What should the new CEO concentrate on fixing first ?

[Plus4206]

.... I never figured out how use those winky,smiley things to explain my humor.

 

[crusader]

Snacky,

You're not going to get much of an argument from me about the need to invest heavily into quality animation at Disney. I believe we all agree on that.

The further Disney moves away from producing excellence in feature animation, the more that segment of their business cheapens. So yes, if DTV's are all we're continuing to get these days absent feature classics, the quality of the brand will weaken.

But, if that weren't the case, and the in-house divisions were producing both high-end animated features and dtv low budgets then I'd disagree that the video II's out there are cheapening the brand. Because as long as Disney grabs the audience in the theatres, the videos become irrelevant to the quality of feature animation. The consumer will be able to make that distinction, and lump dtv's in with the read along books and tapes on the shelves.

I hope you're wrong about Disney sitting on their laurels and riding out the 50th without further announcements. Look, ABC alone has dramatically improved thier cash flow - decisions are going to have to be made with the money same as always. They have several areas they need to concentrate their efforts - animation first, debt second, parks third - while holding the line on the television and motion picture segments.

I've said it before, Eisner will want to leave on an upswing. That'll take more than the 50th to accomplish. When he hands over the reigns - he'll be doing it carefully to insure his legacy puts forth the agenda moving this company forward with certain vital changes in play.

 

[SnackyStacky]

Dumbo - even though low budget - was still a theatrical release unlike today low budget DTVs. Maybe if Walt had the luxury of turning out highly profitable DTV's, Dumbo never would have made it to the big screen.

To change gears a little bit, I agree with Peter that I don't believe mega spending is going to happen in the parks anytime soon. Disney will rely on its latest investments as well as the 50th b/day to keep the parks jammin. But what about something a little less spectacular: Adding staff to the parks. Bathrooms like the days of old. No water bottles laying in the bushes for days at Splash Mountain. More sweepers and less Bradley Suck-o-matics. All the counter service & plush shops open. More street performers.

How 'bout Mickey head butter and an extra chicken finger ???

I agree with the boldfaced sentiment, which is why I said change. I didn't necessarily mean a next-generation E-ticket. I agree with all of your sentiments.

Pirate, I said it once before and I will say it again. I REALLY find it difficult to debate and discuss with you because I have been NOTHING but civil, and then you come out with:

I really wish we could be more civil though.

Maybe you weren't referring to me, so I will continue with this post, but if it was me you meant then my participation is over. Because I don't know how I've been uncivil.

Not to the bottom line. Besides Walt was appalled at some of the "crap" that went out with his name on it. It's all in the books.

I never said that Walt was proud of everything. At his very core, Walt was an artist. Artists are tempremental, and perfectionist. So I'm sure he did have a problem with a lot of releases. Do you see anyone on an executive level complaining about the quality of the direct to video releases? Maybe if someone did pull a Walt and get tempremental (or downright obnoxious) about them - perhaps we'd be debating a very different scenario right now.

Not and make sense at the same time. As another thread points out, it's all about money in this case. It doesn't matter that we think they (management) is taking the wrong road when their profits tell them they aren't.

My arguments have been very consistent. Your point is exactly what makes *you* the double talker here. How can you get back a quality Disney product if your ONLY thought is making money? You can't. Because Disney is in the business of producing ART. In the end, a movie is a piece of art. And then throw in the fact that we're dealing with ANIMATION? That's TWO forms of art in one piece. If your heart is not in a piece of art, then it doesn't matter how much money you throw at it, (or don't throw at it in this case) it won't work.

No matter what your business is: hotel management, online services, software development, making a movie: the FIRST thought should be quality. You produce a quality piece, or a quality service - and your consumers will return. And you'll make money.

the bottom line says

Just as you have said "bottom line" ad nauseum in this post, I have made this point ad nauseum in MY post.

When you're dealing with ANY product or service, first thought should be quality. NOT bottom line. Build, produce, or provide services that are QUALITY and your consumers will come.

I wouldn't dream of it unless you actually do it (which was the case the last time I said it).

I have never called that into question. I've seen you say the same thing on other threads where nobody called it into question.

 

[Plus4206]

Yes they are. But for a profit. They aren't the recipients of 100's of millions of my tax dollars for the Arts EnBowelment. Although I've never seen it, Treasure Planet was a visually beautiful movie with a story some liked, but apparently most didn't. Does that exclude TP from being considered "Art" because it was a box office flop ?

Someday maybe I'll start a thread entitled " How much money should Disney leave on the table just because they ARE Disney" . No time to elaborate....that job thing is getting in the way.

 

[DancingBear]

There's a difference between low cost, and flat out crap.

Dumbo and Pinocchio were both done at a low budget to make money for bigger projects. But they were given the same care that the BIG budget pieces were.

I don't think anyone's talking about Dumbo and Pinocchio. Here is a list of Walt Disney's producer credits from the mid-50's forward (from imdb.com):

I'm No Fool with Electricity (1970) (producer)


It's Tough to Be a Bird (1969) (producer)
Winnie the Pooh and the Blustery Day (1968) (producer)
The Mystery of Edward Sims (1968) (TV) (producer) (uncredited)
Blackbeard's Ghost (1968) (producer)
Charlie, the Lonesome Cougar (1967) (producer)
The Jungle Book (1967) (producer)
The Gnome-Mobile (1967) (producer)
The Happiest Millionaire (1967) (producer)
Scrooge McDuck and Money (1967) (producer)
Monkeys, Go Home! (1967) (producer)
The Fighting Prince of Donegal (1966) (producer)
Follow Me, Boys! (1966) (producer)
Lt. Robin Crusoe, U.S.N. (1966) (producer)
Ballerina (1966) (TV) (executive producer) (uncredited)
The Ugly Dachshund (1966) (producer)
Winnie the Pooh and the Honey Tree (1966) (producer)
The Legend of Young Dick Turpin (1965) (TV) (executive producer) (uncredited)
That Darn Cat! (1965) (producer)
"The Further Adventures of Gallegher" (1965) TV Series (producer)
Goofy's Freeway Troubles (1965) (producer)
... aka Freewayphobia #2
The Monkey's Uncle (1965) (executive producer) (uncredited)
"Kilroy" (1965) TV Series (producer)
Freewayphobia #1 (1965) (producer)
... aka Freewayphobia or the Art of Driving the Super Highway (USA: complete title)
Those Calloways (1965) (producer)
"The Adventures of Gallegher" (1964) TV Series (producer)
Emil and the Detectives (1964) (producer)
The Tenderfoot (1964) (TV) (producer)
Mary Poppins (1964) (producer)
The Moon-Spinners (1964) (producer)
The Three Lives of Thomasina (1964) (producer)
The Scarecrow of Romney Marsh (1964) (TV) (producer)
... aka Dr. Syn, Alias the Scarecrow (USA: theatrical title)
The Misadventures of Merlin Jones (1964) (producer)
Ballad of Hector, the Stowaway Dog (1964) (TV) (producer)
... aka The Million Dollar Collar (USA: new title)
The Horse Without a Head (1963) (TV) (producer)
The Sword in the Stone (1963) (producer) (uncredited)
The Incredible Journey (1963) (producer)
The Waltz King (1963) (TV) (producer)
... aka Johan Strauss
Summer Magic (1963) (producer)
Savage Sam (1963) (producer)
Yellowstone Cubs (1963) (producer)
Miracle of the White Stallions (1963) (producer)
... aka The Flight of the White Stallions (UK)
Son of Flubber (1963) (producer) (uncredited)
In Search of the Castaways (1962) (producer)
A Symposium on Popular Songs (1962) (producer)
The Mooncussers (1962) (TV) (producer) (uncredited)
The Legend of Lobo (1962) (producer)
Almost Angels (1962) (producer)
... aka Born to Sing (UK)
The Golden Horseshoe Revue (1962) (TV) (producer)
Big Red (1962) (producer)
Bon Voyage! (1962) (producer)
Hans Brinker or the Silver Skates (1962) (TV) (producer) (uncredited)
Aquamania (1961) (producer)
Babes in Toyland (1961) (producer)
The Magnificent Rebel (1961) (TV) (producer)
Greyfriars Bobby: The True Story of a Dog (1961) (executive producer) (uncredited)
Nikki, Wild Dog of the North (1961) (producer)
... aka Nikki
Donald and the Wheel (1961) (producer)
The Litterbug (1961) (producer)
The Absent Minded Professor (1961) (producer)
The Saga of Windwagon Smith (1961) (producer)
One Hundred and One Dalmatians (1961) (producer)
... aka Walt Disney's 101 Dalmatians (USA: alternative title)
Donald Duck and his Companions (1960) (producer)
Islands of the Sea (1960) (producer)
Swiss Family Robinson (1960) (producer) (uncredited)
Ten Who Dared (1960) (producer)
Pollyanna (1960) (producer) (uncredited)
Kidnapped (1960) (producer)
Goliath II (1960) (producer)
Mysteries of the Deep (1959) (producer)
Noah's Ark (1959) (producer)
How to Have an Accident at Work (1959) (producer)
Darby O'Gill and the Little People (1959) (producer)
... aka The Little People (USA)
Donald in Mathmagic Land (1959) (producer)
Sleeping Beauty (1959) (producer)
The Legend of Sleepy Hollow (1958) (producer)
Grand Canyon (1958) (producer) (uncredited)
The Sign of Zorro (1958) (executive producer)
Our Friend the Atom (1958) (producer)
White Wilderness (1958) (executive producer)
... aka Large Animals of the Arctic (cut version)
... aka The Lemmings and Arctic Bird Life (cut version)
Paul Bunyan (1958) (producer)
The Light in the Forest (1958) (producer)
Old Yeller (1957) (executive producer)
Mars and Beyond (1957) (TV) (producer)
"Zorro" (1957) TV Series (producer)
Disneyland: The Fourth Anniversary Show (1957) (TV) (producer)
The Truth About Mother Goose (1957) (producer)
Johnny Tremain (1957) (producer)
... aka Johnny Tremain and the Sons of Liberty
The Story of Anyburg U.S.A. (1957) (producer)
I'm No Fool Having Fun (1956) (producer)
I'm No Fool in Water (1956) (producer)
Samoa (1956) (producer)
You and Your Ears (1956) (producer)
Along the Oregon Trail (1956) (TV) (executive producer)
A Cowboy Needs a Horse (1956) (producer)
Secrets of Life (1956) (executive producer)
I'm No Fool as a Pedestrian (1956) (producer)
In the Bag (1956) (producer)
Jack and Old Mac (1956) (producer)
How to Have an Accident in the Home (1956) (producer)
The Great Locomotive Chase (1956) (executive producer) (uncredited)
... aka Andrews' Raiders (USA: TV title)
Hooked Bear (1956) (producer)
Chips Ahoy (1956) (producer)
"Corky and White Shadow" (1955) TV Series (producer) (uncredited)
I'm No Fool with a Bicycle (1955) (producer)
I'm No Fool with Fire (1955) (producer)
Men Against the Arctic (1955) (producer)
You and Your Five Senses (1955) (producer)
You and Your Food (1955) (producer)
You and Your Sense of Touch (1955) (producer)
You and Your Senses of Smell and Taste (1955) (producer)
You the Human Animal (1955) (producer)
Up a Tree (1955) (producer)
Beezy Bear (1955) (producer)
Bearly Asleep (1955) (producer)
Dateline: Disneyland (1955) (TV) (executive producer)
Lady and the Tramp (1955) (producer)
Contrast in Rhythm (1955) (producer)
Lake Titicaca (1955) (producer)
Switzerland (1955) (producer)
No Hunting (1955) (producer)
Johnny Fedora and Alice Blue Bonnet (1954) (producer)
Siam (1954) (producer)
20000 Leagues Under the Sea (1954) (producer) (uncredited)
... aka Jules Verne's 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea (USA: reissue title)
Grand Canyonscope (1954) (producer)
Davy Crockett, King of the Wild Frontier (1954) (producer)
... aka Episode 1: Davy Crockett - Indian Fighter (USA: TV title)
... aka Episode 2: Davy Crockett Goes to Congress (USA: TV title)
... aka Episode 3: Davy Crockett at the Alamo (USA: TV title)
The Flying Squirrel (1954) (producer)

There's quite a bit of less than classic stuff there.

 

[SnackyStacky]

The further Disney moves away from producing excellence in feature animation, the more that segment of their business cheapens. So yes, if DTV's are all we're continuing to get these days absent feature classics, the quality of the brand will weaken.

Traditional, hand-drawn, Disney animation is dead. It doesn't get much further than that.

Not to mention the fact that in theaters we had Jungle Book 2, and Return to Neverland. Both were, I believe, originally slated for direct to video release. I could easily be remembering wrong though.

I've said it before, Eisner will want to leave on an upswing. That'll take more than the 50th to accomplish. When he hands over the reigns - he'll be doing it carefully to insure his legacy puts forth the agenda moving this company forward with certain vital changes in play.

What concerns me even more is that Eisner is just egotistical enough to put an even MORE inept CEO in his place so that he will look like Walt's incarnate. I honestly wouldn't put that past his ego.

Yes they are. But for a profit. They aren't the recipients of 100's of millions of my tax dollars for the Arts EnBowelment. Although I've never seen it, Treasure Planet was a visually beautiful movie with a story some liked, but apparently most didn't. Does that exclude TP from being considered "Art" because it was a box office flop ?

Perhaps you missed this:

I will also concede that their problems are much deeper rooted than budgets. Treasure Planet tanked, but it had a huge budget. I believe another part of the problem is that the creativity is just stagnant, and it needs to be shaken up.

I guess I need to try and state my opinion another way.

If we had an Executive crew different than the one that we have, I would concede that direct to video and high end movies can coexist. But not under Eisner. He sees them as a fast buck. AND he sees their production as a way to cheaply produce FEATURES!

 

[Plus4206]

***"He sees them as a fast buck. AND he sees their production as a way to cheaply produce FEATURES! "***

Personally, I just think he sux at knowing what people want to watch. When you read about all the projects he's passed on and all the tampering he's done on existing projects it seems fairly obvious he hasn't a clue about things like that. The true tragidy is that he's not man enough to admit he hasn't got a clue about such things and won't allow the people that do do their jobs.

 

[SnackyStacky]

***"He sees them as a fast buck. AND he sees their production as a way to cheaply produce FEATURES! "***

Personally, I just think he sux at knowing what people want to watch. When you read about all the projects he's passed on and all the tampering he's done on existing projects it seems fairly obvious he hasn't a clue about things like that. The true tragidy is that he's not man enough to admit he hasn't got a clue about such things and won't allow the people that do do their jobs.

Very MUCH agreed.