A comment about moore's bad editing in F 9/11

[jrydberg]

Frankly, I think if the big criticism of President Bush that day is that he stayed in a classroom for 5-7 minutes, then he did a pretty darn good job.

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by Rutt and Tuke
I haven't read all of the long posts on this thread, but I did see Fahrenheit 9/11 and I felt Moore's editing of that portion was very effective.

Effective?

At what?

And why edit at all? How about letting thinking people see the whole thing UNEDITED and let THEM connect the dots.

 

[Alice28]

Truth.....you confuse me....

Nancy, very well said and I completely agree.

As someone who has worked in elementary schools for 8 years, they need the adults around them to REMAIN CALM in any out of the norm situation.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

Originally posted by GaryAdams
thats right, clinton did nothing!!


its so funny the short term memory people have when it comes to the bomb in the parking garage of the WTC,
oh thats right, it happened under clintons watch, so there is nothing that should have been done after that.

So what do you like about Bush so much? I alwys ask this question and never get a straight answer on here. Are you happy with the status quo? Or is bashing the opposition more intellectually stimulating?

 

[Fantasmic303]

I really don't know what to make of all this...and this is clearly why I stay out of places I don't belong - namely, potential debate threads and Moore's films.


For anyone who said hindsight is 20/20, I agree. For everyone who said they wouldn't have wanted Bush to excite anybody in that school, I agree. For people who pointed out the fact that many schools chose not to inform kids, especially younger students, about the events, I agree. I babysat for a family that night with a 2 year old, a 7 year old, and a 10 year old, and my sister teaches 3rd grade. It was all handled very carefully - applause for the President to actually realize that you don't treat an audience of second graders the same way you do a crowd of Senators.


Did Bush have more background intelligence than any of us had when we first heard about the events unfolding? Um, yes...and just think of how much ADDITIONAL information he probably had as well. And since none of it pinpointed details, I, personally, find it pretty irrelevant for anyone now to say, "well, we should've done this, we could've done that...."


Yeah, and just like how many people on those planes would say they wouldn't get on the flight, knowing now what happened.


Faulting Bush for not having a quicker or more effective immediate response is like faulting the brave men and women who went into those buildings to rescue people for not doing this or that. And I've heard that done, too, and, again, it's all very convenient when it's three years later.


I just wish people could stop debating the coulda-woulda-shouldas of September 11 and just respect the day and the people for what they were...

 

[IamTink]

I do not like or respect Michael Moore. I have seen a clip of the time being discussed though. President Bush looks like a deer caught in the headlights, not knowing what to do, where to go.

I want a strong CIC, that would have immediately gotten up upon hearing of the first attack & left the room. An aide could have explained to the children that the president had something very important to attend to but wouldn't be back that day. Kids can understand that. They don't need any further explanation.

Bush looked so scared, it scary to think he's in charge. I'm glad he's also a one timer, just like his Dad.

 

[Truth]

Originally posted by Alice28
Truth.....you confuse me....

Nancy, very well said and I completely agree.

As someone who has worked in elementary schools for 8 years, they need the adults around them to REMAIN CALM in any out of the norm situation.

What are you confused about, no one that said bush should have not just sat there for seven minutes after getting the word from Card about the second plane ever suggested that bush do anything other than quietly excuse himself from the classroom. It seems to be people that do not want to talk about the possible results of his inaction that bring up the strawman of him upsetting the children.

 

[AirForceRocks]

Originally posted by Truth
What are you confused about, no one that said bush should have not just sat there for seven minutes after getting the word from Card about the second plane ever suggested that bush do anything other than quietly excuse himself from the classroom. It seems to be people that do not want to talk about the possible results of his inaction that bring up the strawman of him upsetting the children.

Hmmm...and the possible results of his inaction were...what exactly?

 

[Truth]

Originally posted by IamTink

I want a strong CIC, that would have immediately gotten up upon hearing of the first attack & left the room.

Just to be clear IamTink,
card informed bush in the classroom of the second plane hitting.
Bush went into the room knowing the first plane had already hit.

 

[IamTink]

Originally posted by Truth
Just to be clear IamTink,
card informed bush in the classroom of the second plane hitting.
Bush went into the room knowing the first plane had already hit.

Even worse than I originally thought. How could he? Why did he go into the classroom at all?? Nobody expects him to have jumped up, scared the kiddos, & scooted. He never should have been in the room in the first place!

With greater & greater amounts of information coming out, it is so clearly apparent as the nose on anyone's face that this man is not CIC material.

Someone who had seen F911, mentioned that Michael Moore (a publicity hound himself), cut this important time frame of Bush on film doing nothing. I agree w/whoever wrote that. That was critical and just sitting through seven minutes & thinking of what he should have been doing besides reading Dick & Jane to school kids, boggles the mind.

Thanks Truth, for bringing it to my attention.

 

[AirForceRocks]

Why did he go into the classroom at all?? Nobody expects him to have jumped up, scared the kiddos, & scooted. He never should have been in the room in the first place!

Why in the world not? They had no idea at the time of the first plane hitting that it was anything more than a horrible accident.

 

[Nancy]

Thruth...when the first plane hit did you immediately know that we were under attack??? I didn't. Why would you think that the government would know anymore at that time? They were probably getting there info a few minutes before we were. (and no I don't know it for sure, I'm guessing here)

The actual day that 9/11 happened is probably the only day I have ever agreed 100% in George Bush.

I am not a huge Bush fan, I don't agree with him all the time. Your original post said to put a timer on for 7 minutes...and what would you do in those situations. I responded that I thought Bush did exactly what I would have wanted him to do and what I probably would have done myself. I have never been the President, but I would not have caused a panic in a room full of second graders. the only people who knew 100 % what was going on that day were the terrorists that were killing our citizens.

You then posted in response to our posts about information that Bush knew beforehand. That has nothing to do with what your original post was about. If you want to debate about what Bush, Clinton or anyone else knew beforehand start a new post.

 

[Nancy]

Iamtink...my same question to you...when the first plane hit did you immediately know that we were under attack?

Why would the President know that. Should he have not gone into the room because he was thinking it was an accident?

Even after the second plane hit, it took me a while to realize what was going on.

So he went in and did what he went there to do. While he's talking to the second grade kids...a whole 6-7 years old...he gets notified of the second plane and you wanted him to say excuse me I have to leave now, something came up????

 

[Dan Murphy]

Originally posted by GaryAdams
.....truth go back to talking about yourself in the third person,its alot more fun to laugh at your posts then.

Gary, please, don't ask him to.

Originally posted by Alice28
Truth.....you confuse me........

Alice, if you only knew.

 

[palmtreegirl]

I didn't think anyone knew we were actually under attack at that point. I remember watching the local NY news(I lived right outside NYC) and seeing the footage of the first plane hitting, they were all saying it was an accident, even after the second plane hit live on TV people were still confused. I switched channels frantically and everyone was just shell shocked at what happened but no one was screaming we're under attack.

Why would the President have been any different, what was he supposed to do yell and scream OMG in front of the kids? If he'd jumped up and ran out he would've caused a stir and besides they were just starting to figure it all out.

I hate when either political side throws cheap punches to try and make a point and this is an example of what I can't stand. I'm not a big fan of many things Bush has done but I think he did a fine job that day and I wouldn't have wanted to be in his shoes.

 

[shortbun]

I work with school children. They are smart. If the POTUS is
in your classroom and needs to leave, it's ok. No one needed
to panic or scream or even advise the children about what had
happened. What needed to be done was this - the bloody
POTUS needed to get up and take care of business!! He
clearly did not know he was in charge and was in some sort
of shock. Seven minutes could be all one had in an attack and
to waste that kind of time listening to school children read in
a daze while who knows what could have been happening....
OMG! Are you guys really complimenting the POTUS for putting
an elementary reading class ahead of national security? Good
grief people....you know the presidential election is November 3rd, right!?

 

[IamTink]

Originally posted by AirForceRocks
Why in the world not? They had no idea at the time of the first plane hitting that it was anything more than a horrible accident.

Because an airplane had flown into one of our Twin Towers in our most populous city in the country. He could have waited for a report on what happened. The teacher could have kept the kiddos busy & they never would have known. If he had waited, he would have found out what everyone found out, before him, because we were seeing it live for the second tower & he was busy reading Dick & Jane. I think he should have been w/his staff as soon as the first one got hit.

 

[Dan Murphy]

Oh, I forgot to go on record here...the President did well on 9/11, IMO.

 

[Rutt and Tuke]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Effective?

At what?

And why edit at all? How about letting thinking people see the whole thing UNEDITED and let THEM connect the dots.

It was effective at getting his point across that it seemed like a long time before Bush did anything other than sit in front of the children. Documentaries are always edited and very few are completely impartial. Or maybe we should have sat through days and days of video footage so we could connect our own dots.

 

[AirForceRocks]

Because an airplane had flown into one of our Twin Towers in our most populous city in the country. The teacher could have kept the kiddos busy & they never would have known. If he had waited, he would have found out what everyone found out, before him, because we were seeing it live for the second tower & he was busy reading Dick & Jane.

And if this had been an accident, as was first suspected, what would have been the point of him not going into the room? It wouldn't have been something that he would have been handling, it wouldn't have been something that he would or could have done anything about. Had it been an accident, would it have been tragic? Of course. Would it have been something that would merit immediate Presidential intervention? Of course not.

I think he should have been w/his staff as soon as the first one got hit.

As I've explained above, to what end?

I think there is a whole lot of Monday morning armchair quarterbacking going on about the President going into the classroom, and to me, it seems silly.

Had the first plane turned out to be an accident, no one would have questioned for a second why the President went into the classroom. But since it wasn't, people seem to expect him to have had ESP about what was going on.