A "is this a good college" thread for all college searchers...

[punkin]

When DD18 was applying to colleges last year, I made a spreadsheet with the final cost of all colleges in order to compare. Honestly, most of the publics and privates were witin $2K of each other. I have to emphasize MOST. The most expensive options were "name brand" privates who give very little, if any merit aid. We do not qualify for any financial aid.

 

[kbeverina]

I guess it is all how you interpret the data. According to this: http://www.globalscholar.com/collegefinder/1979-harvard-university/costs-financial-aid-tuition.aspx the average debt for Harvard grads is $9717. If you make under $60K/year, Harvard is free.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about it being all how you interpret the data.

 

[tw1nsmom]

Student loans are not evil. One can be STUPID about taking out student loans, certainly as this person has illustrated, but I hate to see someone chose between not taking out some loans and not going to college. Our son will have student loans when he graduates, equivalent to about a car payment. It isn't all that bright to take out $100,000 in student loans for a job that pays $30,000. You have to factor that into your decision too. Is going to Harvard going to make a difference between you getting selected for a teaching position vs someone that went to the local State U-probably not, but going to Harvard might make a difference between you getting into a top medical school vs someone that graduated from the local state U. You have to weigh the benefits. Is $100,000 in student loan debt a big deal for a dr, not really, but it is for a teacher (or a fortune cookie writer ).

First, $100,000 in debt is a big deal even for a dr. I have friends who left medical school owing $120,000. He is a Dr and she is a teacher. What you fail to realize is that often Dr's are at an age where they have started a family by the time they can practice. Yes they have a "decent" salary but their expenses are quite large as well. Also, many 17 year olds don't factor in medical malpractice insurance and all the expenses being a doctor dictates when they choose to go into debt for their career. Not every doctor is swimming in cash, especially those who choose to go into family practice.

Secondly, I'm not saying that you can't get an affordable education at a private school. I am saying that you should apply to all different prices of school because in this day you can't be sure that the financial aid packages of a private school are going to come close to covering the difference between public and private.

Third, most professions that would care about an Ivy League degree would rather see it on your graduate diploma. It's much more cost effective to pay for your first 4 years at a less expensive college and move on to a more expensive/prestigious one for your graduate work.

Last...and really a side note...nobody with a "B" average gets into Geneseo. I squeaked in over 20 years ago with an A minus, but you better be looking at an A plus average, excellent SAT/ACT scores and an impressive high school resume if you plan on going now. Employers on the east coast are just as impressed with Geneseo for a liberal arts education as they are with Boston College, Union, and maybe even Cornell. I'm sure their are many other public colleges with similar reputations.

Need based, neither of my parents make much money. My cousins got a lot of aid and their parents make twice of what my parents do so we are expecting a lot too.

I wouldn't count on the aid still being there. Things are changing so quickly on state and federal financial aid budgets that people who would have received aid last year may not receive it this year.

No, taking SATS in two weeks I understand what loans mean. I have family who have large loans but it is manegable. I am somebody who is hard to please at times and I know I could not speand 4 years somewhere if I was not happy there no matter what the cost. I do believe that it is important to be happy over the 4 years no matter the cost. I am expecting to come out of college owing something and that is fine with me. It is my decision to make and I know what I want.

I have been to a lot of places upstate and it is not me! And I know that i do not want a female college! I am somebody who has never had a boyfriend and one of the things I am most excited about in college is to start dating! I know that there are other schools around but I want to be able to go to school with guys.



I understand about student loans and am fine with taking them out. I have done math with my cousin who owes 100 grand and we figured out that if you make 45k (his salary) you can have your loans payed off by the time your 30. I do not think that's bad. Now, I do know that I may not make 45k right off the bat but still, I am fine with paying student loans. And I know you are going to try to convince me otherwise because I am young and all but you are not changing my mind! I already know where I really want to go (all of the other schools are just backups) and I will pay whatever to go there because that is how much I loved it.

I commend your cousin for living so frugally and planning to do so for the next ten years. A person making $45,000 will probably clear about $32,000 a year after taxes and insurance premiums/copays. That's approximately $2,700 a month clear. When you take $100,000, compound 6% interest annually, you would need to pay $1,500 a month to pay it off in ten years. I don't know many people who can live on $1,200 a month with rent, food, car, commuting costs... I guess no vacations, no boyfriend/girlfriend no kids, no house for the next ten years. Now, if you make $35,000 a year with that same debt load, you can expect to clear no more than $2,100 a month. Minus $1,500 for loan payments and that leaves you with $600 a month to live on for ten years. Good luck.

 

[Sadie22]

Punkin, did you visit McDaniel College? Truly one of the "Colleges That Change Lives."

 

[Green Tea]

There was an article the other day about UVA being the best value among public universities. William and Mary, James Madison and Virginia Tech were also in the top 50. The article says the average debt at graduation from UVA is $19,000. In-state tuition is $10,000/year.

http://www2.dailyprogress.com/news/...st-value-among-public-universities-ar-860833/

I guess that's why I always tend to agree with Mrs.Pete on this. I'm sure there are cases where a private school can cost less for that student and is a better school than the state schools around here, but those are the exceptions, not the rule.

Since you are talking about Virginia schools, consider this. Washington & Lee University brings in about 10% of the class each year on complete full rides....room, board, tuition, stipends for summer study...everything. (Johnson Scholars) This is regardless of need. It is truly merit. You have to be a great students, but about 45 kids a year enter in this program. Say a kid is that kind of student-UVA, W & M might be on the radar screen. Those schools do offer merit scholarships, but not to the extent of that one private school's offerings. Throw in University of Richmond http://scholars.richmond.edu/program/oldham.html which has similar merit aid, and the hosts of other privates....I just hope people don't dismiss even considering a private college based on what the comprehensive fee on the website lists.

It is just in the students best interests to do as someone earlier said-not to dismiss any option until you see the bottom line.

 

[punkin]

Punkin, did you visit McDaniel College? Truly one of the "Colleges That Change Lives."

No. It is really close to where we live and my DD was not interested in it.

 

[Green Tea]

Another one: http://news.sewanee.edu/academics/2011/02/16/tuition-reduction

They just announced they are cutting tuition by 10%.

 

[marcyinPA]

I would love some input on Carnegie Mellon, Purdue, Marquette, University of Iowa and Valparaiso. My son is currently trying to decide between these. He got accepted at all of them, but is still waiting on the financial packages from a couple of them before making his final decision.

On the other hand, I know lots about Augustana since my daughter is a senior there. So if anyone needs info about that, I'm your girl!

My friend's son is a freshman at Carnegie Mellon. He is an English major. He LOVES it and is doing very well there. He got a very good financial package, and they are paying less than they would at a state university. He plays bag pipes for them as well, so that might have something to do with his acceptance.

 

[erincon23]

Midwestern here..so I can talk about schools in ILL or IA or Indiana best..


Ill is not as pretty as Indiana, he is accepted at both as direct admit to the business school, but he keeps waffling.. we spent last weekend there and he went to business classes and stayed in a dorm type private housing.. we did look at other private housing, seem the cost the same as a dorm and he get so much more.. loved Illini Towers.. suite arrangement- 4 students per bath, full kitchen, living space plus bedroom.. cafe is open and serving food from 7 am to 7 pm and is near the B school.. the school wouldnt let us view public dorms..
we are going to Indiana , again, for another visit, dorm overnight and more classes.. ..Indiana ( bloomington) did give him LOTS of $$$$ to go there.. ILL has no money so is not giving scholarships.. but instate tution is 10K lower then out of state..

That's interesting. U of Ill is my alma mater, and my DS18 LOVES it but they don't offer his major. I've always thought it's one of, if not THE, prettiest campus I've been to! You must not have visited on one of their pre-arranged "Orange and Blue" visit days, because they include a stop in one of the regular dorms -- they're all much older than some schools, and most don't have a/c. The majority of the dorm rooms are much smaller than ones I've seen at other schools too (just FYI, in case it makes a difference to you). U of ILL is not known for scholarships -- some of the other state schools offer much more in scholarship money. But U of I doesn't feel they NEED to offer scholarships to attract top talent (and they're $5-6,000 more than other state universities as well, even for in-state). For business, though, they're one of the best in the nation.

 

[Green Tea]

I love all the names of schools I've never heard of popping up. There is such a wide world of higher education out there. Who knows, school that someone mentions might be a perfect fit for one of my children. Great thread.

 

[marcyinPA]

My DS 15 is a sophomore in HS...took the PSAT's and has been getting a lot of college mail lately.

We want to take a few visits this summer, but we've already looked at Millersville University of PA (my alma mater) and Penn State (Main Campus). We want to look at some of the satellite campuses of Penn State just to get a feel for them. Penn State/State College is just too big for him to start out.

He also wants to look at Eastern this summer.

The problem is, right now...he doesn't know what he wants to major in. Which I'm sure is a pretty common problem for most kids at this age.

We have a lot of great colleges in our area: Moravian, Lehigh, Lafayette, Cedar Crest, Muhlenburg....but they are all too close to home for him!

 

[kbeverina]

Since you are talking about Virginia schools, consider this. Washington & Lee University brings in about 10% of the class each year on complete full rides....room, board, tuition, stipends for summer study...everything. (Johnson Scholars) This is regardless of need. It is truly merit. You have to be a great students, but about 45 kids a year enter in this program. Say a kid is that kind of student-UVA, W & M might be on the radar screen. Those schools do offer merit scholarships, but not to the extent of that one private school's offerings. Throw in University of Richmond http://scholars.richmond.edu/program/oldham.html which has similar merit aid, and the hosts of other privates....I just hope people don't dismiss even considering a private college based on what the comprehensive fee on the website lists.

It is just in the students best interests to do as someone earlier said-not to dismiss any option until you see the bottom line.

I completely agree.

I think what MrsPete says, and I have seen over the years to be true as well, is that in general here the average kid doesn't get the huge scholarships to the privates that are better than the state schools. Most kids don't get into Harvard. Most kids don't get a full-ride to W&L.

In general, the state schools around here are so good that most kids would not get into a private that is better and would give them so much merit aid that it would be less expensive than the state school. Even with hefty merit aid that would put the private in the price-range of the public, there aren't many privates that are comparably ranked. I hope that makes sense. Obviously, it's not all about ranking or even mostly about ranking. But when the subject is discussed, that is the angle from which it's usually being discussed.

 

[punkin]

I completely agree.

I think what MrsPete says, and I have seen over the years to be true as well, is that in general here the average kid doesn't get the huge scholarships to the privates that are better than the state schools. Most kids don't get into Harvard. Most kids don't get a full-ride to W&L.

In general, the state schools around here are so good that most kids would not get into a private that is better and would give them so much merit aid that it would be less expensive than the state school. Even with hefty merit aid that would put the private in the price-range of the public, there aren't many privates that are comparably ranked. I hope that makes sense. Obviously, it's not all about ranking or even mostly about ranking. But when the subject is discussed, that is the angle from which it's usually being discussed.

In VA and NC that may be true, but it is not the same in all states.

 

[kbeverina]

In VA and NC that may be true, but it is not the same in all states.

Yes, I agree, and I think MrsPete says that her perspective comes from the years of working with students in her state.

 

[Abbie]

No. It is really close to where we live and my DD was not interested in it.

This makes me giggle because when oldest DD was a junior, she refused to consider McDaniel since it is a mere 15 minutes away and she didn't even want to consider going to college so close by. It did, however, fit all the things she was looking for in a school so she agreed to a visit....and the rest is history. And although she toured quite a few schools, this was the only one she applied to and the only one she was interested in!

We were very impressed with the school, she got an excellent scholarship and an excellent education.

 

[linnylu]

When DD18 was applying to colleges last year, I made a spreadsheet with the final cost of all colleges in order to compare. Honestly, most of the publics and privates were witin $2K of each other. I have to emphasize MOST. The most expensive options were "name brand" privates who give very little, if any merit aid. We do not qualify for any financial aid.

I have heard this often enough and we are hoping that it is true. My senior ds has applied at Ohio Northern University and we are waiting to hear what kind of merit aid he will receive. We will not qualify for any financial aid. He was also accepted at SunY Buffalo and received $12,000 in merit aid for 4 years. The University of Toledo in Ohio has offered him $6000 in merit aid for 4 years. He really wants to go to ONU though.

We are also started the search for our junior dd. Her #1 qualification is good merit aid. She will probably be a national merit semi-finalist, is in the top 10 of her class, and has impressive ECs. She does not want to take out loans. We have no clue where to start the search for her. She has no idea what to major in.

 

[golfgal]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about it being all how you interpret the data.

I have heard this often enough and we are hoping that it is true. My senior ds has applied at Ohio Northern University and we are waiting to hear what kind of merit aid he will receive. We will not qualify for any financial aid. He was also accepted at SunY Buffalo and received $12,000 in merit aid for 4 years. The University of Toledo in Ohio has offered him $6000 in merit aid for 4 years. He really wants to go to ONU though.

We are also started the search for our junior dd. Her #1 qualification is good merit aid. She will probably be a national merit semi-finalist, is in the top 10 of her class, and has impressive ECs. She does not want to take out loans. We have no clue where to start the search for her. She has no idea what to major in.

Sometimes colleges really, really want top kids from out of state. It gives them a pipeline to a new area basically. I would start researching some schools outside of your region or even a few states over.

 

[golfgal]

I found this while looking for a link for another thread:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...826725.html#s244346&title=Yale_University_New

Top values in Private Schools by the Princeton Review. Interesting that Harvard and Yale are both up there but since so many people are talking about Swarthmore, that comes in at #1. The picture they show looks like a really cool place to go to college. Duke is also listed, I thought that was a public school for some reason--also a cool photo.

If you go through all the photos there are links to other "college" finds too-top schools for financial aid is one of them--Swarthmore is on that list too. Macalaster in MN is on that list-which really surprised me. GREAT school, VERY, VERY, VERY liberal for any students looking for that atmosphere.

 

[Green Tea]

Macalaster in MN is on that list-which really surprised me. GREAT school, VERY, VERY, VERY liberal for any students looking for that atmosphere.

Take a look at Grinnell then

 

[tar heel]

Duke -- a public school. Duke was originally a little religious college called Trinity until James B. Duke made a whole lot of money in tobacco and decided to give a bunch of it away.

My son got a poster in the mail from Duke today. It was in a big envelope, folded. I told him that they would have put it in a tube if they really wanted him!

I'm flabbergasted to see Duke listed as a "value."My oldest son was interested in Duke and would have had a reasonable chance of getting in. His guidance counselor told us that families like ours (solid middle class with college savings) didn't send kids to Duke. He said the kids who went to Duke were either from families who could afford the almost $50,000 per year or families whose lack of assets qualified the student for lots of aid. One of DS's classmates got $20,000 a year from Duke, but that still left a big gap between Duke's cost and the public schools.