What should be done when people on welfare spend money on vacations?

[NYBlue1]

Where in NY state do you live that people on welfare own two cars and a house in the suburbs? Seriously. That sounds really hard to believe. Do you have any evidence to show that this is happening?Habitat for Humanity is a private organization. Not a taxpayer supported program. Taxpayers don't control who gets their houses.

I use to live about 30 minutes north of the city in westchester county. I have now moved an hour plus from my job to afford a nice home for my family. other than go take photos of peoples homes and cars and post them on here im not sure what "proof" you are looking for. I have no reason to make this up but you believe what you like. I dont know where you live that they dont have these type of developments as they are everywhere in lower westchester county.

As for the habitat for humanity post, you are correct, I should not have used them as a tax paying example of welfare abuse. The fact remains the middle class,is still left holding the short end of the straw.

 

[cardaway]

People living on government assistance in a brand new town house courtesy of the good old tax payers such as myself with a cadilac escalade and a lexus in the driveway, going on vacations and whatever else while I live in the only thing I could afford at the time ,working a full time and a side job ,a 1930s co-op garden apartment ,lots of original left in it,and drive an old honda civic. Yes I have HUGE problems with that when there is no person disabled in the home of the family getting the assistance.

I saw it first hand myself having lived in low income housing when my mom was a single parent. It's amazing how these people supposedly having a hard time can afford high end cars. And don't get me started on all electronics they must have considered essentials.

Anyway, my mom took it as a short term solution and we were out as soon as we were able. Many of those folks are still there playing the game well.

 

[blanq]

I brought that up a few pages ago, but it got lost...

If we actually cut the corporate welfare, gave farming assistance to actual family farmers and not Archer Daniels Midland and closed the tax loopholes so that Warren Buffett isn't paying a smaller percentage of his income on taxes than I do-we might be able to actually help more people.

Sorry I missed your post! I confess I didn't read all of the replies. The topic of people on welfare comes up in various forms with some regularity around here and I must confess it pushes my buttons. Yes, there are some on welfare who abuse the system at times, but welfare to families is a paultry sum in comparison to corporate welfare yet so many seem to accept and settle for that. Fitswimmer, I think you and I are on the same page so it's a start!

 

[Alicnwondrln]

I didnt read the whole thread. I dont know how you would police it but if you are on food stamps WIC and cash welfare a vacation should be your last priority. The system is there to help people when they need it not for them to use so they use the money they do have on other things.

 

[MAKmom]

I thought a welfare check is only given for 1 year. It has to be paid back.

 

[mickeyfan2]

If the poster in question isn't a scammer why the need to lie about when she bought DVC?

And she was looking at adding more points just two months ago.

I believe she moved to act like a separated couple and only report her SSDI to get her food stamps.

 

[cardaway]

I've put some thought into this over the last day and I've stuck on the same idea I had when I first posted the thread. I wanted to see what others might post before throwing this solution out there. Here goes...

Since we own have our own home daycare business I have seen first hand as a recipient how it works when people need financial hlep with daycare. IMO that process could be used accross the board.

Rather than the perosn getting the money directly the person owed the moeny gets a check directly from the government. IMO this goes a long way towards ensuring the money goes only towards essentials. Could work for rent, car payments, medical expenses, etc.

Of course there's still a chance that people could get line in's to give them money to spend on non-essentials (and not report that household income) but IMO it's better than the easily abused system we have now. At least there would be a better chance that the most of people would see there was more oversight and not try and cheat.

 

[JennyMominRI]

I've put some thought into this over the last day and I've stuck on the same idea I had when I first posted the thread. I wanted to see what others might post before throwing this solution out there. Here goes...

Since we own have our own home daycare business I have seen first hand as a recipient how it works when people need financial hlep with daycare. IMO that process could be used accross the board.

Rather than the perosn getting the money directly the person owed the moeny gets a check directly from the government. IMO this goes a long way towards ensuring the money goes only towards essentials. Could work for rent, car payments, medical expenses, etc.

Of course there's still a chance that people could get line in's to give them money to spend on non-essentials (and not report that household income) but IMO it's better than the easily abused system we have now. At least there would be a better chance that the most of people would see there was more oversight and not try and cheat.

There are some programs that work like that like section 8 housing etc..You could also work food stamps in the way you work WIC, allowing the purchases of certain things and maybe a small cap on snacks

 

[cardaway]

The topic of people on welfare comes up in various forms with some regularity around here and I must confess it pushes my buttons. Yes, there are some on welfare who abuse the system at times, but welfare to families is a paultry sum in comparison to corporate welfare yet so many seem to accept and settle for that.

Well then maybe you should have held off until you had read all the replies. Nobody has said anything about accepting corporate welfare. I imagine most are just as upset about it as you are.

 

[cardaway]

There are some programs that work like that like section 8 housing etc..You could also work food stamps in the way you work WIC, allowing the purchases of certain things and maybe a small cap on snacks

IMO all programs should work at least partially like that. No reason public funds need to be given out as cash when there is the option to pays the bills directly.

 

[blanq]

Well then maybe you should have held off until you had read all the replies. Nobody has said anything about accepting corporate welfare. I imagine most are just as upset about it as you are.

Well, gee, thanks for setting me straight for not reading all of the replies. I didn't infer that anyone did say anything about accepting corporate welfare. The point of my initial comment, and not the one you quoted, was that I think there are bigger and more important fish to fry when it comes to the welfare debate. There are very highly paid corporate executives taking vacations using my tax dollars, in addition to the person making $532 per month on a cash grant for two children. I'm thinking that the corporate executive is spending a bit more of my money on vacations than the latter.

Do I think that any kind of welfare fraud, abuse, misuse is acceptable? No, I don't.

 

[lookingforward]

I have clients who live in public housing (south florida housing is expensive), work hard (full time) and take care of several kids by themselves with no child support from vacant fathers. Anyway, they get food stamps and medicaid but work HARD at jobs that pay little (no education, etc). When they get a little back from their income tax they take their kids to disney for three days (value hotels, packed food, etc) and treat their kids to a little joy. It confounds me when other social workers moan and complain about this. They say things like "they get cheap housing and manage to take their kids to disney and I work hard and can't afford it". I just don't feel that it is wrong. They work hard and use the system to help themselves and their kids. A little vacation is not a big deal. Now if they sat at home and did not work I might feel differently, but even then, I don't know their circumstances (health, abuse, etc) and try not to judge them.

 

[cardaway]

The point of my initial comment, and not the one you quoted, was that I think there are bigger and more important fish to fry when it comes to the welfare debate.

Sorry to see that. I'm glad not everybody shares that opinion.

 

[cardaway]

I have clients who live in public housing (south florida housing is expensive), work hard (full time) and take care of several kids by themselves with no child support from vacant fathers. Anyway, they get food stamps and medicaid but work HARD at jobs that pay little (no education, etc). When they get a little back from their income tax they take their kids to disney for three days (value hotels, packed food, etc) and treat their kids to a little joy. It confounds me when other social workers moan and complain about this. They say things like "they get cheap housing and manage to take their kids to disney and I work hard and can't afford it". I just don't feel that it is wrong. They work hard and use the system to help themselves and their kids. A little vacation is not a big deal. Now if they sat at home and did not work I might feel differently, but even then, I don't know their circumstances (health, abuse, etc) and try not to judge them.

So in short, you see nothing wrong with the fact that somebody NOT on assistance can't afford a vacation that somebody CAN afford only because they are on assistance?

If that's the case then I have to agree in taking a much closer look at the numbers that qualify people for assistance. If somebody who works hard can't afford a vacation, and others can just because they make a little less, that is one messed up system IMO.

 

[Nancyg56]

It' just my opinion, but that is messed up. Family should help with the essentials if they are going to help with anything at all.

Family can help in any way that they choose. If I had a family member that was having trouble making ends meet and they were getting some assistance I would not feel badly if I chose to treat them to a little vacation. I think that there are times when a retreat from a grim reality of trying to pay for food, housing and clothing while making a low wage or while recovering from some kind of financial devastation makes a tremendous difference in quality of life. I have no problem when families manage a vacation,and I really have no issue what so ever if a family member pays for the get-a-way.

 

[Ride Junkie]

Wow. Lots of opinions here.

I also grew up on welfare & food stamps. We never had any money for vacations (or to keep the electricity turned on). I can't imagine spending money on a trip when you can barely afford to eat. We collected the plastic liners from bottle caps (this was in the 70's) to be able to get a discount for the state fair. That and camping a few times was as close to a vacation as we got.

I wonder if there are really many families on welfare who take vacations? I would be surprised if there are.

 

[MushyMushy]

I've put some thought into this over the last day and I've stuck on the same idea I had when I first posted the thread. I wanted to see what others might post before throwing this solution out there. Here goes...

Since we own have our own home daycare business I have seen first hand as a recipient how it works when people need financial hlep with daycare. IMO that process could be used accross the board.

Rather than the perosn getting the money directly the person owed the moeny gets a check directly from the government. IMO this goes a long way towards ensuring the money goes only towards essentials. Could work for rent, car payments, medical expenses, etc.

Of course there's still a chance that people could get line in's to give them money to spend on non-essentials (and not report that household income) but IMO it's better than the easily abused system we have now. At least there would be a better chance that the most of people would see there was more oversight and not try and cheat.

I actually like that idea, but I don't see how it would prevent the abuse. How would it stop people from getting "gifts" or hiding other forms of income? But at least as far as preventing abuse, it would ensure that people have a roof over their heads BEFORE money goes towards luxury items (not saying cigarettes, booze or drugs ).

 

[Pigeon]

I couldn't care less what people who are on welfare do. I think we spend way too much effort as a society being rotten to poor people. I can think of lots more productive activities than creating welfare vacation police.

 

[cardaway]

I actually like that idea, but I don't see how it would prevent the abuse. How would it stop people from getting "gifts" or hiding other forms of income? But at least as far as preventing abuse, it would ensure that people have a roof over their heads BEFORE money goes towards luxury items (not saying cigarettes, booze or drugs ).

Totally prevent... no way that will ever happen. But the improvement is exactly what you posted.

In the cases I saw personally the people helping them were doing it because the money that was coming in as cash was an incentive to the person helping out with expenses and helping scam the system. If that money was never seen by anybody in the household, my hope is that much of the scamming will go away.

On a side note I just thought of because of a post about single moms and child support, I think shild support should work the same way. Money goes to part of the bills for esentials. No more shopping trips for mom while the kid wears the same clothes for years.

 

[hentob]

And she was looking at adding more points just two months ago.

I believe she moved to act like a separated couple and only report her SSDI to get her food stamps.

Ding! Ding! Ding! These are my thoughts exactly! I am sure that there was more to that story

Why would you come The DIS for advice on how to scam the welfare system