Disney World Genie+ No longer sold pre-arrival, subject to availability

[BrianL]

Disney doesn’t HAVE to do anything except make their shareholders happy. Just because you don’t consider it a luxury doesn’t mean that it isn’t. There is no decline in people going to Disney so there is no incentive to do anything differently. What they are doing is still wildly profitable.

The supply at Lv only meets the demand because it is priced outside of what most people can afford. You control demand with price - which is what Disney is doing with genie+ If Lv was only $100 they wouldn’t be able to keep up with supply.

You are right - they can control demand with price - except they are NOT doing that. Too many people are buying it and expecting to use it, and as I've said before, "If everyone has fast passes then nobody has fast pass." They are devaluing their own product.

Being wildly profitiable and not delivering on the experience will only last so long. It is working now to some extent, but many of us see it slipping down the wrong path. They will learn a hard lesson - again, actually as they've been here before. I am not advocating for lowering prices, I am advocating for making the experience better and more consistent for that admittedly high price.

 

[Marionnette]

Exactly. Disney has just been giving these people this very premium experience for free for years and now they’re mad.

No other theme park in America has a free fast pass system. And most are more than $15. This needs to be priced way higher. In fact, there needs to be some kind of level between genie+ and the vip tour.

People are mad because they are now being charged to access an inferior system. Had they just monetized FP+, left the 60- or 30-day advance booking and guaranteed that you could get at least 3 attractions for the money you spent, I believe you would not see nearly as much blowback as we see now.

Just raising the price so that fewer people buy it won't be enough. If they're going to charge more for it, people will expect a better product. Motel6 can't raise its rates to Four Seasons levels and expect that people will go for it. Disney has to improve how G+ works if they want to charge a premium price for it.

 

[lcmckenzie2022]

That’s not a fair analogy. Louis Vuitton is the commodity. Entering the park is the commodity. Entering Louis Vuitton is not the luxury. And no one is being forced to buy a LV bag or go to Disney

Louis Vuitton does not have unlimited product. They’re just priced so high that everyone that wants one can’t afford it. Which is the nature of a luxury item.

First, I find this really sad and depressing that we're saying a Disney World vacation is comparable to buying Louis Vuitton bags - if we've truly hit that point, then things really have hit a low with Disney. This is supposed to be a family vacation destination. Not a destination for the top 1% of society. The extensive expansion of the parks and everything within them and the countless hotels and resorts catering to DW means they need butts in seats...Just quickly looking (nothing scientific here), the % of people in the US earning a 6 figure salary (if this is what it takes to afford a Dis vacation) is only about 5.4% of the US population. The US population is around 329 million. The average yearly attendance to Disney World is around 58 million. 5.4% of this 329 million is around 17.8 million....So they'd still need 41 million more people to make up that yearly attendance mark. I get that DW gets international travel as well (myself included in that) - but the more DW expands and builds, the more people they will want to visit...so we're saying that only the top 5% of society should ever be able to afford to go? It just doesn't make sense. Also - in spending that kind of moola, it should be a seamless and positive experience. Not a frustrating and stressful and negative experience. When you buy a luxury item, to BrianL's point - ok use the Louis Vuitton bag again, sure - you expect it to be of high quality and for it to function. You don't expect to buy something of low quality, falling apart and not working - for that price tag.

I liked Fast Pass because it was a level playing field and everyone had the opportunity to use it if they wanted to use it.

 

[SeasonneRose]

People are mad because they are now being charged to access an inferior system. Had they just monetized FP+, left the 60- or 30-day advance booking and guaranteed that you could get at least 3 attractions for the money you spent, I believe you would not see nearly as much blowback as we see now.

Just raising the price so that fewer people buy it won't be enough. If they're going to charge more for it, people will expect a better product. Motel6 can't raise its rates to Four Seasons levels and expect that people will go for it. Disney has to improve how G+ works if they want to charge a premium price for it.

Sure they can if people continue to buy it. It’s only inferior if it’s not selling. You all are looking at this from your personal consumer perspective and not the business perspective. It’s making money. Too many people have it. That is the problem.

You control demand by raising prices. Genie+ will become more exclusive and more expensive. End of story.

 

[SeasonneRose]

First, I find this really sad and depressing that we're saying a Disney World vacation is comparable to buying Louis Vuitton bags - if we've truly hit that point, then things really have hit a low with Disney. This is supposed to be a family vacation destination. Not a destination for the top 1% of society. The extensive expansion of the parks and everything within them and the countless hotels and resorts catering to DW means they need butts in seats...Just quickly looking (nothing scientific here), the % of people in the US earning a 6 figure salary (if this is what it takes to afford a Dis vacation) is only about 5.4% of the US population. The US population is around 329 million. The average yearly attendance to Disney World is around 58 million. 5.4% of this 329 million is around 17.8 million....So they'd still need 41 million more people to make up that yearly attendance mark. I get that DW gets international travel as well (myself included in that) - but the more DW expands and builds, the more people they will want to visit...so we're saying that only the top 5% of society should ever be able to afford to go? It just doesn't make sense. Also - in spending that kind of moola, it should be a seamless and positive experience. Not a frustrating and stressful and negative experience. When you buy a luxury item, to BrianL's point - ok use the Louis Vuitton bag again, sure - you expect it to be of high quality and for it to function. You don't expect to buy something of low quality, falling apart and not working - for that price tag.

I liked Fast Pass because it was a level playing field and everyone had the opportunity to use it if they wanted to use it.

Disney has ALWAYS been a luxury. Go ask any inner city child if they’ve ever been to Disney. This was never for the masses or for families. It was for those who could afford it.

 

[BrianL]

Disneys ticket prices are not as expensive as many theme parks.
They are changing the price structure. Making it more exclusive with less people and then they can deliver better service.

Disney is absolutely one of the most expensive theme park offerings out there. Others do charge more for their "skip the line" features, but the base price is much lower, and I'd say rightfully so. The thing is, even with the ever increasing prices, Disney is NOT quelling demand - they have too many people wanting to go and experience everything - thus they need MORE to experince so that those those people, people willing to pay the price, can.

 

[BrianL]

Sure they can if people continue to buy it. It’s only inferior if it’s not selling. You all are looking at this from your personal consumer perspective and not the business perspective. It’s making money. Too many people have it. That is the problem.

You control demand by raising prices. Genie+ will become more exclusive and more expensive. End of story.

Okay, okay, full disclosure time - are you in fact Bob Chapek?

 

[SeasonneRose]

Disney tickets are like $109 to like $180. Universal is in the same range.

Disney is absolutely one of the most expensive theme park offerings out there. Others do charge more for their "skip the line" features, but the base price is much lower, and I'd say rightfully so. The thing is, even with the ever increasing prices, Disney is NOT quelling demand - they have too many people wanting to go and experience everything - thus they need MORE to experince so that those those people, people willing to pay the price, can.

 

[Jellybean9]

Disney World is way too expensive - WAY too expensive. The idea that it might be even more difficult and more expensive to get on rides going forward is a huge turn off. Why did I just drop thousands of dollars on tickets then…was that not good enough? and thousands on a Disney resort…and thousands on Disney food? I have to consider the ROI on our end, too. And I feel like this is getting out of control. I would cancel our upcoming 2023 trip if I didn’t already have a non refundable voucher for a dvc rental …but even then, my husband is urging me to just throw the voucher/$ away and forget about it so that we don’t have to drop any more money (the thousands and thousands and thousands more that Disney World requires). This is going to be our last trip if we do go. But I’m starting to want to just walk away from our voucher too… I can’t justify it anymore. It’s becoming too stressful in combo with too expensive. Not worth it anymore.

Like a lot of people here who have been saying something similar - I didn’t mind spending the money before because I knew we were taken care of at Disney World - from the magical express, to fast pass where we could for sure grab the handful of rides everyone wanted ahead of time, etc - it was all the little things that just made everything seem more like a seamless and positive experience. I just can’t believe that we’re all supposed to now be on our phones on the day of our vacation at 7am (when it is supposed to be a vacation) fighting each other like wild animals to get something - and for the rest of us who don’t? How do we walk away from that expensive trip feeling good about that? Not to mention - this is always an IT disaster!!!! When you have that # of people trying to do the same thing, it’s just going to crash.

I don’t know - maybe if fast pass had never existed, it be easier to look at the Regular line ups with a different lens…but I can’t now. I liked Fast Pass. It worked for us. It was part of the vacation planning - which is where this sort of thing needed to live.

Can someone please tell me what was wrong with Fast Pass that they needed to get rid of it and replace it with this horrible sounding system?? We went to DW in 2015, 2016, 2017 and 2018 and we never had a problem with it and it seemed to be working ok??

Go watch the Fastpass episode on the Defunctland YouTube channel. Fastpass was not perfect.

 

[Liquidice]

Customers who are paying for Genie+ are expecting a superior product to FP+. After all if you're paying for something, you expect it to be better than something that was "free" (I know it was never truly free, but it was included in your ticket, so all customers had access to the feature). That is why you're seeing lower customer satisfaction even when customers are getting a similar 2-3 rides per day on average, when FP+ used to guarantee 3 FP+'s per day.

The solution to this problem is to decrease supply of Genie+ to provide a better experience. While Disney could overall limit capacity at each park further through limiting of Park Passes, it does not seem like they have so far done that - at least not to the levels they would need to to improve guest experience in a significant way. It would be interesting to see what would happen if Disney raised the prices of tickets and reduced capacity to improve the guest experience, but I imagine this reduces the overall spend of each guest since running at or near capacity raises demand for food and merch and Disney is very focused on the total spend per guest.

This is a baby step imho if they really are going to limit Genie+ sales to lets say 30% of maximum capacity per day. If they don't properly limit sales of Genie+ then this is just a public relations move to try to give customers the idea that they're trying.

Lets take it at face value though and assume they really are trying to reduce the supply of Genie+ to create a better guest experience...

It will almost definitely result in an increase in price as well though because Disney certainly won't want to lose revenue as a result of reducing supply.

But hopefully it will also improve guest satisfaction for those who are buying it.

There is a balance they're trying to figure out.

 

[lcmckenzie2022]

Go watch the Fastpass episode on the Defunctland YouTube channel. Fastpass was not perfect.

Ooo cool! I will thank you! Just found it.

 

[afan]

Another challenge with FP+ was that it didn't take long for crafty individuals to learn how to game the system (won't bother with the details as it's not relevant anymore) so that enterprising individuals could access virtually unlimited FP+ (I was told by a VIP Tour guide how CMs figured it out first and it spread quickly, lol). Anyway, not sure if that's a reason why (aside from earning revenue), but this system certainly shut down the ability to game the system in the way the old one could be played (making it unfair for most guests who did not do that).

May not be unlimited and I've no idea what you are discussing since I never had to game the old system to get several fp in a day but there are still strategies on how to get more fp and what to do that most people aren't going to take the time to learn or do. No system is going to be perfect and people will always find ways to "game the system".

 

[Marionnette]

Sure they can if people continue to buy it. It’s only inferior if it’s not selling. You all are looking at this from your personal consumer perspective and not the business perspective. It’s making money. Too many people have it. That is the problem.

You control demand by raising prices. Genie+ will become more exclusive and more expensive. End of story.

So you feel that G+, in its current form, is a superior product to FP+ in its most recent form? If so, that's where you and I disagree. I thoroughly believe that if G+ had worked more like FP+, there would have been less criticism of the initial price tag. An inferior product can still be peddled to the masses when there is nothing else but that bad product to purchase.

If they were to market G+ as it is today and then a pricier G× that allowed pre-selection of 3 attractions (similar to how DAS currently works and how CL FP+ worked), which would you choose? I'm sure that there will always be people who choose the more affordable option. But for my money, I would welcome the ability to pre-select my ride times instead of fiddling with my phone every morning and intermittently during the day. I would pay more for that. In fact if they offered a G×+ that included one ILL$ per day (pre-selected), I would happily pay for that.

Dissatisfaction with G+ is not solely about the price tag. It has a lot more to do with the its clumsiness.

 

[BrianL]

So you feel that G+, in its current form, is a superior product to FP+ in its most recent form? If so, that's where you and I disagree. I thoroughly believe that if G+ had worked more like FP+, there would have been less criticism of the initial price tag. An inferior product can still be peddled to the masses when there is nothing else but that bad product to purchase.

If they were to market G+ as it is today and then a pricier G× that allowed pre-selection of 3 attractions (similar to how DAS currently works and how CL FP+ worked), which would you choose? I'm sure that there will always be people who choose the more affordable option. But for my money, I would welcome the ability to pre-select my ride times instead of fiddling with my phone every morning and intermittently during the day. I would pay more for that. In fact if they offered a G×+ that included one ILL$ per day (pre-selected), I would happily pay for that.

Dissatisfaction with G+ is not solely about the price tag. It has a lot more to do with the its clumsiness.

I agree with you, however there is still a pitfall to the FP+ system. Many of the most popular rides - 7DMT, FOP, - ran out very fast. So, if I'm someone who paid the money, logged on right at the start of my alotted window, and still couldn't get my most-wanted attractions, I might be a bit upset about that too. They still run into this problem because demand is just too dang high! More people want to do it than they can accommodate in a day, and I'm not sure that price increases will deter the rabid fanbase much.

 

[SeasonneRose]

So you feel that G+, in its current form, is a superior product to FP+ in its most recent form? If so, that's where you and I disagree. I thoroughly believe that if G+ had worked more like FP+, there would have been less criticism of the initial price tag. An inferior product can still be peddled to the masses when there is nothing else but that bad product to purchase.

If they were to market G+ as it is today and then a pricier G× that allowed pre-selection of 3 attractions (similar to how DAS currently works and how CL FP+ worked), which would you choose? I'm sure that there will always be people who choose the more affordable option. But for my money, I would welcome the ability to pre-select my ride times instead of fiddling with my phone every morning and intermittently during the day. I would pay more for that. In fact if they offered a G×+ that included one ILL$ per day (pre-selected), I would happily pay for that.

Dissatisfaction with G+ is not solely about the price tag. It has a lot more to do with the its clumsiness.

I didn’t say anything about FP. I’m assessing this from a business perspective. Others are assessing based on emotion.

Disney is going to do what they want to do. Period. They have no allegiance to anyone but their shareholders and as long as the product is selling expect it to stay.

There is no shortage of people going to WDW and there likely never will be. They don’t owe you or anyone else an affordable or more convenient option. This is a luxury service that you are not forced to purchase. If consumers don’t like what they are seeing then they have the option to spend their money elsewhere like any other product and service out there.

 

[SeasonneRose]

So you feel that G+, in its current form, is a superior product to FP+ in its most recent form? If so, that's where you and I disagree. I thoroughly believe that if G+ had worked more like FP+, there would have been less criticism of the initial price tag. An inferior product can still be peddled to the masses when there is nothing else but that bad product to purchase.

If they were to market G+ as it is today and then a pricier G× that allowed pre-selection of 3 attractions (similar to how DAS currently works and how CL FP+ worked), which would you choose? I'm sure that there will always be people who choose the more affordable option. But for my money, I would welcome the ability to pre-select my ride times instead of fiddling with my phone every morning and intermittently during the day. I would pay more for that. In fact if they offered a G×+ that included one ILL$ per day (pre-selected), I would happily pay for that.

Dissatisfaction with G+ is not solely about the price tag. It has a lot more to do with the its clumsiness.

I personally hope they make a blanket genie+ options over $50 per person. They need to limit demand. Too many people have it. Once demand for it goes down then it will function a lot better.

You control demand with price. Marketing 101.

 

[lcmckenzie2022]

I didn’t say anything about FP. I’m assessing this from a business perspective. Others are assessing based on emotion.

Disney is going to do what they want to do. Period. They have no allegiance to anyone but their shareholders and as long as the product is selling expect it to stay.

There is no shortage of people going to WDW and there likely never will be. They don’t owe you or anyone else an affordable or more convenient option. This is a luxury service that you are not forced to purchase. If consumers don’t like what they are seeing then they have the option to spend their money elsewhere like any other product and service out there.

Correction - we're assessing based on the customer experience perspective. And if you've ever worked for a corporation that has a product for the public, then you will know that customer experience is a HUGE part of things. It's incredibly important. Should not be making business decisions without factoring it in - the impact, the feedback, the perception, everything.

 

[SeasonneRose]

The customer perspective IS the emotional perspective.

Correction - we're assessing based on the customer experience perspective. And if you've ever worked for a corporation that has a product for the public, then you will know that customer experience is a HUGE part of things. It's incredibly important. Should not be making business decisions without factoring it in - the impact, the feedback, the perception, everything.

 

[SeasonneRose]

Correction - we're assessing based on the customer experience perspective. And if you've ever worked for a corporation that has a product for the public, then you will know that customer experience is a HUGE part of things. It's incredibly important. Should not be making business decisions without factoring it in - the impact, the feedback, the perception, everything.

They are factoring it in. Just for the people who will continue to buy genie+ after they increase the price. The service will be better for them when there are less people buying it.

Oh and offering it to deluxe guests is increasing satisfaction. For those guests.

 

[PalmettoPath]

May not be unlimited and I've no idea what you are discussing since I never had to game the old system to get several fp in a day but there are still strategies on how to get more fp and what to do that most people aren't going to take the time to learn or do. No system is going to be perfect and people will always find ways to "game the system".

Not several: approx. 9 - 12 FP+ per day 60 days out (depending on how much work you wanted to put into the creation and linking of shadow MDE accounts etc.). Anyway, it's ancient history now.