Why does disagreeing with our government equate to "not liking America?"

[babar]

I just had to ask this based on a discussion I had last night. Why do people assume because you disagree with the government on certain policies, that you hate America or are anti-American?

I think people who say that are actually the ones who are missing the whole point of what it is to be an American. It means that I can say whatever I want about our government and not get punished for it. I can disagree and try to make things better, not because I hate America, but because I want it to be better.
I'm sorry, but I feel some people here think we can do no wrong, and give support to the belief that other countries have about us being arrogant, or bullies, or whatever they say.

I swear, even the ones who promise they are the most patriotic Americans don't even know why this country is so great.

Just because I may agree with some other country's point of view on something, does not mean I am apologizing for being American, but sometimes the things I hear fly out of people's mouths makes me want to apologize for them being American.

No one has to answer this, just wanted to type this out, because I won't be able to yell like I was last night! (in case you were wondering, this conversation started with the topic of space exploration!)

 

[EROS]

Very well-written, BABAR .......

I call such illustrious individuals the:

AMERICA,LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT CROWD

They're usually Conservative and place undue trust in the "integrity" of our politicians and military leaders. Fortunately, the Founding Fathers had "the number" for these folks. The Constitution places the ultimate responsibility for our government's actions WITH THE PEOPLE .

 

[The Mystery Machine]

Well babar they assume that position, ie "THEN LEAVE AMERICA", because they do not want to think any further than what their stated position is OR they do not want to debate the issue with you.
Honestly...ask any politician and that is part of the job. Your job is to support your position which means then there will be a counter position.
I suppose that political discussions are not for everyone.

 

[babar]

I guess you are right about political discussions not being for everyone. While I did start to get angry last night, it was only after being yelled at and insulted by some of the other people.

It amazes me how some adults cannot (or will not) have a mature, rational discussion on interesting topics. You can certainly get passionate about a discussion without being insulting and taking it personally. (last paragraph not meant for either of you, EROS and MysteryMachine!)

thank you both for your replies.

andrea

 

[minniepumpernickel]

It depends on what is being said. It is possible to disagree on political issues and debate them in a rational manner. I like to read debates with facts. If it gets dirty, and people are hurling insults then It's pretty stupid anyway so I usually leave. When people get too emotional the debates usually lose their sense of rationality.

 

[Kermit]

I agree with you. (And I'm conservative, Eros. ) As long as you're not saying something extreme against the fundamental concepts of our political structure, like that you think democracy and capitalism are stupid and that we should have a king, you're showing your opinion, and the fact that you're able to is one of the things that makes this country so great.

I'm someone who doesn't typically engage in political conversations, simply because I don't really like to argue, but I bow out gracefully when one starts. I don't yell at people with an opposing view and call them un-American. That's childish.

 

[gina2000]

It's funny you should bring this up, Babar. I don't happen to agree with the idea of war with Iraq. I am, however, a conservative. I see this possible invasion as an exercise in futility.

I resent any side that implies that I'm a follower if I don't agree with them. I also resent being told about death in big, bright, red letters. I find that tactic to be degrading to the importance of the subject. No one can make an informed decision when rhetoric is being flung in their faces. It cheapens the argument and reduces the discussion to name calling. If you want to persuade the masses, get rational. Get honest. Get real. The reasonably intelligent man will listen. And perhaps agree.

Get the message?

 

[babar]

Do I get what message? That you are angry about my post?

Once again, I seem to have offended someone without meaning to. Sorry.


Andrea

 

[Bob O]

I would agree with babar that being against a countries policy doesnt make one un-american!!!
But unlike eros the side that is attempting to stifle debate is the left who has done so on college campus's and in society in general with their politically correct movement where if you arent pc you are ostraziced for your views.
A perfect example is the Lott situation where the left fakes outrage and concern for political purposes while one of their leaders is a former Klu Klux Klan member-Robert Bryd- who was known as "sheets" by former leader Tip O'Neil.
I dont support at all what Lott said but find it funny how the left is unwilling to get the so-called racists out of their own party, be it Bryd or Rev. Jackson(known anti-semitic) as blantant examples of how when algore is interviewed no one brings up that his dad voted against the civil rights act.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

Just because someone disagrees with you, you can't automatically assume that they are categorizing you as unamerican. It sounds like an excuse to try to win an argument.

I would never use that term in that context in any forum that I frequent. I see it as an insult that someone would accuse me of it, especially with my mostly liberal, fringe beliefs!

Oh well, that'll teach me to post on the community board, lol! Just kidding, have a nice afternoon!

 

[babar]

I don't think it's assuming when they say "if you hate it here so much, leave" and the like. But I may have to look up the word assume in the dictionary.

 

[gina2000]

Sorry, Andrea. That last line of mine was not meant for you. It's an ongoing private fight between myself and another poster.

 

[minniepumpernickel]

Originally posted by babar
I don't think it's assuming when they say "if you hate it here so much, leave" and the like. But I may have to look up the word assume in the dictionary.

It is hard to jump in in the middle of these things lol! I'll try to check back later! Hopefully no hard feelings!

 

[babar]

 

[EROS]

If any of you ever have a chance to rent this video, please do so.Carol Burnett gave the FINEST dramatic performance of her career in this movie. It's a true story adopted from a book by C.D. Bryan. Out of respect for Pokiemomo and others, I won't go into the detail of its plot. It does show how a loving, patriotic mother of a solider comes to recognize that the institutions in our government and military can and do lie .........

 

[Mackey Mouse]

Not to add any heat to the fire....but I have heard this expression used many times....<b>The Blame America First Crowd</b>...Why are we always considered the bad guys here... Did we use planes as weapons of destruction to murder innocent people on 9/11????I am sorry... I cannot let that one go...

Someone has to be accountable for that....

 

[EROS]

Originally posted by Mackey Mouse


Someone has to be accountable for that....

I AGREE, MACKEY..........but KILLING Saddam as well as countless, innocent, Iraqi women and children WON'T bring about accountability. IRAQ did not initiate 9-11. In fact, the CIA has been hard pressed to find ANY ties between Saddam and Al-Qaeda............

 

[babar]

We aren't always the bad guys, but we aren't always the good guys either. All I'm saying is that some people won't listen to that fact, and when you point it out, it upsets them.

 

[EROS]

Originally posted by babar
We aren't always the bad guys, but we aren't always the good guys either.

DISers DO NOT want to hear that, Babar .

You see, Americans always wear white and ARE the GOOD GUYS .

Most Importantly, GOD is ALWAYS on our side......... and would never "side" with our enemies.

 

[Mackey Mouse]

First of all......we can debate these issue till the cows come home but unless we write to our congressmen and express our opinions...this is all for not..

Also.. I need concrete proof that Saddam was not involved in the terrorism that resulted in 9/11... my understanding is that he does sponsor terrorism against Israel ....I agree we need to think about North Korea as well...

I do not know what the right thing is here...the thought of war terrifies me....I have lived with this threat my whole life...think about it... Korea, cold war with Russia, Vietnam, never mind all the little conflicts....these are very scary times.....

Now.. just for the record here.. I vote the person... not the party... Hey, I actually voted for Clinton, strictly on women's issues.. I almost ended up divorced on that one.. But I am definitely not a member of the Blame America crowd... sorry...I am still flying my American flag and will continue to do so...and will back our President, right now I think he is doing a good job...