A question from a curious UKer

[Claire L]

We don't have that system here; everyone works for the same minimum wage and pays the same amount of tax. I have never met a shop assistant that was allowed to take tips and having worked as a receptionist, cleaner, office monkey and shop assistant for minimum wage, I would have been fired in any of those positions had I accepted tips from customers.

When I worked in a hotel as a Saturday morning 'chamber maid', aka housekeeping, we could accept tips left, I don't think anything has changed since then. I also tip whenever out for meals in the UK or when in a taxi.

Claire

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I guess you could look at it that way, but anyone going in to a tipped position knows (or should know) that's how it works, and if they don't feel comfortable with that, they can always look for a different type of job.

The thing is, though, most unskilled workers can not simply look for another job. The unemployment rate might be lower where you live than where I live but around here, if you have no education and find an employer that will hire you, you take that job and hold on to it for dear life.

I just think that every human being deserves to be guarenteed a minimum quality of life. I know that that's not the reality but I wish it were. I think it would be an absolutely terrible feeling to never be certain if you were going to make enough money to pay your bills because you really had no idea from week to week what your income would be.

A gratuity, to me, a "thank you" for a job well done. It shouldn't be the majority of one's income.

 

[moburg]

OR in some states EVERYONE is paid at least minimum wage, (as all states should require) and still want a 15-20% tip.

Or perhaps the Government should keep its nose out of the employer/employee compensation contract! I still can't find authorization in our Constitution that allows the Government to mandate wages, minimum or maximum.

But that is OT, for another thread, I guess.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

Or perhaps the Government should keep its nose out of the employer/employee compensation contract! I still can't find authorization in our Constitution that allows the Government to mandate wages, minimum or maximum.

But that is OT, for another thread, I guess.

I don't mean to be rude but I'm not getting where you're coming from. By the logic stated above, wouldn't slavery be perfectly legal?

 

[Chicago526]

The thing is, though, most unskilled workers can not simply look for another job. The unemployment rate might be lower where you live than where I live but around here, if you have no education and find an employer that will hire you, you take that job and hold on to it for dear life.

I just think that every human being deserves to be guarenteed a minimum quality of life. I know that that's not the reality but I wish it were. I think it would be an absolutely terrible feeling to never be certain if you were going to make enough money to pay your bills because you really had no idea from week to week what your income would be.

A gratuity, to me, a "thank you" for a job well done. It shouldn't be the majority of one's income.

I also think a minimum wage is a good thing, but you have to understand that the vast majority of waiters, if they're any good at all at what they do, actually earn MORE than minimum wage. Those waiters I knew at RFC made waaaaaaay more than I did with my guaranteed $6 a hour, even if they had a bad week they made more than I did.

Let's look at the math. In a 5 table station with an average check of $30, in a 6 hour shift and assuming that each table turns 4 times and their section stays full for the whole shift, with an average of 15% in tips they'd earn $108 that day before tax in tips and wages. In that same 6 hour shift, I as a hostess making $6 an hour made $36. $108 vs. $36, I'd say working for less than minimum wage worked out well for the waiter. In this example, they made $18 an hour. They'd have to either totally suck as a waiter (and if they were that bad, they'd be fired anyway) or they'd have to have almost no customers at all for their entire shift to make as little as I made during the same 6 hours. Even if they'd only gotten an average of 10% in tips, they still would have grossed $78, still more than double what I made the same shift, or $13 an hour.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

I see what you're saying for YOUR restaurant. However, it was a popular, chain restaurant. Think about people who work at a local diner that's dead for most of the day.

DH is a chef. He gets tipped out. He works in two restaurants. At the fine dining establishment, he does great. At the little gastro-diner, other than in the height of summer, it's almost not worth it for him to collect his tips because it's such a small amount each day. His restaurant is one of the most popular restaurants in the little tourist town next door and one of the few that is opened year round. There are days when they get barely any customers. It's the bakery and catering that really keeps them afloat and that doesn't involve tips. If those servers were not making minimum wage to begin with, they wouldn't even come close to that relying on tips. They are great servers, who work as hard as any other servers. When they aren't serving customers, they have other tasks that they are doing. Is it really fair to penalize them for a lack of customers and make it so that they can't take home a decent wage? I don't think so.

And I know this happens in America. The small town in Maine that I can see from my window is no different than the town DH works in. I always feel so bad for those servers when we'll go out on a week night for dinner and be the only customers there. At least on the Canadian side, we know that when that happens, everyone's still getting paid to be there. Not so for the American servers. So, if the Canadian employers can afford to pay an honest wage, I'm sure the American employers right next door with basically the same customer base can as well.

 

[moburg]

I don't mean to be rude but I'm not getting where you're coming from. By the logic stated above, wouldn't slavery be perfectly legal?

What I am saying is that an employer and an employee should be free to negotiate whatever compensation that they both agree to.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

What I am saying is that an employer and an employee should be free to negotiate whatever compensation that they both agree to.

And again, couldn't that potentially lead basically to slavery? Think of people who are desperate for jobs. You could have an employer offer them pennies a day and, if they didn't have any other prospects, they'd have to take it. Why would the government allow that type of treatment of its citizens?