Bombshell Obama Pastor Video

[DisneyDotty]

Who in the heck knows??/ Its truly baffling to me. These 'this only makes me want him more **thumps up** posts are making me . Proud your wanna-be President went to a racist church??

As a "thumbs-upper," let me explain what I meant.

When I first heard about Rev. Wright's sermons last week, I was heartsick. I had read Obama's books, listened to his speeches, researched his positions on what I thought were important issues and had wholeheartedly decided to give him my support.

So when I heard he went to a "racist" church, supported a "hateful" minister, I lost all faith in not just Obama, but the idea that we'll ever get a candidate worth supporting.

But then I started reading these threads. And their links. And I listened to more speeches. And read more articles. And after careful, thoughtful study, I realized that Rev. Wright hasn't really said much that I disagree with. I do not think he's racist. His comments, though at times offensive and most times provocative and upsetting, were not entirely without merit. (Okay, there's a few I don't buy into--but I try not to be a conspiracy theorist.) And most importantly, I'm not voting for him. He's not running for election.

I buy Obama's rebuttal. I believe that he doesn't support the more controversial, hateful statements Wright has made. I support him as my candidate because I believe he's our best chance to correct the mistakes of the past 8 years and move our country forward as a unified people.

I do think this Wright mess has offered us the chance to have serious discussions about race in America. I look forward to the day that it is a nonissue for Whites and Blacks alike.

I get that others do not trust/support/like/believe Obama. I've been feeling the same way for the past 8 years towards our current President. But I do thank you all for forcing me to do some digging and really think about my decision.

And that's why I gave the .

 

[LohKee]

I have no interest in having a 'calm discussion' about a man and his racist Uncle. And quite frankly it disgusts me that anyone can defend it.

SO - thats how all my posts will be rolling. Again, feel free to ignore me.

So which is it? Is the church racist, or is the pastor racist? Other than the youtube videos what concrete evidence do you have to back your assessment?

 

[disney4us2002]

Nah, you didn't cause AIDS. But maybe if the victims were not primarily poor minorities with drug habits and/or working in the sex trade industry there might have been more done, more quickly. I think that was the real message.

See, I told you I would try to glean what I could...

You seem to have this a bit backwards. If people didn't choose to use drugs and work in the sex industry then they might not have contracted AIDS. There is NO personal responsibility here at all?

I really haven't heard this "govt. gave blacks AIDS" stuff before. The first person I remember discussing or having AIDS at all was Rock Hudson in the mid 80's. It seems to me that the "blame" if there was one at all was that gays caused it. People loved Rock Hudson and I think there was much discussion of finding a cure and how horrible the disease was (is).

As for BO trying to compare his grandmother to Rev. Wright or giving him the title "uncle" the fact is he isn't his uncle and there is no comparison. His grandmother was his grandmother. Ministers, moral compasses, and spiritual advisors are all chosen. Relatives aren't chosen but can certainly be excluded from our lives if necessary. My father is an alcoholic and I don't see him. My kids don't see him. Period. People are responsible for their life choices.

 

[chris1gill]

As a "thumbs-upper," let me explain what I meant.

When I first heard about Rev. Wright's sermons last week, I was heartsick. I had read Obama's books, listened to his speeches, researched his positions on what I thought were important issues and had wholeheartedly decided to give him my support.

So when I heard he went to a "racist" church, supported a "hateful" minister, I lost all faith in not just Obama, but the idea that we'll ever get a candidate worth supporting.

But then I started reading these threads. And their links. And I listened to more speeches. And read more articles. And after careful, thoughtful study, I realized that Rev. Wright hasn't really said much that I disagree with. I do not think he's racist. His comments, though at times offensive and most times provocative and upsetting, were not entirely without merit. (Okay, there's a few I don't buy into--but I try not to be a conspiracy theorist.) And most importantly, I'm not voting for him. He's not running for election.

I buy Obama's rebuttal. I believe that he doesn't support the more controversial, hateful statements Wright has made. I support him as my candidate because I believe he's our best chance to correct the mistakes of the past 8 years and move our country forward as a unified people.

I do think this Wright mess has offered us the chance to have serious discussions about race in America. I look forward to the day that it is a nonissue for Whites and Blacks alike.

I get that others do not trust/support/like/believe Obama. I've been feeling the same way for the past 8 years towards our current President. But I do thank you all for forcing me to do some digging and really think about my decision.

And that's why I gave the .

DisneyDotty, I will give you a big thumbs up because I could have written your post, you just did it for me, so thank you

 

[DisneyDotty]

DisneyDotty, I will give you a big thumbs up because I could have written your post, you just did it for me, so thank you

I gotta tell ya, I've been stewing about this for the past week, and have just now come to this resolution. And your posts helped a lot, so thank you!
(And thanks to the DIS--who knew a Disney planning board could have such a profound impact?!)
I just have to believe this will all have a positive outcome.

 

[chris1gill]

I gotta tell ya, I've been stewing about this for the past week, and have just now come to this resolution. And your posts helped a lot, so thank you!
(And thanks to the DIS--who knew a Disney planning board could have such a profound impact?!)
I just have to believe this will all have a positive outcome.

Well, you sound like you looked at the issues, at the candidates and came to a resolution in your mind I do not take my vote lightly, I've researched the candidates, and like you, Obama is my choice Now may I take this opportunity to invite you to the Obama thread where things are much more civil most of the time and we are very often hopeful for a better outcome!

 

[FayeW]

You seem to have this a bit backwards. If people didn't choose to use drugs and work in the sex industry then they might not have contracted AIDS. There is NO personal responsibility here at all?

I really haven't heard this "govt. gave blacks AIDS" stuff before. The first person I remember discussing or having AIDS at all was Rock Hudson in the mid 80's. It seems to me that the "blame" if there was one at all was that gays caused it. People loved Rock Hudson and I think there was much discussion of finding a cure and how horrible the disease was (is).

As for BO trying to compare his grandmother to Rev. Wright or giving him the title "uncle" the fact is he isn't his uncle and there is no comparison. His grandmother was his grandmother. Ministers, moral compasses, and spiritual advisors are all chosen. Relatives aren't chosen but can certainly be excluded from our lives if necessary. My father is an alcoholic and I don't see him. My kids don't see him. Period. People are responsible for their life choices.

I don't have anything backwards. I merely gave my interpretation of his comments. CathrynRose seemed to think he was saying that the US "caused" AIDS. I think he was saying that inaction by the government allowed the disease to permeate the segment of society that was most vulnerable. That is what I think he meant. YMMV.

 

[Fitswimmer]

I don't have anything backwards. I merely gave my interpretation of his comments. CathrynRose seemed to think he was saying that the US "caused" AIDS. I think he was saying that inaction by the government allowed the disease to permeate the segment of society that was most vulnerable. That is what I think he meant. YMMV.

I had some gay friends during the 80's and early 90's that would have "Amen'd" that idea. Especially considering that our President at the time couldn't even say the word AIDS, let alone provide funding for the CDC to study it.

As for the question raised regarding what Obama would have to do to make me "take of my rose colored glasses": start a war with a country that was no threat to us, lie to the American people about the reasons for starting that war, deny proper equipment and supplies to the soldiers fighting that war, eviscerate or outright ignore the Fourth Amendment, ignore habeas corpus, provide tax breaks and financial assistance to banks and corporations while telling individual Americans to be "personally responsible", veto a bill designed to provide health care for children.....

 

[chobie]

CR, if you decide to attend this particular church, you might want to take some others with you. Also, this Sunday is Easter and it's likely to be quite packed.

And before someone asks, yes, I would indeed be fearful of attending this particular church given the reaction of the congregation during the racist sermons and the spotlight that is currently directed upon them.

I don't think she has anything to fear, but I do think it is disrespectful to attend a church for the purpose of catching them saying something that you can then use to prove a point on internet forum.

If her purpose is to attend this church with an open mind to see for herself then by all means she should attend.


BTW, I 'm sure there will be lots of noBamas trying to get into that church do catch them saying something wrong, and I'm sure it will be all over the media if they succeeed.

 

[lovetomow]

I don't think she has anything to fear, but I do think it is disrespectful to attend a church for the purpose of catching them saying something that you can then use to prove a point on internet forum.

If her purpose is to attend this church with an open mind to see for herself then by all means she should attend.


BTW, I 'm sure there will be lots of noBamas trying to get into that church do catch them saying something wrong, and I'm sure it will be all over the media if they succeeed.

Funny how your more concerned with who attends the church vs what hate speech is spewed out of the church!

 

[chobie]

Funny how you more concerned with who attends the church vs what hate speech is spewed out of the church!

I am concerned about the hate speech that spews from churches and that includes the many, many conservative Christian churches that spew hate against gays. However, I respect their right to say these things and I would not disrespect any church or religion by attending them just to find fault with them. YMMV.


BTW, when my DH's uncle died of AIDS back in the 80's there was a huge fight in his family that left the family broken apart and not talking to each other for years. My DH's other uncle (the dying man's brother) and nephew both believed, because it was preached in their churches, that he "deserved to die because AIDS was God's punishment for being gay." The other uncle tried to "save" him on his death bed while the man was in a delusional stage of dying from AIDS.

Many churches preached that AIDS was God's punishment for being gay. That is the hateful spewing as well, but I didn't run to my uncle's church or his nephew's church to catch them saying those hateful things, because I respect places of worship even if I don't agree with the message.

 

[LuvDuke]

What we are witnessing is the very reason why the Founding Fathers put up a wall of separation between church and state. Implicit in the belief in this wall of separation was the idea that you could go to wherever you want to worship, but it stops at the public policy/government line. That is the separation of church and state.

The idea that we are even having this discussion should send chills through most Americans. The idea that some would deliberately infiltrate a house of worship just so they could do whatever the hell they think they're going to do should be roundly condemned by all Americans. The idea that some would appoint themselves the authority to investigate is truly a step in the Bizarro world.

Don't like someone's religion, don't vote for them. But don't complain when your religion gets thrown back in your face and it used to judge you. If you want religious freedom, extend it to others. If you want privacy, stay the hell out of someone else's private business.

What a fresh idea.

 

[LuvDuke]

Funny how your more concerned with who attends the church vs what hate speech is spewed out of the church!

Damned right I'm concerned when someone appoints themselves an investigative authority based on nothing more than political BS. Have we really sunk this low? Is there no decency left? Everything is fair game? There is no privacy?

Keep defending the investigators. It'll get around to you and the investigators eventually. Then remember where you and the investigator stood on the issue.

What goes around comes around and karma bites us all in the *** sooner or later.

 

[CowboyCO]

As a "thumbs-upper," let me explain what I meant.

When I first heard about Rev. Wright's sermons last week, I was heartsick. I had read Obama's books, listened to his speeches, researched his positions on what I thought were important issues and had wholeheartedly decided to give him my support.

So when I heard he went to a "racist" church, supported a "hateful" minister, I lost all faith in not just Obama, but the idea that we'll ever get a candidate worth supporting.

But then I started reading these threads. And their links. And I listened to more speeches. And read more articles. And after careful, thoughtful study, I realized that Rev. Wright hasn't really said much that I disagree with. I do not think he's racist. His comments, though at times offensive and most times provocative and upsetting, were not entirely without merit. (Okay, there's a few I don't buy into--but I try not to be a conspiracy theorist.) And most importantly, I'm not voting for him. He's not running for election.

I buy Obama's rebuttal. I believe that he doesn't support the more controversial, hateful statements Wright has made. I support him as my candidate because I believe he's our best chance to correct the mistakes of the past 8 years and move our country forward as a unified people.

I do think this Wright mess has offered us the chance to have serious discussions about race in America. I look forward to the day that it is a nonissue for Whites and Blacks alike.

I get that others do not trust/support/like/believe Obama. I've been feeling the same way for the past 8 years towards our current President. But I do thank you all for forcing me to do some digging and really think about my decision.

And that's why I gave the .

So Rev. Wright hasn't said much that you disagree with? I'll list the highlights that I disagree with:

1. "The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law, and then wants us to sing God bless America? No, no, no! Not God bless America! God DAMN America! (cheers) -- it's in the Bible -- for killing innocent people! (cheers) God DAMN America for treating her citizens as less than human!"

Do you agree that the governement gave African-Americans illicit drugs, passed a three-strikes to keep the black man oppressed and that in doing those things has treated black people as less than human?

2. Jesus was a poor black man who lived in a country and who lived in a culture, that was controlled by rich white people! The Romans were rich. The Romans were Italians, which means they were European, which means they were white -- and the Romans ran everything in Jesus' country. It just came to me within the past few weeks, y'all, why so many folk are hatin' on Barack Obama. He doesn't fit the model!

CONGREGATION: Right!

WRIGHT: He ain't white, he ain't rich, and he ain't privileged.

Do you agree that so many folks are hating Obama because he is black? Do you believe with an annual income of $1.2 million that Obama isn't rich? (He makes more than 15 times our annual household income)? Do you believe that as a senator nad his wife's corporate board offers that they are not priviledged? Do you believe in the racist tone of Wright? Then Wright uses this foundation of falsehood to further break the law by preaching political endorsement from the pulpit (illegal) and says:

3. Hillary never had to worry about being pulled over in her car as a black man driving in the wrong! I am sick of Negroes who just do not get it! Hillary was not a black boy raised in a single parent home! Barack was. Barack knows what it means to be a black man living in a country and a culture that is controlled by rich white people! Hillary can never know that! Hillary ain't never been called a ******! Hillary has never had her people defined as nonpersons! Hillary ain't had to work twice as hard just to get accepted by the rich white folk who run everything, or to get a passing grade when you know you are smarter than their C-students sitting in the White House. Hillary ain't never had her own people say she wasn't white enough!

Hillary is married to Bill and Bill have been good to us? No, he ain't! Bill did us just like he did Monica Lewinsky!

CONGREGATION: (cheers)

WRIGHT: He was riding dirty! (Grinds his hips in sexual way)

Do you agree that Bill Clinton screwed the African American Community? Do you agree with using mock sexual acts to drive home a point so their is no confusion what he means in front of children in a church? Clinton did more for creating "opportunity" and investment into inner cities for African Americans than any president before him.

4. "We bombed Hiroshima! We bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye. We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians, and black South Africans, and now we are indignant (cheers) because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back into our own front yards! (cheers and applause) America's chickens are coming home...to roost."

Do you believe that the use of nuclear weapons to end WWII, saving hundreds of thousands of American lives by not having to invade the Japanese homeland was terrorism? Do you agree that 9/11 was earned by our "terrorist support overseas?"

5." ”We’ve got more black men in prison than there are in college,” “Racism is alive and well. Racism is how this country was founded and how this country is still run. No black man will ever be considered for president, no matter how hard you run Jesse [Jackson] and no black woman can ever be considered for anything outside what she can give with her body.”

So who is Michelle Obama "getting dirty with" to get her degrees and jobs? Who are all the other succesful African American women "doing" do advance their careers? Says no black man would ever be considered to run for president, when there was a strong movement to get Colin Powell to run in both 1996 and 2000. Now, Obama is certainly a strong candidate. Should Michael Steele continue to gain experience in leadership, it may be an option for him as well. I thought that Harold Ford had a promising career until he tried to jump to the Senate too early in his career and lost.


6. “America is still the No. 1 killer in the world. . . . We are deeply involved in the importing of drugs, the exporting of guns, and the training of professional killers . . . We bombed Cambodia, Iraq and Nicaragua, killing women and children while trying to get public opinion turned against Castro and Ghadhafi . . . We put [Nelson] Mandela in prison and supported apartheid the whole 27 years he was there. We believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God.”

The United States did not support Apartheid throughout Mandela's incarceration. In fact, the US opposed it all the way back to the Carter Administration and passed legislation to force American Corprations to divest from South Africa in the Reagan Administration and employed economic sanctions against them. Do you agree that America believe in white supremacy more than we believe in God?


7.“We started the AIDS virus . . . We are only able to maintain our level of living by making sure that Third World people live in grinding poverty. . . .”

Do you believe this? The current administration has provided more aids and malaria relief funds for Africa than all administrations before him combined. Bush is highly praised in Africa for these efforts.


I think it would be more accurate for Obama supporters to say that they continue to support Obama's decision to stay and attend this church and include his pastor on his inner circle of advisors despite all of this. Just admit that 20 years of racist sermons and his embracing of this message by his actions doesn't concern you.

 

[Fitswimmer]

What we are witnessing is the very reason why the Founding Fathers put up a wall of separation between church and state. Implicit in the belief in this wall of separation was the idea that you could go to wherever you want to worship, but it stops at the public policy/government line. That is the separation of church and state.

The idea that we are even having this discussion should send chills through most Americans. The idea that some would deliberately infiltrate a house of worship just so they could do whatever the hell they think they're going to do should be roundly condemned by all Americans. The idea that some would appoint themselves the authority to investigate is truly a step in the Bizarro world.

Don't like someone's religion, don't vote for them. But don't complain when your religion gets thrown back in your face and it used to judge you. If you want religious freedom, extend it to others. If you want privacy, stay the hell out of someone else's private business.

What a fresh idea.

 

[charlie,nj]

3/20/08


"Clinton doubles lead in Pennsylvania"







.

 

[FayeW]

4. "We bombed Hiroshima! We bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye. We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians, and black South Africans, and now we are indignant (cheers) because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back into our own front yards! (cheers and applause) America's chickens are coming home...to roost."

Do you believe that the use of nuclear weapons to end WWII, saving hundreds of thousands of American lives by not having to invade the Japanese homeland was terrorism? Do you agree that 9/11 was earned by our "terrorist support overseas?"

Dropping the bombs in Japan was absolutely, positively, unequivocably an act of terrorism. Just like them bombing Pearl Harbour to begin with was an act of terrorism.

How anybody could even ask that question is beyond me. Do you not understand that to the countries that you bomb and invade you are the terrorists? You can't be the bully on the playground and not expect somebody to throw a rock at you when you aren't looking.

I am not saying you deserved 9/11. I am saying that given your role on the world stage and the manner in which you conduct yourselves there, the attacks perpetuated against US interests around the world are not surprising.

 

[CathrynRose]

[COLOR="Purple"]Dropping the bombs in Japan was absolutely, positively, unequivocably an act of terrorism. Just like them bombing Pearl Harbour to begin with was an act of terrorism.

How anybody could even ask that question is beyond me. Do you not understand that to the countries that you bomb and invade you are the terrorists? You can't be the bully on the playground and not expect somebody to throw a rock at you when you aren't looking.[/COLOR]
I am not saying you deserved 9/11. I am saying that given your role on the world stage and the manner in which you conduct yourselves there, the attacks perpetuated against US interests around the world are not surprising.

OMG!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! **must keep out of these threads, GEEEZ*


Japan was the bully, pal. We did what I encourage my children to do if a bully punched 'em in the nose....lay 'em out. They touched you first - they started it. They awaked the sleeping giant.... I believe is what was said.

 

[NewJersey]

3/20/08


"Clinton doubles lead in Pennsylvania"







.

Charlie, I had no idea you were a Clinton supporter! Great to see you supporting a Democrat.

 

[sassyat30]

As a "thumbs-upper," let me explain what I meant.

When I first heard about Rev. Wright's sermons last week, I was heartsick. I had read Obama's books, listened to his speeches, researched his positions on what I thought were important issues and had wholeheartedly decided to give him my support.

So when I heard he went to a "racist" church, supported a "hateful" minister, I lost all faith in not just Obama, but the idea that we'll ever get a candidate worth supporting.

But then I started reading these threads. And their links. And I listened to more speeches. And read more articles. And after careful, thoughtful study, I realized that Rev. Wright hasn't really said much that I disagree with. I do not think he's racist. His comments, though at times offensive and most times provocative and upsetting, were not entirely without merit. (Okay, there's a few I don't buy into--but I try not to be a conspiracy theorist.) And most importantly, I'm not voting for him. He's not running for election.

I buy Obama's rebuttal. I believe that he doesn't support the more controversial, hateful statements Wright has made. I support him as my candidate because I believe he's our best chance to correct the mistakes of the past 8 years and move our country forward as a unified people.

I do think this Wright mess has offered us the chance to have serious discussions about race in America. I look forward to the day that it is a nonissue for Whites and Blacks alike.

I get that others do not trust/support/like/believe Obama. I've been feeling the same way for the past 8 years towards our current President. But I do thank you all for forcing me to do some digging and really think about my decision.

And that's why I gave the .

I could have written this...great post.