DAS changes coming WDW May 20/ DL June 18, 2024

[SueM in MN]

Either I’m very honest or very dumb, but some of these cheat methods just boggles me. Never would have thought to do this or that to get around rules.

People figured out all kinds of things.
The previous program had a printed cardboard card with a handwritten name, number of guests and dates valid.
People were giving them away or selling them as 'never ending Fastpasses'.

When DAS was introduced, it was still a cardboard card, but included a photo of the guest it was issued to and the CMs printed the card.
It couldn't be sold since it was printed and personalized, but one 'hack' people came up with was going to Guest Relations and claiming they lost or forgot to bring their card from their resort.
With a second (or third) card, they could get extra DAS Return Times

Apparently at one point Disney tried to stop the cheaters by using pens with differently colored ink to write the return times. The cheaters responded by bringing along pens with a range of different ink colors.

Yep.
I heard that from CMs

Remember the news stories several years ago about groups paying wheelchair users to be “tour guides” to gain access? It’s sad what people will do.

I don't think that was actually as widespread as the articles suggested, at least at WDW. By that point, actual wheelchair users knew that most lines at WDW were Mainstreamed and wheelchair users didn't skip the lines. The attraction the users of the 'tour guides' mentioned most in the articles was Small World. That did (and still does) have an alternate entry, but since EVERYONE with an alternate entry stamp on their GAC (Guest Assistance Card) was using it, the wait there was often VERY long. Those 'tour guides' were actually pretty good at marketing - they convinced their customers that most attractions (even those with usually short posted wait times) would be hours without using the tour guide.
Guests with mobility devices had no choice but to use that line. When we went during that time period, the line was often filled from top of the ramp to the bottom and outside of the attraction. Often, there would only be 2 or 3 guests in the whole line with a mobility device and the wait in that line was often 45 minutes, even when the wait in the regular line was short.
I saw CMs trying to tell guests they didn't need to use GAC on the ride because they would get on in less than half the time or much less using the regular line. The people I saw pretty much all argued with the CM and used the alternate entry instead.
One time, my husband got into the alternate entry with our daughter in her wheelchair while I walked over to another attraction - it was either Big Thunder Mountain or Pirates. I left them at Small World, walked to Frontierland, rode and came back to Small World. They were still only about 1/2 way down the ramp to the load area. I couldn't get to them, so I got into the regular line with a posted wait of 20 minutes. We ended up riding within one boat of each other.
Their wait in line was almost 45 minutes longer than my wait.

I'm not saying there were not 'wheelchair tour guides', but Disney had ways of dealing with them, including taking away their passes and trespassing them for using passes for commercial purposes.
Disney had another problem that they had no way of dealing with other than changing the program. GAC allowed guests with the 'alternate entry' and 'green arrow' stamps to show them for immediate entry into the Fastpass lane. Guests were using that for access that was not intended, but also not forbidden. People were using GAC to go on high demand/high wait attractions thru the Fastpass entry, riding and getting right back into the Fastpass Line to ride multiple times. People also posted using GAC during Holidays to stay a few hours, ride as many things as they wanted without waiting, then go home early in the day.

There was conjecture that Disney was happy about promoting the 'wheelchair tour guide' stories because those guests were actually doing something wrong. It would look good to have articles denigrating people who were actually using GAC in a way that was not against the rules.

 

[Dvc_queen]

Just to clarify, you were denied DAS and told to use G+ and RTQ?

The bolded part is especially interesting, as I’ve yet to see anyone actually use RTQ, despite so many being told to request it. (They may well be out there using RTQ and living their best Disney lives and not posting about it anywhere, lol! I’m not implying it’s not happening at all, only saying that I really, really want to see a report of it going down in real life and have thus far come up empty!) I hope you’ll come back and let us know how it went!

Not me but my family member was denied ( I was on the call as well). I’m very skeptical since RTQ seems really cast member dependent, but would be a good option for us if it works as intended. The cast member seemed to understand why AQR wouldn’t work for us since I need to be with my family member and couldn’t stay in line without them. We explained why genie plus likely wouldn’t work ( return window too short ) and were told that you can come back anytime after the return window which I know is 100% a lie and up to cast member discretion if they decide to let you use an expired genie + window. Very interesting experience to say the least.

 

[PrincessV]

Not me but my family member was denied ( I was on the call as well). I’m very skeptical since RTQ seems really cast member dependent, but would be a good option for us if it works as intended. The cast member seemed to understand why AQR wouldn’t work for us since I need to be with my family member and couldn’t stay in line without them. We explained why genie plus likely wouldn’t work ( return window too short ) and were told that you can come back anytime after the return window which I know is 100% a lie and up to cast member discretion if they decide to let you use an expired genie + window. Very interesting experience to say the least.

Wow, I’m sorry that you were denied. It’s discouraging to hear that even with a CM understanding why the alternatives - including a paid service that has nothing to do with disability accommodations! - won’t work, their hands are tied. I very much hope for you and others offered RTQ that it turns out to meet your needs!

 

[Dvc_queen]

Wow, I’m sorry that you were denied. It’s discouraging to hear that even with a CM understanding why the alternatives - including a paid service that has nothing to do with disability accommodations! - won’t work, their hands are tied. I very much hope for you and others offered RTQ that it turns out to meet your needs!

Yeah. I expected them to be denied despite being approved under the prior rules since it is a physical disability ( that then causes mental health flare ups), but is not cognitive ( also not solved by mobility aides). I really hope RTQ works as suggested but I’m not overly optimistic about it, my game plan now is to hope we make the genie plus return windows, and if not I guess we are at cast member discretion or out of luck.

 

[BingoJoe]

The RTQ seems pretty easy for them to administer to me, they just need to look at the party size and only allow the single people or parties of 2 through with an RTQ time.

It does give duos more of an opportunity to scam than a large group, but the entire situation seems much better than before.

 

[jlundeen]

Maybe this has been posted already and I missed it, but if the Registration CM recomends RTQ instead of granting DAS,

• is there some kind of note on your file stating that this person can use this accomodation or can any guest walk up to an attraction CM and request this accommadation?
• does the accommodation allow LL entry rather than SB entry, and
• is it for the DAS party, or only the DAS person (and maybe a caregiver), meaning if it a party of 4, two still use SB entrance

It would help to have it spelled out, as if this is for everyone to use, it seems to me to be a bigger opportunity for abuse than if there was something listed on your file. But again, maybe we just don't know yet, or I missed it.

 

[Dvc_queen]

Maybe this has been posted already and I missed it, but if the Registration CM recomends RTQ instead of granting DAS,

• is there some kind of note on your file stating that this person can use this accomodation or can any guest walk up to an attraction CM and request this accommadation?
• does the accommodation allow LL entry rather than SB entry, and
• is it for the DAS party, or only the DAS person (and maybe a caregiver), meaning if it a party of 4, two still use SB entrance

It would help to have it spelled out, as if this is for everyone to use, it seems to me to be a bigger opportunity for abuse than if there was something listed on your file. But again, maybe we just don't know yet, or I missed it.

We were told we would have to ask the cast members at each attraction which to me means that there isn’t a note or anything indicating we were suggested this accommodation.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Maybe this has been posted already and I missed it, but if the Registration CM recomends RTQ instead of granting DAS,

• is there some kind of note on your file stating that this person can use this accomodation or can any guest walk up to an attraction CM and request this accommadation?
• does the accommodation allow LL entry rather than SB entry, and
• is it for the DAS party, or only the DAS person (and maybe a caregiver), meaning if it a party of 4, two still use SB entrance

It would help to have it spelled out, as if this is for everyone to use, it seems to me to be a bigger opportunity for abuse than if there was something listed on your file. But again, maybe we just don't know yet, or I missed it.

There has not been any formal confirmation but I’ve read this whole thread (and many others) and it seems that absent extremely unusual circumstances, it will be limited to the DAS holder and maybe caregiver and/or young children. I do not think the plan to offer it to bigger parties.

 

[lanejudy]

Maybe this has been posted already and I missed it, but if the Registration CM recomends RTQ instead of granting DAS,

• is there some kind of note on your file stating that this person can use this accomodation or can any guest walk up to an attraction CM and request this accommadation?
• does the accommodation allow LL entry rather than SB entry, and
• is it for the DAS party, or only the DAS person (and maybe a caregiver), meaning if it a party of 4, two still use SB entrance

It would help to have it spelled out, as if this is for everyone to use, it seems to me to be a bigger opportunity for abuse than if there was something listed on your file. But again, maybe we just don't know yet, or I missed it.

RTQ procedures will vary by attraction, possibly time of day or conditions at the attraction at the time requested, and/or possibly the need and party make-up.

To be honest, pretty much all reports I’ve seen suggest this is used along with AQR — as in you enter the queue and depending on the circumstances the RTQ may be issued when you leave the queue. Or if you have more party members to hold your spot they will contact you to enter the LL to rejoin them.

 

[Maryrachel713]

Oof, 2 plus hour wait right now.

I asked my daughter why she couldn't wait in line and she burst into tears and hid under the chair. I've chatted that I'm requesting for two weeks but my daughter thinks we aren't going til November (to a different park) so hopefully if they have to reference the visit, they will play along! Thinking back, I don't think they reference the visit at all? I'm not remembering a specific call out about what exactly the visit is.

 

[BingoJoe]

Maybe this has been posted already and I missed it, but if the Registration CM recomends RTQ instead of granting DAS,

• is there some kind of note on your file stating that this person can use this accomodation or can any guest walk up to an attraction CM and request this accommadation?
• does the accommodation allow LL entry rather than SB entry, and
• is it for the DAS party, or only the DAS person (and maybe a caregiver), meaning if it a party of 4, two still use SB entrance

I think RTQ is only available if your party doesn't include anyone to hold your place in the queue. They wouldn't flag your account for it because some attractions you may want to only do with one other person, others with a larger group. It also won't be necessary where there is also a short standby line for an attraction, or your need is not relevant to that particular attraction.

Disney is definitely trying to move away from these proactive booked accommodations for a huge number of guests and just react appropriately when guests need to return to a queue as it crops up.

 

[mistysue]

Apparently at one point Disney tried to stop the cheaters by using pens with differently colored ink to write the return times. The cheaters responded by bringing along pens with a range of different ink colors.

Our first experience knowing there was a disability pass involved watching someone get called out I believe for this, and denied access to the line. Somebody was looping toy story mania, and they had gone through the line and ridden the ride so quickly the person at the entrance recognized that they were coming back the third time in a row. Meanwhile, the wait was over an hour... So she knew that her shift at each station had not been that long.
It's not like we saw the card or anything but there was screaming about having a time written on the part of the adult and the child who appeared to be maybe 2-3 and was held on her hip was crying by then. We just got out of there quickly And later tried to figure out what she was talking about with having a written time.

 

[Maryrachel713]

Posted in the other thread but was approved for DL. Slightly confused because it felt like the old system to me but no issues. I just talked to the CM. I'd say DD's needs are fairly textbook in that the exact issue is the actual waiting in the line, so the other options wouldn't do anything for her. I was expecting to get approved or denied with no alternatives besides "use G+" so I felt pretty calm.

So my experience for my 8 year old was pretty standard--I know this is tough for many, but don't assume it'll be a disaster.

 

[HyperspaceMountainPilot]

Posted in the other thread but was approved for DL. Slightly confused because it felt like the old system to me but no issues. I just talked to the CM. I'd say DD's needs are fairly textbook in that the exact issue is the actual waiting in the line, so the other options wouldn't do anything for her. I was expecting to get approved or denied with no alternatives besides "use G+" so I felt pretty calm.

So my experience for my 8 year old was pretty standard--I know this is tough for many, but don't assume it'll be a disaster.

Just to clarify, DL is still being evaluated under the old system until mid-June, which is probably why it felt like the old system.

 

[Evita_W]

People figured out all kinds of things.
The previous program had a printed cardboard card with a handwritten name, number of guests and dates valid.
People were giving them away or selling them as 'never ending Fastpasses'.

When DAS was introduced, it was still a cardboard card, but included a photo of the guest it was issued to and the CMs printed the card.
It couldn't be sold since it was printed and personalized, but one 'hack' people came up with was going to Guest Relations and claiming they lost or forgot to bring their card from their resort.
With a second (or third) card, they could get extra DAS Return Times

Yep.
I heard that from CMs

I don't think that was actually as widespread as the articles suggested, at least at WDW. By that point, actual wheelchair users knew that most lines at WDW were Mainstreamed and wheelchair users didn't skip the lines. The attraction the users of the 'tour guides' mentioned most in the articles was Small World. That did (and still does) have an alternate entry, but since EVERYONE with an alternate entry stamp on their GAC (Guest Assistance Card) was using it, the wait there was often VERY long. Those 'tour guides' were actually pretty good at marketing - they convinced their customers that most attractions (even those with usually short posted wait times) would be hours without using the tour guide.
Guests with mobility devices had no choice but to use that line. When we went during that time period, the line was often filled from top of the ramp to the bottom and outside of the attraction. Often, there would only be 2 or 3 guests in the whole line with a mobility device and the wait in that line was often 45 minutes, even when the wait in the regular line was short.
I saw CMs trying to tell guests they didn't need to use GAC on the ride because they would get on in less than half the time or much less using the regular line. The people I saw pretty much all argued with the CM and used the alternate entry instead.
One time, my husband got into the alternate entry with our daughter in her wheelchair while I walked over to another attraction - it was either Big Thunder Mountain or Pirates. I left them at Small World, walked to Frontierland, rode and came back to Small World. They were still only about 1/2 way down the ramp to the load area. I couldn't get to them, so I got into the regular line with a posted wait of 20 minutes. We ended up riding within one boat of each other.
Their wait in line was almost 45 minutes longer than my wait.

I'm not saying there were not 'wheelchair tour guides', but Disney had ways of dealing with them, including taking away their passes and trespassing them for using passes for commercial purposes.
Disney had another problem that they had no way of dealing with other than changing the program. GAC allowed guests with the 'alternate entry' and 'green arrow' stamps to show them for immediate entry into the Fastpass lane. Guests were using that for access that was not intended, but also not forbidden. People were using GAC to go on high demand/high wait attractions thru the Fastpass entry, riding and getting right back into the Fastpass Line to ride multiple times. People also posted using GAC during Holidays to stay a few hours, ride as many things as they wanted without waiting, then go home early in the day.

There was conjecture that Disney was happy about promoting the 'wheelchair tour guide' stories because those guests were actually doing something wrong. It would look good to have articles denigrating people who were actually using GAC in a way that was not against the rules.

The wheelchair/DAS as a tour guide was a big problem at DLR though, some even advertising their services blatantly on Craigslist or standing on a corner down the street, there was at least one shop inside a local gas station that advertised they could help you beat the lines and that's what they were doing. It eventually became such a problem they some attractions had longer waits than the standby queues, in particular Haunted Mansion, Small World and Pirates were almost constantly that way, making it all but impossible for those who actually needed the assistance to get it.

 

[dbriggsq]

I was recently on a trip to WDW and qualified for DAS under the previous system, which was incredibly helpful in navigating an immune system disease, which limits many things, including standing in lines and duration in the park. RTQ would be fair for me, as I am usually much more able to stand in the Soarin Queue than SDD. Are there reports yet on what experiences people with physical disabilities are having talking to cast members at individual attractions?

Would love to know more info on this too

 

[DisneyOma]

Hi all - I went to EPCOT last night so I wanted to share some first hand personal observations as somebody who has used DAS as an Orlando local for the last two years. For reference, I go to the parks at LEAST a few times a month, every month. I've surely been to EPCOT 30 times in the last few years, always with DAS.

Last night (a Friday night) was about a 5 in terms of crowds. Busy, but not not crazy busy considering there's no festival going on right now. Spaceship Earth and Soarin' were roughly 20 minute POSTED waits. Remy was 70 or thereabouts.

I used DAS, as I still have it for a few more weeks under the previous requirements (haven't applied under the new ones yet). I could NOT BELIEVE how empty the lightning lanes were. My partner and I would scan and to go straight to the merge point. There was pretty much nobody or just two people in front of us by the time we got to the merge point with not many people behind us as we waited at the merge point.

They were letting the standby line move a TON more than I've previously ever seen. I was shocked! It really gives credibility to the reports and theories that I have seen online that a large majority of people in the LL were DAS. I've always had to stand in line in the LL. Always! But not last night!

My mind is racing with thoughts and questions. How much faster will standby lines become? What will this mean for Genie+ prices? If they have more capacity, will the Genie+ prices go down? And yet, if standby lines are faster will ANYBODY pay for it on slower days? Were DAS people making standby lines slower and therefore Genie+ more worthwhile to pay for? Was DAS helping the profitability for Disney? Will Disney LOSE money by denying people these accommodations? Think about it! Genie+ sales might go down because of this, at least on moderate to slow days.

Honestly, I'm way more worried about my own accommodations going away and not being about to even partake in the attractions at Disney anymore without DAS. But I find the business and operations side of things quite interesting as well. Anyway, just sharing. Let me know what you all think and what you have personally observed in the LL lately.

I've used DAS the past two summers (August) and the LL queues were empty ahead of us almost every time we used that access, except for HM, which would have maybe one more group ahead of us, waiting to get into the area right outside the doors. It's spooky when the FoP queue is that empty! The only time the LL was a hot mess was when Buzz was down half the morning and when it finally opened up lots of people had access and we got stuck in there. I had to bail - went and threw up in a bathroom.

 

[Maryrachel713]

Just to clarify, DL is still being evaluated under the old system until mid-June, which is probably why it felt like the old system.

Thanks--I was confused because our visit is not until after the new system starts so I thought thats how the evaluation would be.

Mods, is it ok for me to edit my post to avoid confusion?

 

[bravenyc]

so for my bestie she has POTS, which means her heart stuggles to pump her blood enough for it to get to her brain sometimes. Walking elevates her heart rate and that helps, standing for long period of times makes her faint. I think though that they would just say, get a wheel chair, but she doesn't want to use up a wheel chair for someone who actually needs it. She would just sit and wait, or walk until her return time.

I feel for your friend. This is the situation that many of us with mobility-like issues have had to deal with for a long time. So many of us have trouble with standing, not with walking (and walking can actually help). It has been hard to use an ECV when I do not really need one to navigate the parks, especially with so many people complaining about the number of ECV's. It is also an added expense, but it allows me to do the parks with my family so there is not really a choice. I wish there was a better system to borrow a wheelchair at rides - to use in the line only. This would likely be really hard to implement, but it would help. Your friend does not need to worry about taking a wheel chair from anyone else - there are plenty available to rent in the park. In-park ECV's are another matter and do sell out, especially in MK - but there are outside vendors to rent from - many of them are wonderful (shout to Gold Mobility). What I do that helps is to share the ECV with others in my party so that I still get a fair amount of walking in - and then use it to sit while in line (and NO ONE minds having a turn on it!).

 

[Disneychick75]

so for my bestie she has POTS, which means her heart stuggles to pump her blood enough for it to get to her brain sometimes. Walking elevates her heart rate and that helps, standing for long period of times makes her faint. I think though that they would just say, get a wheel chair, but she doesn't want to use up a wheel chair for someone who actually needs it. She would just sit and wait, or walk until her return time.

Please tell your friend to be careful and not go during the hot months if she can avoid them. I ended up in the MK First Aid infirmary last Monday due to the heat. The nurses there had me stay for a few hours lying down on a cold pillow with them applying cold packs. The heat had me out of it. I was dizzy and confused. With POTS that could be more dangerous.