Worried About Parents Retirement

[MIGrandma]

You will find out, if your Mom ever has to go into a nursing home or needs Medicaid, that it is definitely somebody else's business. Every penny of your Mom's money will need to be accounted for and perhaps paid back if spent incorrectly. You really need to consult a lawyer about what you have done, if you haven't done so already.

We already went through all of that with my Dad. He had Alzheimer's for several years and it got to the point where he was getting violent, so he spent the last 6 months of his life in a nursing home, and we had to go the Medicaid route because they had no $$$.

THAT is one of the MAIN reasons why I'm trying to be extra careful with her money!!

 

[Lionqueen2]

We already went through all of that with my Dad. He had Alzheimer's for several years and it got to the point where he was getting violent, so he spent the last 6 months of his life in a nursing home, and we had to go the Medicaid route because they had no $$$.

THAT is one of the MAIN reasons why I'm trying to be extra careful with her money!!

Each family's financial/health/living situation is different and decisions have to be made that are appropriate for that family. Each family has to do what is right for them. It sounds like you are doing a good job watching out for your mother.

 

[frndshpcptn]

I think I would be embarassed that my kids would HAVE to tell me that. But it's not like people who are bad with money magically change at 45. Adults that can't manage money become seniors that can't manage money.

When you're young and healthy, you can be accountable for getting yourself out of your own scrapes. But when you find yourself 60 and in failing health, it's not like you can just go get a job to cover your expenses.

Will everyone who is so incensed by the idea of talking to your parents about their financial health be so outraged as they're taking Grandma to the food pantry? Getting on the 5 year waiting list for a crappy senior studio? Vetting supportive care facilities that take Medicaid?

What exactly do you plan to do when Gran can't make the mortgage? Or can't afford her medicine?

I agree with a lot of this post. I think too often people don't have the uncomfortable discussion on financial health until it's too late. It's a fair conversation to have - adult to adult - so that families are on the same page in terms of choices / expectations as our parents age.

Yes, it's my parents money - but as thier adult child I do want an idea of what thier retirement plans are (including long term care, housing, etc).

Partly because at the end of the day, they are my parents and I am not going to let them live in a bad situation so if I need to be sure I can cover X, I'd like to have some idea of what that X will be, so I can plan accordingly.

I 1000% want them to travel and enjoy life. I really and truly do - and have encouraged them to book trips every year. But I also want to know they've thought about "what happens if..." because if they haven't then we need to - but then again I'm a big fan of thinking ahead and not waiting until last minute on important things like "how I am going to afford to live when I no longer work full time."

I've had this conversation with my parents (after we had a really hard time financially taking care of my granmother's medical / long term care needs) and I feel like we are on the same page as to what we expect of each other moving forward.

 

[eliza61]

I agree with a lot of this post. I think too often people don't have the uncomfortable discussion on financial health until it's too late. It's a fair conversation to have - adult to adult - so that families are on the same page in terms of choices / expectations as our parents age.

Yes, it's my parents money - but as thier adult child I do want an idea of what thier retirement plans are (including long term care, housing, etc).

Partly because at the end of the day, they are my parents and I am not going to let them live in a bad situation so if I need to be sure I can cover X, I'd like to have some idea of what that X will be, so I can plan accordingly.

I 1000% want them to travel and enjoy life. I really and truly do - and have encouraged them to book trips every year. But I also want to know they've thought about "what happens if..." because if they haven't then we need to - but then again I'm a big fan of thinking ahead and not waiting until last minute on important things like "how I am going to afford to live when I no longer work full time."

I've had this conversation with my parents (after we had a really hard time financially taking care of my granmother's medical / long term care needs) and I feel like we are on the same page as to what we expect of each other moving forward.

So let me ask you, if they tell you they are ok and to mind your own business (not as crappy as that but you get the idea) would you respect them?

Or better yet, what if they tell you and you don't agree with their plans what are you going to do, force them to spend the money or invest their money the way you want?

I'm not talking about incapacitated parents. I mean fully functional parents who's only crime is that they are elderly.

The bottom line is the Ops parents have told her they are ok. They have thought about what they are going to do in the future. Op doesn't agree because of what she has read and heard. Her parents have said they don't respect or agree with the tv financial gurus so after it's all said and done, it's still their decision.

 

[geffric]

the op might benefit from a trip to the local senior center and get advise from a neutral 3rd party ( soc worker or ship counselor).. they can tell them watch healthcare cost costs will be and how to budget the funds.. also what is pd by medicare and what is not..

 

[The Mystery Machine]

So let me ask you, if they tell you they are ok and to mind your own business (not as crappy as that but you get the idea) would you respect them?

Or better yet, what if they tell you and you don't agree with their plans what are you going to do, force them to spend the money or invest their money the way you want?

I'm not talking about incapacitated parents. I mean fully functional parents who's only crime is that they are elderly.

The bottom line is the Ops parents have told her they are ok. They have thought about what they are going to do in the future. Op doesn't agree because of what she has read and heard. Her parents have said they don't respect or agree with the tv financial gurus so after it's all said and done, it's still their decision.

My dad tells me to keep out of his business and we do until he starts getting harrassed from the banks, IRS, creditors, etc., and my mom starts freaking out.

Then we have the unfortunate task of stepping in.

We have paid for my parents bills, they lived with my sister for 2yrs because they were BROKE.

Now they are in an apartment and the latest crisis is, they were not paying for taxes (again, this is not new ).

I only step in when I have to. My dad tells me they are OK but he is lying.

 

[frndshpcptn]

So let me ask you, if they tell you they are ok and to mind your own business (not as crappy as that but you get the idea) would you respect them?

Or better yet, what if they tell you and you don't agree with their plans what are you going to do, force them to spend the money or invest their money the way you want?

I'm not talking about incapacitated parents. I mean fully functional parents who's only crime is that they are elderly.

The bottom line is the Ops parents have told her they are ok. They have thought about what they are going to do in the future. Op doesn't agree because of what she has read and heard. Her parents have said they don't respect or agree with the tv financial gurus so after it's all said and done, it's still their decision.

I can only speak for my relationship with my parents, but I trust them enough that if they said they were ok I'd belive them. But, as a family, we are VERY honest about finances. We went through some very hard times when I was young and that's one area where there are no secrets. We almost lost everything and thanks to my grandparents (on both sides) managed to keep our house and stay afloat (barely) until things improved (and that took about 10 years).

My parents are very fiscally aware now and have secured LTC insurance, etc. Nothing's for sure with stocks and investments and 401Ks, but I know they have tried to chose those wisely. It's been very hard to pay for my grandmother's long term care and I know my parents don't want thier children to worry about providing for them in retirement. I would if needed (of course). but we've had these conversations so that they could share thier expectations with me and I could be in the loop in case something ever happened and I needed to step in and care for one or both. It seems to me the most responsible way to go about something like this.

 

[wdwfan16]

I can only speak for my relationship with my parents, but I trust them enough that if they said they were ok I'd belive them. But, as a family, we are VERY honest about finances. We went through some very hard times when I was young and that's one area where there are no secrets. We almost lost everything and thanks to my grandparents (on both sides) managed to keep our house and stay afloat (barely) until things improved (and that took about 10 years).

My parents are very fiscally aware now and have secured LTC insurance, etc. Nothing's for sure with stocks and investments and 401Ks, but I know they have tried to chose those wisely. It's been very hard to pay for my grandmother's long term care and I know my parents don't want thier children to worry about providing for them in retirement. I would if needed (of course). but we've had these conversations so that they could share thier expectations with me and I could be in the loop in case something ever happened and I needed to step in and care for one or both. It seems to me the most responsible way to go about something like this.

This is fine but a far cry from putting all of there assets in your name and then not allowing them to travel on the money they saved.

 

[natenapril]

When I was a legal assistant, I saw cases where this happened. Well what happened was the siblings fought back and much of the estate was squandered in legal fees.

It happened in my family. My grandparents were very frugal and had saved quite a bit of money. My aunt provided care fro my grandpa and during that time remodleld her house and paid her DIL to Babysit at $50,000 a year. She blew through the money pretty quick and the other children were left with a smaller inheritance. It was very nasty for a bit.

 

[frndshpcptn]

This is fine but a far cry from putting all of there assets in your name and then not allowing them to travel on the money they saved.

Yes, that's true but I don't think I ever advocated that being a good idea?

My responses have (imo) suggested having open and honest conversations between adult family members about topics such as long term care, financial health and expectations on both sides so you can be as prepared as possible for the future.

 

[wdwfan16]

Yes, that's true but I don't think I ever advocated that being a good idea?

My responses have (imo) suggested having open and honest conversations between adult family members about topics such as long term care, financial health and expectations on both sides so you can be as prepared as possible for the future.

You did not advocate it but others on this thread did not see this as a problem.

 

[minkydog]

Will everyone who is so incensed by the idea of talking to your parents about their financial health be so outraged as they're taking Grandma to the food pantry? Getting on the 5 year waiting list for a crappy senior studio? Vetting supportive care facilities that take Medicaid?

What exactly do you plan to do when Gran can't make the mortgage? Or can't afford her medicine?

In fact, I did help my MIL get food stamps and Medicaid after FIL died and left her with a sum total of $47, the contents of his pockets. No savings. No checking acct. No life insurance. Didn't own their house. It was a baaaaaad situation, but it was not of our making. We were willing to help her with food and GRandma paid the taxes on her house. She got rid of cable, didn't run her A/C--she is very very frugal. We were willing to move her in with us, but she did not want to leave her home, so even though we disagreed with her we had to let it go.

EVentually, MIL had to be forced into assisted living. She's an alcoholic and it had gotten out of control(she became psychotic due to hte alcohol.) MIL was incensed that we forcibly moved her out of her home, but by that time she couldn't take care of herself OR her home. So we had to force the issue--and it was ugly.

MIL has one source of income, FILs paltry SS widow's benefit. FIL owned a restaurant and he cooked the books, so he didn't pay much in to SS. Now, it's come back to bite HER. You have to really look around for a place that you can afford on SS but it CAN be done. MIL has lived for 10 years in a no-frills place which is at least equal or better than her home.

Last year, MIL broke her hip. She has been failing for a couple years now and we knew it was just a matter of time before she would have to go to a nursing home. The broken hip actually opened that door. We had no trouble finding her a Medicare bed in a local nursing home which is very nice and has a good reputation in their small town.

My point is, you can't generalize about what a senior can or can't afford. Most seniors think they can't afford ANYTHING but then they are surprised at how far their small incomes can go. It's not impossible.

 

[bumbershoot]

If it's nobody's business but yours, then why announce it on the DIS board?

I agree with the part about whose business it is. Also, why announce it on a board in such a *different* way than it seems the reality is? MIG you should really go back and re-read your post. It's very different from what it seems the reality is. It REALLY sounded like you just willynilly took the money and put it in your name.

You will find out, if your Mom ever has to go into a nursing home or needs Medicaid, that it is definitely somebody else's business. Every penny of your Mom's money will need to be accounted for and perhaps paid back if spent incorrectly. You really need to consult a lawyer about what you have done, if you haven't done so already.

On the other hand, it does sound like they aren't hiding it, but rather using it for her costs. Doesn't sound like one of those things where people take money and houses ahead of time.

 

[MrsPete]

It's all well and good to say, "It's their business" . . . but what about if the parents suddenly discover -- in their old age, once they cannot realistically go back to work -- that they haven't saved enough, or that pension they'd expected isn't enough, or that the social security check isn't nearly as large as they'd thought it would be?

THEN WHAT?

Should the child who'd attempted to encourage retirement planning then shell out money -- perhaps money that they need to save for their own retirement or money that they need to spend for their children's educations -- for their parents' necessities?

Should the child who'd tried to be helpful earlier, when it was still possible to save for retirement, shove their own children together in one bedroom so the grandparents can move in once they cannot afford their own home?

Should the child really be expected to say, "Sorry, Mom and Dad. Have you thought about dumpster diving? Don't forget that I tried to convince you earlier to save!" That's not realistic.

Everything we read these days about retirement is scary. LOTS of people are not going to be prepared for their "golden years". The reality is that parents and children ARE tied together in this, and it IS the children's business if they're going to end up providing financial support for their parents one day.

 

[BuzznBelle'smom]

To the OP: I understand being a worrier. A lot of us have been there with aging parents. Yours aren't "old", by any means, and only you know the specific dynamics. So, no criticism here, but I'll offer you a little advice.

It's okay for you to suggest they look over their retirement plans, consider long-term insurance, create or update will and POA's, etc. Offer to get the name of a good retirement planner for them, if they're interested. These things should be done by any couple, at various stages of their lives. As a starting point of the conversations, it wouldn't hurt for YOU to say that YOU'RE thinking about your future, you went to see someone, you learned some things... It's also reasonable for you to ask if they're expecting any particular things from you in the future--if one parent died, would the other expect to move in with you? Would it depend on which parent survived? Might the situation change if you married, had children, or moved?

It is NOT okay for you to ask specifics. Offer to be there to support their decisions. Then respect their privacy and choices.

 

[portocall]

My dad tells me to keep out of his business and we do until he starts getting harrassed from the banks, IRS, creditors, etc., and my mom starts freaking out.

Then we have the unfortunate task of stepping in.

We have paid for my parents bills, they lived with my sister for 2yrs because they were BROKE.

Now they are in an apartment and the latest crisis is, they were not paying for taxes (again, this is not new ).

I only step in when I have to. My dad tells me they are OK but he is lying.

Boy do I know this one!

It's all well and good to say, "It's their business" . . . but what about if the parents suddenly discover -- in their old age, once they cannot realistically go back to work -- that they haven't saved enough, or that pension they'd expected isn't enough, or that the social security check isn't nearly as large as they'd thought it would be?

THEN WHAT?

Should the child who'd attempted to encourage retirement planning then shell out money -- perhaps money that they need to save for their own retirement or money that they need to spend for their children's educations -- for their parents' necessities?

Should the child who'd tried to be helpful earlier, when it was still possible to save for retirement, shove their own children together in one bedroom so the grandparents can move in once they cannot afford their own home?

Should the child really be expected to say, "Sorry, Mom and Dad. Have you thought about dumpster diving? Don't forget that I tried to convince you earlier to save!" That's not realistic.

Everything we read these days about retirement is scary. LOTS of people are not going to be prepared for their "golden years". The reality is that parents and children ARE tied together in this, and it IS the children's business if they're going to end up providing financial support for their parents one day.

In our case, you could hardly call my in-laws ederly. My MIL isn't even close to 60 yet. All the warning signs were there from the time my FIL retired on disability as their poor financial advisor became the end all be all. There were several bad decisions that led to the point were they are now. I was content to let them be adults... until the day I checked my bank account and found myself in the negative by a lot. I balance my books often and I knew I couldn't be that far off so I went into the bank where I was informed that my DH had been on an account they had overdrawn by a lot and so since my DH was also on ours, they took it from us. We are asked for money weekly. I can't afford to substain their separate household and neither can my bil. We both have families with young children. I might feel a little more sympethetic, however, it wasn't just the dip in the economy that got them. I tried to be the voice of reason during the last few years, however they wouldn't hear a bit of it. Now it looks like it will be much sooner than I would like that I will now share joint custody (6 months a year) of my in-laws. I am sad and angry over it. My fil can't work, my mil can but doesn't want to. Well, she does now when there is a super competitive job market so can't seem to find one, at least that is what she says, but judging from the news, she probably isn't lying about that.

 

[dansamy]

Where does this sense of entitlement come from? Yes, my mother raised me. We were poor growing up, so we didn't get trips, proms, cars, college expenses, etc. I am not footing my mother's retirement. Period. If push comes to shove, I will (if there is room available) house and feed her. But she certainly shouldn't expect to live a lavish lifestyle if she is broke. And if she is broke, but physically able, she should expect to hold at least a part-time job to defray her expenses. It's the responsible thing to do. When did personal responsibility fall to the wayside and entitlement become the norm?

 

[dsny1mom]

Where does this sense of entitlement come from? Yes, my mother raised me. We were poor growing up, so we didn't get trips, proms, cars, college expenses, etc. I am not footing my mother's retirement. Period. If push comes to shove, I will (if there is room available) house and feed her. But she certainly shouldn't expect to live a lavish lifestyle if she is broke. And if she is broke, but physically able, she should expect to hold at least a part-time job to defray her expenses. It's the responsible thing to do. When did personal responsibility fall to the wayside and entitlement become the norm?

I feel every families dynamics are different. My parents afforded their children every opportunity and footed the bills for those opportunities, as well. I would jump at the chance to have my mother move into my home so I could do for her a small portion of what she and my father did for all of their children.

My mother is very independent minded at age 86 and refuses to live with any of her children and has made it clear she won't do so at any point of her remaining years. She says she doesn't want to be a burden on any of her children. Having my mother live with me and letting me do for her wouldn't be a budren, it would be a blessing.

dsny1mom

 

[aprilgail2]

I. My parents afforded their children every opportunity and footed the bills for those opportunities, as well. I would jump at the chance to have my mother move into my home so I could do for her a small portion of what she and my father did for all of their children.

Having my mother live with me and letting me do for her wouldn't be a budren, it would be a blessing.

dsny1mom

I agree! My parents gave me so much growing up,vacations, paid for college, paid for a car, insurance etc.....I would have NO problem taking care of her (my dad died at 55 years old) if that was ever needed!

 

[portocall]

It is all about family dynamics. DH didn't have a particulary rough childhood, however, his mother opened several credit cards in his name so he started life off $10,000 in the hole that we are still climbing out of.