Anyone hear recent news about Terri Schiavo?

[The Mystery Machine]

Originally posted by Disney Doll
If anyone kept me in a PVS like, this, I'd come and haunt them when I did die, and make their life miserable.

There are worse things than dying, and this is one of them. I have made it very clear to my DH, friends, and family that I do not wish to be kept alive ina PVS like this.

Quality of life is far more important than quantity of time.

I have to agree with this. But my family knows my wishes. It really is a tough situation.

However I am glad we do have this "situation". Remember when EVERYONE was on a feeding tube (about 13yrs ago) ??? They wouldn't allow people to BE let go. It was horrid.

 

[ca859093]

Originally posted by peachgirl
Unless she had specified otherswise, yes I would. Since she is in a persistent vegetative state she certainly can't make any decisions for herself.

This subject was discussed months ago and I provided link after link, but the fact of the matter is that every single court that has ever ruled on this case has always sided with the husband and doctors who say she will never recover.

Terri Schiavo will not "starve" to death. Her death will be from dehydration which is not a painful way to die.

I say her parents are selfish because if they truly loved their daughter they would let her die in peace. This poor girl has been examined and poked and prodded enough.

Have to agree. I really don't understand people who say that Terri will recover. She won't. It is unfortunate but it is the truth. They say they have proof on the video she can do things but that is just a stinpet of the whole video where she is not doing anything. Until the money came into play the dad never even went and saw her. This is a very sad case, and why everyone should get a living will. Jeb should not even touched this case. UGH frustrating.

 

[Lisa F]

Whenever people talk about how cruel and inhumane it is to withhold nutrition from this woman it makes me cringe, because my husband and his family were faced with the same decision a few years ago. His grandmother was aspirating food into her lungs when she ate and the family was told that they either put a feeding tube into her or she would either starve to death or die from an infection in her lungs. She was barely eating anything anyway, never spoke, never moved. She would occasionally have moments of lucidity when she did remember who her sons were, sometimes remembered who her grandchildren were and never remembered who I was (I had only known her for 10 years at the point when she died).

My husband's father and uncle had spent years bickering over her care and how much assistance she needed and when she needed to go into a nursing home etc, but I was somewhat relieved that they actually both agreed that it was time to let her go. So they, as you said, "withheld nutrition" from her and opted to not put in the feeding tube. This was after talks with doctors (including one of her grandsons who is a cardiac surgeon) who assured the family that basically what would happen would be that her already very slow metabolism (from lying in bed all the time and not moving) would slow even more until it just stopped and that she would not be in any pain.


Even though she had been going downhill for a while and logically everyone knew that it was her time to go and it seemed merciful, that didn't make it any easier on the people who were left behind. The image of my brother in law, who is normally brash and slightly obnoxious, sobbing rawly and clinging to me because he could barely stand up in his grief at the funeral will forever be etched in my mind. The whole idea that dealing with the loss of a loved one is somehow more easy when you have years to prepare for the inevitability is a bunch of crap.

It's very very difficult to deal with losing someone you love and the knowledge that you will never see them again. I can only imagine how much MORE difficult that is for a parent to lose a child. You don't even have the comfort of it just being the natural order of life. It's not that I don't sympathize with the parents... I really and truly do. BUT I don't believe for a second that their fight for Terry is anything but selfish. They don't want to feel that incredible anguish that you feel when you lose someone you love. I don't really blame them for feeling the way they do but I do think at some point you just have to let people go, regardless of how difficult it will be for you to lose them.

 

[JayBee]

Originally posted by Mamu
Whenever I see news articles on this very sad situation, my heart aches. First for the parents who love their daughter and don't want to lose her.

But the sad fact is they have already lost her....it's like being at a perpetual wake, staring at a body pumped with chemicals.

 

[peachgirl]

BUT I don't believe for a second that their fight for Terry is anything but selfish. They don't want to feel that incredible anguish that you feel when you lose someone you love. I don't really blame them for feeling the way they do but I do think at some point you just have to let people go, regardless of how difficult it will be for you to lose them.

Very well said.

It "sounds" awful to withhold nutrition and fluids, but to say that you're starving them to death or that they will suffer a horrible death just isn't true.

 

[sha_lyn]

I would hope that since she was happily married to him when this happened that he would know her and know what her wishes were

From most accounts they were not happily married.
Her parents, other family members and friends say that she would not want the feeding tube removed, as it would go against her religious beliefs. Why should one man (who gained a lot of money in a law suit to provide her lifelong care) be able to say what she would want when every other person who knew her say otherwise?

They say they have proof on the video she can do things but that is just a stinpet of the whole video where she is not doing anything

OK so because in most of the video she is doing nothing, the things that she is doing does not count?

Lets say someone takes an 8 hr video of me. Well they happen to take in at night while I am sleeping and they only get 15 min of me awake. Does that prove I can do nothing but sleep?

yes it is a very sad situation, but I really and truly do not believe that withholding food and water is humane. We don't kill condemned prisoners that way, it would be ruled cruel and inhumane. Why should an innocent woman be put to death this way?

 

[SandraM]

Even aside from the fact that I believe Terri is not PVS, and that with therapy, she could be fed orally (but her husband has not permitted swallowing tests, depite the fact that she swallows her own saliva, not drooling like PVS patients normally do), I have serious concerns that her husband's assurances "she wouldn't have wanted to live like this" only came out AFTER he was awarded $600,000 in November 1992, and an award of $1.4 million was made for Terri's care and rehabilitation. This rehabilitation was denied shortly afterwards, and a DNR placed on her chart in February 1993.
Would the $1.4 million have been awarded if Terri's husband's later stance had been known beforehand? I think not.

In court, Michael Schiavo swore to the jury that "I believe in
the vows that I took with my wife, through sickness, in health, for richer or poorer. I married my wife because I love her and I want to spend the rest of my life with her. I'm going to do that." Schiavo also testified to the malpractice jury that he was going to become a nurse in order to assist in the care and rehabilitation of his wife, also, presented an expert witness who testified that Terri would have a normal life span and would need extensive and expensive rehabilitation care throughout her life.
At no time during his testimony to the malpractice jury did Schiavo intimate that Terri "wanted to die" or did not want to be sustained on "anything artificial" or the like.

It just doesn't seem right to me that Terri can be awarded a sum for her care, which is then used to end her life.

 

[peachgirl]

From most accounts they were not happily married.

Not true. The only ones who claim that it was an unhappy marriage are her parents and those who side with them. This issue has been brought up in appeal after appeal. There are no facts to back up that claim.

I really and truly do not believe that withholding food and water is humane.

Whether you believe it or not, it is humane. She will not suffer, she will feel no pain. That's just a fact.

The money issue is a two way street. The husband claims the parents only got involved after he refused to give them a "cut" on the settlement.

 

[MosMom]

Originally posted by SandraM
Even aside from the fact that I believe Terri is not PVS, and that with therapy, she could be fed orally (but her husband has not permitted swallowing tests, depite the fact that she swallows her own saliva, not drooling like PVS patients normally do), I have serious concerns that her husband's assurances "she wouldn't have wanted to live like this" only came out AFTER he was awarded $600,000 in November 1992, and an award of $1.4 million was made for Terri's care and rehabilitation. This rehabilitation was denied shortly afterwards, and a DNR placed on her chart in February 1993.
Would the $1.4 million have been awarded if Terri's husband's later stance had been known beforehand? I think not.

In court, Michael Schiavo swore to the jury that "I believe in
the vows that I took with my wife, through sickness, in health, for richer or poorer. I married my wife because I love her and I want to spend the rest of my life with her. I'm going to do that." Schiavo also testified to the malpractice jury that he was going to become a nurse in order to assist in the care and rehabilitation of his wife, also, presented an expert witness who testified that Terri would have a normal life span and would need extensive and expensive rehabilitation care throughout her life.
At no time during his testimony to the malpractice jury did Schiavo intimate that Terri "wanted to die" or did not want to be sustained on "anything artificial" or the like.

It just doesn't seem right to me that Terri can be awarded a sum for her care, which is then used to end her life.

Thank you!

 

[Keli]

Hum, I really don't think her husband should be allowed to keep the money that was allotted for her care. Should her feeding tube be removed then it would be logical that the money that should have been used for her care be given back to the people that paid it in the first place (I'm assuming an insurance agency?). Of course her dh should be allowed to keep the $600,000 he was awarded. He has suffered the loss of his wife and deserves the compensation they gave him.

 

[peachgirl]

Hum, I really don't think her husband should be allowed to keep the money that was allotted for her care.

By all reports there is very little of that money left. The money that was awarded for her care was set aside for just that purpose. He does not have access to it for his personal use.

Anyone who thought he had abused his guadianship responsibilites could bring the issue before the court. Her parents have asked to have the guardianship changed just for that reason. The courts ruled there was no evidence that he had and ruled against them.

Should she die, he would not receive the funds allotted for her care if any remain.

 

[SandraM]

From terrisfight.org :

MYTH: Terri's Medical Trust fund has been used to care for her.
FACT: The following expenditures have been paid directly from Terri's Medical Trust fund, with the approval of Judge George Greer:
Summary of expenses paid from Terri’s 1.2 Million Dollar medical trust fund (jury awarded 1992)
NOTE: In his November 1993 Petition Schiavo alleges the 1993 guardianship asset balance as $761,507.50

$10,668.05 Atty Gwyneth Stanley
$65,607.00 Atty Deborah Bushnell
$7,404.95 Atty Steve Nilson
$1,500.00 Atty Pacarek
$4,511.95 Atty Richard Pearse (GAL)
$397,249.99 Atty George Felos

Other

$55,459.85 1st Union/South Trust Bank
$10,929.95 Michael Schiavo

Total $545,852.34

So, as I see it, the money for her care and rehabilitation is going towards legal fees to end her life.

I'm sure that award would not have been made if it was going to be used to make Terri die.

 

[MinnieYC]

No matter how you feel about Terri Schiavo's personal story, I think that the main take-home point is to write your own living will, and also talk to your next of kin about what you want. It's not a fun subject, but the effort can be worth so much, should the worst happen. In addition to a written living will, tell your family about your wishes, so they hear it from your own mouth. If possible, talk to different relatives at the same time. My DH and my parents know what I would want in various situations, so there will be much less of a chance of disagreement.

It's not fun, it's sad, but face it- anyone can get hit by a car tomorrow. For our families' sake, let's have some things determined.

 

[peachgirl]

So, as I see it, the money for her care and rehabilitation is going towards legal fees to end her life.

If you believe the information posted on that site, yes. However, they are not unbiased so I wouldn't take the information they post as undisputed facts.

Even if it is accurate, the costs would've been much, much less if her parents didn't continually drag this matter back into court. They file appeal after appeal and each one is eventually denied.

That costs money and I don't think the husband is out of line using those funds to defray the costs. Obviously it's legal or he wouldn't be able to do so.

No matter how you feel about Terri Schiavo's personal story, I think that the main take-home point is to write your own living will, and also talk to your next of kin about what you want

 

[bsnyder]

Agreed, Minnie. The only good thing that can come from this sad case is to heighten the awareness of the need to put one's wishes in writing. Don't just rely on a conversation with your spouse or parents, or children.

I have very mixed feelings about this case. I believe strongly in the sanctity of life, and have a basic mistrust of any type of legal intervention. I feel for Teri's parents.

But as I stated when we debated this before, I do have sympathy for Michael Shiavo as well. My sister was the first newspaper reporter (St. Petersburg Times) to ever do a story on Teri. The context of the story wasn't anything controversial. It was an attempt to publicize Teri's condition and raise money to help with her care. At that time, Michael and Teri's parents were very much working together, hoping that Teri's condition would improve. Michael and Teri were living with Teri's parents and he was providing round the clock care for her. And searching for a miracle.

It was only after he had exhausted all the medical avenues, and given up hope that the split between them occured. So I can see why he'd become very bitter and mistrustful of the rumors and lies they have spread about him since then. I realize they are desperate to keep their daughter alive, but in their desperation, they crossed a line, IMO.

 

[ripleysmom]

Her parents are wrong for intervening. In fact, I just told my husband if I ever wind up like that I want him to off me, period. Can any of you honestly sit there and say that you would want to live like this woman is?

 

[DisMN]

Originally posted by ripleysmom
Her parents are wrong for intervening. In fact, I just told my husband if I ever wind up like that I want him to off me, period. Can any of you honestly sit there and say that you would want to live like this woman is?

Yes but then, sadly, your husband who loved you enough to NOT see that you live the rest of your life in a vegetative state would be tried for murder.


Our country and society as a whole really needs to consider what it is that motivates us to keep people alive at ALL COSTS.

 

[bsnyder]

Originally posted by ripleysmom
Her parents are wrong for intervening. In fact, I just told my husband if I ever wind up like that I want him to off me, period. Can any of you honestly sit there and say that you would want to live like this woman is?

RM, it's not enough to tell your husband. You need to put it in writing.

 

[bsnyder]

Originally posted by DisMN

Our country and society as a whole really needs to consider what it is that motivates us to keep people alive at ALL COSTS.

Yep, we're long overdue for that debate.

 

[manning]

I've seen this happen.

Everyone has a firm position on what to do until it is their turn to make the decision. The vast majority hesitated in their decision before making it.