Disney’s Lakeshore Lodge Coming to former Reflections Site in 2027!

[TimbertopNJ]

Not sure if the Google numbers are accurate, but it looks like...
FTW campground (+ cabins) have around 1,200 lodging areas
WL has over 700
LL will have around 900

FTW survives on buses + boats, WL survives on buses + boats. AKL (~1300 units) survives on just buses.

I think LL transportation will be fine. It's not a capacity anomaly within WDW no matter how you shake it. And if a problem does arise, an additional boat probably resolves it. Seems like an easy fix to an unlikely theoretical problem.

Something to note: From 2013 to 2024, Disney World enlarged all 4 theme parks with minor hotel occupancy increases. PVB, CCV, Cabins & FTW replaced existing rooms (CC Cabins and Bungalows withstanding). Disney removed around 550 rooms at Caribbean Beach when they added Riviera (300 guest rooms).

At the end of 2024, we saw Island Tower add 268 rooms, essentially bringing total room totals in WDW back to their 2013 quantity (someone check my math if I missed something obvious).

The additional guest throughput from Lakeshore Lodge backfills years of park expansions. Any crowdedness we experience is simply from the Walt Disney company selling more tickets than they probably should, not from a sudden hotel-to-park imbalance. At least, that's how my brain processes that

 

[muppets3d]

Something to note: From 2013 to 2024, Disney World enlarged all 4 theme parks with minor hotel occupancy increases. PVB, CCV, Cabins & FTW replaced existing rooms (CC Cabins and Bungalows withstanding). Disney removed around 550 rooms at Caribbean Beach when they added Riviera (300 guest rooms).

At the end of 2024, we saw Island Tower add 268 rooms, essentially bringing total room totals in WDW back to their 2013 quantity (someone check my math if I missed something obvious).

The additional guest throughput from Lakeshore Lodge backfills years of park expansions. Any crowdedness we experience is simply from the Walt Disney company selling more tickets than they probably should, not from a sudden hotel-to-park imbalance. At least, that's how my brain processes that

The 3 bedroom at Riviera accommodates 12 guests, the rooms at Caribbean Beach accommodate 4 or 5 I guess. So how did actual beds change over this time? Obviously we know that many guests chose to stay offsite when they visit WDW, assuming they aren't locals in the first place. And hotel capacity in Orlando has exploded in the past 15 or so years around WDW I feel. I know a lot of the old motels on 192 have closed but tons of huge new hotels and resorts have opened.

 

[TimbertopNJ]

The 3 bedroom at Riviera accommodates 12 guests, the rooms at Caribbean Beach accommodate 4 or 5 I guess. So how did actual beds change over this time? Obviously we know that many guests chose to stay offsite when they visit WDW, assuming they aren't locals in the first place. And hotel capacity in Orlando has exploded in the past 15 or so years around WDW I feel. I know a lot of the old motels on 192 have closed but tons of huge new hotels and resorts have opened.

Good points; I don't know the actual occupancy numbers and their deltas. Is a grand villa always booked? Is it always max capacity? Those are important numbers that only Disney knows.

I have no idea how to estimate off-site guests, but you are definitely correct in your thinking.

My point, I suppose, is I don't see Lakeshore Lodge doing anything new to park capacity that's different from the previous 10 years. If anything, it's intent is to drive people from off-site to on-site.

 

[teamsamant]

Why does every new build in the last 20 years resemble an apartment complex with rooms that look like a corporate motel in a large city?

I have no intention of staying in these new rooms as long as the current regime continues to create bland hotels.

 

[DVCsloth]

It looks like Disney may be catering to their future customer base perceived preference of less themed resorts.
This resort seems to have the potential to be a pretty amazing resort, although it does seem out of place mostly because the size of it. Could be the possibility of a spa and several nice restaurants. Not that familiar with the details though.

 

[davidhr]

Why does every new build in the last 20 years resemble an apartment complex with rooms that look like a corporate motel in a large city?

I have no intention of staying in these new rooms as long as the current regime continues to create bland hotels.

The answer is always money.

 

[bama_ed]

It's ugly and ruined the majesty of nature that fort wilderness is, what a joke for NATURE

That statement deserves to be repeated ad infinitum.

 

[PolyRob]

I am also concerned about transportation, however adding this many more rooms is going to make the over crowding at the parks even worse. Where are all these people going to go? I know that Disney is building new attractions and lands, but that will only absorb some of the guests in the new rooms.

I think Disney is over built. I hate to say it, however here I go.

In the old days (pre covid) there were not nearly so many DVC resorts. The parks could get crowded, but it was at least tolerable. I almost never say wait times close to an hour. FastPass was free, food and merch was expensive, but tolerable. Everything seemed to look new and fresh. Rides and attractions did not break as often, or so it seems. You spent a lot of money, but it felt like you were getting something special in return. Disney was making money, lots of money. Middle Class families could go to Disney and not feel like they were financing the national debt.

Fast Forward to now. Disney has built a metric crap ton of new rooms. Every time you turn around you are paying for something that used to be free. Costs keep increasing at a rate that far out paces inflation. Executive Pay is astronomical. Rides and attractions go down at an alarming rate. The park looks very shabby around the edges. It is still clean, but things really show their age. Middle Class is getting shut out. Disney is still making money, lots and lots of money, but there seems to be no end of their greed. Costs to us is going up, return is going down. Execs making More, CM's barely keeping even.

LL is just the latest example of this.

Ok rant over. I will still go to Disney. I admit it. However I have really changed how I approach a Disney Vacation.

Onsite guests make up only a small portion of WDW daily visitors. Disney naturally tries to convert more guests into staying on property by offering various "perks." DVC is essentially a more affordable path to deluxe accommodations.

I don’t think anyone sees this giant new building and imagines it will inspire a surge of visitors craving "wilderness" themed immersion. Disney is focused on converting existing guests into onsite guests and keeping those rooms filled.

I completely agree about the nickel and diming post 2020 though. It's gotten much worse while service has gone down.

It's no larger than some other WDW resorts, and they are already building a new dock. I am confident there will be at least one boat added to the Bay Lake routes.

Exactly. Will LL hold more than each All Star? Maybe it will get it's own accordion busses. Disney won't have a problem moving people.

Why does every new build in the last 20 years resemble an apartment complex with rooms that look like a corporate motel in a large city?

I have no intention of staying in these new rooms as long as the current regime continues to create bland hotels.

Villa Grand Floridian opened in 2013 so 12 years ago. Although it didn’t perfectly match the resort’s original victorian theming, it still has far more personality and feels much more consistent with the overall design. These new structures don’t blend nearly as well. It’s simply cheaper to put up these sterile towers and Disney doesn’t seem to mind because pepole still buy and book them.

 

[RickNJane]

Onsite guests make up only a small portion of WDW daily visitors. Disney naturally tries to convert more guests into staying on property by offering various "perks." DVC is essentially a more affordable path to deluxe accommodations.

I don’t think anyone sees this giant new building and imagines it will inspire a surge of visitors craving "wilderness" themed immersion. Disney is focused on converting existing guests into onsite guests and keeping those rooms filled.

I completely agree about the nickel and diming post 2020 though. It's gotten much worse while service has gone down.

Exactly. Will LL hold more than each All Star? Maybe it will get it's own accordion busses. Disney won't have a problem moving people.

Villa Grand Floridian opened in 2013 so 12 years ago. Although it didn’t perfectly match the resort’s original victorian theming, it still has far more personality and feels much more consistent with the overall design. These new structures don’t blend nearly as well. It’s simply cheaper to put up these sterile towers and Disney doesn’t seem to mind because pepole still buy and book them.

I sure hope you are correct, however more rooms, means more opportunity for larger crowds.

As far as transportation, I agree that Disney does not have a problem moving people, most of the time. Disney transportation CMs do a pretty fantastic job. I dont like the newer busses with the seats along the sides. I prefer the older style where the seats are perpendicular to the sides, like the back seats are. I know they changed to accommodate more scooters, but I feel they hold less people in general.

 

[Steelers0854]

Fast Forward to now. Disney has built a metric crap ton of new rooms.

What am i missing? From the pandemic to now the only new rooms added were PIT?

 

[muppets3d]

Good points; I don't know the actual occupancy numbers and their deltas. Is a grand villa always booked? Is it always max capacity? Those are important numbers that only Disney knows.

I have no idea how to estimate off-site guests, but you are definitely correct in your thinking.

My point, I suppose, is I don't see Lakeshore Lodge doing anything new to park capacity that's different from the previous 10 years. If anything, it's intent is to drive people from off-site to on-site.

By that same token, were the CBR rooms that were razed always booked to full capacity? I'd say overall it was a wash in terms of head count with Riviera. PIT added a lot of capacity to an already stressed corridor in my opinion. The monorails and buses serving Polynesian are often full. I stayed at Grand Floridian over the fourth and never once got to sit down on a bus as I recall.

 

[PolyRob]

By that same token, were the CBR rooms that were razed always booked to full capacity? I'd say overall it was a wash in terms of head count with Riviera. PIT added a lot of capacity to an already stressed corridor in my opinion. The monorails and buses serving Polynesian are often full. I stayed at Grand Floridian over the fourth and never once got to sit down on a bus as I recall.

Not saying it's a wash, but the Luau brought insane crowds to Poly. The lobby was bustling twice a night from Tuesday - Saturday. The monorail station was chaotic and the busses were full from people leaving parks for their ADR or heading over from DS. Guests would visit Tambu, Trader Sam's, and even Pineapple Lanai before watching the fireworks or water pageant after their dinner show.

I agree PIT brings in more traffic overall with constant guest flow throughout the day, but Poly did lose some traffic by removing the luau.