7 month window could go away

[timC]

It seems the key reason to change the window would be to maximize the booking opportunity at a resort.

If there's a resort that's just not popular (chronic low occupancy), then perhaps they could set the window on that 1 resort to 11/10 for example, to give all member greater access to it.

I'm basing this on the assumption that they could adjust the windows at each resort independently.

 

[Chuck S]

Remember, too, that many of these rules were written at the first thought of DVC. There were no gurantees, EVER, that there would be more than one DVC resort. Disney and DVC have much written into the contracts to protect them in the event of natural disasters or attacks...also did you know that all banking and borrowing CAN be discontinued? The chances of them them actually exercising any of these changes is remote...changes in the last 11 years have included...one point chart re-allocation at OKW, occasional suspension of pool hopping (seasonally), no SAB pool hopping, and a change from RCI to II for outside resort interchanges. In fact Disney has added to our choices via Buena Vista trades, on-site WDW resort trades, and cruise trades - all of which could disappear at any time.

Also written into the contracts is the clause the WDW theme parks could cease to operate, be sold by Disney, turned into a landfill...whatever...what do you think the chances are of that happening?

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by KANSAS
dean

in an absolulte extreme scenario, are you telling me that someone that owns at VERO BEACH, could not have access to the other 6 DVC RESORTS AT ALL??

That is correct though it's a small risk. This is no different than any other timeshare out there or even a beach house for that matter. I wouldn't avoid DVC because of this, there are many risks in this world far more likely to happen and potentially devastating.

 

[Dean]

Originally posted by ArRzrbk
This is all scaring me a lot. I am buying into DVC for a multitude of reasons (use of home resort, ability to stay at non-home DVC resorts, use of resorts outside Disney, abilty to bank and borrow points for big trips, etc.). I have chosen our home resort and the number of points with all this in mind, and it could all change.

If I was buying into my home resort only to stay there year after year for 39 more years, I wouldn't do this. Period. We have our member number and a reservation for Labor Day, but I am planning on reading all the fine print when our contract arrives next week. I feel like once we see it, we may back out.

How can Disney put in some much fine print that the program they are selling you today could hardly resemble at all the program in few years...if they so choose to change it. A little fine print is ok, and I knew about some of it, but what you all are talking about changes this membership dramatically.

ArRzrbk a.k.a. Char

As stated, you shouldn't buy into DVC. In reality, it depends on exactly how you plan to use it. The risk of a resort leaving the system or being totally unavailable is extremely low, so much so that I would ignore the possibility for practicle considerations. OTOH, buying with the idea of using Interval International, the Disney Collection, DCL and the Concierge Collection makes DVC an inappropriate option for these usages. While it's nice to have options and choices, they could all vanish or change dramatically tomorrow. Even in their present form, they are so financially unatractive as to make DVC an unreasonable option for anyone expecting to use them much at all. As a general rule, I'd say anyone who buys in with the idea of using any of these options routinely is making a mistake, financially. Of course everyone's situation is different. There are those that look at things like taxes as a forced savings plan, personally I think they're nuts and would equate anyone expecting to use DVC for the other options "because they bought DVC as a vacation plan" as having the same type of thinking. That works for some but everyone would be better off just saving the money everymonth for the non DVC options.

If you think the DVC resorts hold value for you, just buy the amount of points you might use, maybe with a small cushion. Then pay cash for the other items. The other option is to buy the points and rent them using the proceeds to pay for the non DVC options. While we didn't buy the points to rent out, we're doing this for a DCL cruise in March and have about $1800 to spend on the cruise over and above paying for the cruise.

 

[DaveH]

I have been a DVC owner for only a little over 2 years. According to what I have read here on the boards, the points charts have been changed twice. Once at OKW and at BWV with some units change to standard and prefered views. DVD and WDW has changed things like pool hopping as demand has required the changes. The only thing I know I was quarenteed is that I have 150 points to use each year at VWL. The total points that can be charged a year for the resort can not change. DVD can change how many points it charges for the rooms as long as the total for the year does nott change. If you are selling points faster than you can build, why cange anything. I seriously doubt we see any major changes anytime soon unless something very drastic happens.

 

[DVCTX]

if I am thinking about buying 225 OKW POINTS, to get a grand villa sunday-thursday night, in May every 4 of 5 years

are you trying to warn me that the at could not work out?
if points are increased for May or sunday-Thursday goes higher and friday and saturday, lower point requirement

In my opinion it will normally work out. I think your greatest risk is the demand for the GV and not Disney making changes to the point chart. Using past history as a guide, DVC has made only one change to the OKW point chart since I became a member in 95.

One other option to consider if a GV is not available is to reserve a 2BR and a Studio or a 1BR. This will give you the needed sleeping capacilty and it actually costs less than the GV for Sun - Thursday.

This is all scaring me a lot. I am buying into DVC for a multitude of reasons (use of home resort, ability to stay at non-home DVC resorts, use of resorts outside Disney, abilty to bank and borrow points for big trips, etc.). I have chosen our home resort and the number of points with all this in mind, and it could all change.

Don't be scared! DVC is a class act. Disney is just trying to maintain maximum flexibility in regards to running the association. Disney retained 3% of the points for cash reservations and any trade made by a DVC member for a DCL cruise, Buena Vista exchange or a stay in a non-DVC Disney hotel is points that Disney can use to make cash reservations for the general public. Because non-DVC members can stay at a DVC resort, Disney wants the DVC resorts to be maintained and run at the same level as any other Disney resort.

When we bought in 95 I too was concerned. I now consider DVC to be one of my best decisions. I should have bought more points!

What we are talking about is a worst case that will probably never occur.

Larry
OKW 95

 

[TroyWDW]

While talking about unlikely events...

I believe the "fine print" also states that we the owners can vote to replace DVCMC with a new managing company. DVD Inc., DVCMC, and The Walt Disney Company are all separate entities and play different roles in the Disney Vacation Club. DVD Inc. sells the property to us and we pay dues to DVCMC to manage our property.

Troy

 

[RobDoc]

Originally posted by TroyWDW
While talking about unlikely events...

I believe the "fine print" also states that we the owners can vote to replace DVCMC with a new managing company. DVD Inc., DVCMC, and The Walt Disney Company are all separate entities and play different roles in the Disney Vacation Club. DVD Inc. sells the property to us and we pay dues to DVCMC to manage our property.
Troy

That's exactly right. However, should the owners vote to replace DVC as the managing entity, the resort MUST change it's name and any mention of Disney - in signage, decor, logos, landscaping, etc.- MUST be removed.

The name for SSR would be The Lakes (yes, it's specified in the POS). A management change by the owners would also remove that resort from the BVTC and any exchange opportunity with other DVC resorts (unless the new management could negotiate exchange rights with Disney ) This management company would also have to negotiate with Disney for transportation and any services currently provided from within the Disney "family" of business entities.

As mentioned, only OKW has had it's point chart changed (that happened once in 1996) and it did affect some dates (some went up a few points- some went down a few points- most didn't change).

While these issues are covered in the contracts we all signed, I believe it will require a catastrophic set of circumstances to invoke these measures.

As for the concern that prompted this thread, the minimum Home Resort Reservation Priority is one month. Meaning that owners could book at their home resort at 11 months and at other DVC resorts at 10 months.

Enjoy!

 

[TroyWDW]

The name for SSR would be The Lakes (yes, it's specified in the POS). A management change by the owners would also remove that resort from the BVTC and any exchange opportunity with other DVC resorts (unless the new management could negotiate exchange rights with Disney ) This management company would also have to negotiate with Disney for transportation and any services currently provided from within the Disney "family" of business entities.

Yup. Just like the Swan and Dolphin negotiate for services and alliances with TWDC.

The nice part is that they keep building more and more DVC Resorts. Over time, we keep becoming a bigger and bigger fish in the Disney Pool. The Walt Disney Company is slowly converting some of it's most loyal customers into DVCers.

Troy

 

[Richyams]

One of the ways those low-life scoudrel guides were trying to sell VB was with the hope that "soon those morons that bought at WDW DVC resorts would only have a one month booking advantadge"

Shortly after reports of this, which was only one of many ways they tried to sell their failed resorts over the years, we had a survey. That survey asked about people wanting to change the booking window from the current 7-11 to 10-11. There was a resounding "NO" to that question.

They could change it, now that their failed resorts are finally sold out, they no longer have a need to use WDW DVC resorts to sell those resorts. Because of that and the results of that survey, I think it is highly unlikely that we will see that change.

It is way more likely that they will even out weekends. That also got a 'no' on that same survey, it wasn't anywhere near as strong, but strong enough so that they haven't changed it yet.

I do think that someone who bought planning Sun to Thurs stays is at great risk of losing their desired vacation someday. I think it is more likely that evening out weekdays will not happen, but I definitely would give it a good chance of happening.

people who only stay Sun-Thurs do us all a diservice. They increase the likelyhood of Disney being forced to make that change.

 

[childsplay]

Originally posted by Richyams
people who only stay Sun-Thurs do us all a diservice. They increase the likelyhood of Disney being forced to make that change.

I'm not quite sure about this, I used to think the same thing (the forced to even out weekend and weekdays, not the diservice part). But, DVC is now on its seventh resort with basicially the same point chart of Sun-Thurs being the same as Fri-Sat. It seems to me that if they thought it wasn't working they would have modified it slighty with BCV or SSR.

 

[Richyams]

Umm, take a look at the charts.

SSR GV is way more than OKW during the week, yet on weekends it is less.

So they have moved in this direction.

 

[Lisa F]

Originally posted by Disney Doll
My guess is that they've done this to "equalize" everyone's ability to get into some of the smaller DVC resorts, such as BCV. My DH had said right off the bat that once BCV was sold out, that,because of its location, if it wasn't your home resort, you'd probably have a tough time getting in there based on the size of it, if you had to wait till the 7 month window. What they're banking on is some of the owners of BCV will not be able to plan a vacation 10 or 11 months out, thus guaranteeing that DVCers with other home resorts will fill the place up at 10 months.

What reason would they have to want to "equalize" other members' ability to book at the smaller DVC resorts? I guess I don't see why they'd care. I think it's a much more likely scenario that they might tweak booking windows in order to try to fill resorts that are lagging behind. When you bought your home resort, you didn't buy an opportunity that is "equal" to the members that own that resort.

Lisa

 

[dianeschlicht]

Originally posted by Lisa F
What reason would they have to want to "equalize" other members' ability to book at the smaller DVC resorts? I guess I don't see why they'd care. I think it's a much more likely scenario that they might tweak booking windows in order to try to fill resorts that are lagging behind. When you bought your home resort, you didn't buy an opportunity that is "equal" to the members that own that resort.

Lisa

I'm not sure I understand what you mean, Lisa. Explain further.

 

[childsplay]

Originally posted by Richyams

SSR GV is way more than OKW during the week, yet on weekends it is less.

So they have moved in this direction.

Agreed, but GV are only 24 out of what, 550 proposed units? For the vast majority of the units they have not seen the need to even out the weekend and weekdays.

In addition, I'm not sure I would classify what they did with the SSR GVs as "evening out" the point schedule....I'd say it was more a case of jacking up the weekday points. Making OKW an even better deal as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Lisa F]

I'm not sure how to explain any more clearly than what I said before. I guess I can't see a reason why DVC would find it worth their time and money (well time IS money) to change the rules to make it easier for folks to get into a resort that is MORE popular than their home resort. What would be the point?

The only way I can see DVC making a change is if somehow things DO get out of whack and they see changing the booking priority as a solution. I guess I don't see members wanting to book a popular (and likely more expensive) resort that they don't own as a good reason to change the rules. I don't see that as "equalizing" or being more fair, I see it as being LESS fair. I know they CAN change the rules, but I just don't see that as being a very good reason.

Lisa

 

[dianeschlicht]

to change the rules to make it easier for folks to get into a resort that is MORE popular than their home resort.

I don't think this has anything to do with staying at your home resort or a different DVC resort. The issue here is equalizing of points. I agree with Rich, that the point schedule for SSR GVs does look like they are trying to equalize that size unit at that resort.

 

[Lisa F]

Originally posted by Disney Doll
I think what they mean is that you will have an 11 month window to book at your home resort, and a 10 month window to book at a non-home resort. Basically, it's compelling people to firm up their vacation plans a little more quickly. Instead of a DVCer having those four mothns between the current 11 and 7 month window to decide what they wanted at their home resort, they'd only have one month to decide. My guess is that they've done this to "equalize" everyone's ability to get into some of the smaller DVC resorts, such as BCV. My DH had said right off the bat that once BCV was sold out, that,because of its location, if it wasn't your home resort, you'd probably have a tough time getting in there based on the size of it, if you had to wait till the 7 month window. What they're banking on is some of the owners of BCV will not be able to plan a vacation 10 or 11 months out, thus guaranteeing that DVCers with other home resorts will fill the place up at 10 months.

Actually, ArZrbk, if they do change this, it will improve your ability to get into a resort different from your home resort, as you'd only be 1 month behind the "home resort" people in your ability to book, rather than 4 months behind.

Sorry for quoting you twice, Disney Doll. Diane, this is what I was responding to, not a reallocation of weekend points. The idea that DVC might narrow the home resort booking priority from being 4 months long to only 1 month long to give more people who don't own there a shot at staying there. I just don't see the 7 month window being changed to a 10 month window for that reason. IMO that doesn't "equalize" things but it makes things LESS equal because the people who are paying for that home resort priority are getting less of it.

Lisa

 

[ralphd]

Originally posted by Lisa F
Sorry for quoting you twice, Disney Doll. Diane, this is what I was responding to, not a reallocation of weekend points. The idea that DVC might narrow the home resort booking priority from being 4 months long to only 1 month long to give more people who don't own there a shot at staying there. I just don't see the 7 month window being changed to a 10 month window for that reason. IMO that doesn't "equalize" things but it makes things LESS equal because the people who are paying for that home resort priority are getting less of it.

Lisa

Agree with Lisa- Disney does not have a reason to change the booking priority.

ralphd

 

[timC]

If there's a resort that's just not popular (chronic low occupancy), then perhaps they could set the window on that 1 resort to 11/10 for example, to give all member greater access to it.

I made this comment in an earlier post on this thread. I don't think Disney has this problem today, but if it developed...

Does anyone know for a fact if DVC can change the priority booking window on one resort only?