Can Disney admit that FP+ and MDE are a fail?

[Sammie]

I don't intend this to be snarky or sarcastic in any way, so please don't take it that way. This is a sincere question that so far, has largely eluded an answer here. Here goes: Insofar as this relates to FP+, does "It worked perfectly for us" mean that you found it to be a tremendous improvement over the old system, or simply that you have no complaints about it? There have been many, many posts such as yours where people are stating that "it worked for them", and there is no basis to question that conclusion at all. But what seems to be missing is the taking of the next step. Did you find that getting 3 FP+ per day at one park only with tiering and no repeats is better than the old system, just as good, or not as good, but perfectly acceptable? I think that it is very clear how the people who do not like FP+ come out in all of this. But there seems to be a lack of clarity coming from the other side. Lots of "we liked it" and "it worked for us" posts, which is fine. But it isn't necessarily the case that those responses are coming from people who view this as an improvement as opposed to merely a change that they can adjust to. Hope that made sense.

p.s. This question actually goes out to anyone who falls into the "we liked it" or "it worked for us" camp, and not just PrincessJo, so anyone is free to comment. (Obviously.)

We found it much better than the old system. Again it is personal touring style. We like to go to a park on arrival day since we have annual passes, so getting Legacy fastpasses for late afternoon or evening was not possible.

Also I like to know what time I am going to do something so I can plan other things, such as dinner around it.

Also as we age, we have been going to WDW over 30 years, the backtracking one did for Legacy was a waste for us and many times made us avoid getting any.

Also we are not rope drop fans. We like to go late and stay late. We enjoy having a nice breakfast in the morning, swim time, or boating, fishing before going to the parks.

So for us it is a huge improvement and 3 is fine. I was given 4 at MK during our test and that was nice.

I do think they will increase the number given and allow them to be used at more than park. I think that was in the long range plans all along.

And someone asked if they had planned all along to give more than 3 and park hop, why not do that from the beginning and not anger all these people.

And I laughed. Because those people if given 4 or even 5 at first would have still complained but after getting 3, they may very well be pleased to get one or two more and park hop.

Disney did not become the company they are without being smart.

 

[PlutoTheDog89]

Again, no. The end of the calendar year is Q1.

Interesting. Any reason why Disney does this? I've only heard of Oct-Nov-Dec being Q4.

Apologize if I missed your explanation. I didn't read the entire thread and don't feel like going digging.

 

[BuckeyeBama]

Interesting. Any reason why Disney does this? I've only heard of Oct-Nov-Dec being Q4.

Apologize if I missed your explanation. I didn't read the entire thread and don't feel like going digging.

A company's fiscal year begins on the day that the company is formed. It can be changed later, but most companies do not. Also, companies do not like to end a fiscal year at the wrong time and can set up the fiscal year to end when it is most advantageous to them.

I assume that Disney has a Sept 29-Sept 28 fiscal year for a reason, but it could be as simple as it was the day that the company started. It was founded in October of 1923.

 

[*NikkiBell*]

I'm not quite so sure how anyone could call the new program a failure if it is not even fully implemented yet.

 

[PlutoTheDog89]

I've given my thoughts on MB and MM+ from a business perspective, but having followed this thread a bit, I just need to vent.

First of all, no one likes change. It's a proven fact. The new Coke analogy is a perfect example. There's always going to be people who dislike the change and they will always have a good reason.

I'll see this objectively - I agree that it could be unfair that Disney does not allow off-site guests to book FP+ 60 days in advance. When my 60-day window opened for this past trip, I was on MDE at 12am on the dot to book my FP+ and was happy to get all of my choices. I could understand the frustration from off-site guests who do not get this luxury.

To that, I say that Disney has been moving closer and closer to becoming an all-inclusive resort. I understand that it is MUCH more expensive than an all-inclusive and that you have the choice to add meal plans, etc. but Disney certainly has an all-inclusive feel when you book your vacation with all the amenities. By staying on-site, you are rewarded with the FP+.

See it from another side for a moment. Let's say you're staying on site. You paid a ton of money to stay on site. Now, Disney allows those who stay off-site to book their FP+ 60 days in advance as well. Suddenly, FP+ for rides are unavailable, or there are less selections. Well that's not fair! You're paying to stay at the resort when you could be saving (even though some places are the same amount) and staying off-site! Imagine the discussions that would be happening on this board should that be the case!

Next, this is a FREE addition. A few years ago my family decided to take a year off from Disney. I had recently graduated from college and did not yet have a job. When I finally got a job, I was happy to find out that I had the entire week of Christmas off. It was too late to book a Disney vacation by then. The restaurants were all booked, and there was little availability at the resorts. I started looking into alternatives - Universal, etc. Other parks make you pay for their equivalent for FP. Disney includes it as an amenity!

Look, I see both sides. It could be seen as unfair, but many people shell out a ton of cash to stay on-site at Disney. If they started opening it to everyone, it'd be unfair to those paying for the full experience.

I went to Disney during Christmas - the peak season at Disney World. I did not wait on one line. I did not have FP+ for every ride, obviously. But, through planning and strategically picking my parks and FP+, I was able to manage. And guess what? When I was unable to make my FP+ reservation, I changed it, with ease. When Thunder Mountain went down, I was given the option to change my FP+ or come back at any time. I held out and rode the ride 2 hours later.

I'm not trying to sound snobby... but if you pay to stay on-site, you should be rewarded. That's what Disney does. And for the locals - I can understand the frustration.. but the same goes to those who have annual passes vs. those who only go a few times a year.

 

[sonofanarchy]

Right.

So... "New FP+ Sucks! People are leaving WDW in droves to go to Universal".

"What? Numbers are out? Disney is way up? Huge gains over Universal".

"Oh... well then it must be too early to tell".

Not sure where you're getting your "information" from, but where is Disney making huge gains over Universal? It's not in attendance. If it's in profits, that wouldn't surprise me. Universal is spending money hand over first in the parks. Disney is not.

 

[sonofanarchy]

WDW just announced yesterday that the first quarter sent an all time attendance record for WDW. I don't think MB or FP+ is going anywhere.

Amazing since the 1st quarter isn't even half way through yet.

And for I believe, the 1,482,458,258th time, this isn't about MB. It's about FP+.

 

[MrInfinity]

Not sure where you're getting your "information" from, but where is Disney making huge gains over Universal? It's not in attendance. If it's in profits, that wouldn't surprise me. Universal is spending money hand over first in the parks. Disney is not.

My info is from the Disney's conference call on its earnings ending Dec 28 held yesterday. Where is YOURS from? Or is it just your speculation?

Here's more:

•The MyMagic+ product at theme parks is having an impact. At Walt Disney World, close to 3K extra visitors a day can be serviced due to the innovation.

So they have confirmed that their increased profit and visitors are a direct result of MM+.

Also, Bob Iger "hinted" at big things to come for Star Wars...

"Nothing I say here today could ever capture or convey the magnitude global anticipation for this movie."

Thus, I'm anticipating big things at not just the box office but the parks as well. Investors are stoked.

 

[dwheaton]

My info is from the Disney's conference call on its earnings ending Dec 28 held yesterday. Where is YOURS from? Or is it just your speculation?

Here's more:

•The MyMagic+ product at theme parks is having an impact. At Walt Disney World, close to 3K extra visitors a day can be serviced due to the innovation.

So they have confirmed that their increased profit and visitors are a direct result of MM+.

Also, Bob Iger "hinted" at big things to come for Star Wars...

"Nothing I say here today could ever capture or convey the magnitude global anticipation for this movie."

Thus, I'm anticipating big things at not just the box office but the parks as well. Investors are stoked.

But is MM+ really what's expanded the capacity, or the Seven Dwarfs Mine Train and other Fantasyland updates. Also, I'm not sure I would trust Iger in terms of how they run the numbers for the capacity.

I'm excited for Star Wars, but they've been hinting at it for a year.

 

[Pooh2]

We went to Disney Thanksgiving week and were not up on fastpass plus. We did not book any fastpass plus until a few days into our trip (with help from concierge). Intially, it befuddled me. After we figured out how to change rides and times to our advantage, we liked the system.

We did not think we would be able to do any rides in Epcot the day after Thanksgiving with the heavy crowds, but it ended up being one of our best days of the week after sleeping in and doing laundry in the morning and not gettting there until 1pm.

So count me as one who looks forward to using the system as they make improvements over the next year or so.

 

[MrInfinity]

But is MM+ really what's expanded the capacity?

According to Disney, yes.

"At Walt Disney World, close to 3K extra visitors a day can be serviced due to the innovation."

 

[Shaden]

Exactly. I read there are 16 million visitors to the MK in a year. Yet there are only a few hundred out here being negative. The target customer is the millions of families that are not local to Florida but go there once every 1-3 years for a family vacation. THESE families shop, look, buy, eat, swim, drink, and spend spend spend because it is their big vacation.

Yep. I'd guess your numbers are pretty much right on.



Correct. DW would sooner see 10 "B" families get on 3 rides each than see 2 "A" familiies get on 10 rides each while each "B" family gets on 1 ride. All up, it is 30 rides. Disney wants them spread out. Not usurped by any group of ppl who know how to get more out of the system.
.

The problem is that those thinking it is a fail are basing that on the opinions of at best a few thousand.

That is nothing to Disney.

I love when people come here and make posts based on absolutely unfounded numbers.

Oh oh, wait I know.

There are 17 Million people to MK each year (that is actually more accurate, seriously if you are going to use numbers you read, at least use ones that are accurate) ... but 84.32198% of them aren't happy with only 3 FPs.

And while the people on the DIS only represent 1.456742% of Disney Visitors/fans, They actually account for 9.8123% of the revenue, they are such huge fans they spend more money. And Disney can't afford anything more than a 4% revenue loss, otherwise they will go out of business. And 47.32% of DISer's don't like FP+ (not that anyone outside if DIS thinks the same as many of the people here, so we can just pretend that the opinions of DIS members are held only within the virtual walls of this forum)... which means its just beyond their threshold of loss which means Disney is going out of business NEXT WEEK !!!!

They are going to keep this all secret though, then close the parks and keep all the reservation money currently kept. Seriously, I talked to a CM and they told me ... not just a CM, but a high ranking CM that I can't tell you about.

Yup, that's it.

 

[Shaden]

But is MM+ really what's expanded the capacity, or the Seven Dwarfs Mine Train and other Fantasyland updates. Also, I'm not sure I would trust Iger in terms of how they run the numbers for the capacity.

I'm excited for Star Wars, but they've been hinting at it for a year.

Indeed, if you compare the 2011 Attendance numbers vs the 2012 numbers, you can see on average there were 1079 more people per day in MK in 2012 than in 2011. No MM+ or FP+.

I do wonder how much that uptick is Fantasy land 2 .... or if they are actually thinking that people will cycle through the park faster with FP+.

If its the later this can be looked at in 2 ways, either people pop in and use their 3 FPs and are "Happy" and done and so they leave. Or, people go in, use their FPs, realize they aren't willing to wait in SB lines and leave the parks.

If its the later of those possibilities, I'd hardly call that an improvement.

 

[Laketravis]

According to Disney, yes.

"At Walt Disney World, close to 3K extra visitors a day can be serviced due to the innovation."

That is definitely NOT what Iger said during the conference call.

Also, listen carefully how Rasulo answered the question posed by Bank of America / Merrill Lynch in regards to how much more the project is going to cost:

"What we spend on MM+ and how we account for that I don't really want to get into that".

The 'excitement' was more about Frozen and franchise opportunities and cable deals. The questions about MM+ were from the standpoint of concern over costs and lack of documented returns.

But don't take my word for it, listen to it yourself.

 

[larryz]

On the MB side, they did cite that MyMagic+ allows them to handle more than 3,000 additional guests per day

Well, there's a little clue about how many additional FP slots they created...

 

[larryz]

That is definitely NOT what Iger said during the conference call.

Also, listen carefully how Rasulo answered the question posed by Bank of America / Merrill Lynch in regards to how much more the project is going to cost:

"What we spend on MM+ and how we account for that I don't really want to get into that".

The 'excitement' was more about Frozen and franchise opportunities and cable deals. The questions about MM+ were from the standpoint of concern over costs and lack of documented returns.

But don't take my word for it, listen to it yourself.

And if you play it backwards, it says, "The Yeti is dead."

 

[JimmyMartin]

Disney did not become the company they are without being smart.[/QUOTE]

To big to fail, right?

 

[JimmyMartin]

You think the would build the speedway if they had to do it over again?

 

[dfb]

-MM+, MDE, MB all digital system, once working properly, is efficient and cost effective -- A good thing!!

-FP+ a digital extension of FP-, once working properly, flexible, efficient and cost effective -- a good thing!!

3 FP limit, tier system, one park only is ridiculously too restrictive - a bad thing!!

I don't have a problem with the system. I do have a concern with what Disney will do with the system. It is a one of many control mechanisms Disney implements. It's just a very powerful one. I think it can easily be used to restrict or reward (manipulate) guest at will.

Example Guest A goes to MK uses his 3 FPs, stands in line for another ride, tires of this and leaves the park. Does not go to another park and his tracking device(MB) shows no activity in any of the stores. Send guest A an email offering an extra FP or 2 or maybe a seat for Wishes, etc to lure him back in. After a little while they'll know exactly what trips your trigger. Guest B goes to MK and he is a good little clone and is happy with his 3 FPs and stays in the park loving Disney. Send him an alert email letting him know there's a reservation open at Tony's so when he gets out of a 2 hour standby line for SM he can get some meatballs. Don't want to have guest B just wasting away in a long line when he could be spending some money somewhere else.

I'm not a hater. I love going to Disney. I'm a PAP, DVCer, D23er and so on. But standing in a long standby line is not magical to me. I use way more than 3 FPs a day. If I don't feel the magic or see the value I can go elsewhere.

If you don't feel the magic ( or if you do) let Disney know.

WDW.Guest.Communications@disneyworld.com

You have more power in this than you know.

"Fear is the path to the darkside. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hatred. Hatred leads to suffering."

Be a Rebel!!!

 

[redrosesix]

I think it's interesting that some people are so gleeful that they announced they could get 3k more people into MK per day over the Christmas season. But did you forget that they are the ones who control how many people are allowed into the parks? For me, it just means instead of cutting it off at 40k, they let an extra 3k people in. Now maybe it was easier on the CMs because of MM+, or maybe they just want to say that to make the project sound good even though they are over budget and past their deadlines. Don't forget that when they announce their earnings they are basically talking to their lenders ie the fund managers and analysts who hold or push their stock. They have to make it sound as good as possible, or give out bad news in a way that won't make the stock crash later (eg. we're considering a different direction that will work even better).

They also stated unequivocally that the increase in profits was due to an increase in prices.

Neither of these issues is support for or against FP+