Do you think animals go to heaven?

[CheshireVal]

I'll grant you, everyone DOES interpret the Bible differently. And while some things are open to interpretation, it also needs to be granted that some things are also MIS-interpreted. I believe the best interpretation of Scripture is Scripture itself. Sometimes literal (as written), and sometimes not (if symbolic or figurative). I don't ALWAYS use a literal interpretation.

As you state you're a Christian, I would be curious to know why you don't agree with the notion that one goes to hell if they haven't converted to Christianity at the time they die. However, I understand if you would rather not discuss as well, but I am nonetheless curious.

Well, again, this is one of the oldest theological problems/debates. We spent weeks discussing this very issue in a Religion class I took in college.

For me, personally, however... I don't believe my God would be that cruel or unfair. The God that I believe in can see the inherent goodness in people, whether they are Jewish or Buddhist or Hindi or what have you. I have a hard time believing that Jesus would send all those people to Hell, that's all. Especially since the Jews were, originally, God's chosen people.

 

[poohandwendy]

Sometimes literal (as written), and sometimes not (if symbolic or figurative). I don't ALWAYS use a literal interpretation.

I think the disagreement comes from the fact that many people have a different opinion of when the Bible should be taken literally (as written) or figuratively/symbolically? And then there is the problem with disagreement over translations throughout the years...

 

[binny]

the reason I say "most" things are open to interpretation in the Bible is because everything HAS been interpreted. Perhaps I should have said "Many" things are open to interpretation by people in the present time.


I do believe the Bible, dont get me wrong. Im a strong believer. I think that it is correct and shows the way we should live. I *do* believe though that some things are taken so literally by some people ( not anyone in particular) that maybe God meant as figurative or as an example for something else.


Just my opinion though

 

[binny]

LOL paw, GMTA

 

[poohandwendy]

LOL, Binny!

 

[numbersman]

Don't mind me... I'm just thinking out loud here...

I'm not a christian. Most of the bible makes no sense to me. Seriously, it's like it's written in riddle and no one knows what the heck it means. For the record, I have read it, cover to cover.

Saying that it makes sense to god, because it doesn't make sense to you... well, makes no sense.

You remind me of Vizzini from the Princess Bride though. I keep expecting you to say "inconcievable!"
Just teasin, heh.

I agree, the Bible is often quite difficult to understand, I don't understand it all, either! The verses I'm referring to when I say the above are these:

"For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways," declares the LORD. "As the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts." Isaiah 55:8-9

"Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out! Who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has been his counselor?" Romans 11:33-34

It doesn't SEEM to make sense to us, but we're not God, as the above verses show. That's all I was trying to say.

On a related note..."Hallo, my name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die!"

 

[numbersman]

Well, again, this is one of the oldest theological problems/debates. We spent weeks discussing this very issue in a Religion class I took in college.

For me, personally, however... I don't believe my God would be that cruel or unfair. The God that I believe in can see the inherent goodness in people, whether they are Jewish or Buddhist or Hindi or what have you. I have a hard time believing that Jesus would send all those people to Hell, that's all. Especially since the Jews were, originally, God's chosen people.

Interesting, but I figured that would be the case. In fact, just a few posts earlier, I said:

The number 1 argument people then make is to say "Well, I believe that God is a loving god, and wouldn't send people to hell if they don't have a chance." There are 2 flaws with that argument: (1) it doesn't matter what we believe, it matters what the Bible says (of course, I suppose this is only applicable if you believe the Bible, which many don't, but I'm speaking for myself here); and (2) Romans is pretty clear that ALL people are without excuse (with specific Scriptural exceptions for the 2 categories I stated above). So again, while it may not seem "fair" or "logical" to us, I believe it is so, b/c God said it.

Which is basically your argument in a nutshell. "Being good" doesn't get you to heaven, according to the Bible. Only accepting Jesus as your Savior does. So perhaps tied up in your reasoning as to why God wouldn't send people to hell is a misunderstanding of what actually allows people to go to heaven?

 

[imsorry]

Yes, I know animals go to Heaven. I am not getting into a big religious debate about it. They are there.

 

[numbersman]

I think the disagreement comes from the fact that many people have a different opinion of when the Bible should be taken literally (as written) or figuratively/symbolically? And then there is the problem with disagreement over translations throughout the years...

Agreed. However, this can largely be mitigated by comparing the interpretations to the Bible itself to see if they stack up, or if they cause conflicts with any other Scripture. As the Holy Bible is innerrant, any interpretation that causes a conflict by definition cannot be correct, so you can throw out many of the interpretations people use, if they don't hold up to all portions of the Bible.

As to the different translations, this can be entirely mitigated by going back to the original texts and studying any apparent issues. As the English language is a poor substitute for Greek/Hebrew/Aramic (example: "love" is but 1 word in English, but 4 in Greek, with 4 separate meanings!), a "translation" can often misconstrue the meaning, but the original text will never do so. And the great thing is you don't have to be an ancient language scholar to do so. There are great Bibles that have Greek/Hebrew keywords defined in their original meaning so you can investigate yourself without knowing the words or the language!

 

[annie1995]

Of course no one knows for sure. However, I believe they do and here's why. When my grandmother was dying of Colon Cancer she would sometimes lay in bed and would be talking to people who we all knew to have died already. Some were her family, others were just people she had worked with or known. One day though as I was watching over her she started rubbing her chest, almost like she was petting an animal, and I asked her what she was doing, and asked her if her chest hurt. She told me no that she was petting my kitty. Confused I asked her what kitty she was talking about. She told me she was petting my little white kitty "trouble". Well, Trouble had been dead for almost a year, and my Granny had only seen her a couple of times while visiting from Tennessee. Yet, there she was clear as day to her, laying on her chest and being petted. Later that night my granny passed away.

The only way I have to rationalize that is that she was already seeing the people that were waiting for her, and that's where my kitty was too. Waiting for her to come home. To some people it may sound a bit crazy, but that's why I believe.

Dana

That was a very touching story. I truely believe that our pets will see us in heaven. I have a kitty right now that was just diagnosed with 3 cancerous tumors. 2 of which cannot be removed. I know in my heart we are down to our last days or weeks with him, but while he is happy and comforatable, we will give him all the love we can until that sad day comes and we have to say goodbye. I know we will see him someday and he will be with his buddy that died last year.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

annie, I'm sorry to hear about your cat.

 

[CheshireVal]

Interesting, but I figured that would be the case. In fact, just a few posts earlier, I said:

Which is basically your argument in a nutshell. "Being good" doesn't get you to heaven, according to the Bible. Only accepting Jesus as your Savior does. So perhaps tied up in your reasoning as to why God wouldn't send people to hell is a misunderstanding of what actually allows people to go to heaven?

But that's the thing-- you say my logic is flawed, but it's not logic. It's a belief. I could just as easily say that *your* logic is flawed for taking the Bible so literally when so much of it is allegory, anyway.

Besides, there's also a verse (don't want to go pawing around my Bible to find it) where Jesus tells a man that the way to heaven is to "love your neighbor," etc and basically follow the rules set forth by the 10 Commandments.

Either way, you believe what you believe, I believe what I believe. I don't think it's your place to say which logic is right and which logic is wrong.

We'll all find out the truth, one way or another, in the end.

 

[goin2disneyagain]

Yes, I believe they do. I'm with Staci, I think they are far more deserving than most people.

I agree completely. If you believe humans go to Heaven how could you not believe animals go to Heaven too? If they didn't go to Heaven then where would they go? As poohandwendy stated, most are more deserving than humans are.

 

[Mermaid02]

My dog has a soul- I can see it in her eyes when she nuzzles up to my crying child to comfort him or when she gets unbelievably excited to see my daughter walk up the driveway after school. She loves us unconditionally- we take care of her basic needs (food, water and shelter) and in return she gives us much, much more. The heaven I'm going to will include animals- I hope to see you there!

 

[EltonJohn]

Do you think animals go to heaven?

No.

 

[BriarfoxinWA]

For me, personally, however... I don't believe my God would be that cruel or unfair. The God that I believe in can see the inherent goodness in people, whether they are Jewish or Buddhist or Hindi or what have you. I have a hard time believing that Jesus would send all those people to Hell, that's all. Especially since the Jews were, originally, God's chosen people.

I agree - I also have a hard time taking the Bible literally when it has been translated many times over the years and is basically a collection of various writings that may or may not have been done by the authors that they are credited to. Not to mention that various political and social climates throughout history could have a bearing on how these books were translated.

And YES I emphatically believe that my horses, dogs, guinea pig, gerbil and hampster have all gone to heaven because it wouldn't be heaven without them.

 

[goin2disneyagain]

My dog has a soul- I can see it in her eyes when she nuzzles up to my crying child to comfort him or when she gets unbelievably excited to see my daughter walk up the driveway after school. She loves us unconditionally- we take care of her basic needs (food, water and shelter) and in return she gives us much, much more. The heaven I'm going to will include animals- I hope to see you there!

Well put. If Heaven doesn't include animals then I don't want to go.

 

[DukeStreetKing]

You said you have many unanswered questions. Sounds like it's time to start seeking out the answers. Feel free to PM me, maybe I can help, or at least point you in the right direction!

numbersman, the questions I was referring to where questions such as who killed JFK, how did the world begin, etc, etc, not spiritual questions. But thanks for the offer to help, I appreciate it.

 

[alliecats]

But that's the thing-- you say my logic is flawed, but it's not logic. It's a belief. I could just as easily say that *your* logic is flawed for taking the Bible so literally when so much of it is allegory, anyway.

Besides, there's also a verse (don't want to go pawing around my Bible to find it) where Jesus tells a man that the way to heaven is to "love your neighbor," etc and basically follow the rules set forth by the 10 Commandments.

ITA.
Kinda like this one, Micah 6:8
What doth the Lord require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God?

 

[simba928]

I am not religious at all, but I do believe that if there is a heaven, animals would definitly be there. First off, they are more deserving than any human on this earth. You may argue with that, but when was the last time you saw a dog sin/break a law? When was the last time you saw a human sin/break a law? And second, I know for many of us, it would not be heaven without our beloved furbabies. I know it would be absolute torture for me if any one would say that I have to live without animals for the rest of eternity. That is my definition of H-E-double hockey sticks.

I was watching an old episode of 7th Heaven today. It was one of my favorites. An older couple called the reverand and asked him to sit with "Mom" while she died. When the reverand got to their house, he walked in and saw Mom, a beautiful older dog I wanna say a golden retriever or border collie mix or something like that. The couple asked him to take her to the vets to have her put down because they couldn't bear to do it. He took the dog to the vets, but he couldn't bear to bring her in, so he took Mom to a park that she loved to play in. The reverand sat with Mom all night at the park. Eventually, a yellow lab came up to them. This lab, Huck, was abused by his previous "owner" and Mom was the only dog Huck would go near. He refused to go near any humans. Huck sat with the reverand and Mom, who passed away shortly after Huck approached them. The reverand buried Mom in the park that she loved so much. The reverand brought Huck, who in some miracle trusted the reverand, back to the older couples house and asked them to take him in. They eventually agreed to it because they thought he was a gift from Mom. As the reverand walked away from their house, he looked up at the sky and they show a bunch of dogs running around chasing eachother in Heaven. And sure enough, there is Mom running along with the rest of the dogs. I never make it through the end without crying. It makes me think of my baby, Nakita, that passed away. She was the sweetest dog and died very suddenly. I sobbed through the whole episode because I kept glancing over at a picture of her. She truly deserves to be in heaven if there is such a place.

My dog has a soul- I can see it in her eyes when she nuzzles up to my crying child to comfort him or when she gets unbelievably excited to see my daughter walk up the driveway after school. She loves us unconditionally- we take care of her basic needs (food, water and shelter) and in return she gives us much, much more. The heaven I'm going to will include animals- I hope to see you there!

Isn't that so true. That reminded me of how my Nakita would come up to me when I was crying to make sure I was OK. I remember one time, shortly after my rabbit died, I was laying on my bed crying because I missed my rabbit. Nakita came over and got on my bed and licked me and layed with me. Jake, on the other hand, runs in the opposite direction when I cry. My grandma's dog, Smokey, just turned 16. Honestly, as much as I hate to say it, I can only imagine her living a few more monthes if we're lucky. I don't think she'll make summer. When I walk into my grandma's house, even though I'm not sure how well she can see, she starts to look around for me. Today, I was sitting in the chair and Smokey perked her head up as well as she could and looked at me. I grew up with her. My mom gave her to my grandma only a few monthes before I was born. It is going to be so weird going to my grandma's house without seeing Smokey laying on the ground looking for me. Even though I really didn't like her when I was younger, she deserves to go to heaven.

BTW, I love that story that Hiwaygal posted. And sorry this is so long. There are some days that I just miss my Nakita so much, even though she died about 5 1/2 years ago, and today was one of the hard days.