Why Intelligent Design Will Win

[hokiefan33]

The question is, would Christ agree?

With most of what you say? No way.

 

[hokiefan33]

Wow.

Do you have a doctor? Does he make his diagnoses based on the Bible or based on opinions from scientific studies?

Clearly, Aidensmom, this does not mean that. And you know it. Of course, I'm sure you agree with most of what is being said, anyway.

 

[sodaseller]

Yes, I do too. I wonder if that kind of "doublethink" (couldn't think of a less Orwelian term, sorry!) is a sign of maturity in general, not just spiritual maturity.

As Paul Davies mused, who would deign to worship a Deity discernable as the end result of a mathematical equation? By definition, that contradicts a transcendent nature. Melding the quantitative and qualitative (the God head?), words are finite devices that cannot describe the Infinite. Don't follow the Hokie heresy - anthopomorphizing a Being that by definition cannot be anthropomorphized. Our understanding is not His. Doubletalk indeed - we are acknowledging what we cannot explain or understand, what we can only sense on a nonsensory level. Again, don't follow the Hokie heresy and imagine you can speak for the Infinite. Denying the existence of the Infinite merely because we cannot understand it is the flipside of Hokieism, no less immodest, and just as heretical

 

[hokiefan33]

As Paul Davies mused, who would deign to worship a Deity discernable as the end result of a mathematical equation? By definition, that contradicts a transcendent nature. Melding the quantitative and qualitative (the God head?), words are finite devices that cannot describe the Infinite. Don't follow the Hokie heresy - anthomorphizing a Being that by definition cannot be anthropomorphized. Our understanding is not His. Doubletalk indeed - we are acknowledging what we cannot explain or understand, what we can only sense on a nonsensory level. Again, don't follow the Hokie heresy and imagine you can speak for the Infinite. Denying the existence of the Infinite merely because we cannot understand it is the flipside of Hokieism, no less immodest, and just as heretical

WHAT???

Clearly on a "different" playing field than the rest of us...

 

[RickinNYC]

With most of what you say? No way.

I think Jesus would be a little ticked to know that you're speaking for him. You don't know what he would say or think. And if you deign to even suggest that you do, then I aint standin' next to you chief. Those lightning bolts are HOT!

Anyway, back to double date thing. His name is Chris, he's 6' tall, great sense of humor, pretty good looking guy. He's a great friend of mind and I know he'd love to meet you. Let me know what your schedule is like and I'll put something together. It'd be fun!

 

[Miss Jasmine]

I don't even know where to begin. Hokie, I'll be praying for you.

 

[toto2]

What I find interessting in this discussion , and the one recently closed , is the "war" between the "catholics" and the "christians" , and the fact that some people , like hokien , with whom I've had a very nice conversation a few months back , are certain that there interpretation of scriptures is the right one , and the others think the same. When we read what ever , we bring all our baggage with it.

Hokkien , you make look like you are the only authority on the bible, and while I am sure you know a lot more than I do about scriptures , I dont think any one have autority on there meaning. A lot of people , I am sure , study the Bible just as much as you do , and come to different conclusion. Can you say , foe sure , 100 % that your interpretation is correct ?


I know I am a bit of subject for this thread , but in the same way it fits abit with it.

 

[Crankyshank]

I'm not understanding why it's absolutely essential that God be mentioned in schools. Isn't it better to learn the science and accepted fact in school and then parents and religious leaders teach their version at home and in religious education.

That way there's no chance of a heathen messing up the word of God as interpreted by the fundamentalist masses.

 

[JCJRSmith]

You are priceless! I have a couple of friends I can set you up with someday. We could double date.

Now THAT would be something to see

 

[sodaseller]

WHAT???

Clearly on a "different" playing field than the rest of us...

Your first correct response, accidental at that (Ellen's Energy Adventure subreference). The point is that the Divine is on a "whole different playing field than the rest of us." We can't pretend to speak for Him with certitude (even assigning "Him" a gender is presumptuous and demeaning, both to the Divine and to women

 

[hokiefan33]

I think Jesus would be a little ticked to know that you're speaking for him. You don't know what he would say or think. And if you deign to even suggest that you do, then I aint standin' next to you chief. Those lightning bolts are HOT!

Anyway, back to double date thing. His name is Chris, he's 6' tall, great sense of humor, pretty good looking guy. He's a great friend of mind and I know he'd love to meet you. Let me know what your schedule is like and I'll put something together. It'd be fun!

We speak for Jesus anytime we tell others about Him, anytime we teach in Sunday School or talk in church, or anytime we quote the Bible to someone. Would Jesus agree with what sodaseller is shoveling? I say, 100%, unequivocally, absolutely NOT. We can never know everything about Jesus, or His nature. But we can know what He wants for us, what He wants us to believe about Him, and about aspects of Christianity, by reading the Bible. And if people say things contrary to what the Bible teaches, then I can absolutely say that Jesus wouldn't agree.

 

[RickinNYC]

We speak for Jesus anytime we tell others about Him, anytime we teach in Sunday School or talk in church, or anytime we quote the Bible to someone. Would Jesus agree with what sodaseller is shoveling? I say, 100%, unequivocally, absolutely NOT. We can never know everything about Jesus, or His nature. But we can know what He wants for us, what He wants us to believe about Him, and about aspects of Christianity, by reading the Bible. And if people say things contrary to what the Bible teaches, then I can absolutely say that Jesus wouldn't agree.

Well, last time I saw Jesus, he told me to tell you that he agrees. You should take me up on my offer and go on that double date. It'd be a hoot!

 

[FencerMcNally]

I find myself more and more interested in just what this "biblical" view Hokie likes to talk about actually is? Biblical is a pretty unspecific term after all. Whenever I see you arguing about the bible, you say that you come from a "biblical" viewpoint and so it's useless to argue with the rest of us because we don't (and, presumably we're ignorant heathens too I suppose). Saying you're arguing from a "biblical" viewpoint when you're talking about christianity is like saying you're arguing from a "medical" viewpoint when you're arguing about which prescription someone should take for a cold.

Just exactly what is your specific school of exegesis and theology? I've gone to sunday school since I was in 1st grade and taken upper level theology courses at a private religious university, and I don't think I can pick out just exactly what your "biblical" view represents.

Mostly you just come off as an irrational, blithering hate-monger who doesn't take opposing viewpoints well, whether they've been presented to you civilly or rudely

 

[hokiefan33]

you make look like you are the only authority on the bible, and while I am sure you know a lot more than I do about scriptures , I dont think any one have autority on there meaning. A lot of people , I am sure , study the Bible just as much as you do , and come to different conclusion. Can you say , foe sure , 100 % that your interpretation is correct ?

I know I am a bit of subject for this thread , but in the same way it fits abit with it.

Can I say with absolute certainty, to be proven with fact, that what I believe is 100% correct? No, b/c there are often no tangible facts against which to prove things. Many come on faith. However, do I believe 100% in my heart that I am right about what I say? Absolutely, without reservation. You have to remember, a LOT of people on these boards make statements based upon what they've heard in the media, from a friend, from their church or some other source, without REALLY taking the time to study the Bible for all it's worth themselves. So they will attribute things to the Bible that really aren't there, b/c they misunderstand the Bible. It's an argument from ignorance a lot of times.

 

[BelleMcNally]

WHAT???

Clearly on a "different" playing field than the rest of us...

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

I think it was a very pretty way of saying that claiming to fully comprehend the Divine as possessing NO contradictions does a disservice to religion. That the true burden and beauty of spirituality comes when people accept the charge to be completely merciful, even as they are completely faith-filled, even if they can't totally wrap their minds around how it's possible to do both.

And that SCRIPTURE (or rather, your interpretation of certain parts of the Christian scripture) isn't meant to be used like mathematics equation...

sodaseller, feel free to chime in if I'm wrong.

 

[hokiefan33]

We can't pretend to speak for Him with certitude (even assigning "Him" a gender is presumptuous and demeaning, both to the Divine and to women

So now God is, or could be, a woman? OK, how about all you Christians (or those who claim to be, at least) out there, why don't you weigh in on this one with some certainty.

Who believes that God is, or could be, a woman??

Soda, you're really borderline blasphemy here...

 

[Miss Jasmine]

Mostly you just come off as an irrational, blithering hate-monger who doesn't take opposing viewpoints well, whether they've been presented to you civilly or rudely

I think this is worthy of repeating. Hokie, is this really how you want to represent Christ?

 

[BelleMcNally]

So now God is, or could be, a woman? OK, how about all you Christians (or those who claim to be, at least) out there, why don't you weigh in on this one with some certainty.

Who believes that God is, or could be, a woman??

Soda, you're really borderline blasphemy here...

I, for one, do. And as a Hebrew scholar I should tell you that, all through Genesis, a feminine form of the noun is used to describe the Creator.

 

[hokiefan33]

I find myself more and more interested in just what this "biblical" view Hokie likes to talk about actually is? Biblical is a pretty unspecific term after all. Whenever I see you arguing about the bible, you say that you come from a "biblical" viewpoint and so it's useless to argue with the rest of us because we don't (and, presumably we're ignorant heathens too I suppose). Saying you're arguing from a "biblical" viewpoint when you're talking about christianity is like saying you're arguing from a "medical" viewpoint when you're arguing about which prescription someone should take for a cold.

Just exactly what is your specific school of exegesis and theology? I've gone to sunday school since I was in 1st grade and taken upper level theology courses at a private religious university, and I don't think I can pick out just exactly what your "biblical" view represents.

Mostly you just come off as an irrational, blithering hate-monger who doesn't take opposing viewpoints well, whether they've been presented to you civilly or rudely

How do I not take opposing viewpoints well? I listen to everyone of them, just don't agree with most of them. Am I supposed to agree with them to be "nice", if I don't believe they're true?

I don't have a specific "school" of exegesis or theology. I am a tried and true Southern Baptist, and have also been in church and sunday school since I was old enough to remember. I never went to a "religious" university, but then again, depending on where you went, that could be a good thing.

How about you, what is your viewpoint from?

 

[kidshop]

So now God is, or could be, a woman? OK, how about all you Christians (or those who claim to be, at least) out there, why don't you weigh in on this one with some certainty.

Who believes that God is, or could be, a woman??

Soda, you're really borderline blasphemy here...

Um, I don't think God is either. He is God not human. Jesus became a man on earth, but that's really all we know.