Advice from a Teacher re: taking kids out of school for Disney

[boomhauer]

Duplicate post.

 

[boomhauer]

I have a better note that you can all feel free to use:

Dear Teacher:

I'm taking my child to Disney World for a family vacation the week of________.
I'm sorry to have to pull him out of school, but due to the fact that my wife and I both work year round and do not have the entire summer off, we're limited as to when we can take our vacations. Please understand that we do no devalue our child's education, but simply value family time equally.

Thank you.

 

[Happy05]

How dare you say that. You don't know what you are talking about. My child was reprimanded for saying a silent prayer over her lunch. She whispered the word Amen when she was done. She then ended up in the office. Why? Because she dared to pray to herself. I was then called and told I needed to explain to her she was NOT ALLOWED to pray at school, not even to herself. It might make other students uncomfortable to see her with her head bowed and her hands folded. We were told if it did not stop she would be suspended. She didn't share her believe with other students, she didn't insist anyone pray with her. She then got suspended because I told her to she could continue to pray to herself as long as it was silently. 2 days later she was caught with her hands folded and her head bowed over her lunch. she This was the same public school that sent her home in Kindergarten with a book about homosexual princes I didn't fail her, the school did.

If this did happen, that is really sad. That wouldn't happen where I live. We even have prayer before sporting events. What was the title of the book about homosexual princes? That sounds really odd.

 

[disneygal33]

If this did happen, that is really sad. That wouldn't happen where I live. We even have prayer before sporting events. What was the title of the book about homosexual princes? That sounds really odd.

It did happen and the name of the book is King & King. It is the story about a prince whose mother tells him it's time to marry. He then tells her he isn't interested in princesses. It is the story of how he finds his "King". Don't believe me feel free to Google the title.

 

[rhiannonwales]

OK have to chime in here. We went to DW this October. I told the teacher on the first day of school, and she had all the assignments (or equivalent if it was a group activity) before we left. She offererd to do this as she plans out lessons 7-10 days in advance.Yes, we did homework on vacation, but it was not a horrible amount, and he was completely up to date when he returned.

Secondly, i am not a christian, but i do know that it has been ruled in the supreme court that children can pray in school, as long as it is voluntary and not teacher led. The "seperation of church and state" only means that governmant (schools) cannot incorparate church into school, it does not stop individuals from practising their own beliefs.

The book about the gay princes is called "King and King". It is about a young prince who is told he must marry and is presented with many princesses, but he likes none of them. However, he does like another prince and they get married. Thats it.The same-sex attraction is normalized. There’s no proselytizing, no big lesson. It just is.

I'm not trying to turn this thread into a war. But that being said, i think that many people get their panties in a bunch over this book without really reading it. Whether you approve of GLBT lifestyles or not, the fact is that our kids will most likely meet someone who is gay, or has gay parents. And i think its important that they are made to understand that everyone is different. You can still dissaprove of it but at least you know its out there. The idea that if we dont talk about it it doesnt exist is not only untrue, but also is a great underestimation of a childs ability to understand and make their own opinions.

Ok off the soapbox now.

 

[disneygal33]

I am going to walk away from this

 

[Happy05]

It did happen and the name of the book is King & King. It is the story about a prince whose mother tells him it's time to marry. He then tells her he isn't interested in princesses. It is the story of how he finds his "King". Don't believe me feel free to Google the title.

I can understand being upset about your situation. All I can speak for is myself and the fact that I have been very fortunate as far as my childrens' education is concerned. The "government" has never had a hand in the rearing of my children.

 

[Whosemom]

Wow! I always read these school threads because they just fascinate me.

Why is it that if someone suggests being polite rather than curt, that is called begging, or groveling or asking permission? If your friends invite you to do something and you are busy, do you say "NO!" and slam the phone down? A tiny bit of information is kind of good manners in our culture.

My "letter" to the teacher would start like this..."Hey Carol, we're planning a trip to Disney in a couple of months. How would you like us to handle Isaac's work?"

I guess what I'm saying is, if you have developed a relationship with the teacher, what's the big deal? And if you haven't, why is that? Aren't you working together for the advancement of your children? One would assume that takes some communication.

Then fill out the stupid forms or whatever the district needs. YIKES, no one is offering to throw you in jail.

Again, this is of course AFTER you understand how your child is doing. You aren't going to pull out a highschooler who is barely passing math, are you? I teach remedial math at a community college. I have people who have to miss class, and in the process learn to become independent learners, a way more valuable skill than what they missed that day. But I also have folks miss one day who never recover, because they need the interaction to learn the concept. The book never says to them "why do you look puzzeled" LOL

Disneygal33, your daughter's rights have been trampled. there's no court in the land that would find that acceptable. You should fight that.

rhiannonwales, "oh honey, I know your mommy read you the Bible says this is wrong, but look, its ok in this story, isn't it? It must be that other book that's wrong." Come on. Be honest. "There’s no proselytizing, no big lesson." Yes there is, or why do we read the story? Just because the teacher enjoys ? No, because she's trying to make a point. Another phrase for that is "teach a lesson". The debate can't remain valid if both sides don't function honestly.

 

[MarkBarbieri]

My child was reprimanded for saying a silent prayer over her lunch. She whispered the word Amen when she was done. She then ended up in the office. Why? Because she dared to pray to herself. I was then called and told I needed to explain to her she was NOT ALLOWED to pray at school, not even to herself.

I'd get an attorney. That sounds an awful lot like an infringement of your basic constitutional rights. The first amendment prevents the government from establishing religion (thus no school prayer) but it also says they can't prohibit the free exercise of religion either. I've never heard of a case won in which the government attempted to bar someone from silent prayer.

I believe the exact quote is "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"

 

[jodifla]

Wow! I always read these school threads because they just fascinate me.

Why is it that if someone suggests being polite rather than curt, that is called begging, or groveling or asking permission? If your friends invite you to do something and you are busy, do you say "NO!" and slam the phone down? A tiny bit of information is kind of good manners in our culture.

My "letter" to the teacher would start like this..."Hey Carol, we're planning a trip to Disney in a couple of months. How would you like us to handle Isaac's work?"

I guess what I'm saying is, if you have developed a relationship with the teacher, what's the big deal? And if you haven't, why is that? Aren't you working together for the advancement of your children? One would assume that takes some communication.

Then fill out the stupid forms or whatever the district needs. YIKES, no one is offering to throw you in jail.

Again, this is of course AFTER you understand how your child is doing. You aren't going to pull out a highschooler who is barely passing math, are you? I teach remedial math at a community college. I have people who have to miss class, and in the process learn to become independent learners, a way more valuable skill than what they missed that day. But I also have folks miss one day who never recover, because they need the interaction to learn the concept. The book never says to them "why do you look puzzeled" LOL

Disneygal33, your daughter's rights have been trampled. there's no court in the land that would find that acceptable. You should fight that.

rhiannonwales, "oh honey, I know your mommy read you the Bible says this is wrong, but look, its ok in this story, isn't it? It must be that other book that's wrong." Come on. Be honest. "There’s no proselytizing, no big lesson." Yes there is, or why do we read the story? Just because the teacher enjoys ? No, because she's trying to make a point. Another phrase for that is "teach a lesson". The debate can't remain valid if both sides don't function honestly.

The OP's note CLEARLY had the parents apologizing to the teacher. That's unnecessary in my book.

I'm not saying to be rude, but I don't have to APOLOGIZE for spending time with my kid.


I simply state that we need to be out of town and to ask how the teacher wants to handle the work.

 

[Whosemom]

OK, I reread it and she does use the word apologize. I guess it just sounds like a "polite form" to me than an actual expression of sorrow over wrong-doing. I have class next Wednesday night from 5:30 - 10:30. Lots of folks are planning to miss class because of Thanksgiving. Some said, "I'll be traveling, so I won't be here." Some said, "I'm sorry I'll be missing class, I'll be traveling." One even said, "Everyone's coming to my house. I have to clean and make pie." In my book, all the people made equivalent statements. I realize that missing class is totally different at this level, but my point is that I don't believe the person who threw in "I'm sorry" meant to grovel. Its just how they express themselves.

 

[GOODoldPAL]

The OP's note CLEARLY had the parents apologizing to the teacher. That's unnecessary in my book.
I'm not saying to be rude, but I don't have to APOLOGIZE for spending time with my kid.

I do agree with you on this point only because of the way the OP worded her apology:
"I apologize that he will be missing classtime for this trip"

However, I don't believe she meant anyone should "have to APOLOGIZE for spending time with my kid."
IMHO the apology was intended as a regret that the child would be missing out on a vital part of the planned lessons, not a regret for spending time with family. Hopefully the OP will clarify though.

I apologize to teachers who I know will go "above & beyond the paycheck" to help my kid catch up and keep her grades up. I apologize not for the vacation itself but for the extra work & hassle created by an extended voluntary absence. If DD's teachers demonstrated they really didn't care if she caught up, well then I probably wouldn't apologize.
But the same applies for my co-workers. I don't apologize for the missed days at work to be with my family, but I know who will step up and pile my workload on top of theirs. I apologize to them too.

Like someone else said; it's a politeness thing not a guilt thing - it merely acknowledges the extra efforts of others. How can that even feel wrong?

I guess if we were all robots we could just spew out "You are acknowledged for additonal unpaid time" and then it wouldn't be an issue over the word "apologize"

 

[the Fidge]

Thank you and yes I will copy and paste that ! DH works for a seasonal company and they only permit the employees to vacation during February and the end of March. Thankfully DH has been there some time and they permit him to go the 2nd week of April which is DH and DS birthdays too!

I alwyas print out the pages formt he Education site about the states and as we drive through them and he fills in the sheets about each one. We also stay at one historical place for him to get a wee bit of knowledge in too! We stayed at Saint Augustine for a few days and did the whole tour of the area as well as a lie down on the beach.

This year in his class Saint Augustine came up and he was tickled that he could tell his teacher all about the history and got a great grade on his test that week! DH and I smiled and realized it is worth the extra to make a stop along the way and get some first hand history in there!


Thank you very much for all you do, a teacher can make a difference in a childs life and what a gift that is!

 

[DisneyDotty]

Disneygal33, your daughter's rights have been trampled. there's no court in the land that would find that acceptable. You should fight that.

I agree wholeheartedly, and I apologize if my other post was insulting to anyone. I guess my point is that we as parents have to be willing to fight for our rights to parent--and that if we don't, we need to accept the consequences. It seems that's what this whole thread is about, anyway.

 

[disneygal33]

I apologize if I was rude earlier. My daughter was in second grade when she got suspended for praying to herself over her lunch. That was 4 years ago and it still makes my blood boil.

 

[hsmamato2]

Disneygal- I think you're angry, and you should be,it was wrong, but I can't imagine anyone here agreeing with the sort of nonsense your daughter went through...
And I'm sorry, is it just me?(maybe it is) But it sounds so scary to hear posts about being obligated to fill out a pre-approved form that promises any absence will be "educational"- and the whys and wherefores of any family trip....that frightens me- To whom are any parents obligated to explain their choices for their families?
Who are the great ones who deem themselves the"deciders of what is worthy?"
And what if they don't agree with my families choices? Do they have the right to tell us we're not allowed to do what we wish? That as parents, we're incapable of making informed,intelligent decisions for OUR families?
What if you fill out that form,and it gets refused?
Is that what enrollment in a school district is, simply compulsory attendance for the benefit of the great machine?Silly me, and here i was thinking kids were required to be in school because they were truly benefiting....
*IF* my kids went to school, I'd feel an obligation to explain politely to their teachers that they'd be absent,when,and why. I'd politely request work that could be done so the child can keep up with the class,and not burden the teacher when he returns by not knowing the information.
*BUT* I'd feel no compunction to apologize or ask permission to raise my own children as I see fit.
I think some things get way off balance sometimes.....

 

[MarkBarbieri]

Wow, people are getting really bent out of shape over what seems so trivial. I read the apologizing portion of the OP’s posting as just being polite, not groveling. Having your child out is an inconvenience for the teacher, however mild, and so a simple apology isn’t out of line. It’s like saying “sorry” to someone when your dawdling child holds them up at a door. It’s not that someone has done something wrong. Apologizing isn’t required. It’s just the polite thing to do. Maybe it’s one of those regional differences. Where I live, passing someone on the sidewalk without saying “hi” or at least politely nodding one’s head is a bit rude; in Manhattan I got the sense that it was a personal affront to acknowledge a stranger on the streets.

*BUT* I'd feel no compunction to apologize or ask permission to raise my own children as I see fit.

If you want to get technical, you really don’t have an unfettered right to “raise [your] own children as you see fit,” at least not in any of the United States. I believe that every state requires that your children be educated. That can be done through home schooling, but it still needs to be done and failure to do so can result in the removal of your children.

If you opt to send your children to a school, you need to follow the rules of the school, whether it is a public or private school. Most schools have some form of attendance policy. In the case of public schools within a district, they may be motivated to enforce the policy by a desire for funding, but that’s not why the rules are there in the first place. The funding requirements are used as stick to bully schools into improving their attendance records. The rules are in place because our elected representatives chose to make it so.

The problem I see is that too many school officials either don’t have the authority or ability to use good judgment on when to strictly apply the rules and when to overlook transgressions. It’s the sort of thing that leads to kids being suspended for having an aspirin in their purse, a kitchen knife in their truck, or pretending that a chicken nugget is a gun. In some cases, that same bureaucratic rigidity leads overzealous administrators to punish kids for reasonable absences while trying to follow a rule designed to protect children at-risk of excessive absences.

We get along great with our kid’s principal and teachers. Part of that is the result of carefully selecting where we live based on the schools our children would attend. Part of that is the result of our working to develop a strong relationship with those people. Part of that is good fortune. I’m much happier living this way than viewing our kid’s school as an adversary.

As for the froth about the King & King thing, I don’t have much sympathy there either. I agree that schools should generally avoid controversial subjects with young children, but you’ll never be able to please everyone. Your kids will get exposed to ideas that you disagree with. Train them to deal with rather than hide them from it.

 

[Kayakmom]

A couple of things...

As to the poster that said they would start with, "Hey Carol," that's great *if* the teacher is a nice person who truly cares about your kid. Both of my son's teachers this year are outstanding and basically that was what I did and I also did let them know that I truly appreciate all they do for my children and that I'm sorry they will miss lessons that will have to be made up, etc. HOWEVER, last year I flat out told the school principal that I felt that the school was nothing more than a six hour a day babysitting service, which it was. He basically learned NOTHING. Same with the year before. He had teachers who had been teaching for many years and really did not like any sort of special needs students in their classrooms. The gripe was basically the same from all of the parents of kids who had some sort of learning disability, whether large or small. The principal flat out told me that they put EIGHT special needs students in the classroom on purpose, basically to punish the teacher. Well, it was my son and the other students who suffered and we go like crazy to try to make up for that. In that case, I had no problem taking my son out for a day or two while my mother was visiting to go to the aquarium or other academic kind of trip. In fact, I let him "skip" a couple other days for mental health days, too. I'd sure need a break from those witches! I used to ask constantly for progress updates and would get no response. I'd have to go over their heads to the principals constantly. Now, don't get me wrong, they really were not fit to be teaching, and have both since retired. The two teachers my sons have now are OUTSTANDING teachers and believe me, I let them know OFTEN and I intend to get them each a little gift on our vacation because of how good they are to my boys. I am so relieved that they have teachers that actually care. My ds10's teacher goes so far above and beyond and she always says that she really appreciates how much home support I give children. I have learned to do that because in the past two years, if i did not teach him, no one would.

As for the suspension for praying before lunch, that is not only outrageous, but illegal!!! That would make my blood boil.

 

[ppony]

Wow, people are getting really bent out of shape over what seems so trivial. I read the apologizing portion of the OP’s posting as just being polite, not groveling. Having your child out is an inconvenience for the teacher, however mild, and so a simple apology isn’t out of line. It’s like saying “sorry” to someone when your dawdling child holds them up at a door. It’s not that someone has done something wrong. Apologizing isn’t required. It’s just the polite thing to do. Maybe it’s one of those regional differences. Where I live, passing someone on the sidewalk without saying “hi” or at least politely nodding one’s head is a bit rude; in Manhattan I got the sense that it was a personal affront to acknowledge a stranger on the streets.

That's how I read it and took it as well. If I were to walk into the classroom to take my child out while class was in session, I would say "excuse me". it's just polite. People here (think Minnesota nice. ) say excuse me even if you are the one not with the right-of-way at a grocery store or in a walk way. It's just polite.

I have things all in a row with my son's school. He's expected to be absent and the teacher and I had the same idea of having him do a little booklet of writing each night. 3 sentences about each day and a picture to illustrate it. (first grader) It goes perfectly with what they are doing in class.

 

[homedad]

as the husband of a teacher that I beg her to take time out of school to go to disney...I really see it from all angles. She has to get special permission(and since I have a serious health issue I think she may get alittle leeway) to miss school, so she has to prep well in advance. She has students who go at non -break times and she'll try to come up with a project that may slightly be related to topic at that time. And then we take our kids out of school. I'm in the camp that one week a year is not going to hurt her career, her students or my own children. I refuse to wait 1 hour for any ride so its off time we go, we go,to disney we go......