Congress concerned over MagicBand security issues..

[disneyfan55]

That's just it. Our family's Disney Experience has always been pretty darn near perfect every time we've been there. Our resort was impeccable, transportation great, character interaction delightful when not too long ago you would turn the corner and OMGosh, there was Minnie! Or Pluto! ADRs always kept to a minimum (one or two/trip) to alleviate our "must be somewhere now" stress. We could come and go via park hoppers as we please, obtaining fast passes when we wanted, for what we wanted and somehow learned to stay relaxed while keeping occupied while waiting for our return time or heaven forbid, waiting in line if we so choose (which was not very often). We limited our spending, because we did choose a deluxe resort because that is what is importent to us. Our in park spending stopped 1) as kids got older and 2) when you could no longer walk up to a kiosk and purchase "a guy" for a few bucks which made our DD happy for the entire day. And Disney's hope we will spend more $ in the parks is delusional.

We don't "need" anything more than a family vacation; stress free time spent
together. Their current marketing strategy is making this increasingly difficult.

Yes I agree. I don't like all that info on an RFID. It may stop me from visiting. Funny when the govt tracks most all that we do they would question Disney! Heck many schools make children wear RFIDs to attend and disallow them from attending if they don't wear it. I wish times were back even 10 years ago!

 

[UNCFanatik]

But as I said, it would be difficult to opt out completely and still be able to take advantage of things. You need to provide at least a minimal amount of information to use MDE - I'm not sure the minimum but at least an email address and as we are led to understand a ticket. Not yet sure what else would be required in order to make FP+ reservations, etc.

If you are opting out of MyMagic+ (of which MDE is a defined part) because you don't want to provide ANY personal information, I don't see how you could participate.

And even in-park, they say they are asking for an email address at a minimum to participate in FP+.

So it isn't clear what you have access to if you opt-out completely. It's clear that you won't have a single device to access it though, which was fairly obvious.

You are the one that referenced this quote and I think you read something into that wasnt there and not "obvious":

+ is a completely optional program
Guests can enjoy admission to the park without having to register or provide any personal information. But guests who do choose to participate in MyMagic+ will enjoy the convenience of having their tickets, guaranteed ride times for shows and attractions, resort room access and other enhanced features all in one place. Using MagicBands or cards for purchases is also optional.

I am saying that a simple reading of that statement would not lead to the conclusions you are drawing from that because of the unknowns.

 

[doconeill]

Unless I'm missing something, Markey never asked about guests fully opting out of RFID -- he asked about guests opting out of MagicBand. That was answered fully.

--> From Markey's letter: "1. b. If a guest chooses not to use MagicBand, what disadvantages, if any, will that guest experience while visiting a Disney park (i.e., longer waits for attractions, etc.)?"

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

That's exactly what Markey asked, and was answered. Now, it probably wasn't the question that Markey meant to ask...

WE would like a clearer answer on what it means to opt completely out of RFID (and it's not 100% clear that will be possible in the end ... my understanding is that all the turnstiles will be converted, so it would be the only way in) or MyMagic+. However, WE are not a member of Congress, so I'm not expecting any letters, sternly worded or otherwise, to be forthcoming

 

[doconeill]

Yes I agree. I don't like all that info on an RFID. It may stop me from visiting. Funny when the govt tracks most all that we do they would question Disney! Heck many schools make children wear RFIDs to attend and disallow them from attending if they don't wear it. I wish times were back even 10 years ago!

Just to make sure you understand, there is NO information on an RFID device other than it's unique code. That code has to be tied to information somewhere else - in this case, Disney's computers. If you've provided that info to Disney in the past - say, to be able to charge to your room - it isn't much different with the RFID.

A thief after personal information is not going to go after your RFID. They'd go after Disney's computers, since that's where it all is.

 

[doconeill]

You are the one that referenced this quote and I think you read something into that wasnt there and not "obvious":



I am saying that a simple reading of that statement would not lead to the conclusions you are drawing from that because of the unknowns.

You may have missed the fact that I changed my interpretation somewhat. I was simply stating that the statement does not confirm access to anything, only that there would not be a single device making it convenient, _IF_ you can access all those features.

The "obvious" part I was referring to was not being able to have the single device. If you don't want room charges, you don't provide a credit/debit card, and you have to have credit/debit or cash with you. If you don't want to link PhotoPass, you will need a separate card. If you don't want to link your ticket (or unable to - not clear that _all_ ticket types can be linked yet), you need a separate ticket.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Why are you attacking me for feeling this way? These are not mutually exclusive. The sarcasm is unecessary. I am simply trying to figure out the best course of action for my vacation. I applaud the questioning. I have many of the same concerns as Markey - even if not for the same reasons. Iger's response was highly unprofessional for an executive of his stature - let alone for the head Disney "cast member". In my mind, a gracious, polite, and informative response would have gone a whole lot further toward garnering trust in the company.

I seek information, not argument.

There was no attack on you in my post at all. I am being sarcastic about Markey's motivations. My point is that if he wrote letters like this one to every company that is doing the same or comparable things in marketing or with RFID, you would have an incredibly long list of companies to be "concerned" about from Mr. Markey! But he isn't doing that -- he's targeting a big name like Disney for a reason.

Markey and his letter are disingenuous -- there's no reason to be more or less concerned because a politician writes a letter. That's what the sarcasm is about -- nothing personal at all! We're obviously each going to have our own feelings about whether what Disney is doing is concerning or not.

 

[finedice]

Unless I'm missing something, Markey never asked about guests fully opting out of RFID -- he asked about guests opting out of MagicBand. That was answered fully. Not dodging anything.

--> From Markey's letter: "1. b. If a guest chooses not to use MagicBand, what disadvantages, if any, will that guest experience while visiting a Disney park (i.e., longer waits for attractions, etc.)?"

Sent from my iPhone using DISBoards

We learn by questioning. When we cease to question, we cease to learn. I have no reason to trust any corporation that wants my dollars - regardless of the happiness their services have provided me in the past, or may in the future. It is somewhat troublesome to me that some choose to do so. Most of us don't have any real idea of what its capabilities are, yet so many seem to blindly trusting in it. I am not old-fashioned, and I welcome technology. I also understand that it can be, and often is, used for devious purposes. I appologize in advance for saying so, but I do not think The Walt Disney Corporation is above this to a degree.

And thank you - I am sorry I misread the intent of your post.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

That's exactly what Markey asked, and was answered. Now, it probably wasn't the question that Markey meant to ask...

WE would like a clearer answer on what it means to opt completely out of RFID (and it's not 100% clear that will be possible in the end ... my understanding is that all the turnstiles will be converted, so it would be the only way in) or MyMagic+. However, WE are not a member of Congress, so I'm not expecting any letters, sternly worded or otherwise, to be forthcoming

Exactly my point -- it wasn't a dodge on Iger's part at all -- asked and answered re: MagicBand.

 

[jade1]

Just to make sure you understand, there is NO information on an RFID device other than it's unique code. That code has to be tied to information somewhere else - in this case, Disney's computers. If you've provided that info to Disney in the past - say, to be able to charge to your room - it isn't much different with the RFID.

A thief after personal information is not going to go after your RFID. They'd go after Disney's computers, since that's where it all is.

I'm sure the wheels are turning regardless though.



From 4riction:

New credit cards and debit cards have what is called an RFID chip in them.
The RFID chip in a credit card emits the account number, expiration data and other information.

About 100 million credit cards now have this contactless technology embedded into them. However, over the next 2-3 years, it is expected that credit card issuers will replace every single magnetic stripe credit and debit card with a new contactless smartcard.

This technology update will enable you to use your credit card without ever needing to take it out of your pocket.

But watch out ! Thieves are quick to jump on this technology upgrade which makes their job so much easier. These new tech criminals are called SKIMMERS and what they can do to you will scare the life right out of you. If it doesn't they will certainly scare the life out of your credit card.

How does it work ?

SKIMMERS have a device which by doing as little as passing by you in a shopping center which will read your credit card number and expiration date of your card.

It's basically a small computer and as the SKIMMER walks by you and others, it stores the information of every card he or she passes by that day.

Later when they get home is when they do series damage to your account without you even knowing about it.

But you can protect yourself against this, companies are now offering cases for your credit card which will block the RFID signal. You can get these for as little as $3, which in my opinion is money well spent. This doesn't protect you against a SKIMMER who may be standing beside you in line when you pull it out to use it at the store.



I have a feeling this type of crime is going to skyrocket in the next year.
Consider yourself warned !

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

We learn by questioning. When we cease to question, we cease to learn. I have no reason to trust any corporation that wants my dollars - regardless of the happiness their services have provided me in the past, or may in the future. It is somewhat troublesome to me that some choose to do so. Most of us don't have any real idea of what its capabilities are, yet so many seem to blindly trusting in it. I am not old-fashioned, and I welcome technology. I also understand that it can be, and often is, used for devious purposes. I appologize in advance for saying so, but I do not think The Walt Disney Corporation is above this to a degree.

And thank you - I am sorry I miread the intent of your post.

I agree with you!! I may be one of the least trusting people out there... trust me!!

I am -- for now -- satisfied by the info Disney has released. This, combined with a bit of knowledge about RFID, and Disney's track record has me comfortable with this for now. I'll keep paying attention as more info comes out, and I'll reassess if I need to.

No company -- even the awesome Disney!! -- is above the law or oversight. I just think it should be equal to the oversight that other companies get. And it is just a pet peeve of mine when politicians demagog an issue or target anyone/any company for their own ends -- bugs me!!!

 

[Granny square]

Devious purposes? Really? Devious is planning to take a kid into the restroom and molest them. Not trying to market action figures to parents. Gmab.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

SKIMMERS have a device which by doing as little as passing by you in a shopping center which will read your credit card number and expiration date of your card.
...

I have a feeling this type of crime is going to skyrocket in the next year.
Consider yourself warned !

Again, though, a compatible skimmer will only pick up a unique ID# -- only that ID# is actually stored on the band. All other info is stored in Disney's system. You'd need a skimmer and access to Disney databases. And again, only info you choose to give Disney will be in that database.

 

[doconeill]

I'm sure the wheels are turning regardless though.



From 4riction:

New credit cards and debit cards have what is called an RFID chip in them.
The RFID chip in a credit card emits the account number, expiration data and other information.

About 100 million credit cards now have this contactless technology embedded into them. However, over the next 2-3 years, it is expected that credit card issuers will replace every single magnetic stripe credit and debit card with a new contactless smartcard.

This technology update will enable you to use your credit card without ever needing to take it out of your pocket.

But watch out ! Thieves are quick to jump on this technology upgrade which makes their job so much easier. These new tech criminals are called SKIMMERS and what they can do to you will scare the life right out of you. If it doesn't they will certainly scare the life out of your credit card.

How does it work ?

SKIMMERS have a device which by doing as little as passing by you in a shopping center which will read your credit card number and expiration date of your card.

It's basically a small computer and as the SKIMMER walks by you and others, it stores the information of every card he or she passes by that day.

Later when they get home is when they do series damage to your account without you even knowing about it.

But you can protect yourself against this, companies are now offering cases for your credit card which will block the RFID signal. You can get these for as little as $3, which in my opinion is money well spent. This doesn't protect you against a SKIMMER who may be standing beside you in line when you pull it out to use it at the store.



I have a feeling this type of crime is going to skyrocket in the next year.
Consider yourself warned !

The RFID in credit cards themselves are different, because their ID codes are the credit card information itself. Thus they are much more of a problem in that regard since any retailer with an RFID reader can process the transaction. Some require presenting the card so they can enter the printed CVV code on the card, which provides a second factor authentication that a skimmer couldn't get. Online retailers require the CVV code for much the same reason. It is inconsistently used however.

And some security experts will tell you those cases won't always work...

Someone who skims your Disney RFID might be able to make some purchases (PIN codes are supposed to be required on all purchases now), and might be able to get some pictures taken and added to your PhotoPass (some thieves aren't too bright ), and might be able to get into the park with your ticket (if the finger scanners are off). And if they are very very lucky at guessing what resort you are staying at and what room, get into your room. And only while you are still at WDW. That's about it.

 

[doconeill]

Hmm...while scanning Deadline for bits of news for one of my other web sites, I came across this very interesting quote attributed to Iger last week:

Iger also took time to promote his new MyMagic+MagicBands digital venture, a Disney theme park initiative set to launch this spring at Disney World that enables park visitors to upload personal information into digitally enhanced wristbands designed to enhance their experience. The so-called MagicBands store information in a cloud that will allow patrons to reserve time on rides and in restaurants, upload birthday information, and track guest interaction and purchasing behavior  trading privacy for convenience. Iger says the future of MagicBands can include even more meticulously collected interactive data that one day will allow guests to go cash- and credit card-free and order food in advance, sit at table& well know because of GPS positioning where youre sitting and well know what you ordered.

Now, this is VERY interesting, because we know by the specs of the band that they are not GPS, and according to the attachments in Iger's letter, it is not GPS based. But it seems that he is in fact thinking in that direction - and I wonder if THAT had a lot to do with what transpired.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Hmm...while scanning Deadline for bits of news for one of my other web sites, I came across this very interesting quote attributed to Iger last week:



Now, this is VERY interesting, because we know by the specs of the band that they are not GPS, and according to the attachments in Iger's letter, it is not GPS based. But it seems that he is in fact thinking in that direction - and I wonder if THAT had a lot to do with what transpired.

Are you TRYING to confuse and freak people out on here now?!?!?!?

I think the operative words are FUTURE and CAN. As you said, this is NOT the technology that they going to be rolling out now with MagicBand. If they ever get there will probably depend on how this whole system is ultimately received after implementation... and whether additional value will be perceived by GPS features.

"Iger says the future of MagicBands can include even more meticulously collected interactive data that one day will allow guests to go cash- and credit card-free and order food in advance, sit at table& well know because of GPS positioning where youre sitting and well know what you ordered"

 

[SaraJayne]

I'm only on page 21 for reading, so forgive me if this has already been asked/answered.

When Disney says they don't market to children, is that a Disney child (9 and under)? So anyone over 10 would still be marketed to?

 

[doconeill]

Are you TRYING to confuse and freak people out on here now?!?!?!?

I think the operative words are FUTURE and CAN. As you said, this is NOT the technology that they going to be rolling out now with MagicBand. If they ever get there will probably depend on how this whole system is ultimately received after implementation... and whether additional value will be perceived by GPS features.

"Iger says the future of MagicBands can include even more meticulously collected interactive data that one day will allow guests to go cash- and credit card-free and order food in advance, sit at table& well know because of GPS positioning where youre sitting and well know what you ordered"

Yes, but I'll also point out that among those "future" features, it will one day "allow guests to go cash- and credit card-free and order food in advance" - featured already announced.

 

[ses1230]

Hmm...while scanning Deadline for bits of news for one of my other web sites, I came across this very interesting quote attributed to Iger last week:

Now, this is VERY interesting, because we know by the specs of the band that they are not GPS, and according to the attachments in Iger's letter, it is not GPS based. But it seems that he is in fact thinking in that direction - and I wonder if THAT had a lot to do with what transpired.

Isn't that already in place? I thought that the rose that you get at BOG lunch somehow transmits where you are sitting, so the server knows where to bring your food.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

I'm only on page 21 for reading, so forgive me if this has already been asked/answered.

When Disney says they don't market to children, is that a Disney child (9 and under)?

13 and under, I believe, from Iger's response.

Disney does not use personal information to market to children under age 13, does not personalize or target advertisements to an individual child, and never shares childrens personal information with any third party for their marketing purposes.

 

[SaraJayne]

Yeah, I thought so, too. He comes off as a bit rude in the tone he chose - as if he's offended to even be questioned. Doesn't seem like good PR to me.

I agree.