We tried to warn him................(thick headed family member)

[Jynohn]

What makes me upset are people who sign up during times of war and actually think it is reasonable to say, "Oh, I want to join, but I don't want to actually be put in danger."

I have to say I agree. Anyone who signs during war time cannot honestly be surprised when they are called to serve.

Thank you to your nephew for his service. I will keep him in my thoughts for a safe return home.

 

[transparant]

What makes me upset are people who sign up during times of war and actually think it is reasonable to say, "Oh, I want to join, but I don't want to actually be put in danger." Excuse me? You want the pay, the education benefits, the travel, but you think you shouldn't have to do what others have done and are doing? Personally, if someone is so blind that they think they can join the military and not expect to be sent to Iraq, they shouldn't be joining in the first place. Get a grip. Oh... they lied to me boohoo. You lied to yourself as well. flame away

Well said lyeag!

 

[cardaway]

I really wish people wouldn't paint with such a broad brush.

My son is a recruiter and I can guarantee you--he doesn't lie. Especially when it comes to his job. He despises recruiters who lie. It makes his job much more difficult.

He refuses to lie in order to make a quota and I would venture a guess that a majority of recruiters feel the same way.

The post was...

"I believe that recruiters will lie and deceive in order to make their quotas."

And you posted that your son knows some recruiters lie. Maybe he should do something about it, or does the miltary make things worse by punishing those who dare to speak up on the subject.

 

[inaminute]

Knew you would get your feathers ruffled. And yes thank you it did make my day.

I have to admit that I am truly surprised by your callousness.

I truly thought people who worked with special needs kids were more compassionate toward everyone. For some reason I thought they were somehow more understanding of emotions and human behavior. It surprises me that someone in charge of these kids, above all others, would be happy to see someone fail.

Wow. That just knocked special needs educators off the pedestal I had placed them on. Thanks for the wake-up call.

 

[lyeag]

The post was...

"I believe that recruiters will lie and deceive in order to make their quotas."

And you posted that your son knows some recruiters lie. Maybe he should do something about it, or does the miltary make things worse by punishing those who dare to speak up on the subject.

That's right it's one big RIGHT WING conspiracty to lie to recruits. Post that on the Daily Kos.

 

[inaminute]

And you posted that your son knows some recruiters lie. Maybe he should do something about it, or does the miltary make things worse by punishing those who dare to speak up on the subject.

He said he knows SOME recruiters lie. Just like you know SOME people steal, or SOME people can dance, or SOME people take drugs. He didn't say whether he knew anyone personally.

FWIW, I know he would do the right thing. It's been commented on one of his evaluations that "he will stand up for what he believes is right even when he knows it's not in his best interest."

 

[graygables]

What makes me upset are people who sign up during times of war and actually think it is reasonable to say, "Oh, I want to join, but I don't want to actually be put in danger." Excuse me? You want the pay, the education benefits, the travel, but you think you shouldn't have to do what others have done and are doing? Personally, if someone is so blind that they think they can join the military and not expect to be sent to Iraq, they shouldn't be joining in the first place. Get a grip. Oh... they lied to me boohoo. You lied to yourself as well. flame away

No flames from me!

I grew up in the Army, had 2 brothers in the Army, married (and divorced) in the Army. Even when I was a kid, I heard "How do you know a recruiter is lying? His lips are moving." My ex actually considered recruiting...he would have been great at it.

BTW, I know it's a technicality, but recruiters are generally enlisted, not officers. There is a certain amount of "the Army protects its own", but I wouldn't call it a conspiracy. It's just well-known that recruiters (of ALL kinds) are masters of embellishment.

 

[robinb]

He refuses to lie in order to make a quota and I would venture a guess that a majority of recruiters feel the same way.

I'm glad your son is one of the good ones.

Adding more since I'm here:
I am in no way condoning the behavior of the people who curse and yell at your son, but I can understand the anger behind it. Have you thought that maybe the "general public" doesn't want recruiters in their neighborhoods and schools? Maybe they don't want to have their high school kids talked into putting their lives in danger in a war zone. Maybe they don't want recruiters to call them at home. All of this happened to me as I am a 44 year old returning student at the local tech college. I am an adult and able to ignore them. I asked my tech college to never give my phone number or address to anyone else after getting the call.

Your son should know that he's not going to get "sweetness and light" from every kid (and their relatives, neighbors and friends) who is trying to recruit. It's part of his job to deal with the public, both nice and not nice. Just as it's part of the job of those kids who he talked into signing on the dotted-line to put their lives in danger.

 

[inaminute]

Have you thought that maybe the "general public" doesn't want recruiters in their neighborhoods and schools? Maybe they don't want to have their high school kids talked into putting their lives in danger in a war zone. Maybe they don't want recruiters to call them at home.

If the general public doesn't like the way recruiting is done, then they need to bring it to the attention of those who can make changes. The guys on the street doing the recruiting are using methods that have been in place for years. Doesn't make them right or wrong. These guys are like any other military person--just following orders.

Your son should know that he's not going to get "sweetness and light" from every kid (and their relatives, neighbors and friends) who is trying to recruit. It's part of his job to deal with the public, both nice and not nice. Just as it's part of the job of those kids who he talked into signing on the dotted-line to put their lives in danger.

He doesn't expect "sweetness and light" from everyone. However, he has a right to be treated with respect--just like everyone else. I don't think it's part of his job to be spat on, cursed at, or threatened. Well, it would be in Iraq, but he's working in the U.S.A. I don't know, maybe that's the problem? Perhaps Americans feel they "own" the military so they're free to treat them badly?

In any case, there is definitely something wrong when I hear my son saying things like "I'd rather be in Iraq--I felt safer."

 

[Skatermom23]

Right now there are two types of soldiers....those that have been and those who are going. No one is exempt.

 

[Ziva]

Have you thought that maybe the "general public" doesn't want recruiters in their neighborhoods and schools?

There could be a flip side to that though. I'm sure the "general public" doesn't want a draft either, the military has to "recruit" to keep the numbers up. If they cut back and/or tone down their efforts and the number of recruits suffer, eventually those numbers will have to be made up in some other form and that could possibly result in a draft. In a way it's a double edged sword.

 

[inaminute]

Excellent point, Ziva!

 

[LvsTnk]

I have to admit that I am truly surprised by your callousness.

I truly thought people who worked with special needs kids were more compassionate toward everyone. For some reason I thought they were somehow more understanding of emotions and human behavior. It surprises me that someone in charge of these kids, above all others, would be happy to see someone fail.

Wow. That just knocked special needs educators off the pedestal I had placed them on. Thanks for the wake-up call.

I would have been happy to see him fail as well. So glad we have people like these protecting our special needs kids. I am very callous when it comes to my sons...my older one was totally harrased by a recruiter and thank goodness my special needs son has people like this concerned about his well being.

Good for your son (really) that he is such a good guy, but they aren't all like that.

 

[cardaway]

I would have been happy to see him fail as well. So glad we have people like these protecting our special needs kids.

But it goes beyond the special needs kids. Many go after the slower kids and bad students, the ones they can use these lies on with more success.

 

[Keggy]

No flames from me!
It's just well-known that recruiters (of ALL kinds) are masters of embellishment.

Excuse me?

I really don't even know what to say to that.

Ridiculous.

 

[hugsquared]

What makes me upset are people who sign up during times of war and actually think it is reasonable to say, "Oh, I want to join, but I don't want to actually be put in danger." Excuse me? You want the pay, the education benefits, the travel, but you think you shouldn't have to do what others have done and are doing? Personally, if someone is so blind that they think they can join the military and not expect to be sent to Iraq, they shouldn't be joining in the first place. Get a grip. Oh... they lied to me boohoo. You lied to yourself as well. flame away

No flames from here either. I think you 100% right on!

 

[Stitchfans]

I have to admit that I am truly surprised by your callousness.

I truly thought people who worked with special needs kids were more compassionate toward everyone. For some reason I thought they were somehow more understanding of emotions and human behavior. It surprises me that someone in charge of these kids, above all others, would be happy to see someone fail.

Wow. That just knocked special needs educators off the pedestal I had placed them on. Thanks for the wake-up call.

Beg your pardon. If watching out for and standing up for my students makes me callous than I am proud to hold that title. Not only for the special needs students but all the others. I am very compassionate and understanding of emmotions, human behavior. I think I proved my point by trying to protect the students every day.

As far as the pedestal you had me on. Never asked to be on it and never wanted to be on it. You are welcome for the wake up call, cause I stand firm that a student cafe is no place for recruitters.

 

[becka]

But it goes beyond the special needs kids. Many go after the slower kids and bad students, the ones they can use these lies on with more success.

Some recruiters may do this on purpose but I think in some ways going after the "bad students" is not as evil as you may think. Those kids that are just barely passing high school are not exactly being bombarded with full ride scholarship offers. Many of them will never pursue any type of higher education and will end up working in minimum wage, dead end jobs. The military, for all its faults, can often times be a good thing for some of those kids. Yes, right now there is obviously more physical risk in joining and recruiters should not try to sugar coat the risks but people who are enlisting are doing so of their free will and should always be prepared to see action no matter what their rank, sex, occupation, etc.. If you enlist, during a war or not, you should be prepared to be deployed.

I am also a little shocked that so many of you think the "general public" should not have to be subjected to recruiters? Who exactly do you think should be recruited? Everyone wants the military to be there to protect them but they have a NIMBY-type syndrome, NMK - Not My Kids - syndrome. Let someone else's kid die to protect me but don't you dare have a recruiter talk to my kid. All your kid has to do is to tell them they are not interested - they are not putting a gun to your child's head and forcing them to sign up.

 

[PrincessKitty1]

I am also a little shocked that so many of you think the "general public" should not have to be subjected to recruiters? Who exactly do you think should be recruited? Everyone wants the military to be there to protect them but they have a NIMBY-type syndrome, NMK - Not My Kids - syndrome. Let someone else's kid die to protect me but don't you dare have a recruiter talk to my kid.

Um, maybe some of the general public don't think soldier's are dying to protect us. Maybe some of the general public thinks we shouldn't be sending soldiers to Iraq to enrich the businesses of Bush's and Cheney's buddies. Maybe some of the general public think we were lied to about weapons of mass destruction.

 

[becka]

Um, maybe some of the general public don't think soldier's are dying to protect us. Maybe some of the general public thinks we shouldn't be sending soldiers to Iraq to enrich the businesses of Bush's and Cheney's buddies. Maybe some of the general public think we were lied to about weapons of mass destruction.

Oh, you mean someone like me? Gee, guess what? Not all people who don't support the war think the military is evil! Shocker!

Unfortunately, when it comes to the military you take orders even if you don't agree with them. That is their job and it is a job that they have willingly and voluntarily signed up for. You may not think the soldiers are in Iraq to protect you but I know there are soldiers elsewhere that are protecting you even if you don't know it.