AKV models will open next week...and...

[tjkraz]

What I find a great feature is the UNDERGROUND parking! No more 3000 degree cars and no more endlessly long parking lots. They must be building the new villas up on the second floor, like the MK in order to create that "underground" parking.

Sort of. It's not "underground" parking...it's first floor parking. The cars will still sit at ground level with the rooms beginning on the second floor.

Looking at the diagrams pulled from the web, there will also be a lot of standard outdoor parking.

 

[Psychometrika]

Yep - as I said, it would have to be the first floor as digging a foot down into Florida sand hits the water table.

 

[BCV23]

I don't see how that's possible. I wouldn't have expected to see anything on the public website, but there's nothing prohibiting DVC from providing additional details to existing members who are eligible to purchase.

Besides, it's not like DVC is prohibited by law from selling to non-members. That's their own doing. DVC needs to be registered in a state to sell to any residents, regardless of whether they are existing customers or not. If DVC is LEGALLY able to sell to current members living in FL, CA, OH and many other states, then they are LEGALLY able to sell to non-members as well.



I can't speak for BCV specifically but I've frequently heard that DVC has offered new resorts to current members before non-members.

I think the irony to all of this is that DVC apparently spent more effort working out the specifics of this tapestry thing than they did putting together useful information for those contemplating add-ons. Pretty arrogant, IMO.

Are you familiar with the timeshare laws in each state in which DVC does business? I'm certainly not.

Does anyone remember if BWV, VB or HH went on sale early to members? I know BCV did not, SimbaCub knows WL did not and I am almost certain that SSR didn't either.

Of course, we have no idea how much time or effort DVC has put into readying materials for those who want to addon or buy for the first time. Those materials are not out yet. For those who were excited enough to buy in advance, it obviously didn't matter. For those of us still contemplating, no harm no foul either. I see no arrogance on DVC's part rather a real excitement among some DVC DISsers. I'm sure we'll all know more details soon.

 

[Psychometrika]

I couldn't begin to know how DVC thinks ... but ... it would seem to me a logical first step in wanting to assess appeal, etc. Current DVCers are already very familiar with the basics of the program. It's hard to show a newbie why they should join without models. Another thought ... AKV will open initially with only the top two floors of the existing resort, meaning, few rooms. Perhaps they wanted to limit purchasers temporarily to ensure there were enough spots for existing DVCers to purchase before opening to the general public. When reservations open, it's going to be tough those first couple of years. Then there's SSR. That isn't sold out yet. Perhaps the bean counters worked out how long they needed to sell out SSR or something before they began to sell the AKV to the general public. Who knows, but just speculation.

They've done this sort of thing in other areas, albeit not in real estate. Offering advanced and/or reduced fee tickets to events etc. for passholders, DVCers, credit card holders, etc. This perhaps was a natural extension for them. This is a business, ultimately, know matter how many mouse ears we wear.

Personally, I'm happy to be able to get an "advanced" opportunity since I already support DVC with my other contracts. Seems like a pretty nice thing to do for those already paying fees, etc.

 

[tjkraz]

Are you familiar with the timeshare laws in each state in which DVC does business? I'm certainly not.

Then why bring it up in the first place? Sounds like your "maybe they can't provide information" doesn't hold any more water than my "uhh, I think they can!"

(And I'm still sticking by my comments. State laws bend over backward to protect residents where timeshare sales are concerned. I'm more than a little skeptical of the inference that there are laws out there prohibiting TS marketers from providing their customers with MORE information about the product they are buying.)

Of course, we have no idea how much time or effort DVC has put into readying materials for those who want to addon or buy for the first time. Those materials are not out yet.

Exactly!

For those who were excited enough to buy in advance, it obviously didn't matter. For those of us still contemplating, no harm no foul either.

That's your $.02, and I happen to disagree. If you read this thread and others you'll see there are other members who have openly disagreed with the way DVC has handled this, and there are no doubt more remaining silent.

DVC announced the resort back in October. (Prior to that it was certainly in the works for many months.) They had more than 4 months to prepare basic marketing details for current members before sales began.

In my opinion, it's a black mark for a company who thus far has shown a pretty forthright manner of dealing with potential customers. Frankly it makes me wonder what they are trying to hide.

 

[tjkraz]

Personally, I'm happy to be able to get an "advanced" opportunity since I already support DVC with my other contracts. Seems like a pretty nice thing to do for those already paying fees, etc.

Just to clarify, I don't have a problem with the advance sales approach. My problem is the lack of official information provided by DVC. If you look back on Page 2 you'll see a scan of information given to SSR buyers from the moment the resort went on sale. Model rooms were open. The brochure has photos from the models, artist renderings, diagrams of the floorplans, room square footage, etc.

All we've gotten from DVC regarding AKV is that stupid (sorry) animal cut-out marketing piece that gave more information about getting your name on a tapestry than it did about the resort itself.

Since then all thru UNOFFICIAL CHANNELS we've learned things like:

* There will only be FIVE concierge level units in the entire development.
* The converted rooms will have a much different floor plan than the new units, including a much smaller kitchen and bathtub.
* Where the converted rooms are located in the lodge.

On top of that, there are still many unanswered questions:

* Will one bedroom villas have two bathrooms?
* How far away are the two buildings and can you even walk between them?

And one of the most frustrating issues is that people are getting different answers from their Guides. I know that one can't simply trust everything that the Guide says, but where else is there to turn when Disney isn't pro-offering any written materials short of a POS to those daring enough to say "yes"?

I'm sure most of these finer points mean little to those who bought in advance. But again I'm speaking as someone very much on the fence and it really bothers me to see how DVC has introduced this resort.

 

[BCV23]

Are you asking why I brought it up? If so, because I think several on this thread are off base in their assessment of the situation. I do believe I have as much right to guess at the situation as you.

Actually it was an implication not an inference.

Exactly indeed. This is my guess as I said. But I have found DVC to be honorable in their transactions. And yes, some states are very protective of their citizens as they should be. To me that reinforces my argument not yours.

Yes, I know you and some others disagree. But there are probably even more who are at the fuming. If one isn't comfortable, then simply don't buy. And somehow I doubt that DVC is quaking in their boots over the reaction of a few.

Any owners remember presales for current owners only at the other resorts?

 

[jbrowna]

Just to clarify, I don't have a problem with the advance sales approach. My problem is the lack of official information provided by DVC.

.......

I'm sure most of these finer points mean little to those who bought in advance. But again I'm speaking as someone very much on the fence and it really bothers me to see how DVC has introduced this resort.

Perhaps that is your point, but it seems to me that this thread has devolved into something else.

You -- by your own admission -- are still on the fence about AKV, and you come across as trying to justify that. Those who have bought are being asked by you to justify why they bought, given that they had no more information than you. You imply that those who have already bought are either gullible or are being scammed -- or, at the very least, they are not as savvy as you. But worse, you even go so far as to imply some sinister motivation behind DVC's actions!

Why can't we just say that you don't feel you have enough information to decide to purchase, while others apparently felt that they did have enough information to decide to purchase. Wait until DVC reveals enough information to satisfy you and then do what you want to do. Give others the courtesy of doing the same. In the meantime ....

 

[pilferk]

On top of that, there are still many unanswered questions:

* Will one bedroom villas have two bathrooms?

That one was answered in the recent AKV floorplans thread. There will be 2 bathrooms, in the 1 BR's in the new building, according to the info that briefly popped up on the DVC members website and was then taken down.

 

[Psychometrika]

Should more info have been available, sure, I agree. It would have been better had there been nice glossies like SSR.

I must disagree with some of the comments indicating a lack of additional info. There were detailed points charts up on the DVC site the very same day they announced the pre-general public sales. If you actually visited your guide (albeit, that shouldn't be necessary) he/she could have shown you artist's renderings of rooms, as well as layouts including where it is in relation to the current AKL, etc. Additionally, it has been clear from the beginning what would be "open" initially (prior to 2009) - the TOP TWO CONCIERGE LEVEL FLOORS. There's really no great mystery here in that regard. It was in official press release materials in newspapers, media outlets and the web, and any guide worth their weight in salt could have told you. Mine certainly did. I received info on everything from sq footage to timelines, pools, restaurants, etc. Granted, I was going to buy anyway, and granted, you're correct...those REALLY SHOULD have been in writing in glossies, but the official information was there for the asking. No need to guess. Can I tell you the size of the tub? No. But unless my first name is William Howard I didn't consider it important.

I'm sure I'll be flamed but I don't see it as a "black mark" on an otherwise "flawless" record. They should know a bit better than this how to run a marketing campaign, but overall I can't see that it's horrendous. Disney makes mistakes all the time, perhaps this is one of them... But I'd say a relatively minor one.

In a totally non-accusatory tone here (REALLY) ... it amazes me how people who love the "happiest places on earth" really flame out on here. I once asked a question about MNSSHP and the park closing early ... you'd think I told their 2 year old there wasn't a Santa. Geesh. Chill guys. It IS a vacation place after all. If we can't play nice about a simple thing like the Diz, how can we ever hold a peaceful election again??

 

[tjkraz]

Are you asking why I brought it up? If so, because I think several on this thread are off base in their assessment of the situation. I do believe I have as much right to guess at the situation as you.

Yes, you do. But do others the courtesy of respecting their opinions rather than dismissing them with a snide comment like "Are you familiar with the timeshare laws in each state in which DVC does business?"

As for the original discussion, I'll grant that it may not have legally been possible to send mailers to every single member with SSR-like details on AKV. However, DVC should have been able to prepare more detailed materials to be sent on request to members living in approved states. If DVC is approved to sell, they were certainly approved to present something a little more "warm and fuzzy" than a POS. Capice?

Those who have bought are being asked by you to justify why they bought, given that they had no more information than you.

I've done nothing of the sort!!! Please go back and re-read my comments as I have done. I don't see anything there that is even mildly critical of those who have chosen to buy.

My issues are with DVC and DVC alone.

That one was answered in the recent AKV floorplans thread.

OK, then move that one from the "things we can't answer" column to the "things we had to find out for ourselves" column.

In a totally non-accusatory tone here (REALLY) ... it amazes me how people who love the "happiest places on earth" really flame out on here. I once asked a question about MNSSHP and the park closing early ... you'd think I told their 2 year old there wasn't a Santa. Geesh. Chill guys. It IS a vacation place after all.

And in a totally non-defensive tone (NOT REALLY ), my intention isn't to keep beating this into the ground. However, when I get multiple responses to a post, some of which misinterpret my comments, I do feel it is my right to respond. I'm not trying to flame anyone...just responding to the critics.

...and finally...

Additionally, it has been clear from the beginning what would be "open" initially (prior to 2009) - the TOP TWO CONCIERGE LEVEL FLOORS.

I'm not entirely sure what you were responding to with this comment--particularly given the use of caps. I assume there's a possibility it was a response to my comment about there only being five concierge units in AKV. If so, my information is correct.

Although DVC is converting rooms that were previously part of the AKV concierge, most of those units will fall into the Value, Standard or Savannah categories. The concierge class is limited to 5 lockoff two bedroom villas, for a maximum of 10 rooms. That's a little over 1% of all AKV rooms.

Personally I think there will be a pretty ugly feeding frenzy over those rooms on a daily basis, but that's a topic for another thread.

Here's hoping that bit of info didn't catch you by surprise.

 

[Psychometrika]

I'm not entirely sure what you were responding to with this comment--particularly given the use of caps. I assume there's a possibility it was a response to my comment about there only being five concierge units in AKV. If so, my information is correct.

Although DVC is converting rooms that were previously part of the AKV concierge, most of those units will fall into the Value, Standard or Savannah categories. The concierge class is limited to 5 lockoff two bedroom villas, for a maximum of 10 rooms. That's a little over 1% of all AKV rooms.

Personally I think there will be a pretty ugly feeding frenzy over those rooms on a daily basis, but that's a topic for another thread.

Here's hoping that bit of info didn't catch you by surprise.

Nope, and I guess we were at cross points. My posting was more about the whole concierge level floors (original concierge level anyway) rather than the concierge rooms. When it is finally all out in the wash, I've seen the remarkable point difference in staying in the Villas development and the original Lodge. There seem to be varying units ultimately on concierge however, as the point values were all different - not just seasonally... but I'll have to find the final charts again to be exact. Anyway ... should be interesting.

Feeding frenzy? Ha! That's putting it mildly I'd say, and for more than just those rooms. Hysteria I'd venture. When they open those phones in March... heck, you'll be lucky to get through in a month.

 

[Starr W.]

Feeding frenzy? Ha! That's putting it mildly I'd say, and for more than just those rooms. Hysteria I'd venture. When they open those phones in March... heck, you'll be lucky to get through in a month.

You thought people flamed out here now? Just wait until booking starts.

 

[jbrowna]

I doubt any of the emerging details have had much impact on the die-hards who spent thousands of dollars largely due to the resort affiliation. But speaking as someone who is on the fence, DVC's actions have been very disappointing thus far.

Perhaps I was mis-reading you here, but to me this sounds rather critical of the "die-hards" who spent all that money just for some "resort affiliation." I read this to say that those of us who purchased weren't smart enough, or suspicious enough, about DVC's actions. I certainly apologize if that's not what you meant.

 

[BroganMc]

Feeding frenzy? Ha! That's putting it mildly I'd say, and for more than just those rooms. Hysteria I'd venture. When they open those phones in March... heck, you'll be lucky to get through in a month.

My response voiced in this thread is probably more of an anti-hype to the initial DISboard hoopla Feb 1. Remember when we were all rabid for the point chart, Founding Member tapestry, and discount? Not to mention the ecstatic response to Concierge rooms.

For me the point charts were surprisingly low and thus it made an add-on very tempting. The reports regalling concierge and the Sunrise Safari were even more intriguing. One of those "you ave to own in order to reserve" sentiments. But then the lack of rooms just make getting one even as an owner near impossible. At least not for consecutive nights.

The room configurations leaked for value rooms and distance from the AKV to AKL buildings all just serve to make it seem less attractive to me, and undeserving of the earlier hype here.

I'm not really upset with DVC. I don't think they're being dishonest as much as playing to an audience they know will buy know. That audience had already said they'd buy AKV as long as it was AKV, no other questions need be answered. For those buyers it is a simple question of theming. Perfectly fine for someone who cares most for that. The trouble we get into is for those folks debating whether to wait for AKV to buy-in to the program. For them, I think there are enough concerns to encourage a more cautious wait-and-see approach.

Sorry if that offends anyone. It's just a viewpoint, and as accurate a description of how I went from a "yeah" response to a "Ugh".

 

[BCV23]

But do others the courtesy of respecting their opinions rather than dismissing them with a snide comment like "Are you familiar with the timeshare laws in each state in which DVC does business?"

I was neither snide nor discourteous. I don't think it is nice to imply otherwise.

I don't know you. Perhaps you are an expert in timeshare law You write with such certainty that one might wonder.

If you are not, then perhaps it would be wise to modify your assertions a bit.

 

[BCV23]

The trouble we get into is for those folks debating whether to wait for AKV to buy-in to the program. For them, I think there are enough concerns to encourage a more cautious wait-and-see approach.

Sorry if that offends anyone. It's just a viewpoint, and as accurate a description of how I went from a "yeah" response to a "Ugh".

BroganMc, I don't think anyone could be offended by your position. And your description of the mood in many threads is accurate and funny (to me anyway).

But for folks waiting to buy into the program, they can't do so yet anyway. Hopefully there will be more info by the time they can.

 

[tjkraz]

I don't know you. Perhaps you are an expert in timeshare law You write with such certainty that one might wonder.

If you are not, then perhaps it would be wise to modify your assertions a bit.

I've spent quite a bit of time familiarizing myself with real estate law in my state as it applies to timeshares and see nothing that would prohibit DVC from sending customers resort design plans and room layouts prior to a purchase. In fact, the forms which must be submitted to the state prior to selling Foreign (out-of-state) Real Estate to residents require a lot more detail than DVC has thus far made public.

And, yes, DVC was approved to sell in my state before 2/1.

 

[spiceycat]

I maybe wrong here - but I think Florida has the hardest timeshare laws in the country. and Florida who has approve everything first.

 

[mc97]

Not sure if they've already been posted somewhere else, but we took a quick tour (they were still under construction) on Tuesday.

http://www.babymc.com/march07/disney/aklmodel.htm