Dating questions after seeing Courageous.

[golfgal]

Ok, I'll bite.

We are Christian. Presbyterian to be exact. Both kids were raised in the church. Both kids are UBER-involved in youth groups, mission trips, summer camp, community service. We didn't force them- they actually LIKE it! *gasp*

My DS16 has friends of all different religions. One of his best friends is Buddhist. Actually, a couple of his good friends are Buddhist. I have NEVER told my son he had to date only Christian girls. We have talked, though, openly, about how it is easier on a marriage when people who are very active in their faith, have similar beliefs. But I've never said "Son, when you get married, you can only marry a Christian girl".

My feeling is that my son will fall in love with a Christian girl, though, because his faith is the biggest part of who he is. Not because I want it to be, but because he wants it to be. We are actually looking at colleges now, and he wants to see two Christian colleges here in PA, and has been tossing around the idea of becoming a youth pastor. To be honest with you, I want him to major in something like English, or Communications, or Psychology, and then he can go to seminary if he wants.

And just because I know that some of you are probably thinking my son is a weirdo....he is actually a really fun kid! He has a lot of friends, both from church and public school. He is involved in all kinds of stuff, he likes music and movies and going out with his friends and parties. Just because he has core Christian beliefs does not mean that he can't have fun and just be a normal kid!

I understand what you are saying, totally. I think that for kids that are involved in their church/synagogue, whatever, that they will naturally gravitate toward people with a like faith, etc. Obviously this isn't a hard and fast rule but having a basic, core belief like this can be a common denominator for two people and an initial attraction. I know plenty of people that are of different faiths that do get married but most of them have also had one spouse convert somewhere along the way too--or at minimum have agreed to raise children in one of the faiths. It works too.

 

[pacrosby]

I was just responding to your comment that those that aren't strict are naive in thinking that the kids won't make mistakes. I'm not naive, I expect my kids to make mistakes. I don't just sit back and pray. Instead I chat about it, I ask open ended questions, etc. But ultimately (and the older they get, the more I do it) I rely on them to make their own decisions. Like I said, if it's health and safety, that's one thing - but interrogating prospective dates I don't consider an issue. I trust my teen's judgement.

Actually the full phrase I used was "........strict and have all kinds of rules......" IDK, perhaps you have a different definition of 'strict'. In my book strict just means that there are rules in place....and plenty of them (as opposed to the loosy goosy "I've given you a firm foundation now I trust you to use it"). But having plenty of rules in place doesn't mean kids don't have any leeway to make their own decisions. You seem to have taken liberties with my words.

I also never said anything about 'interrogating' prospective dates. I was speaking in the bigger picture (as many others have been also). I can't imagine I would 'interrogate' prospective dates either. Of course I've already commented on my position with regards to teenage 'dating'. No real 'dating' goes on between teenagers where I live. Kids develop their relationships in school and once established, take it out on the road (so to speak). By the time kids are going to movies or dinner.......it's pretty much a 'relationship' and chances are I'll already have met them/know them by then.

 

[punkin]

I think perhaps you have a different definition of 'strict'. In my book strict means that there are rules in place....and plenty of them. But that doesn't mean that they don't have any leeway to make their own decisions. You have taken liberties with my words.

I also never said anything about 'interrogating' prospective dates. I was speaking in the bigger picture (as many others have been also). I can't imagine I would 'interrogate' prospective dates either. Of course I've already commented on my position with regards to teenage 'dating'. No real 'dating' goes on between teenagers where I live. Kids develop their relationships in school and once established, take it out on the road (so to speak). By the time kids are going to movies or dinner.......it's pretty much a 'relationship' and chances are I'll already have met them/know them by then.

I meant to address this when you first posted it. You are absolutely right, that around here children hang out in packs. Occasionally, a couple will split off from the pack and develop into something serious (and sometimes for just a hook up -- I hate that). For the most part I knew every boy and girl DD19 hung out with in high school. Now that she's in college, things are different. Yet, I did meet her current (fairly new) boyfriend when she was home 2 weeks ago. He came to visit and DH and I met him. He's a nice boy BTW. Do I think she'll marry him? Who knows. Do I think he's marriage material? Yes. I do. DD has always made good decisions (at least in recent memory ).

 

[Tinkermommy]

I am curious if some parents never talk to their children about values and beliefs and what's important before said child brings home an "unacceptable" date. The teen years are the worst time to try and influence your children. By that time they think you're stupid and clueless and won't listen to a word you say. However, if they have been internalizing your values from birth, hopefully the "unacceptable" date will only be a small rebellion and not a lifelong choice.

Of course! I have expectations on how my kids behave and what is acceptable and unacceptable behavior. And I do have a list of criteria for acceptable dates (this applies to both my son and daughter when the time comes.)

- No drug use and no drinking
- No abuse (verbal or physical)
- No controlling behavior
- No disrespect
- Good driving skills

That's about it.

Ok, I'll bite.

We are Christian. Presbyterian to be exact. Both kids were raised in the church. Both kids are UBER-involved in youth groups, mission trips, summer camp, community service. We didn't force them- they actually LIKE it! *gasp*

My DS16 has friends of all different religions. One of his best friends is Buddhist. Actually, a couple of his good friends are Buddhist. I have NEVER told my son he had to date only Christian girls. We have talked, though, openly, about how it is easier on a marriage when people who are very active in their faith, have similar beliefs. But I've never said "Son, when you get married, you can only marry a Christian girl".

My feeling is that my son will fall in love with a Christian girl, though, because his faith is the biggest part of who he is. Not because I want it to be, but because he wants it to be. We are actually looking at colleges now, and he wants to see two Christian colleges here in PA, and has been tossing around the idea of becoming a youth pastor. To be honest with you, I want him to major in something like English, or Communications, or Psychology, and then he can go to seminary if he wants.

And just because I know that some of you are probably thinking my son is a weirdo....he is actually a really fun kid! He has a lot of friends, both from church and public school. He is involved in all kinds of stuff, he likes music and movies and going out with his friends and parties. Just because he has core Christian beliefs does not mean that he can't have fun and just be a normal kid!

Thanks Marcy for answering!

 

[punkin]

Of course! I have expectations on how my kids behave and what is acceptable and unacceptable behavior. And I do have a list of criteria for acceptable dates (this applies to both my son and daughter when the time comes.)

- No drug use and no drinking
- No abuse (verbal or physical)
- No controlling behavior
- No disrespect
- Good driving skills

That's about it.




Thanks Marcy for answering!

Well that would let my DD right out. Her driving is....interesting.

 

[Tinkermommy]

Well that would let my DD right out. Her driving is....interesting.

 

[Hannathy]

Pray tell how are you going to judge good driving skills?
are you going to have an driving course set up in your neighborhood? or do they need to bring a signed letter from their driving instructor and permission to go to the police station and run their record. Or do you have to go for a ride with him?

 

[NHdisneylover]

Of course! I have expectations on how my kids behave and what is acceptable and unacceptable behavior. And I do have a list of criteria for acceptable dates (this applies to both my son and daughter when the time comes.)

- No drug use and no drinking
- No abuse (verbal or physical)
- No controlling behavior
- No disrespect
- Good driving skills

That's about it.




Thanks Marcy for answering!

I would have been out as a teen then I chose not to get my license after taking Driver's Ed because I as not comfortable behind the wheel and driving made me nervous (my parents already had a car for me even!).

When I was 20 my then boyfrioend (now DH) taught me to drive again since I had pretty much forgotten what I learned at 16.

Since we live where the legal driving age is 18 and I fully expect that at least one kid will be interested in dating before they are that age and kind of hope they are not intersted in dating someone so much older, then I think I would not have that rule either Then again, the drinking age here is 16, so I am also not likely to have a no drinking rule.

 

[marcyinPA]

Pray tell how are you going to judge good driving skills?
are you going to have an driving course set up in your neighborhood? or do they need to bring a signed letter from their driving instructor and permission to go to the police station and run their record. Or do you have to go for a ride with him?

Kids know when other kids are crappy drivers. My DS drove with one of his friends this summer, came home and said "I am never driving with so and so again! I thought I was going to die!" I love that my DS is as honest as the day is long....because after he said that, I told him "You are absolutely never driving with him again!"

 

[Tinkermommy]

Pray tell how are you going to judge good driving skills?
are you going to have an driving course set up in your neighborhood? or do they need to bring a signed letter from their driving instructor and permission to go to the police station and run their record. Or do you have to go for a ride with him?

Kids know when other kids are crappy drivers. My DS drove with one of his friends this summer, came home and said "I am never driving with so and so again! I thought I was going to die!" I love that my DS is as honest as the day is long....because after he said that, I told him "You are absolutely never driving with him again!"

I was going to say, I would rely on my kids for this info, but I see someone beat me to it.

And really, I wouldn't know just meeting someone for a short time (even with pointed questions!) if they did any of the above, but I would hope my kids would!

 

[skater]

So again..you will show atheists/agnostics the door? What about someone who is Muslim, Jewish, Hindu, Buddhist..etc? Religion can be as important to you as you want it to be but when you discriminate against someone based on their religion (or choice to not believe in one) it isn't OK and you should think that one through and think what example you are setting by your actions. Again..I am one who like pp will teach my boys their religion (or having religion preached to them) is not appropriate and they can and should politely state "I am not comfortable with this" and end it. If they persist they should apologize to their date and leave. I would not be OK with some person quizzing my kids on their beliefs.

I would not discriminate against someone's religion in hiring, selling a home, etc. But dating my sons or daughter is a different issue altogether. And it is OK for me to feel that way. I wouldn't presume to preach my religion to your boys (or anyone else's boys or girls), and I agree that's not appropriate.
Fortunately, it wouldn't get to the point where I have to quiz a date about his/her religion because I tend to know the kids my children hang out with.
As far as dating being fun, it doesn't sound like its as much fun as it used to be although I could be wrong about that. When the prom is more about sex and pressure to have sex than enjoying a romantic night out, how much fun is that? I hope I'm wrong about dating, but what I hear some teens talk about just doesn't sound as light-hearted as what we would like it to be.

 

[skater]

The difference here to me is that Susie hasn't gone out on a few dates with Bob and is finding issues regarding how they connect regarding religion but that Susie's parents are screening her date and presumably turning away/telling her she can't date someone of another faith. This isn't Susie saying "we aren't compatible in this regard" but someone teaching her to exclude or disregard people of different faiths.

Marriages of different faiths can work out..I can't imagine ignoring someone because of a different faith (or is an atheist) without even bothering to get to know the..my own marriage has been going on for almost 18 years (Jewish and Catholic), my parents for almost 40 years (Catholic and atheist). It's about taking a moment to get to know someone and how you guys function together rather than tossing them aside based on something like religion (because really to me that isn't a big step away from refusing to date someone of another race as well).

Sorry Coconut, I'm not trying to pick on all your posts, but I have just found this post and have to say that not dating someone based on religion is totally different than not dating someone based on race. I would explain further, but every time I try to compose an explanation, I feel like I'm breaking some kind of religion DIS rule .

 

[FireDancer]

When the prom is more about sex and pressure to have sex than enjoying a romantic night out, how much fun is that?

Mathematically speaking: lots^lots

 

[skater]

Mathematically speaking: lots^lots

Okay, you got me on that one! (But still, its only fun, if you're the kid that wants it that way).

 

[Coconut36]

Sorry Coconut, I'm not trying to pick on all your posts, but I have just found this post and have to say that not dating someone based on religion is totally different than not dating someone based on race. I would explain further, but every time I try to compose an explanation, I feel like I'm breaking some kind of religion DIS rule .

Sorry but I disagree with you. Discrimination is discrimination..be it race or religion. You would refuse to allow your child to date someone simply based on their religion..that is no different than refusing to allow your child to date someone who is a certain/different race.

It's one thing to gravitate towards people you are around (like dating people in your church) and it's an entirely different thing to say "That young man is Jewish/Buddhist/Muslim/atheist or whatever religion I deem "bad" and you can not date them".

 

[JaneBanks]

I would not discriminate against someone's religion in hiring, selling a home, etc. But dating my sons or daughter is a different issue altogether. And it is OK for me to feel that way. I wouldn't presume to preach my religion to your boys (or anyone else's boys or girls), and I agree that's not appropriate.
Fortunately, it wouldn't get to the point where I have to quiz a date about his/her religion because I tend to know the kids my children hang out with.
As far as dating being fun, it doesn't sound like its as much fun as it used to be although I could be wrong about that. When the prom is more about sex and pressure to have sex than enjoying a romantic night out, how much fun is that? I hope I'm wrong about dating, but what I hear some teens talk about just doesn't sound as light-hearted as what we would like it to be.

Would it be okay for you to feel that way if the person was a different race?

 

[Owlpost23]

I have no religious affiliations at all.My husband was raised Catholic.When we were planning to get married,his mother (a wonderful woman!) asked my husband if I were planning on converting.He said that there wasn't a chance in Hades in that happening.We got married in a restaurant by a justice of the peace.We've been married almost 21 years,and are very happy.And by the way,three of his siblings married catholics in the church,and all three are divorced.

 

[Hannathy]

I was going to say, I would rely on my kids for this info, but I see someone beat me to it.

And really, I wouldn't know just meeting someone for a short time (even with pointed questions!) if they did any of the above, but I would hope my kids would!

If your child knows the other kid well enough to know how they drive doesn't that say they know them rather well? so why do you have to interview them?

Also if you trust their judgement on how well they drive why can't you trust their judgement on whether they are good enough to go out with?

I know a Valedictorian, Eagle Scout, Religious, mannerly, polite,non drinking boy who would not be good enough for your DD's because he flunked his driving test twice! My poor Friend's son took forever to pass his driving test, she was ready to kill him cause she was tired of driving him to symphony and debate and wanted him driving!

This example is why I think hard and fast rules are worthless.

 

[punkin]

Sorry but I disagree with you. Discrimination is discrimination..be it race or religion. You would refuse to allow your child to date someone simply based on their religion..that is no different than refusing to allow your child to date someone who is a certain/different race.

It's one thing to gravitate towards people you are around (like dating people in your church) and it's an entirely different thing to say "That young man is Jewish/Buddhist/Muslim/atheist or whatever religion I deem "bad" and you can not date them".

Who said any religion was "bad"? No, all I'm saying is different, not bad. That's enough. If your religion is a major part of your identity, why would you ever consider marrying someone whose beliefs are different than yours?

 

[mdsoccermom]

Who said any religion was "bad"? No, all I'm saying is different, not bad. That's enough. If your religion is a major part of your identity, why would you ever consider marrying someone whose beliefs are different than yours?

Well, this Jewish girl says it's because I loved him.