Why is everyone so concerned with the new Poly tower

[Sandisw]

I can see both RIV and VGF2 sales hurting from the current AP situation. I know I wouldn't have even considered DVC without APs. That has to be a huge cloud over the whole product for now. There's a ton of resale sitting too. To me, the elephant no one is talking about is the APs.

I am not sure its that big of a deal. As I said, most of the people that I know who own DVC do not have AP's because they don't go often. The one poll here suggested that many don't use them either.

I think the lack of sales over the past year was the current situation, lack of travel, etc.

But I think we could be seeing people getting out of DVC because of a lot of the other changes that WDW have made.

 

[Tech4444]

PVB is still one of the best values in terms of selling price (resale), length of contract and maintenance fees. I'd rather own PVB than AKV, SSR or OKW even if I had to pay a nominal premium for it.

It's nice to have a flagship monorail resort as your baseline. Enjoy your contract!

Thank you ... COME ON ROFR HURRY UP!!

 

[kilik64]

The once a year or every other year set of DVC owners is most likely the biggest amount of the membership. Unless you are moving your yearly trip by at least a week, those folks have no good reason to get an AP. Our plan is once a year for spring break, so no reason for us to ever get AP, even with discounted Sorcerer pass, the 4ish park days we plan for its just cheaper to get tickets. Loads of owners like that as well. You awesome people with your loads of points going multiple trips per year are awesome outliers (so jelly!)

I think the sales volume speaks to that, biggest single month since 2013. Lack of AP didnt seem to hurt anything.

 

[Paul Stupin]

I am not sure its that big of a deal. As I said, most of the people that I know who own DVC do not have AP's because they don't go often. The one poll here suggested that many don't use them either.

I think the lack of sales over the past year was the current situation, lack of travel, etc.

The once a year or every other year set of DVC owners is most likely the biggest amount of the membership. Unless you are moving your yearly trip by at least a week, those folks have no good reason to get an AP. Our plan is once a year for spring break, so no reason for us to ever get AP, even with discounted Sorcerer pass, the 4ish park days we plan for its just cheaper to get tickets. Loads of owners like that as well. You awesome people with your loads of points going multiple trips per year are awesome outliers (so jelly!)

I think the sales volume speaks to that, biggest single month since 2013.

I think there‘s probably anecdotal evidence as well that annual passes are significant to a considerable percentage of DVC owners. I know they are to my wife and I!

And even if they’re not to some DVC owners, then why not offer them anyway? It’s a perk that might serve as an additional sales tool without costing Disney much money.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

It will have been built as a DVC resort and will not be converted hotel rooms.

Are you describing that as upside or downside?

Because I read that as "it will have 350 square foot studios, not 450 square foot studios."

I think there‘s probably anecdotal evidence as well that annual passes are significant to a considerable percentage of DVC owners. I know they are to my wife and I!

And even if they’re not to some DVC owners, then why not offer them anyway? It’s a perk that might serve as an additional sales tool without costing Disney much money.

"Important to DVC owners" and "important to DVC buyers" are two different things.

 

[Sandisw]

I think there‘s probably anecdotal evidence as well that annual passes are significant to a considerable percentage of DVC owners. I know they are to my wife and I!

And even if they’re not to some DVC owners, then why not offer them anyway? It’s a perk that might serve as an additional sales tool without costing Disney much money.

Because its not about just one small subset of guests. DPEP considers everyone that would want them and suspended them, other than pixie pass, to all. I know people hate to hear this, but DPEP doesn't make decisions to help DVD with sales. If the company worked like that, then DVD would have found a way by now to get them to offer them to owners.

My point was more that I don't think lack of AP sales are playing any substantial role in the sales, given what has happened the past two months when passes are still not being sold.

 

[Paul Stupin]

Are you describing that as upside or downside?

Because I read that as "it will have 350 square foot studios, not 450 square foot studios."


"Important to DVC owners" and "important to DVC buyers" are two different things.

Huh? No they’re not. I think both some buyers and some owners would fInd the return of annual passes of great interest. DVC buyers become DVC owners so I‘m not sure exactly what your point is.

 

[Huskerpaul]

To me, the elephant no one is talking about is the APs.

To me the elephant is the current political environment surrounding Disney and if this influenced people selling their DVC contracts in the last few months.

 

[Sandisw]

Huh? No they’re not. I think both some buyers and some owners would fInd the return of annual passes of great interest. DVC buyers become DVC owners so I‘m not sure exactly what your point is.

I think the difference may be that when people first buy, AP's may not be something they need. As they begin to use their memberships, and add on, then they become more of desired product.

When I bought, I didn't need to have an AP...because we did once a year trip...though we did get them to capitalize on the every other year plan...but, had they not existed, it would have been fine.

Now, with the amount of times I go, it definitely matters!

 

[RoseGold]

I know people hate to hear this, but DPEP doesn't make decisions to help DVD with sales. If the company worked like that, then DVD would have found a way by now to get them to offer them to owners.

Unless it does. There's lots of historic precedent for comped tickets or free ticket passes with DVC sales. And with linking the ability to buy classes of APs.

I bought in 2019, confident in APs shining down on me. There's no way I was the only buyer with that as a factor. APs could change sales for direct and resale.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Huh? No they’re not. I think both some buyers and some owners would fInd the return of annual passes of great interest. DVC buyers become DVC owners so I‘m not sure exactly what your point is.

New buyers come to DVC so they can Stay Magical Year After Year. They don't care about Annual Passes or Moonlight Magic or when Boulder Ridge is going to be refurbished or if they can pool hop to High Rock Springs or when Top of the World Lounge is going to reopen.

 

[Paul Stupin]

Because its not about just one small subset of guests. DPEP considers everyone that would want them and suspended them, other than pixie pass, to all. I know people hate to hear this, but DPEP doesn't make decisions to help DVD with sales. If the company worked like that, then DVD would have found a way by now to get them to offer them to owners.

My point was more that I don't think lack of AP sales are playing any substantial role in the sales, given what has happened the past two months when passes are still not being sold.

Yeah, I agree about the lack of AP sales not playing a particularly substantial role in DVC sales right now. But so what! The lack of moonlight magic probably didn’t effect sales either but they brought it back. Enhancing the perceived benefits to buying direct could help them in the long run, especially as ticket prices go up.

Granted, I’m not holding my breath, but hope springs eternal!

 

[Paul Stupin]

New buyers come to DVC so they can Stay Magical Year After Year. They don't care about Annual Passes or Moonlight Magic or when Boulder Ridge is going to be refurbished or if they can pool hop to High Rock Springs or when Top of the World Lounge is going to reopen.

So why have any benefits to buying direct at all?

 

[CaptainAmerica]

So why have any benefits to buying direct at all?

To create FOMO for resale owners. To keep members happy (which keeps their contracts off of the resale sites, which keeps resale prices high, which makes Direct more appealing by comparison). Because existing members themselves buy a ton of points. To maintain brand affinity, which sells merch, F&B, recreation, and D+ subs.

 

[Sandisw]

So why have any benefits to buying direct at all?

Because they want to be able to give owners some level of perks to help sway them to buy directly from DVD...it does enhance the product. But, not all perks they offer are from them...they require agreements between third parties,

It's like AAA. You buy it for the services not for the discounts you get with it....same with DVC...if they can get other divisions or companies to give discounts, they will....but with the AP, they can't offer something they don't sell. Its why they can do Moonlight Magic...because its something they directly pay for out of their marketing budget...

 

[Brian Noble]

So why have any benefits to buying direct at all?

They are part of the sales song and dance. What they are, specifically, isn't that important. It's not even strictly necessary to have them. But having some features distinguishing direct from resale gives the sales agent something to pull out when someone mentions resale.

This is all part of a much bigger truth: in general, timeshares are sold, not bought. Part of that sales process is that the purchase is aspirational--the sales agent is selling an idea of vacationing in a "better way" that is still "affordable." Part of it, and a big part of DVC, is the sense of belonging, of being "special" as a Member. A good example of this is all the Welcome Home nonsense. You aren't just going on vacation when you are going to WDW. Oh no! Unlike all those other peasants that are merely renting a hotel room, you are going home.

The Membership Extras are a way of reinforcing that idea of belonging and being special. Most of them are meaningless: the vast majority of DVC Members will probably never go to a Moonlight Magic and may never buy a discounted Annual Pass. They might get a nominal dining discount here or a merch discount there, but those are not that hard to come by---a zero-fee Disney Visa gives you at least some of them some of the time.

But, the people who are Members get a feeling, and that feeling means something and has tangible value. At the end of the day, Disney is a company that makes money by selling happiness. This is just another way that happens.

 

[Paul Stupin]

To create FOMO for resale owners. To keep members happy (which keeps their contracts off of the resale sites, which keeps resale prices high, which makes Direct more appealing by comparison). Because existing members themselves buy a ton of points. To maintain brand affinity, which sells merch, F&B, recreation, and D+ subs.

Exactly! But if members feel that way, so do buyers (who want to become members), and you just said none of that matters. You’re contradicting yourself.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Exactly! But if members feel that way, so do buyers (who want to become members), and you just said none of that matters. You’re contradicting yourself.

I think you're giving prospective buyers way too much credit on how savvy they are. I'd bet most of them buy without having ever even HEARD of half the things I mentioned.

"Tractors is so dumb," as they say.

 

[Paul Stupin]

Because they want to be able to give owners some level of perks to help sway them to buy directly from DVD...it does enhance the product. But, not all perks they offer are from them...they require agreements between third parties,

It's like AAA. You buy it for the services not for the discounts you get with it....same with DVC...if they can get other divisions or companies to give discounts, they will....but with the AP, they can't offer something they don't sell. Its why they can do Moonlight Magic...because its something they directly pay for out of their marketing budget...

They are part of the sales song and dance. What they are, specifically, isn't that important. It's not even strictly necessary to have them. But having some features distinguishing direct from resale gives the sales agent something to pull out when someone mentions resale.

This is all part of a much bigger truth: in general, timeshares are sold, not bought. Part of that sales process is that the purchase is aspirational--the sales agent is selling an idea of vacationing in a "better way" that is still "affordable." Part of it, and a big part of DVC, is the sense of belonging, of being "special" as a Member. A good example of this is all the Welcome Home nonsense. You aren't just going on vacation when you are going to WDW. Oh no! Unlike all those other peasants that are merely renting a hotel room, you are going home.

The Membership Extras are a way of reinforcing that idea of belonging and being special. Most of them are meaningless: the vast majority of DVC Members will probably never go to a Moonlight Magic and may never buy a discounted Annual Pass. They might get a nominal dining discount here or a merch discount there, but those are not that hard to come by---a zero-fee Disney Visa gives you at least some of them some of the time.

But, the people who are Members get a feeling, and that feeling means something and has tangible value. At the end of the day, Disney is a company that makes money by selling happiness. This is just another way that happens.

I totally agree with you guys. And I believe these perks matter. My question was meant to reflect sarcasm, but it didn’t come across. My bad!

 

[Paul Stupin]

I think you're giving prospective buyers way too much credit on how savvy they are. I'd bet most of them buy without having ever even HEARD of half the things I mentioned.

"Tractors is so dumb," as they say.

Wrong again! I’m sure all these perks are a required, mandatory part of every guide’s sales pitch.