WWYD:the truth about Santa?

[trivial]

In response to the neighbors...I dunno. I have no sympathy for those who do the Santa thing when it starts to unravel. Those parents choose to lie to their children, you choose to NOT lie, AND you are very kind about it, because you have tried to let your kids know that they should just stay mum on the subject (while the kids who "believe" and the ad agencies and stores and everyone else get to spout off all year long)...I don't have to think too hard about which side gets to have empathy and sympathy from me!

Yep, horrible, vicious liars, all of us!

 

[ampc3]

Yep, horrible, vicious liars, all of us!

add me to that list too... infact my mom is still lying after 30 plus years.. I personally love keeping my kids in a bubble...

 

[rt2dz]

Well, I, for one, thoroughly understand the other mom's position. I would feel the same way. Right down to not wanting my kids to play with yours--although I'd get over that. I WOULD NOT have gone to you with that feeling. I WOULD NOT have said you "ruined" Christmas, even if you did for that child, even temporarily because my child wouldn’t know what to think. I might have told you so that you could talk to your DS and remind him to be more careful at times. I WOULD NOT expect him to be punished. Basically, I would have handled it differently, but probably had the same feelings.

We also do not know how the mother handled it with her daughter. We just know how she reacted to the OP's DH.

DS6 has a little girl in his class that has told all the kids that Santa isn't real. I asked DS what he thought. He said he believed, but over the course of the long holiday season, she presented some good arguments. I told my DS that I believe in Santa (and I do, guess I'm living a lie! ) I told him what Santa stands for. That Santa is for Christians (which this little girl is not) and for believers. I also pulled out the book, The Polar Express-]--much more to the point about believing. When DS6 asked how Santa does it, I told him simply that not every house has a visit from Santa and Santa really has a lot of helpers. I also reminded him about the International Date Line and time zones.

A little more about the not wanting my kids to play with yours... I'd be more inclined to feel that way because I'd be wondering what else your kid might spill to mine. Not necessarily the Easter Bunny or Tooth Fairy, but about other adult things like the birds and the bees. The simple fact is most kids in the USA believe in Santa, not believing is usually for older kids and adults. I'd have to wonder what other (not just birds and bees) things your child might bring up to mine in everyday conversation I might not want them exposed to yet. But, like I said, I'd get over it.

 

[irene_dsc]

Well, I'm Jewish, so I grew up knowing that Santa was make-believe - but we were definitely instructed NOT to tell any of our Christian friends. And I never did, fwiw.

I married a Christian, and as part of our agreement, we "help Daddy celebrate Christmas," tho it is a pretty secular celebration that concentrates more on Christmas' origins as a celebration of the Winter Solstice. I was not quite sure how to deal with Santa, so most of our earliest conversations with ds were along the lines of "some people believe". Ds6 decided all on his own that he believes in Santa, so I've been fairly careful not to give it away and play along with stuff like leaving cookies for Santa, but he also knows that most grownups don't believe. I have a sneaking suspicion that he may be starting to suspect, but he probably won't say anything for a long time, because he probably thinks that if he doesn't believe, he won't get any presents.

Honestly, I think that if parents are going to do Santa with their kids, they need to also prepare them for the idea that not everyone believes in Santa, and that they need to figure out for themselves what they believe.

 

[Nom]

Yes, it is your choice to teach your family whatever you want. But, if you are going against something that means so much, like Santa, I think you should think very carefully how you handle it.

I was so suprised by this quote. Does santa really mean that much to people? For people who celebrate christmas, isn't it Jesus who the season is about- who should mean that much to you?

As you might be able to tell already, we don't tell dd about santa. We talk about baby Jesus. I did not do this for any particularly religious reason, just that dd is deathly afraid of beards, will not go in any stores with santa decorations, etc- after two years of this, this year (she is 3) I finally told her santa is not real, and she is ok with that and now does not mind santa decorations. WE celebrate christmas with baby Jesus, and our christmas is very magical.

That in mind, I am mildly offended at this quote:

A little more about the not wanting my kids to play with yours... I'd be more inclined to feel that way because I'd be wondering what else your kid might spill to mine. Not necessarily the Easter Bunny or Tooth Fairy, but about other adult things like the birds and the bees. The simple fact is most kids in the USA believe in Santa, not believing is usually for older kids and adults. I'd have to wonder what other (not just birds and bees) things your child might bring up to mine in everyday conversation I might not want them exposed to yet. But, like I said, I'd get over it.

Do you really believe that because my family does not believe in Santa, that means my child is inappropriately sexualized? that is a MAJOR stretch, and a bit offensive to not only me, but also the many many Jewish, Muslim and Christian families in this nation that don't celebrate Santa. Wow, just wow.

Back on topic, I believe that the mother overreacted and could have said something simple to her daughter to continue the belief. I don't think an apology or punishment is neccessary- if people tell their children about santa, they have to know that the day is coming when they will find out the truth- it is inevitable.

 

[ShannonN]

All I have to say is WOW !! My DS 8 said to me a few weeks ago, "Mom you know that Rudolph is just a tradition don't you" I thought oh boy here it comes the Santa question: !!! Then I asked him well if Rudolph is just a tradition then who guides Santa's sleigh ? He just looked at me with the look of are you serious . Then I said , what would you say if I told you that Mommy and Daddy are really Santa and he said "I would be famous!!" So we just left it at that. He knows Santa isn't real but he still likes to believe and that's okay with me....

DH DS ME

 

[teresajoy]

My husband called me while I was out shopping this evening to let me know our 6 year old DS told the little girl (5) across the street that Santa was not real. The mother came over and talked to my DH. He said she could hardly hold back her tears. I feel horrible. I do not know what to do.

We do not celebrate Santa in our home. We have told our children the true reason Christmas is celebrated and that Santa is a story about a man who gave presents to children a long time ago. He is not coming into our home and delivering gifts. We see him at the mall and get pictures, we watch movies about Santa but we know he is not real. It is fun to make believe and that is what we do.

We have always told our children not to tell other children the truth about Santa. We explain to them that each family has different beliefs and that some parents choose to have their family believe in Santa. Unfortunately my son is 6 and the things I tell him to do are not always the things he does. The little girl’s mother said if my son was going to do things like that then her children are not going to be able to play with mine! Now I sympathize with her and I do feel terrible. However, I think that is a bit much. He is a child and she is holding him to much higher standards than she is her own child. I think if she chooses to have her children believe in Santa then she should be able to find a way to keep the story alive for her DD. What would be wrong with saying "well if Justin doesn’t believe in Santa then he will not get any presents from Santa" or "we believe there is a Santa and that is all that matters". Am I wrong? Should it be a bigger issue? She talked to my husband tonight, do you think I should go over tomorrow mom to mom and apologize? I want to make it better or at least let her know I sympathize with her feelings. She wanted him punished and let my DH know that is why she was here. She said, “I just thought someone should know what he did so it could be handled appropriately” and that my son has “ruined Christmas”. I guess I am sad for her and her DD, but I feel like my DS didn’t really do anything wrong. He didn’t say it in a mean way it just came up when they where showing Christmas gifts. I don’t think he “ruined Christmas”. Someone somewhere was going to tell her DD the truth eventually. I do wish is was not my DS

FWIW we did talk to DS again about the importance of not telling other children there is no Santa. We did not punish him for it. He does feel bad for hurting her feelings and wrote an apology note to the mom and dad.

Thanks in advance for the advice.

Hey Lacy, I'm going to put my own opinion in here before reading anyone elses response. Because, I don't want to be influenced or scared off by what anyone else might have replied!

Anyway, I think you handled it appropriately. Your son wrote an apology, your husband apologized, that's enough. The lady is making way more out of it than she should have. I don't celebrate Christmas (although I AM Chrisitan), but my husband does with my kids. We tought our children that there was no Santa, however, you would NOT believe the nubmer of adults (and kids, but I don't get my panties in a wad about what kids do) that have tried to convince my children that there IS a Santa! Even when I politely say, "We don't do that in our house." I mean, if we are out in public, I don't want to just announce, "No, we don't believe in Santa", so I try to do it discreetly. (Usually, this is done by a cashier in a store, while we were paying, so walking away is not a real option.) I have had to convince my children that in fact there is NO Santa. No one ever apologized to me for that, and I didn't ask them to. I would say that if your neighbor's daughter believed your son about their not being a Santa, she probably allready knew it, or was ready to let it go. And, you handled it very respectfully.

 

[lindsmom]

Do you really believe that because my family does not believe in Santa, that means my child is inappropriately sexualized? that is a MAJOR stretch, and a bit offensive to not only me, but also the many many Jewish, Muslim and Christian families in this nation that don't celebrate Santa. Wow, just wow.

I don't think this is what rt2dz was saying. I also understood what the other mother was upset about, and I have the same feeling with my dd. There are families that believe and those that don't. But it's a question of the filter the child has. My daughter (usually) knows that if she sees someone in a wheelchair, she comes to me and asks why that person's in a wheelchair. She has a filter whereby she checks with us about things she's not sure about. I would (and have before) hesitate to have her socialize with children without a filter.
I think rt2dz is talking about children who want to discuss EVERYTHING to impress their friends. I agree, that children in this category are eager to one - up their peers with the profound knowledge they have, either Santa's not real, or the Easter Bunny, or sex. It's those topics that parents don't want to discuss or hope to keep their children naieve about for just a bit longer. I'm one of those parents, and I would rather my child socialize with children who either believe / are a bit naieve / or can filter or edit themselves.

And rt2dz, if that's not quite what you meant, I apologize for speaking in your turn.

 

[jeepgirl30]

My DD7 goes to a very diverse school and daycare. She has many friends that do not believe. She told me a couple friends do not believe in Santa but that they celebrate New Years! I tried to explain everyone celebrates New Years but she is convinced otherwise

I am pretty sure one parent (parent of twins) has told her daughter NOT to tell other kids but this little girl is very opinionated and verbal. I would never approach the mother to critize her. It is her right to not believe.

We choose to believe. We debated coming clean this year if DD pushed the issue as she was really questioning last year. Along with the diverse backgrounds there is a diverse financial background also. We can not do as much as a lot of parents and would not even if we could. However she did not question so we did not spill anything. She has said she knows some people do not believe in Santa so they do not get presents.

I think the mother over reacted completely and it sounds as if the child may have already begun to have doubt.

Another mother at the daycare had a great idea. Last year she put a tiny piece of coal in her boys stockings with a note saying "if you are bad or stop believing this is all you get next year". The older boy told everyone and now my DD is so fearful of evening thinking about questioning! She hears both sides and has chosen for herself. Isn't that what we want her kids to be able to do as they grow up? Choose what is right for them? Not saying Santa is right or wrong but being able to stand up to someone with a different opinion and say that is not for me.

 

[Nom]

I don't think this is what rt2dz was saying. I also understood what the other mother was upset about, and I have the same feeling with my dd. There are families that believe and those that don't. But it's a question of the filter the child has. My daughter (usually) knows that if she sees someone in a wheelchair, she comes to me and asks why that person's in a wheelchair. She has a filter whereby she checks with us about things she's not sure about. I would (and have before) hesitate to have her socialize with children without a filter.
I think rt2dz is talking about children who want to discuss EVERYTHING to impress their friends. I agree, that children in this category are eager to one - up their peers with the profound knowledge they have, either Santa's not real, or the Easter Bunny, or sex. It's those topics that parents don't want to discuss or hope to keep their children naieve about for just a bit longer. I'm one of those parents, and I would rather my child socialize with children who either believe / are a bit naieve / or can filter or edit themselves.

And rt2dz, if that's not quite what you meant, I apologize for speaking in your turn.

Perhaps that is what they meant, but it did not seem to be what they were saying. The poster specifically said that :

The simple fact is most kids in the USA believe in Santa, not believing is usually for older kids and adults.

That's just not true- not everyone in the US is christian, and even some that are christian don't believe in santa. Does the poster want their children away from all kids who don't believe in santa, or just those christian kids that don't believe in santa? And just because my child does not believe in santa does not mean that her head is filled with other inappropriate adult things, which I what it seemed the previous poster was saying, to me. Just seemed bizzare. Anyway, like I said I was only mildy offended.

I am just suprised about the passion that people feel for santa. I don't even remember the year that I found out santa was not real, so that christmas was not cast in a pall. My cousin said to me on christmas eve, "Don't you think your dd is going to be scarred for life if you don't let her believe in santa claus"- and he was serious! I just don't get the 'cult of santa'. just my personal opinion.

 

[adoptionmomma4]

Well, I, for one, thoroughly understand the other mom's position. I would feel the same way. Right down to not wanting my kids to play with yours--although I'd get over that. I WOULD NOT have gone to you with that feeling. I WOULD NOT have said you "ruined" Christmas, even if you did for that child, even temporarily because my child wouldn’t know what to think. I might have told you so that you could talk to your DS and remind him to be more careful at times. I WOULD NOT expect him to be punished. Basically, I would have handled it differently, but probably had the same feelings.

We also do not know how the mother handled it with her daughter. We just know how she reacted to the OP's DH.

DS6 has a little girl in his class that has told all the kids that Santa isn't real. I asked DS what he thought. He said he believed, but over the course of the long holiday season, she presented some good arguments. I told my DS that I believe in Santa (and I do, guess I'm living a lie! ) I told him what Santa stands for. That Santa is for Christians (which this little girl is not) and for believers. I also pulled out the book, The Polar Express-]--much more to the point about believing. When DS6 asked how Santa does it, I told him simply that not every house has a visit from Santa and Santa really has a lot of helpers. I also reminded him about the International Date Line and time zones.

A little more about the not wanting my kids to play with yours... I'd be more inclined to feel that way because I'd be wondering what else your kid might spill to mine. Not necessarily the Easter Bunny or Tooth Fairy, but about other adult things like the birds and the bees. The simple fact is most kids in the USA believe in Santa, not believing is usually for older kids and adults. I'd have to wonder what other (not just birds and bees) things your child might bring up to mine in everyday conversation I might not want them exposed to yet. But, like I said, I'd get over it.

WOW! Thanks everyone for all of your opinions. Also for keeping this pretty much on topic and keeping it nice

I was also a little offended by this post. I too also understand the other mothers feelings. I sympathize with her feelings, I really do. I also feel like many other people that posted that if you want your child to believe you should be prepared to field questions your children may have from listening to their peers.

That being said... Just because we decided to celebrate Christmas with out Santa does not mean my children are over knowledgeable on adult issues. I think my neighbor knows this. My children are home schooled in part so I can protect them from information I do not want them to know yet. She knows we are very strict with our children and would like to keep them young and innocent as well (I have been accused many time of raising my children in a bubble). We have had many conversations about her beliefs and mine in the past. She also knew we didn’t celebrate Santa since I told her on Christmas Eve when she asked me if children were getting excited for Santa to come. That is what bothers me the most. I already told her they don't believe. I also told her how we handled it with our children. She knew they were told to keep the secret, unfortunately they are kids. "Filters" or not they will tell other kids things they have been told not to.

 

[trivial]

A bit off-topic here, but I'm saddened by those who would prevent their children from playing with other children who might say something about *gasp!* the birds and the bees, let alone about Santa or the boogie man. Are there really people out there raising their children with such fragile little minds?

Children will hear and see all sorts of things that parents might not want them to; that's an unavoidable certainty of life. So what? They'll live, and they won't become corrupt little monsters. I don't believe parenting should be about shielding your children from every possible thing, but rather about teaching children how to appropriately deal with whatever comes their way.

If you'd rather hide your children away, they're not going to have very many friends first of all, and they're probably going to fall a lot harder when they inevitably break free from the prison created for them.

Alright, sorry everyone. </rant> Back to our regularly-scheduled programming.

WOW! Thanks everyone for all of your opinions. Also for keeping this pretty much on topic and keeping it nice

Uh oh!

 

[wilderness01]

I can see why the other mother is upset due to the age of her child. I too would be very upset. I would not think that your son did this on purpose, but it is too much for such a young child to remember not to reveal the truth. I would probably limit the amount of information in the future to the child until I was sure he was mature enough to know what to keep a secret and the meaning of what a secret is. He is clearly too young to know the difference if he spilled the beans. I'm sorry this happened.

 

[mommytobug]

I can understand both sides. 5 is so young to be told, if you do celebrate with Santa. We had a few children in our church who were home schooled and also told there was no Santa or Easter Bunny. We always hold an Easter Egg hunt at our home. They always choose to show up and then proceed to tell young children the "truth". That, in my opinion, is their parents fault. Why bring them? These children are also not well behaved and have no rules at all when it comes to others feelings. I am not downing home schooling by any means, we have friends who home school and we love them. So, you can handle these things kindly or you can laugh at what your children do. The latter is not acceptable in my opinion. I can tell you that the children I am talking about are not allowed to play with my child. There are more reasons than not believing in Santa. I guess I am wandering WHY she would allow her children to play with yours so close to Christmas if she knew that you did not believe. I would have been nicely careful. My dd came home from a friends and said the friend said there was no Santa, I was so suprised, I just said "she is a little strange, huh?" I feel bad for saying that but I was not prepared!

 

[MiniGirl]

A little more about the not wanting my kids to play with yours... I'd be more inclined to feel that way because I'd be wondering what else your kid might spill to mine. Not necessarily the Easter Bunny or Tooth Fairy, but about other adult things like the birds and the bees. The simple fact is most kids in the USA believe in Santa, not believing is usually for older kids and adults. I'd have to wonder what other (not just birds and bees) things your child might bring up to mine in everyday conversation I might not want them exposed to yet. But, like I said, I'd get over it.

Wow!!! That's about the biggest leap I have ever seen. Kudos to you on that one.

My dds (8 and 5) know the truth. Dh and I went back and forth with my oldest; and for the first few years, it wasn't an issue. My dd knew that Santa was a character but never thought him to be a real person. It wasn't until others started asking her about Santa that she started to realize that people believed him to be real and not just a wonderful character in a lot of great stories, and it freaked her out. She was terrified at the thought of a stranger coming into our house while we were sleeping. It didn't matter that he was a kindly stranger and was bringing her presents. He was still a stranger, so our decision was made for us. We told her the truth. We also told her that this was a grown up secret and she was not to tell any of her friends. She loved feeling like a big kid and encouraging her friends in their belief. Then she'd look at me and give me a little smile.

Personally, I think the woman over reacted. She wants you to punish your son for being truthful? I also find it terribly sad that your neighbor's holiday is dependent on belief in a man in a red suit in order for it to be merry, and without that belief it is "ruined."Yikes.

Oh and for what it is worth. My dds know the grown up Santa secret, but they do not yet know about the birds and the bees. Of course, when the time comes, we will be open and honest abut that, too.

 

[CEDmom]

I have no sympathy for those who do the Santa thing when it starts to unravel. Those parents choose to lie to their children, you choose to NOT lie, AND you are very kind about it, because you have tried to let your kids know that they should just stay mum on the subject (while the kids who "believe" and the ad agencies and stores and everyone else get to spout off all year long)...I don't have to think too hard about which side gets to have empathy and sympathy from me!

Forget saving for DD8's college education - we'll need all that money for her therapy bill .

As for the OP, it's tough when kids get of school age and start discussing family traditions because everyone does different things. I think all you can do is to just continue to teach your kids to be respectful of different people.

 

[CEDmom]

My DD7 goes to a very diverse school and daycare. She has many friends that do not believe. She told me a couple friends do not believe in Santa but that they celebrate New Years! I tried to explain everyone celebrates New Years but she is convinced otherwise

I am pretty sure one parent (parent of twins) has told her daughter NOT to tell other kids but this little girl is very opinionated and verbal. I would never approach the mother to critize her. It is her right to not believe.

We choose to believe. We debated coming clean this year if DD pushed the issue as she was really questioning last year. Along with the diverse backgrounds there is a diverse financial background also. We can not do as much as a lot of parents and would not even if we could. However she did not question so we did not spill anything. She has said she knows some people do not believe in Santa so they do not get presents.

I think the mother over reacted completely and it sounds as if the child may have already begun to have doubt.

Another mother at the daycare had a great idea. Last year she put a tiny piece of coal in her boys stockings with a note saying "if you are bad or stop believing this is all you get next year". The older boy told everyone and now my DD is so fearful of evening thinking about questioning! She hears both sides and has chosen for herself. Isn't that what we want her kids to be able to do as they grow up? Choose what is right for them? Not saying Santa is right or wrong but being able to stand up to someone with a different opinion and say that is not for me.

Given your DD is in a diverse school it's possible these other children are Asian and celebrate Chinese New Year.

 

[tonilea]

I say this as the reluctant mother in a family that believes in Santa. I dread the day my son discovers or is told Santa isn't real, but if you are going to allow your child to believe in a fictional character, then you had better be expecting someone, somewhere to let the cat out of the bag!

 

[Manda]

My answer would probably be, "Well, why was your kid lying to my kid and telling him that Santa DOES exist??"

As far as I'm concerned, her kid is just as much in the wrong as your kid. They both were being equally disrespectful of each other's beliefs. I'm sure your kid didn't just walk up to the Santa believer on the playground and start shouting at him that Santa is pretend. There was certainly a Santa conversation that led to your child exposing the truth.

My four year old told everyone in his preschool class the other day. I've told him not to, but that didn't last when other kids started prodding him and telling him that he didn't get gifts from Santa because he wasn't a "good boy." So, he told them that Santa was just their parents pretending.

I did my best and explained to him that telling other kids that would make them sad, but when other people continually disregard the fact that not everyone in the world believes the same as them and continually try to convince my son of a lie that we don't believe... well, I can hardly fault him for speaking the truth.

 

[teresajoy]

She told me a couple friends do not believe in Santa but that they celebrate New Years! I tried to explain everyone celebrates New Years but she is convinced otherwise

Actually, not everyone celebrates New Years. I don't. Obviously, I'm aware it happens, but I don't join in the celebrations.

And, I am just relating this because I have always thought it was funny: I don't celebrate birthdays, and to this day (and I'm 38!) people (adults!) are SHOCKED that I know how old I am! As if you have to celebrate a birthday to actually have one! I wish!