What do you mean " WE " Paleface ?

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by Saffron
What does that mean, "dilutes the significance of your nationality"? How is that possible? Only the person whose nationality is in question can decide how significant their nationality is to them, no one else can decide that for them.

It means exactly what it says. I think it makes people appear to less proud of being an American.

You can do what you want, it's just my opinion.

And I'll ask this again, how many generations does it take for the hyphen to disappear?

When asked in an official capacity (passport, etc) what my country of origin is, I don't recall seeing any choices with a hyphen in it.

Do you think that when an American family emigrates to another nation and becomes a citizen of that nation, has children born there call themselves American-_____ or American-______?

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by pokiemomo181
I am Cherokee.


Pokie

Are you an Amercican citizen?

 

[Dan Murphy]

Well said, dawgfan.

 

[pokiemomo181]

Yes, I am an American citizen.


Pokie

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by dawgfan
Truth---In the last 100 years, list a few good things that talking (detante) rather than war has accomplished (be specific and the achievements must be real and long lasting). But, in the same light list a few good things that war has done. Be fair. I'll wager that war has actually done more good than bad as sad as I am to say that. You see, I am a soldier or used to be one. Soldiers understand more than anyone else the value of peace. We prize peace more than anything on earth, but we understand the necessity at times of military engagements and solutions. War is an aboration to you it seems. To some it is a tool. To some it is an inevitible situation that has a determinate end with substantial consequences for someone. War has many victims and that plays out on many different levels. In the end you can only hope that mankind is served to some degree by the completion of the hostility. Seeking to justify the hostility, when one is at the crux of anti establishment philosophy, is foolhardy. Any established rule or policy by the current administration is fuel for your disgruntlement. This seems obvious by the tone of your posts here on the CB. You hate Bush and everything he does, says, or proposes. That is fine. Vote for someone else. Let us vote for anyone we please. The rants about F 911 are tiresome. You believe Michael Moore. Good for you. Pay him and see the movie a few more times. Don't tell us what he is saying in the movie or what Bush really did that day (one day out of our lives and one day in the Bush administration). Let us make up our own minds. Michael Moore, and therefore seemingly you, want to boil the Bush administration into one 20 to 30 minute piece of time. During this time you wish to say he did a bad job as president because he did not seem to grasp what was going on or was not concerned enough. This basically boils down to your interpretation of his demeanor on film that day during an editted 15 to 20 minute piece. I have been attached to the Secret Service. I know what the duty is like. I know what that experience is like. You cannot gauge someones true feelings or thoughts by a facial expression in a time of crisis. Bush handled himself well enough. As for your latest rant "paleface" we includes you whether you like it or not. I was no fan of Bill Clinton but he did a great many things that included "we" . Americans are a "melting pot society".

Nicely put.

 

[cynsaun]

Originally posted by Dan Murphy
Well said, dawgfan.

ITA!

 

[Elwood Blues]

Originally posted by pokiemomo181
Yes, I am an American citizen.


Pokie

Ok, then why do you call yourself a Native American and not a Cherokee American?

Native American is a designation given to you by the Government. It's meant to lump all indigenous peoples together for easy reference.

And since I was born here, why can't I call myself a Native American?

I'll ask a modified version of a previous question, how many generations does it take for someone become indigenous?

(I'm not trying to be smart, I'm just asking)

 

[pokiemomo181]

Have you ever heard of the BIA( Bureau of Indian Affairs). The Government calls us indians. We call ourselves Native American. That is why to many the word indian is not concidered a good thing. The native part of Native American stands for our people being native to this land, as in first. You were born to this Country, but you ancestors at some time came from somewhere else so they were not Native to it. That is the difference, and that is why we use it. We are not any more American than you who were born here, we were just first, and are proud of it. My ancestors were here before it was America. So the American part is from a later time than the Native part. It is the joining of two times into one in a matter of speaking. The word Indian comes from the explorers who thought they were in the Indies, and called us by that name. The government just continued the handed down tradition of calling us Indians, its not something they just deceided to call us one morning when they got up. As for how long before you lose your heritage and become American. My heritage is important to me, I will always be Native American. I hope no one ever loses their heritage. Does it make me less American, no. Maybe because we were forced to the edge losing our right to be Native American, by the people and government of years ago, we appreciate what we nearly lost. The history of my people and the way they loved and cared for this land is worth saving for the future generations. If you don't feel that way about your ancestors and what they endured for the generations leading up to you, then I don't think I can explain how I feel about mine. It just won't make any sense to you. Am I American, you bet. Am I Native Amercan, thanks to my ancestors yes. They are one and the same, yet with different twists to the end.


Pokie

 

[Saffron]

I had a post all written out answering other questions that were posed, but Pokie, your post is beautiful and proud and I just can't say or add anything more to it that would be anymore heartfelt or understandable.

 

[AZKathy]

Originally posted by Elwood Blues
Not to be flip or anything but is someone holding a gun to your head forcing to read political threads (or any thread) against your will?

Yes, you were flip or anything<a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_6_102.gif' border=0></a>...I was trying to harrass Truth about not posting anything but political threads, that was all. No one holds a gun to my head but I do have to read through the titles to find something I wish to read. I know that Truth can take a little teasing once in a while and hold his own quite well!

 

[pokiemomo181]

Thank you Saffron.


Pokie

 

[MJames41]

Originally posted by Truth
You do not get to pick, choose or judge, either
You are for killing people or
You are against killing people.

So, where did you stand before we went to war? Were you for killing people by going to war or for killing people by allowing Hussien to remain in power? There is no other choice.

 

[teh fish]

sorry about being so late about replying. What the bumper sticker means is that while the US is full of people with ancestors from different nations, we are all one people, american. Adding prefixes does nothing but try to distance yourself away.

 

[pokiemomo181]

My ancestors were always here, so using Native American doesn't distance me from anything, only brings me closer to.


Pokie

 

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by pokiemomo181
I want to know what the paleface is all about. Are you Native American? If so then you should know that is not a term WE use unless trying to insult someone. If your NOT Native American, in what text are you using paleface?
An inquiring Cherokee would like to know.


Pokie

Well, I'm native American. I was born and raised right here in this country.

 

[dmadman43]

The sooner people realize that there is no middle ground on this the sooner wars will cease to exist.

Riight! Okey dokey. Whatever you say.

Come back to mean when someone has a gun to your head and all you are left with is "being oppsoed to killing"

 

[pokiemomo181]

You know dmadman43 if thats all it took to be Native American it would be great. Just tell the government you are Native American. Now if you were Irish American, the government would say fine your Irish American. When you tell the Government you are Native American they say prove it. You have to have documentation going all the way back to one of the three different rolls of Indian registry. If for some reason your ancestors were in hiding so as not to be put on reservations and not on those rolls then the government says you are NOT Native American. I know the years some people have put in through geneology searches to prove their heritage. So it is not as simple as saying you are Native American just because you were born and raised here. That has nothing to do with being Native American. Just ask the Government they will tell you all about whats required to be Native American. We are the only peoples required to prove who we are in this country, so we don't take it lightly.


Pokie

 

[dmadman43]

Originally posted by pokiemomo181
You know dmadman43 if thats all it took to be Native American it would be great. Just tell the government you are Native American. Now if you were Irish American, the government would say fine your Irish American. When you tell the Government you are Native American they say prove it. You have to have documentation going all the way back to one of the three different rolls of Indian registry. If for some reason your ancestors were in hiding so as not to be put on reservations and not on those rolls then the government says you are NOT Native American. I know the years some people have put in through geneology searches to prove their heritage. So it is not as simple as saying you are Native American just because you were born and raised here. That has nothing to do with being Native American. Just ask the Government they will tell you all about whats required to be Native American. We are the only peoples required to prove who we are in this country, so we don't take it lightly.


Pokie

So, if a white Afrikaan from South Africa immigrates to the US, does the make him African-American?

I thought you said the Govt classification was indian?

 

[pokiemomo181]

I also said that was considered not a good name by most Native Americans didn't I. I choose to use Native American, if you like Indian better so be it. If the white Afrikaan chooses to call himself an African American thats his business They would probaby call themselves Afrikaan Americans though wouldn't you think.


Pokie

 

[Truth]

Originally posted by MJames41
..... we went to war?

Thanks for presenting the opportunity to clear up a bit of a misunderstanding.
Your use of " we " is offensive for at least a couple reasons.
First, If you say this administration went to war,
no problem.
If you say the government went to war, still no problem.
If you say America went to war, small problem but understandable and not worth a thread.
If you say we went war, now it's a problem.
There is a large group of Americans that were and are against the war in Iraq and to say " we " is to make the war effort sound like something the whole country is united behind.

Second, to use the more inclusive " we " went to war, seems some how unfair to those that really did go to war. There are American's being killed and wounded everyday in Iraq. Those are the people that went to war and they deserve everyone's respect, prayers, best wishes, good vibes and any other positive thoughts anyone can summon up and send their way. If you were part of the troops that spent time in Iraq worrying about ever seeing America again then yes, you and your buddys went to war and it just does not seem right for people
all comfy here in America to say "we went to war" when they are in not danger of losing their life or limbs every second of the day till their tour of duty is over.

And on a much less important note,

Originally posted by MJames41
So, where did you stand before we went to war?

The same place that's been occupied since first learning of the Golden Rule.

Originally posted by MJames41
Were you for killing people by going to war or for killing people by allowing Hussien to remain in power?

This is an example of what's called a false dichotomy and thus requires no other comment.

===============================================

On a non related note, the title of this thread is actually the punchline to a joke. A joke that seemed to fit the theme that was being discussed
but these days people's willingness to use jokes, satire, irony, or sarcasm should correspond to the thickness of their skin if some people do not get the context.

As AZKathy correctly stated Truth is more than capable of responding or ansorbing any reply
to the degree it requires or deserves. Truth takes no offense, real or perceived from anything anyone wishes say about Truth. It is always nice to see anyone exercising a little free speech.