the foot. DVC owners are some of THE best free advertisers of both Disney AND DVC. You make them disgruntled, and that is going to dry up. I just don't get it.

The only up-side I see to this is that the resale market dips, Disney massively exercises ROFR (because the cost has significantly decreased), thus Disney is able to reclaim more points to sell direct...at MUCH higher pp cost.

It is all just super-stinky!

Interesting point... Perhaps Disney is planning to go into the resale business after all??? Just thinking out loud.

 

[Heffalump2761]

When we bought into DVC in 1995 1 point cost approximately 0.36% of my annual salary. Today's price per point equates to approximately 0.26% of my annual salary.
Whilst rummaging around the other day I found my very first 7 day paper pass and the cost was approximately 1.26% of my annual salary. The current price for this years 14 day ulitmate pass is approximately 0.73% of my annual salary. Now I am based in the UK and appreciate we can get tickets not available in the US but last visit we bought 7 day MMW tickets with park hopper and they equated to 0.60% of my salary. Again may be the economy is different in the UK but we have still seen multiple serious down turns in our economy over the last 25 years and I also appreciate that when we visited the first time we were young and at the early stage of our careers and our salaries have increased over the years as our careers have developed but Disney is no more expensive now than it was when we first visited 24 years ago in terms of our spending power in fact for us it slightly cheaper. That said I do accept that the costs of a WDW stay can be quite eye watering and I agree that they are reducing what you get for your money which makes the decision as to whether to go as often or at all more questionable but in reality when making the investment all those years ago were the perks the deciding factor - no. Would the removal of the perks cause me to buy direct rather than resale absolutely not. Since we rarely use any of the perks apart from the odd discount in the stores and we used to use the valet parking at the Boardwalk then the removal of these would not even figure into my calculations.

 

[Eoghann]

I am in contract along with many others. Despite the fact that the contract was signed and presented to Disney before this announcement, realtors are advising those of us in contract limbo that we are not grandfathered in. We are plain old out of luck. We put in our bids on the premise we would recieve these benefits, now that most of us are contractually bound to the sale - we're done...

Was the contract executed? If so you have a legal case for breach of contract, but only if all parties have signed.

If they changed the terms after you bid a lawyer should either be able to get the original terms, or get you out of the contract.

Not a lawyer, but I am a subcontracts administrator so I deal with similar stuff a lot.

 

[Crystal824]

Newest part of this - yesterday resale agents were told any contracts submitted for ROFR before yesterday were grandfathered. Now late today, they went back on that and said the contract has to be closed before yesterday. Very unfair to those who signed a contract thinking they would be members with perks and now they are not. Not even getting a member card.

If i were in that situation having signed a contract but not closed, I would be furious. I would be demanding to get out out of the contract as I was not receiving the benefit of what I bargained for. The terms have changed. I think those people would have good cases. However, the cost of fighting it may not be worth it....really depends on the size of the contract.

 

[beer dave]

No - I'm sure none do. It is true that buying resale is STILL a better financial deal than buying direct. But, if I am buying DVC, I want to be IN THE CLUB. All of it is emotional, and when I'm welcomed home, I want to be a full member of the family, not the step-sister with no privileges. If it wasn't an emotional purchase of place AND perks, people would continue to rent hotel rooms!

I really foresee DVC resales being purchased more for rentals now. If there are no real benefits/perks to owning DVC (via resale), why would someone even purchase at all, except to rent and maybe take the occasional trip? The math doesn't really make sense otherwise.

And, the more who rent, the higher the risk of damages, which ultimately will impact all owners. I think Disney may have shot itself in the foot. DVC owners are some of THE best free advertisers of both Disney AND DVC. You make them disgruntled, and that is going to dry up. I just don't get it.

The only up-side I see to this is that the resale market dips, Disney massively exercises ROFR (because the cost has significantly decreased), thus Disney is able to reclaim more points to sell direct...at MUCH higher pp cost.

It is all just super-stinky!

I think the next step will be to exercise their right to clamp down on the rental side of ownership. Then things will really change.

I'm also not convinced that they want to get into the speculation market as far as the rofr goes... It seems fairly certain that they don't rofr anything that they don't have someone on the waitlist for. If you call your guide, I don't think there is ever any "available" contracts or points for the sold out resorts. They put you on a waitlist....

To me this seems like an opportunity for current members to receive access to the higher level of perks that are starting to come our way, as disney pumps them up to aid the sale of the new high priced contracts. And as I said before-- when the resale plummits because for one, the perks are gone, but mostly for two, when the commercial rentals are defined and shut down, I will be happy to buy some BLT at 60 per point.

 

[beer dave]

Was the contract executed? If so you have a legal case for breach of contract, but only if all parties have signed.

If they changed the terms after you bid a lawyer should either be able to get the original terms, or get you out of the contract.

Not a lawyer, but I am a subcontracts administrator so I deal with similar stuff a lot.

Unfortunately Disney has nothing to do with this contract (acknowledging you didn't say they did). It would be interesting because as far as the seller is concerned, they had no idea the product was going to change, and really are not at fault for the contract breach. The purchaser agreed to buy a product that has no guarantee of "perks".......so.....

 

[beer dave]

If you hadn't gotten around to it by now...I don't think you were gonna

On a side note...what happened to that clown that used to go on every DVC thread and put "haha...I do much better with my free dining than any of you DVC fools ever could!!!"

I miss him

So did you notice the thread that popped up shortly after you mentioned this? and who commented to bring it back? Must be his mom........

 

[lockedoutlogic]

So did you notice the thread that popped up shortly after you mentioned this? and who commented to bring it back? Must be his mom........

Nope...I don't care. A dude can only suffer so much fool, you know?

 

[manning]

I love quotes like this:
"We see this policy change as a very positive step to ensure that, going forward, our Members who purchase directly from Disney Vacation Club receive a premium advantage – in addition to all the magic that Disney has to offer," DVC said on its website."

Positive step for whom? I think they left out two little words...."for us". Because there are no positives flowing to the buyers. Some buyers (who buy direct), get exactly what they would have gotten before. So there are no positives there. Other buyers (who do not buy direct), will get less than before. So no positives there. When some buyers retain the status quo and other buyers lose benefits, it is impossible to say that this is a "very positive step" unless you are talking about yourself.

This news will have some very interesting side effects. It has to cause the indirect after-market pricing to go down. So now people will have an interesting choice: Get the perks at the higher price, or forego the perks at what promise to be even lower indirect prices. So the test will be: how much do people value the perks. My guess is that Disney will be surprised to learn that the answer to that question is...not very much. If I can pay $10 for something that comes with perks, or $8 for something that comes without perks, I will choose the perks. But when the lower price shifts down to $6, I will skip the perks and save my money. So will the lowering prices of the indirect after-market create a big enough gap to make them so attractive that this plan will backfire? Could be.

Whoever wrote this must be a politician. Very positive step...yeah right

 

[lockedoutlogic]

When we bought into DVC in 1995 1 point cost approximately 0.36% of my annual salary. Today's price per point equates to approximately 0.26% of my annual salary.
Whilst rummaging around the other day I found my very first 7 day paper pass and the cost was approximately 1.26% of my annual salary. The current price for this years 14 day ulitmate pass is approximately 0.73% of my annual salary. Now I am based in the UK and appreciate we can get tickets not available in the US but last visit we bought 7 day MMW tickets with park hopper and they equated to 0.60% of my salary. Again may be the economy is different in the UK but we have still seen multiple serious down turns in our economy over the last 25 years and I also appreciate that when we visited the first time we were young and at the early stage of our careers and our salaries have increased over the years as our careers have developed but Disney is no more expensive now than it was when we first visited 24 years ago in terms of our spending power in fact for us it slightly cheaper. That said I do accept that the costs of a WDW stay can be quite eye watering and I agree that they are reducing what you get for your money which makes the decision as to whether to go as often or at all more questionable but in reality when making the investment all those years ago were the perks the deciding factor - no. Would the removal of the perks cause me to buy direct rather than resale absolutely not. Since we rarely use any of the perks apart from the odd discount in the stores and we used to use the valet parking at the Boardwalk then the removal of these would not even figure into my calculations.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

When we bought into DVC in 1995 1 point cost approximately 0.36% of my annual salary. Today's price per point equates to approximately 0.26% of my annual salary.
Whilst rummaging around the other day I found my very first 7 day paper pass and the cost was approximately 1.26% of my annual salary. The current price for this years 14 day ulitmate pass is approximately 0.73% of my annual salary. Now I am based in the UK and appreciate we can get tickets not available in the US but last visit we bought 7 day MMW tickets with park hopper and they equated to 0.60% of my salary. Again may be the economy is different in the UK but we have still seen multiple serious down turns in our economy over the last 25 years and I also appreciate that when we visited the first time we were young and at the early stage of our careers and our salaries have increased over the years as our careers have developed but Disney is no more expensive now than it was when we first visited 24 years ago in terms of our spending power in fact for us it slightly cheaper. That said I do accept that the costs of a WDW stay can be quite eye watering and I agree that they are reducing what you get for your money which makes the decision as to whether to go as often or at all more questionable but in reality when making the investment all those years ago were the perks the deciding factor - no. Would the removal of the perks cause me to buy direct rather than resale absolutely not. Since we rarely use any of the perks apart from the odd discount in the stores and we used to use the valet parking at the Boardwalk then the removal of these would not even figure into my calculations.

That's a great analysis...

But here's one fundamental problem:
Americans don't get raises...so the math is more heavily skewed on this side of the pond.

 

[Ohana2011]

Was the contract executed? If so you have a legal case for breach of contract, but only if all parties have signed.

If they changed the terms after you bid a lawyer should either be able to get the original terms, or get you out of the contract.

Not a lawyer, but I am a subcontracts administrator so I deal with similar stuff a lot.

Was the contract executed? If so you have a legal case for breach of contract, but only if all parties have signed.

If they changed the terms after you bid a lawyer should either be able to get the original terms, or get you out of the contract.

Not a lawyer, but I am a subcontracts administrator so I deal with similar stuff a lot.

Thank you, Eoghann. My contract clearly states, "Do not purchase your Ownership Interest in reliance on your ability to transfer these products, services and Incidental Benefits." I guess at this point I need to know what Disney defined as Incidental Benefits as of 03/30/2016, when my contract was signed.

 

[cel_disney]

Thank you, Eoghann. My contract clearly states, "Do not purchase your Ownership Interest in reliance on your ability to transfer these products, services and Incidental Benefits." I guess at this point I need to know what Disney defined as Incidental Benefits as of 03/30/2016, when my contract was signed.

Interesting ...So - does this imply that your signed contract INCLUDED Incidental Benefits on the day it was signed?

 

[kristenrice]

I'm also not convinced that they want to get into the speculation market as far as the rofr goes... It seems fairly certain that they don't rofr anything that they don't have someone on the waitlist for. If you call your guide, I don't think there is ever any "available" contracts or points for the sold out resorts. They put you on a waitlist....

I wonder, though....currently, the only way to acquire one of the "sold-out" resorts is to buy resale. Certainly, DVD must know that there are many potential new buyers out there who want to own at one of these resorts and will only purchase if their preferred resort is available. Based on that, I would think that if resale prices "plummet", DVD would benefit from more aggressive ROFR in order to have a supply of over-priced points at ALL of the DVC resorts. If they wanted to reclaim points at the popular, sold-out resorts, I would think that resale prices would need to go UP in order to avoid ROFR. Of course, when they get too high, then people will realize that the price difference between resale and direct may be just small enough to justify the direct purchase in order to get the full membership benefits. At that point, DVD will have a nice stockpile of points that they acquired via ROFR at the lower prices and they could sell them to those willing to pay more for the direct benefits.

Another thought...many have mentioned that the menial perks (with the exception of the AP discount) are really not worth the extra cost. If I were to buy today, I would not even consider buying direct because it would take me over a decade to break even on the food and merchandise discounts, I don't plan my trips around "member-exclusive" events, I can get similar discounts with my Disney Visa, and I have no need for the exchange options. So, that leads me to wonder...now that they have restricted resales about as much as they can, what is the next step in making a direct purchase more appealing? Perhaps it is MORE benefits to new direct (and current) owners???

 

[Ohana2011]

Interesting ...So - does this imply that your signed contract INCLUDED Incidental Benefits on the day it was signed?

Good question!! I think it would with that verbiage.

 

[gatorskin76]

I feel like I found the land of logical thought processes. Not as much of that on some of the other sub forums on this topic.

 

[lockedoutlogic]

I feel like I found the land of logical thought processes. Not as much of that on some of the other sub forums on this topic.

Are the other primates throwing feces again?