Whats wrong with children?

[Brian Noble]

Good for you for not buying the doll.

We solve the Souvenir Problem by giving each of the kids a handful of Disney Dollars at the beginning of a trip, and tell them that the last day of the trip will be "shopping day." They can spend their Disney Dollars on shopping day, but not before. That way, they can take the first part of the trip to see what they might be able to get and prioritize, so that they can blow the whole wad on the last day without too many of the "shoulda gotten that instead"s.

This worked even for my DS3, who I was concerned would be too young to get the whole Money Is Finite concept. Of course, they bought a lot of useless junk that they rarely play with only six months past the trip, but that's the way it goes.

 

[sperk99]

I think society at this point has an issue with discipline. What the heck??? If we continually baby and over protect our kids, they will not have the required skills to suceed in today's world. Look at the schools...parents complain and they can't use red ink and everyone gets a trophy or a prize. I'm sorry but if you work hard, you will be successful. It is getting absurd. What is the big deal about making kids feel bad? THAT IS HOW THEY WILL LEARN TO COPE AND MOVE ON!!!!!! Why can't we use stricter discipline in schools. We are so quick to blame somebody else and not blame ourselves etc...

We can't be their "best friend". We have to be parents first! If that means having to go against their wants and wishes so be it. Yes, we want to build confidence in our kids and love them but there comes a time when kids need to be taught hard lessons. I'm not saying we need to abuse kids but be a parent not a friend when necessary.

THoughts?

 

[swilphil]

I think some great points have been brought up here. There's a common sentiment among the anti-kids threads that if kids (especially toddlers) are throwing tantrums it's because they have bad parents. Just the opposite is true as others have pointed out, the parents are probably saying "no" to something and NOT giving the child what he/she wants. I think all of us need to stop judging parents and kids based on 5 minutes of observation. Kids do need to have limits set by parents, and when you set those limits sometimes the kids throw a fit.

I also agree that parents don't need to be their kids' friends.

 

[WDWorBUST]

I think the key to so much of this is that usually it's people without kids being anti-kid. Things are much different when you don't have children. I can remember those days very clearly....and before children there were a lot of I will "never" do "blank" when I have kids. Yeah right. I still think I'm a good parent....but I have done one of the things I did not want to. I let my dd sleep with me. However....she is basically a good baby - and none of that really has to do with my parenting skills yet. What I"m trying to say as I ramble on and on is - the gauge I use with my daughter is that I don't care how spoiled she is by love and attention but she will be behaved. I never want her to be the kid that no one wants to be around.

 

[kpossible]

If I wanted an adult time vacation(which I don't get anymore with three young ones) I would choose a hundred other destinations. My last vacation with just me and DH was 7 years ago for our honeymoon and we went to an island resort and ate fancy food every night. Now that I have kids I want to go to Disney World. Disney will always have crying, screaming kids, because no matter how well behaved, most kids act out at some time or another. All I have to do is think of a normal day at home with my three DD. My two oldest DD start out every other day fighting and my three year old has at least three melt downs a day no matter how well the day is going. That is normal kid behavior that will happen at Disney just like it happens at home and parents have to do their best, it's called raising children. Granted I think parents have to be smart and not push kids to exhaustion and go at the childs pace. I think of Disney as a place you and the kids can go on vacation that has constant entertainment and mom can eat out and not have to cook. It's a true life fantasy.

 

[crisi]

Originally posted by sperk99
I think society at this point has an issue with discipline. What the heck??? If we continually baby and over protect our kids, they will not have the required skills to suceed in today's world. Look at the schools...parents complain and they can't use red ink and everyone gets a trophy or a prize. I'm sorry but if you work hard, you will be successful. It is getting absurd. What is the big deal about making kids feel bad? THAT IS HOW THEY WILL LEARN TO COPE AND MOVE ON!!!!!! Why can't we use stricter discipline in schools. We are so quick to blame somebody else and not blame ourselves etc...

We can't be their "best friend". We have to be parents first! If that means having to go against their wants and wishes so be it. Yes, we want to build confidence in our kids and love them but there comes a time when kids need to be taught hard lessons. I'm not saying we need to abuse kids but be a parent not a friend when necessary.

THoughts?

I think people have been saying "Kids today!" since the time of Socrates. There have always been bad parents who end up with bad kids. There have always been bad kids with good parents who do their best. There have always bad parents who end up parenting little angels and then judging the good parent who ended up with a kid with Sensory Deprevation Disorder with "why can't you keep him under control?" And of course, there have always been good parents with good kids.

Most parents do their best. Their parenting philosophies may not go lock step with mine, but they do their best. A few don't, and that is a real shame, but it isn't any different than how my father grew up between the ages of two and six. Or my uncle, whose two parents were both alcoholics in the 1940s.

Indulgence of you children is nothing new. The Victorian cult of the child is famous in family history circles.

Society still functions.

 

[suzifli]

Originally posted by sperk99
I think society at this point has an issue with discipline. What the heck??? If we continually baby and over protect our kids, they will not have the required skills to suceed in today's world. Look at the schools...parents complain and they can't use red ink and everyone gets a trophy or a prize. I'm sorry but if you work hard, you will be successful. It is getting absurd. What is the big deal about making kids feel bad? THAT IS HOW THEY WILL LEARN TO COPE AND MOVE ON!!!!!! Why can't we use stricter discipline in schools. We are so quick to blame somebody else and not blame ourselves etc...

We can't be their "best friend". We have to be parents first! If that means having to go against their wants and wishes so be it. Yes, we want to build confidence in our kids and love them but there comes a time when kids need to be taught hard lessons. I'm not saying we need to abuse kids but be a parent not a friend when necessary.

THoughts?

I agree with some of your thoughts however, making a kid feel bad is not discipline. I do not believe in raising my child to fear me, I do believe in structure, limits, rewards and punishment. As in all things a good Balance will produce a healthy well adjusted human being. As for people disapproving of kids behaviors at WDW, get real, it is an extremely stimulating environment, most young children do not have the facilities to cope with all of it, therefore melt downs do occur. I also try to prevent misbehavior by not putting my children in a position to have to behave more mature than their age and emotional develpment dictate, for example, I would not take a small child to a fancy restaurant, the meal takes too long and is setting my child up to find a way to be in trouble.

 

[dawgsgirl]

I would like to add another observation. I have made 3 trips to WDW. The first two were with a child. The third was a solo trip. Based on this experience--When you are there with children, you don't have time or energy to notice much of what any other child is doing. When on a childless trip--you notice MUCH more. Could it be that these anti-child posts are related to this concept? Just food for thought. This was my personal experience.

 

[VAN]

Why do people have to label us anti-kid because we expect people to parent their children. As I said before, I am one of 14 children, have 48 nieces & nephews, 2 children (now 18-19) and 4 great nieces/nephews .... I am around kids all the time and enjoy my interaction with children immensely.

My expectations of parents "making an attempt" to deal with melt-downs, etc does not make me anti-kid. Just because you think your child is cute swinging on the ropes, running around between strangers legs, etc doesn't mean we all think your child is cute ... it doesn't mean we don't like children either.

All I can say is, wait until your children are grown and see if you enjoy everyone else's "cute child" as much as you enjoyed your own when they were that age!!

 

[sperk99]

I am not saying that we need to make kids feel bad. THat was a wrong choice in wording. What I mean is that I don't like that teachers in schools have to be overly equal with the students. They can't do a lot of things to control kids anymore and among other things can't use red ink, and have to give all kids a trophy at the end of the year. This, to me, is stupid. All this is going to do is condition children to expect rewards for EVERYTHING they do. Rewards should be something that is infrequent or given for extreme performance in an activity or a great act of kindness. I am not saying that we need to never reward kids or rule with an iron fist. Please don't misunderstand me on that front. However, we can't reward every kid with something when they were just average at something. That is sending the wrong message. Believe me, these over protected kids will be horrible in a corporate environment or the regular workforce. They will NOT get rewarded and expect to, not be treated with the same "niceties" as in school and be ill prepeared to deal with the everyday pressures of a decent job. By teaching kids structure and the idea of a good days work and the value of the dollar, they can be better prepared to enter society.

I am not saying that anyone does this but there is additional media attention (60 minutes, Dateline, etc...) that has covered this topic in the last 6 months. So there is something going on here with our society that we may not realize for another few decades...

 

[Amirah95]

We waited until our DD was 8 years old (some say that's too long to wait) to take her to WDW. Our DD was always a good girl but DH and I figured that a place of that size and magnitude would have been too much for her busy body and ever changing attitude. I watch and still watch my sister with her children (5, 4, 3 and 16mo.) and I see what I don't have to go through (crying, screaming, napping, strollers, mid day breaks, breast feedings, mandatory play time, disciplining, baby bags, etc.) when on vacation with my DD. I got to do all of that with my DD at home for the first 5 years of her life (with weekly trips to the Chuck E. Cheese and one day trips to the Jersey Shore) and was not prepared to do it on a 7 night vacation away from home.

As for my sister, with all that comes with taking small children on vacation, she does a very good job and if it makes her happy then it makes me happy.

As for "Anti-Kid" people, I say pay them no mind and do the best you can with your children because I know I can't go on vacation and leave my small child at home.

 

[Jalva22]

I wonder how many of the people who complain about "out of control children" turn right around and make absolute fools of themselves at sporting events. I've seen plenty of little league dads who are far more revolting than the most ill-behaved child I've seen.

 

[Taratink]

Jalva22
very wise words.
Tara

 

[hellooothere]

When witnessing a tantrum in a department store aisle, an amusement park or a bank line up, I hold on tightly to my twin daughters hands (they will be 4 in December), smile as kindly as I possibly can at the mother or father and repeat these words to myself, "There but for for the grace of God go I" and hopefully they will do the same for me the next time they see me saying no to my little ladies at the checkout. Half of the battle of dealing with public tantrums are the way the parent feels about their actions; they know they are being watched and judged by those of us who think we could "do better".

 

[Deb & Bill]

I think some of you "Kid" people are reading a little too much into what you call the "Anti-Kid" messages. They aren't so much anti-kid as anti-stupid parents who fail to see that their children might be causing the rest of the world a problem. I have no problem with a child having a tantrum. I just have a problem with a parent who doesn't try to do anything about it. I understand fully that sometimes kids will start to cry or fuss or whatever. It's when the parents fail to do something about it.

Children will always cry or fuss. We all understand that. It's just when the parent insists that that crying child keep standing in line/ get on the scary ride/ stay in the park when they are tired or cranky/ etc., that there is a problem.

When a child gets tired/cranky/whiny, its time to take a break. Feed your child, take them swimming, take them for a nap. Give them a break.

There really are very few "Anti-Kid" people out there.

 

[disneyjunkie]

Originally posted by Deb & Bill
I think some of you "Kid" people are reading a little too much into what you call the "Anti-Kid" messages. They aren't so much anti-kid as anti-stupid parents who fail to see that their children might be causing the rest of the world a problem.

I'm a "kid" person and I agree with you 100%.