WWYD - Potential job offer but with a huge pay cut and in-office requirement

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I would take it and continue to look for another job. Always seems easier to get a new job if you already have one. Plus, you could stop the early retirement withdrawals.

Taking a job you don’t like doesn’t mean you have to stay there forever. Use it as a stepping stone to something better.

I actually don't think so, especially with the commitment the OP would be putting in. I think sometimes people overestimate the ability to find a job while at a job that comes with a lot of added stuff. In this case it's 4 hours commute each day they are going in and those days they are projecting to be 14 hr work days (I'm not sure if that's including commute time or excluding that). Chances are IF the OP has been looking for a job now with being at home adding a job with so much outside commitment will mean less energy, less time and less availability to do the job hunting much less interview for one. Would this new job allow her time off should she need to interview most especially when she knows she's coming on when a big project is starting?

The realist in me thinks if the OP took this job they would end up sticking with it far longer than one would think and potentially be very discontent with that OR they would quit nearly immediately once the reality of all they would be giving up is there.

Ideally they would be able to take what they can get so they aren't bleeding funds like they are now but the job they are being presented with presents very big and very real drawbacks. A 4 hour commute 3X a week is going to put a lot of wear and tear on the only vehicle the household has. If the conversation were about going back into the office 3X a week but being much closer say 15-20mins (maybe 30mins max) per way some of the drawbacks would be mitigated. An example could even be the OP and their husband drive together to the OP's work and then that leaves the car with the husband during the day, then he picks them back up at the end of their workday. That type of potential consideration towards the husband's situation is out of the question with a 4 hour RT commute.

I don't think the OP should continue living off retirement savings but this potential job offer is not one that is tenable for the majority of people, it's easy to say some suggestions when we're not the ones having to do what the OP would have to do to take this job.

 

[reddog21]

I really wish HR where I worked would have permitted us to inquire of out of area applicants (out of region-no way they could commute) if they had researched housing and other living expenses in the areas surrounding our offices. it never failed that we would get highly qualified applicants who just saw that we were paying the highest rate in that state for the identical job they were doing elsewhere and they were ready to pull up stakes and move for it. the thing was, housing back then was SO much higher where we worked as compared to most other places that the majority of our workforce commuted (as much as 2 hours each way per day in good traffic) to get even a small break on housing (it was still more than people were used to paying elsewhere) so there was the added cost of gas and tolls, wear and tear on your car (no feasable public transportation). we inevitably would make an employment offer, it would be accepted and then during the 30 days or so before they were scheduled to report they would call and withdraw their acceptance always saying 'i did'nt know it cost so much to live there'.

I conduct a fair number of interviews, and it never ceases to amaze me how unaware some people are about the cost of things or how little they know about the job they applied for. We’ve limited most applications to about a 45-minute commute, as anything longer feels like a complete waste of time. While there are fully remote positions available, they aren’t within my department.

 

[DCLMP]

2 hours to drive each way? For that commute I would be getting a cheap apartment near the work site. It doesn’t seem like you really need this job so I would be out.

I would agree with you, but I don't think cheap apartments exist these days.

 

[DCLMP]

x

 

[DCLMP]

You’ve lived off your retirement account for 2 years and you didn’t intend to at this point in your life? Unless you have baller level retirement tucked away you take this job and suck up the misery until you find something better. On the mental health- whatever issues you’re feeling/have had will pale in comparison to not having a retirement account left when you need it.

My husband got laid off during the last recession. He had to take a job 3 hours away and basically live in his car 3 nights a week and shower at a gym. I was working full time and our kids were young. It lasted two awful years, but now it's a distant memory. You do what you got to do when good jobs are scarce.

 

[cruisehopeful]

From my own perspective, I would continue to interview until they offer me the position. I would then try to negotiate for something better. If they can't bend at all, wish them a good day and move on to something else. Unfortunately, that type of commute can take a significant toll on your health and quality of life overall. Since it's a pay cut from what you made there previously, it's even less motivating to put up with it.

 

[AxesOkay]

So this might be a bit of a stretch on a Disney board, but here goes. I was part of a mass layoff a few years ago and haven't worked since. My former employer posted a role I'm uniquely qualified for in a different department and I've been invited for 3rd round interviews. Here's the catch: even though the role is at the same level as my old job (with 10 times the direct reports too), the salary is considerably less than what I was earning back then AND they want me in the office 3 days a week (I worked remotely the last dozen years). Though I don't live far, it can take almost 2 hours to drive each way plus the extra costs in terms of gas, tolls, maintenance & probably insurance too, because of the increased mileage. There's a big project with an upcoming deadline that will make for long days so I'm guessing those in office days will be about 14 hours, including the commute. I normally start my day with a 5-mile walk which has been great for my physical and mental health - I would have to give those up on in-office days. We only have 1 car so DH would be stuck at home those office days, impacting his mental health as well. I'm surprised that in this environment, I'm even considering saying no and continuing to live off my retirement savings, but I'm not sure why I would want the added stress of working more for less. I realize I sound spoiled to even have that opportunity but I was taken advantage of for years (my peers were paid more) and I want to at least be kept whole financially to make these sacrifices. Do I wait to see if I get the offer and try to play hardball? There's close to a 20% gap between my number and their max. Do I walk? WWYD?

Cool

 

[Robber Baron]

You live close but the commute 'can' take up to 2 hours? How long will it 'likely' take.

You are 'guessing' in office days would be 14 hours? How long will they 'likely' be?

Taking the worst case scenario in every facet may be something to be concerned with, but that may not all even be probable.

For me, being out of work and living off my retirement savings FOR YEARS would pretty much make my decision very easy.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

You live close but the commute 'can' take up to 2 hours? How long will it 'likely' take.

There are certainly places where traffic (or construction) is such a nightmare that a close distance is only close in proximity, not time. I think people generally know their areas well enough to know if on average the chances of X (in this case a high commute time) is all but a given.

 

[Forevermarypoppins]

So this might be a bit of a stretch on a Disney board, but here goes. I was part of a mass layoff a few years ago and haven't worked since. My former employer posted a role I'm uniquely qualified for in a different department and I've been invited for 3rd round interviews. Here's the catch: even though the role is at the same level as my old job (with 10 times the direct reports too), the salary is considerably less than what I was earning back then AND they want me in the office 3 days a week (I worked remotely the last dozen years). Though I don't live far, it can take almost 2 hours to drive each way plus the extra costs in terms of gas, tolls, maintenance & probably insurance too, because of the increased mileage. There's a big project with an upcoming deadline that will make for long days so I'm guessing those in office days will be about 14 hours, including the commute. I normally start my day with a 5-mile walk which has been great for my physical and mental health - I would have to give those up on in-office days. We only have 1 car so DH would be stuck at home those office days, impacting his mental health as well. I'm surprised that in this environment, I'm even considering saying no and continuing to live off my retirement savings, but I'm not sure why I would want the added stress of working more for less. I realize I sound spoiled to even have that opportunity but I was taken advantage of for years (my peers were paid more) and I want to at least be kept whole financially to make these sacrifices. Do I wait to see if I get the offer and try to play hardball? There's close to a 20% gap between my number and their max. Do I walk? WWYD?

Me, I could never go back to the Co. I worked for previously, been laid off and then be rehired for basically same skills at a lower pay rate. No one kicks me in the teeth with my approval!

On the other hand, no one says you have to stay at the job if you were to get it! Revenge is sweet, keep applying and then leave and don't look back! Easier said than done, I know!

 

[tvguy]

I really wish HR where I worked would have permitted us to inquire of out of area applicants (out of region-no way they could commute) if they had researched housing and other living expenses in the areas surrounding our offices. it never failed that we would get highly qualified applicants who just saw that we were paying the highest rate in that state for the identical job they were doing elsewhere and they were ready to pull up stakes and move for it. the thing was, housing back then was SO much higher where we worked as compared to most other places that the majority of our workforce commuted (as much as 2 hours each way per day in good traffic) to get even a small break on housing (it was still more than people were used to paying elsewhere) so there was the added cost of gas and tolls, wear and tear on your car (no feasable public transportation). we inevitably would make an employment offer, it would be accepted and then during the 30 days or so before they were scheduled to report they would call and withdraw their acceptance always saying 'i did'nt know it cost so much to live there'.

I clearly was naive about current hiring procedures when I learned the HR was filtering applications before they got to the managers doing the hiring. I recommended a couple of highly qualified people, who never even got an interview. The manager.......after hiring two clunkers who did not make it past the 90 day probationary period......asked me if I knew of any people he should consider. I told him I had referred two qualified candidates and they didn't even get interviews. He had never heard of them nor seen their resumes or applications. He went to HR and asked for the applications and just looked at the HR person and asked why these were not forwarded........because on paper......................they were clearly the top candidates. Never heard the reasoning, but shortly after that, HR was directed to forward ALL applications, the big boss ordered an end to HR filtering applications.
Ultimately my two candidates did get hired and worked out. Well, I suspect in one case, the applicant had over 30 years experience in multiple jobs in our industry....INCLUDING HR. While the job was not HR, I think this persons HR qualifications were more than our HR persons. Maybe that was a factor?

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

I clearly was naive about current hiring procedures when I learned the HR was filtering applications before they got to the managers doing the hiring. I recommended a couple of highly qualified people, who never even got an interview. The manager.......after hiring two clunkers who did not make it past the 90 day probationary period......asked me if I knew of any people he should consider. I told him I had referred two qualified candidates and they didn't even get interviews. He had never heard of them nor seen their resumes or applications. He went to HR and asked for the applications and just looked at the HR person and asked why these were not forwarded........because on paper......................they were clearly the top candidates. Never heard the reasoning, but shortly after that, HR was directed to forward ALL applications, the big boss ordered an end to HR filtering applications.
Ultimately my two candidates did get hired and worked out. Well, I suspect in one case, the applicant had over 30 years experience in multiple jobs in our industry....INCLUDING HR. While the job was not HR, I think this persons HR qualifications were more than our HR persons. Maybe that was a factor?

This wouldn't surprise me. People get catty when they start feeling insecure.

 

[Cynt]

No! No! No!
I commute 90 minutes one way 3 days a week. I loathe my in office work days. My manager is really flexible and allows me to leave early to get ahead of the traffic.

Don't do it. I'm 4 years in and it's brutal. Traffic is worse and I swear every freeway is under construction.

I'm always tired.

 

[StitchesGr8Fan]

I think it comes down to how badly you need the money right now.

 

[ruadisneyfan2]

No! No! No!
I commute 90 minutes one way 3 days a week. I loathe my in office work days. My manager is really flexible and allows me to leave early to get ahead of the traffic.

Don't do it. I'm 4 years in and it's brutal. Traffic is worse and I swear every freeway is under construction.

I'm always tired.

But do you prefer it to being unemployed?
You haven’t quit yet.

 

[QueenIsabella]

When my husband had to work a few hours away for a few months, he found a co-worker who rented him a bedroom. It worked really well--co-worker got cash and some who pitched in (helped shovel snow, stayed home with the dog when the couple went out to dinner). DH got a bed, TV, private bath, and kitchen access. He worked 4, 10-hour days, then came home. Sometimes, the couple fed him (it wasn't part of the deal, but neither was the dog-sitting--they just kind of worked together).

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

When my husband had to work a few hours away for a few months, he found a co-worker who rented him a bedroom. It worked really well--co-worker got cash and some who pitched in (helped shovel snow, stayed home with the dog when the couple went out to dinner). DH got a bed, TV, private bath, and kitchen access. He worked 4, 10-hour days, then came home. Sometimes, the couple fed him (it wasn't part of the deal, but neither was the dog-sitting--they just kind of worked together).

That was something I thought about too getting a place closer by to the job but regardless of where that added expenditure would need to be included in the financial analysis of the job not to mention the OP's household only has 1 car.

If the job was highly lucrative then the added costs of a place to stay closer to the job as well as getting another vehicle could make a big difference but from the OP it didn't sound like it was. Depending on what the husband does and his needs (not the mental health part but the logistical part) rideshare could work out for the husband to use when he needs to leave the house but that also should be included on the financials part.

 

[tvguy]

No! No! No!
I commute 90 minutes one way 3 days a week. I loathe my in office work days. My manager is really flexible and allows me to leave early to get ahead of the traffic.

Don't do it. I'm 4 years in and it's brutal. Traffic is worse and I swear every freeway is under construction.

I'm always tired.

A friend got transferred to a different city with the same company, 56 miles away, about an hour drive, he got an apartment because he didn't want to deal with 2 hours a day on the road and I think his employer required him to live within 30 minutes of work. (He was on call 24/7/365)
A co-worker made a tough choice, she took a job with us, 7 hours drive, 400 miles from home and got an apartment. But she went home every Friday after work and came back Sunday night. THAT was brutal. She started with a brand new car, burned through a lot of books on tape. 3 years and 120,000 miles later, she decided to take a lower paying job in her home town.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

A friend got transferred to a different city with the same company, 56 miles away, about an hour drive, he got an apartment because he didn't want to deal with 2 hours a day on the road and I think his employer required him to live within 30 minutes of work. (He was on call 24/7/365)
A co-worker made a tough choice, she took a job with us, 7 hours drive, 400 miles from home and got an apartment. But she went home every Friday after work and came back Sunday night. THAT was brutal. She started with a brand new car, burned through a lot of books on tape. 3 years and 120,000 miles later, she decided to take a lower paying job in her home town.

My husband's employer actually moved to our side of the state line about 8 months prior to my husband starting (he's been with the company almost 4 yrs now). Where they were originally at was still part of our metro but on the eastern outskirts and considered far enough away that it was reducing the interest in applicants with it being on the outskirts. Most had graduated from a college a little over a 100 miles east from there. They were wanting to grow in the number of their company (at the time my husband was hired was just under 100 people). That move to the other side of the state line helped tremendously and now most of their applicants come from our side of the state line and now from two other colleges rather than almost entirely just from one. With our area being big on engineering they were losing out on qualified applicants with where they were located at.

It's not even that much of a drive really, the metro is large and spread out and people often work across state lines (going both ways) but traffic comes into play, commute time does as well. They briefly considered moving to Downtown (which would have been on the side of the state line they had started at and was trying to get away from) but the 1% earnings tax that employees have to pay to work OR live in that city would have been a major turn off and so that was quickly abandoned. Largely this new location could be considered mostly in the middle of the metro appealing to both sides of the state line and even though there is still traffic the highways systems tend to be better laid out and more efficient on our side of the state line than the other side of the state line.

Had my husband been looking at this company when they were in their original location he wouldn't have applied. A commute of 45mins-1 hour each way fighting the worst of traffic at the worst of times was not appealing in the least despite that he would have made more than his job at that time (a good amount more). And he told them too when they asked for input during the interview process too that he wouldn't have even looked at that company. His commute now roughly 15-25mins each way, rarely more than that but would be due to an accident or something on the highway, that good amount more income now can go a lot more without the double to potentially more than double the amount of commuting had the company stayed at their original location.

 

[Former DVC Owner]

My commute is 2 hours.

Walk the dog then leave at 6:15. Walk to train station. Get on 6:45 train. Get into Penn station (nyc) at 7:45. Walk to subway. Get on subway 7:55. Get off subway 8:10, walk to work. Get to building 8:15.

So I guess 2 hour commute isn’t a deal breaker for me since I’m doing it every day