What do you think about this statement?

[SereneOne]

Ok, I have to agree here-the only one doing the attacking here is you, SereneOne. There have been plenty of posters on here with various beliefs & opinions & so far, everyone has generally been nice and peaceful except for your unnecessary outbursts. In the OP, I said that I said I welcomed all respectful opinions from any religious or non-religious background.

If you cannot remain respectful, than please take your drama to a different thread.

Everyone else-thank you for your variety of respectful thoughts & opinions so far!

I did NOT attack or act disrespectful in anyway and btw, you do not get to dictate where anyone posts on these boards. I did not make any unneccessary outbursts, I made an opinion and then I was attacked and called names. It is defending yourself when one is accused of things and one stands up for themselves. Check it out in the dictionary. You and a few others took it upon yourselves to disparage me. If you and those few others where so interested in keeping the discussion civil, then why accuse someone of something they never said or meant? Why not clarify and move on from there? Pot meet kettle I belong to several boards and I never see the childishness that I see on these boards. Again, I made a comment, a couple of you did not like it and you are the ones that decided to start calling names and making accusations. I gave an OPINION and then I defended myself. I suggest some of you step away from the keyboard and you calm down. I am going for a walk, jog, walk, walk, jog and starting my day.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

To segregate a related topic that was touched on by Uncle Remus, those folks who have been diagnosed with mental illnesses were (and by some STILL are) considered to be possessed by the devil.

Given that part of my professional work consists of teaching caregivers how to care for folks with SMI (serious mental illness) I have had to deal with that belief time and time again.

That Uncle Remus mentioned it, does not reveal a "hidden agenda" rather only speaks to the actual circumstances in this society today.

Just wanted to clarify that.

Circular conclusions (if this...then that...with no deviation) are not applicable to many things outside quantified statements. To say that one person, or one group is "smart" does not equate to any other person or group being less smart. It simply means what the statement says, XXXX is smart. Drawing unstated conclusions from a simple statement is not generally a valid means of arriving at "facts" or legitimate concepts.

Now, to the original question! LOL. Nothing new to add. I would simply tell the child that some people in this world believe some things while others do not. From "my" perspective (because the child and I would be interacting) I would explain that I choose not to believe in such things. If the child pressed for more, we would then move to a more detailed discussion.

And to the member who posted that older children can talk these things to death, isn't that the TRUTH!!!! Whew!!!

 

[SydneyBristow]

I copied this from my church's website. This is what I believe:

We believe in a literal Hell. We believe that hell is a real place, that it was prepared for the devil and his angels, and that all of those who die outside of the Lord Jesus Christ will spend eternity in hell. We believe that hell is a literal place of physical, mental, spiritual, and eternal suffering. We believe that every person will spend eternity either in heaven or in hell.
Luke 16:19-31 * Rev. 20:11-15 * Matt. 13:42 * Matt. 25:41 * Mark 9:43-46


We believe there is a devil called Satan. We believe that Satan is a real person; that he was created; and that he originally lived in heaven but was cast out of heaven when he rebelled against God. He is totally sinful, deceptive, and powerful. We believe that he is the leader of a vast host of evil spirits who seek to keep unsaved people lost, and to divide and deceive individual Christians. We believe that Christ defeated Satan at the cross and that the Christian has authority and power over him now, through the Lord Jesus Christ. We also believe that Satan will ultimately be cast into the lake of fire at the end of the age.
Isaiah 14:12-17 * Ezekiel 28:11-19 * Eph. 6:12 * Gen 3:11 * Cor. 11:14 * Revelation 12:11

That's what I believe as well.

 

[perla75]

I did NOT attack or act disrespectful in anyway and btw, you do not get to dictate where anyone posts on these boards. I did not make any unneccessary outbursts, I made an opinion and then I was attacked and called names. It is defending yourself when one is accused of things and one stands up for themselves. Check it out in the dictionary. You and a few others took it upon yourselves to disparage me. If you and those few others where so interested in keeping the discussion civil, then why accuse someone of something they never said or meant? Why not clarify and move on from there? Pot meet kettle I belong to several boards and I never see the childishness that I see on these boards. Again, I made a comment, a couple of you did not like it and you are the ones that decided to start calling names and making accusations. I gave an OPINION and then I defended myself. I suggest some of you step away from the keyboard and you calm down. I am going for a walk, jog, walk, walk, jog and starting my day.

Here is the correspondence a few people are referring to. The poster made a comment about the person in the OP's story & you accused them of calling your church members "dumb." It was over reacting & unnecessary. There is a big difference between a comment & an accusation. Kikifan was making a general comment & opinion directed toward the OP's story-not directed toward you. In turn, you accused them of something they did not say and you were a bit harsh & sarcastic about it as well. Your unnecessary harshness & accusations is what got a few people upset with your posts.

Once again: just because a person calls someone smart, it does not mean they are calling other people stupid. If you cannot understand this much than it is not worth continuing to discuss this.

Originally Posted by KikiFan View Post
I just feel compelled to point out that the single most important difference between Scientology and other religions. Scientology was established in modern times by a man on record as saying that (and I'm paraphrasing) "the best way to become rich was to invent a religion" Which sort of leads me to think there just might not be an thetons.

As someone who does not believe in the devil (or hell) I applaud your friend OP. He's a smart man.

YOUR RESPONSE:
So those that do believe are dumb men? I will be sure to tell my daughter's cardiologist, heart surgeon, neurosurgeon, etc., several who attend my church what stupid men they are.

 

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

.......And the clock is ticking on this one!!!!!



RUM ??

 

[d1gitman]

Not believing in something doesn't make it go away.

Believing in something doesn't make it real either...


However, i do believe in Hell.

 

[GRUMPY PIRATE]

I am always reminded of the Sam Kinnison bit.

he dies and meets the Devil. The Devil is trying to scare him, until he finds out he was married.

the Devil just stops, and says come in, have a seat. Not much else here to scare ya with, after all, you were MARRIED!!


hehehehehehe


RUM?

 

[SereneOne]

Here is the correspondence a few people are referring to. The poster made a comment about the person in the OP's story & you accused them of calling your church members "dumb." It was over reacting & unnecessary. There is a big difference between a comment & an accusation. Kikifan was making a general comment & opinion directed toward the OP's story-not directed toward you. In turn, you accused them of something they did not say and you were a bit harsh & sarcastic about it as well. Your unnecessary harshness & accusations is what got a few people upset with your posts.

Once again: just because a person calls someone smart, it does not mean they are calling other people stupid. If you cannot understand this much than it is not worth continuing to discuss this.

Originally Posted by KikiFan View Post
I just feel compelled to point out that the single most important difference between Scientology and other religions. Scientology was established in modern times by a man on record as saying that (and I'm paraphrasing) "the best way to become rich was to invent a religion" Which sort of leads me to think there just might not be an thetons.

As someone who does not believe in the devil (or hell) I applaud your friend OP. He's a smart man.

YOUR RESPONSE:
So those that do believe are dumb men? I will be sure to tell my daughter's cardiologist, heart surgeon, neurosurgeon, etc., several who attend my church what stupid men they are.

I did NOT accuse anyone of anything, I ASKED a question. However, there are many people who think people that have faith are ignorant people but yet want to spout off about tolerance and how people of faith do not have it. There was no harshness or overreaction except on your parts. It is so ridiculous that me posting a couple of sentences makes me harsh and overreactive, you are projecting.

 

[luvsJack]

I would have to agree with SereneOne's understanding of the original statement.

If a man that does not believe in Satan or hell is a smart man; what then does that make a man who does believe?

 

[perla75]

I did NOT accuse anyone of anything, I ASKED a question. However, there are many people who think people that have faith are ignorant people but yet want to spout off about tolerance and how people of faith do not have it. There was no harshness or overreaction except on your parts. It is so ridiculous that me posting a couple of sentences makes me harsh and overreactive, you are projecting.

Whatever, lady

 

[Tiggernut_jadie]

I would have to agree with SereneOne's understanding of the original statement.

If a man that does not believe in Satan or hell is a smart man; what then does that make a man who does believe?

Why does it have to be either/or? Can't both the believer and the non-believer be smart but just have different belief systems?

 

[perla75]

Why does it have to be either/or? Can't both the believer and the non-believer be smart but just have different belief systems?

I would go further & commend you for such a wise & true statement, but I'm afraid that I will get a response from another poster accusing me of calling every other poster out there dumb & false!

 

[SereneOne]

Whatever, lady

Back atcha, "lady"

 

[SereneOne]

I would go further & commend you for such a wise & true statement, but I'm afraid that I will get a response from another poster accusing me of calling every other poster out there dumb & false!

You are the one making the accusations, I suggest you see a mental health professional because you are having delusions. I posted a thought on the topic and YOU ARE THE ONE THAT WENT OFF AND STARTED ACCUSING PEOPLE OF THINGS because you did not like the thought. I suggest you take a break from the boards.

 

[perla75]

You are the one making the accusations, I suggest you see a mental health professional because you are having delusions. I posted a thought on the topic and YOU ARE THE ONE THAT WENT OFF AND STARTED ACCUSING PEOPLE OF THINGS because you did not like the thought. I suggest you take a break from the boards.

Sorry, you are terribly confused-that post was directed toward Tiggernut_jadie, not you. Also, I find your replies to me very harsh, rude, and harassing. Please do not yell at me again. Thank you.

 

[stellablue]

You are the one making the accusations, I suggest you see a mental health professional because you are having delusions. I posted a thought on the topic and YOU ARE THE ONE THAT WENT OFF AND STARTED ACCUSING PEOPLE OF THINGS because you did not like the thought. I suggest you take a break from the boards.

I am the OP, and I have to say that you have caused much negative energy to this thread. Listen to yourself-you are accusing this poster of being argumentative while you are yelling at them (& yes, using all caps in a post is considered yelling). Others have tried to reasonably explain to you that just because one is praising one belief, it does not mean they are criticizing another belief. No one has been hostile on here, except for you. Now, please stop with the insulting, the yelling, and the accusations.

I agree with the PP who said that it doesn't have to be one or the other. For the millionth time, praising one belief system does not mean you are ridiculing another.

 

[SundancePass]

IMO, this enitire post is what's wrong with the United States. NO ONE can express his/her opinion without anyone/everyone commeting and "stirring things up".

This is a free society. To me, no one should be blasted for any religious belief or belief in the Devil or anything else. I do no believe in organized religion yet am deeply spirtiual and believe totally in God. It is no one's business what I believe or what you believe.

Cannot we just get along. This thread is over for me. It is too toxic for words and it started out innocentlyy enough.

Good luck to all of you who are blasting each other. IMO, you need it.

 

[perla75]

IMO, this enitire post is what's wrong with the United States. NO ONE can express his/her opinion without anyone/everyone commeting and "stirring things up".

This is a free society. To me, no one should be blasted for any religious belief or belief in the Devil or anything else. I do no believe in organized religion yet am deeply spirtiual and believe totally in God. It is no one's business what I believe or what you believe.

Cannot we just get along. This thread is over for me. It is too toxic for words and it started out innocentlyy enough.

Good luck to all of you who are blasting each other. IMO, you need it.

I agree-I think this thread started out interesting and civil, and then it got ruined by paranoia & rudeness.

People should have the right to praise others' beliefs without it being turned into pot stirring paranoia and silly defensiveness. I love my religious beliefs & I can't imagine being that defensive and paranoid over it because another belief system gets praised

Never thought I'd have to use the "ignore list" but I guess there is a first time for everything!

 

[luvsJack]

Why does it have to be either/or? Can't both the believer and the non-believer be smart but just have different belief systems?

I agree that it doesn't have to be either/or.

I didn't mean to say that it had to be. I meant that the statement being debated sounded as though the poster was saying the man was wise because he doesn't believe in satan or hell.

I personally don't think intelligence has anything to do with how someone believes, one way or the other. While I do not think the man in the OP is wise in the way he handled the question from his son; I would not say he is unintelligent because of what he believes.

Religious beliefs will always be one of those subjects that cause lots of emotion simply because so many are passionate in their beliefs. Its not necessarily that they mean to be judgmental; its just that they (myself included) feel so strongly about what they believe in.

 

[VickiVM]

Wow, what a coincidence. At church I started a book club study and we're reading Velvet Elvis by Rob Bell. I haven't purchased the book yet and found this sample chapter on line which speaks to the debate that has opened up here:

Both perspectives
are faith perspectives, built on systems of belief. The person who
says we are here by chance and there is no greater meaning has just as many
beliefs as the person who says there’s a creator. Maybe even more.
Think about some of the words that are used in these kinds of discussions, one
of the most common being the phrase “open-minded”. Often the person with
spiritual convictions is seen as close-minded and others are seen as openminded.
What is fascinating to me is that at the center of the Christian faith is
the assumption that this life isn’t all there is. That there is more to life than the
material. That existence is not limited to what we can see, touch, measure,
taste, hear, and observe. One of the central assertions of the Christian worldview
is that there is “more”. Those who oppose this insist that this is all there
is, that only what we can measure and observe and see with our eyes is real.
There is nothing else. Which perspective is more “closed-minded”? Which perspective
is more “open”?
An atheist is a person of tremendous faith. In our discussions about the things
that matter most then, we aren’t talking about faith or no faith. Belief or no
belief. We are talking about faith in what? Belief in what? The real question
isn’t whether we have it or not, but what we have put it in.
Everybody follows somebody. All of us make decisions every day about what is
important, how to treat people, and what to do with our lives. These decisions
come from what we believe about every aspect of our existence. And we got
our beliefs from somewhere. We have been formed, every one of us, by this
complicated mix of people and places and things. Parents and teachers and
artists and scientists and mentors – we are each taking all of these influences
and living our lives according to which teachings we have made our own. Some
insist that they aren’t influenced by any person or any religion, that they think
for themselves. And that’s an honorable perspective. The problem is they got
that perspective from . . . somebody. They’re following somebody even if they
insist it is themselves they are following.
Everybody is following somebody. Everybody has faith in something and
somebody.
We are all believers.