We own resale and are debating buying direct..

[Maistre Gracey]

It's not even about the buying direct benefits IMO. Much of that is negligible.
I believe DVC is trying to play on emotions of not being a "full member" i.e. the membership card difference.

Sort of slimy IMO.

 

[CarolMN]

.....(sip)........
Personally we have decided that we wouldn't do resale again. Everyone has a time calculus and its possible we just had a bad experience but we found the whole resale process a gigantic pain. We arent buying thousands of points and for the difference in price for the number of points we are likely to add on, I'd rather just eat the cost. I am frugal in day-to-day life but with the philosophy that money is there for me to use for things I don't want to deal with. In this case, we had to coordinate trips to lawyers with 4 people (2 owners, 2 witnesses), the time waiting, the sheer difference in paper work between resale vs not, the loan process (because lets be honest I wasn't going to wire more than what was required as I am still very skeptical of wiring money anywhere), and then we had unclear instructions for wiring money etc (which incidentally caused the money to go into limbo because the first attempt was wired it a non-existant account).... And there were other hassels trying to get a hold of the seller etc.

With Disney I called up and within I'd like to say 5 minutes I had my points. Here is my CC, and like that I had an account, my membership card was in the mail and we were off.

Some people would value the extra cash, but we have used our discount for the AP and I travel for work, so time at home is very limited and at a premium. With all these concerns we have already decided that if/when we can get a BWV contract, it will be direct.

I completely understand! There are times when I am more than willing to pay for convenience or for someone else to do something I don't want to do! IMO, that's absolutely OK - as long as it is an informed choice.

 

[Brian Noble]

I believe DVC is trying to play on emotions

At some level, the whole concept of "Membership" overlaid on what is just another timeshare has always been this---from "Welcome Home" on down. A timeshare is sold, not bought, and it is generally an aspirational purchase. The notion of "belonging" is one of the keys that Disney has tapped into to help sell its product from the start, and if they can divorce that sense of belonging from resale purchasers, it helps them close more sales.

But remember: that sense of belonging was never anything but a marketing ploy. Points are points, they spend the same way when booking DVC rooms, and that's really the best use of them. Everything else is in the noise.

 

[schoen]

We bought direct vs resale because it seemed MUCH easier. We called them, gave them our credit card number, and that was that. I booked our trip the next day. We bought at OKW, and the points have the extended expiration date. We bought in late May with a June UY and so it was a totally loaded contract, which was also great. Membership perks aside, the buying process seems like a major advantage of buying direct.

The membership perks are great too!

 

[Wakey]

We bought 50 pts direct and 150 pts at resale.

Personally we have decided that we wouldn't do resale again. Everyone has a time calculus and its possible we just had a bad experience but we found the whole resale process a gigantic pain. We arent buying thousands of points and for the difference in price for the number of points we are likely to add on, I'd rather just eat the cost. I am frugal in day-to-day life but with the philosophy that money is there for me to use for things I don't want to deal with. In this case, we had to coordinate trips to lawyers with 4 people (2 owners, 2 witnesses), the time waiting, the sheer difference in paper work between resale vs not, the loan process (because lets be honest I wasn't going to wire more than what was required as I am still very skeptical of wiring money anywhere), and then we had unclear instructions for wiring money etc (which incidentally caused the money to go into limbo because the first attempt was wired it a non-existant account).... And there were other hassels trying to get a hold of the seller etc.

With Disney I called up and within I'd like to say 5 minutes I had my points. Here is my CC, and like that I had an account, my membership card was in the mail and we were off.

Some people would value the extra cash, but we have used our discount for the AP and I travel for work, so time at home is very limited and at a premium. With all these concerns we have already decided that if/when we can get a BWV contract, it will be direct.

I find this a bit unusual- where did you buy? If buying in at a DVC Florida, there is no need to visit a lawyers office- you just sign the paperwork and email it back- its a contract and then a closing document, so not sure what you were signing and why you were visiting lawyers offices? Wiring money should be easy- heck it was easy for me and I'm in the Uk so not sure what problems you had. Maybe a bad resale company? Yes there is a wait, and maybe the chance of ROFR, but if that happens you do not lose anything financially. From making my offer to using my points, it took 5 weeks 2 days. For me the saving on a direct purchase was $12,000. I'd have to be extremely wealthy to cost my extra time spent on this at $12,000. If the price difference was $1,000 I may have been tempted, $2000 I very much doubt it, $3000 no chance, but $12000 get out of here! And I work 60+ hours a week.

 

[Wakey]

http://www.nxtbook.com/ygsreprints/ARDA/G70973_arda_jan2017/index.php#/42 see page 40+

Ken P talks about member benefits here, although more in the context of offering excellent service. If excellent service and changing the perception of the timeshare industry is top priority, where does banning members who are spending big bucks on their Disney trips and who love Disney fitting in with that. What other product would offer a lesser product to a resale buyer? Most people know it is only to sell more direct, and keep direct prices higher. Not sure is Ken P is practising what he preaches here? Also he talks about a new exchange programme?

 

[ziravan]

http://www.nxtbook.com/ygsreprints/ARDA/G70973_arda_jan2017/index.php#/42 see page 40+

Ken P talks about member benefits here, although more in the context of offering excellent service. If excellent service and changing the perception of the timeshare industry is top priority, where does banning members who are spending big bucks on their Disney trips and who love Disney fitting in with that. What other product would offer a lesser product to a resale buyer? Most people know it is only to sell more direct, and keep direct prices higher. Not sure is Ken P is practising what he preaches here? Also he talks about a new exchange programme?

If I owned a timeshare company, then I would want to maximize my value and that's with retail sales. Resale does nothing for my bottom line, so screw em.

That's true for timeshares in general. It's true for DVC as a division.

It's not true for Disney.

Disney's hotel industry started to service its parks. And DVC took root from there. DVC is a 'shake your money tree' all on its own. But there's a larger purpose being served here.

I don't understand why Disney allows one of its divisions to knife its customers as a whole in the name of division profit alone. Especially since these restrictions are so unnecessary:

Most timeshare operators would sell their grandmothers to have a fraction of the traffic that DVC ignores.

 

[FireflyTrance]

We bought 50 pts direct and 150 pts at resale.

Personally we have decided that we wouldn't do resale again. Everyone has a time calculus and its possible we just had a bad experience but we found the whole resale process a gigantic pain. We arent buying thousands of points and for the difference in price for the number of points we are likely to add on, I'd rather just eat the cost. I am frugal in day-to-day life but with the philosophy that money is there for me to use for things I don't want to deal with. In this case, we had to coordinate trips to lawyers with 4 people (2 owners, 2 witnesses), the time waiting, the sheer difference in paper work between resale vs not, the loan process (because lets be honest I wasn't going to wire more than what was required as I am still very skeptical of wiring money anywhere), and then we had unclear instructions for wiring money etc (which incidentally caused the money to go into limbo because the first attempt was wired it a non-existant account).... And there were other hassels trying to get a hold of the seller etc.

Sorry about your difficult experience with resale! Mine was also a bit of a pain since the seller was very very slow to do anything.

 

[FireflyTrance]

You can try to get on the vgc waitlist if they are still allowing it as we have been on there for a while now and are slowly getting points.

Last I heard the waiting list was closed, but that is when I asked about it last year so things could have changed.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

We bought 50 pts direct and 150 pts at resale.

Personally we have decided that we wouldn't do resale again. Everyone has a time calculus and its possible we just had a bad experience but we found the whole resale process a gigantic pain. We arent buying thousands of points and for the difference in price for the number of points we are likely to add on, I'd rather just eat the cost. I am frugal in day-to-day life but with the philosophy that money is there for me to use for things I don't want to deal with. In this case, we had to coordinate trips to lawyers with 4 people (2 owners, 2 witnesses), the time waiting, the sheer difference in paper work between resale vs not, the loan process (because lets be honest I wasn't going to wire more than what was required as I am still very skeptical of wiring money anywhere), and then we had unclear instructions for wiring money etc (which incidentally caused the money to go into limbo because the first attempt was wired it a non-existant account).... And there were other hassels trying to get a hold of the seller etc.

With Disney I called up and within I'd like to say 5 minutes I had my points. Here is my CC, and like that I had an account, my membership card was in the mail and we were off.

Some people would value the extra cash, but we have used our discount for the AP and I travel for work, so time at home is very limited and at a premium. With all these concerns we have already decided that if/when we can get a BWV contract, it will be direct.

You had a somewhat odd resale purchase that I also don't understand. Our resales were never even close even setting aside the steps you had for a loan. Lawyers office?

Even still the cost saving on anything more than 25 or 50 points these days can typically pay for a fair amount of items. It can pay dues for a couple of years - maybe more. You can look at it as paying for more points if you had a fixed amount of money to spend on DVC. Plus, in addition to that loss of savings up front in buying direct you've immediately lost that same difference on your direct points should you ever have to sell and with financing that would be a concern to me personally. Even not financing it annoys me to realize that the second you get past your time to rescind you've lost 20%, 30% or maybe even 50% of the purchase price should anything happen when you could have purchased resale and not had that same out the door drop.

 

[bwvBound]

If I owned a timeshare company, then I would want to maximize my value and that's with retail sales. Resale does nothing for my bottom line, so screw em.

That's true for timeshares in general. It's true for DVC as a division.

Not arguing -- just adding a voice for the small, independent timeshares. In the case of an independent timeshare, a strong resale market is still very important to the overall health, and even the viability, of the timeshare once the resort is sold out and the developer has moved on. After the first 10 years (+/-), the earliest wave of owners begin to thin out. Perhaps these owners have lost interest, they've moved away, they've passed away, etc. Dues collection on these shares becomes more difficult.

If their shares cannot be easily transitioned to new owners via resale -- the resort budget suffers for lack of stable dues income. The remaining owners must pick up the slack for the shortage and dues are increased across the board to the remaining body of owners. Two immediate effects: The dues increase hurts resale interest for that property; existing owners resent the dues increase and stop paying. A downward spiral ensues. In short, the independent timeshare cannot afford to ignore or discourage the resale market.

But of course, this thought pattern does not apply to DVC as our developer has no plans to release control and continued development of its product.

For those who have bought from Disney directly instead of resale, what made you choose to do so?

Our DVC contracts were each purchased long ago (2004-2007) so our reasons will be different than if similar purchases were being evaluated today. However, we did attempt to purchase resale before retail in 2003/2004 -- so we were quite aware of the resale market, even at that time. Our reasons for going retail at that time were, essentially, emotional. We allowed ourselves to agree to a purchase that didn't meet our original plan.

• What we knew we wanted: BWV, 200 points, Dec UY. We were trying to buy resale which was running near $74/point at that time, if I recall correctly.
• What we purchased after some pressure from our 'guide': SSR, 150 points, Oct UY. Costs came in <$79/point for full 50yr contract (adding 12 years beyond our intended BWV).

Elements that tipped the cards in favor of the retail purchase:

• Emotion: We'd already lost two contracts in the resale process.
• Emotion: We'd been on the wait list for BWV through DVC for awhile.
• Convenience. Retail promised, "We can make this happen immediately. No more waiting ... " (That was a stronger pull for us, having no prior DVC contract, than it might be for you at this moment?)
• Costs: Purchase cost per point were close, a small spread for "new/50 year" vs "resale/-12 years". Initial dues for SSR were considerably lower -- but we saw that as an unreliable variable.
• Emotion / Practical: Brand new 50-year contract! (That was a really strong pull.)

Of course, we had no idea of the final build out plans for SSR or its impact on the Club, overall. Long term, we don't regret the decision to buy SSR retail vs BWV resale. We don't have any particular affection for SSR -- but it has been a good element in our larger, timeshare toolkit.

In light of the more recent changes to ownership "classes" -- I can't truly predict how I'd respond if buying today in your situation. I suspect I'd end up buying 50 points SSR direct to gain the member benefits. I doubt I'd for a "full size" contract at any of the top priced WDW resorts ... I still want a bargain, if possible?

 

[FireflyTrance]

Member lounge at Aulani? There's a lounge that can be used say for example you have a late flight out but it is not anything more than to get cleaned up and maybe print out a boarding pass before your flight. You would have been allowed to do that. It's not a Member Lounge per se. And the photo booth shouldn't have been an issue. From what I'm reading it feels like you have built up more thoughts that you are missing out on things than there actually are but of course that also is something DVC would like to build on I'm sure. The bracelets are not bracelets - no matter what they say - they are just the wrist bands that you are staying at the hotel and can use the pool. You cut them off at the end of the day just like the others. They tend to be more shiny than the hotel guests get but I think that if you showed your online card you'd get them too. If not it's really nothing - I really wouldn't care which they gave me when staying there. I've gotten nothing extra because I had the "shiny" ones.

Start pulling out your online card and see what it gets you. I think you'll find that it's more than you think and in many cases you won't need it anyway.

You're right, a lot of it is just built up in my head. Part of that is because it's not completely clear to me which benefits resale buyers still have access to and how well the rules are enforced.

It sounds like I would have been ok to use the photo booth, but I didn't know that at the time. The reason I didn't go over is I didn't want to tell my daughter we were going to take photos at a photo booth, just to be turned away when we got there which would have led to disappointment. That's something I didn't wanted to experience while trying to relax on vacation. I assumed the Member lounge was where the photo booth was, but it sounds like it isn't really a lounge.

 

[Tardisblue]

At some level, the whole concept of "Membership" overlaid on what is just another timeshare has always been this---from "Welcome Home" on down. A timeshare is sold, not bought, and it is generally an aspirational purchase. The notion of "belonging" is one of the keys that Disney has tapped into to help sell its product from the start, and if they can divorce that sense of belonging from resale purchasers, it helps them close more sales.

But remember: that sense of belonging was never anything but a marketing ploy. Points are points, they spend the same way when booking DVC rooms, and that's really the best use of them. Everything else is in the noise.

Perfect. If we would have purchased our 200 points direct, we would have spent another $12,000. If I want to be a full fledged member it's going to cost me another $4,000 minimum. I remind myself of this every time I feel a tiny twinge of resentment at being excluded from the Epcot lounge. We're still using those points to stay for a week in May and will get to use them again next year and the year after that...

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

You're right, a lot of it is just built up in my head. Part of that is because it's not completely clear to me which benefits resale buyers still have access to and how well the rules are enforced.

It sounds like I would have been ok to use the photo booth, but I didn't know that at the time. The reason I didn't go over is I didn't want to tell my daughter we were going to take photos at a photo booth, just to be turned away when we got there which would have led to disappointment. That's something I didn't wanted to experience while trying to relax on vacation. I assumed the Member lounge was where the photo booth was, but it sounds like it isn't really a lounge.

They did not have the photo booths yet the last time we were at Aulani 2 years ago but if the info I looked up is correct it is located in the Pau Hana Room which is the Community Hall. The Community Halls are resort amenities and yes, you could use it. It's also the location that DVD's are rented out and resale buyers can still do that too. Virtually anything that would be covered by maintenance fees at the resorts still has to be allowed for use - like the Community Hall.

The only real Member Lounge that is restricted with DVC is the one at Epcot and that is run by DVC itself, not the resorts. Even TOTWL at BLT is open to any member, resale or not.

 

[Brian Noble]

Most timeshare operators would sell their grandmothers to have a fraction of the traffic that DVC ignores.

Interestingly, I was finally offered (via letter dropped off in my villa after the first night there) a $100 gift card to tour during my stay last week. Have never been an owner, and have stayed on RCI exchanges frequently. This is the first time I've been given a tour incentive.

So, maybe they will start paying more attention to that traffic after all.

 

[D-Trick]

I am currently in the ROFR process with my first contract at SSR. After everything is done 6-8 weeks from now, I fully intend on purchasing an add-on contract of 25 points right away with the same UY and resort. According to my calculations:

SSR resale is $140/pt minimum 25. Using a conservative resale point price or $85, the price difference is around $1375. This doesn't include the fact that closing costs are cheaper buying direct (brought up by another disboards member).

So, how long will it take for me to rack up ~$1375 in discounts? Not very long at all, especially since you get the discount on APs. That's $100 per person already!

Of course, all this is assuming that current policy on membership benefits remain the same. With my situation, buying an add-on direct is a no brainer. I want to feel included gosh darnit! =P

Unfortunately, at this time I'm in no position to afford buying into CCV, even they look crazy awesome.

 

[mustinjourney]

Perfect. If we would have purchased our 200 points direct, we would have spent another $12,000. If I want to be a full fledged member it's going to cost me another $4,000 minimum. I remind myself of this every time I feel a tiny twinge of resentment at being excluded from the Epcot lounge. We're still using those points to stay for a week in May and will get to use them again next year and the year after that...

If it makes you feel any better, I've been to WDW two separate times and still haven't made it into the Epcot lounge. Tried the first time during F&W and it had closed for the day (I think we tried around 7 pm -- closes at 6 pm). Last visit in February just didn't have the time.

 

[mustinjourney]

I am currently in the ROFR process with my first contract at SSR. After everything is done 6-8 weeks from now, I fully intend on purchasing an add-on contract of 25 points right away with the same UY and resort. According to my calculations:

SSR resale is $140/pt minimum 25. Using a conservative resale point price or $85, the price difference is around $1375. This doesn't include the fact that closing costs are cheaper buying direct (brought up by another disboards member).

So, how long will it take for me to rack up ~$1375 in discounts? Not very long at all, especially since you get the discount on APs. That's $100 per person already!

Of course, all this is assuming that current policy on membership benefits remain the same. With my situation, buying an add-on direct is a no brainer. I want to feel included gosh darnit! =P

Unfortunately, at this time I'm in no position to afford buying into CCV, even they look crazy awesome.

If the blackout dates on the Gold AP don't affect you, you actually save $200 per AP (closing costs for 25 direct are $104 -- so as you said, a lot cheaper than resale).

 

[D-Trick]

If the blackout dates on the Gold AP don't affect you, you actually save $200 per AP (closing costs for 25 direct are $104 -- so as you said, a lot cheaper than resale).

Before I discovered the DIS boards, I had asked via chat on the DVC Resale Market website about having access to a Gold Pass when buying resale, and he said that it was possible. Of course, I now know that it's not (which is fine). I would definitely prefer the Gold Pass as I don't plan on visiting during the busy months. In fact, I wish I could get the Silver Pass, as that works even better for my vacation plans. But alas, I'm a CA resident and ineligible.

I know this isn't exactly the right thread, but does anyone know what the wait times are at SSR for an add on 25 point contract?

 

[mustinjourney]

Before I discovered the DIS boards, I had asked via chat on the DVC Resale Market website about having access to a Gold Pass when buying resale, and he said that it was possible. Of course, I now know that it's not (which is fine). I would definitely prefer the Gold Pass as I don't plan on visiting during the busy months. In fact, I wish I could get the Silver Pass, as that works even better for my vacation plans. But alas, I'm a CA resident and ineligible.

I know this isn't exactly the right thread, but does anyone know what the wait times are at SSR for an add on 25 point contract?

I don't know firsthand, but based on my experience last year, my guide pretty much told me they can get anything except for VGC/VGF/BCV really quickly. As in a few minutes for SSR and AKV. BWV was usually a week or two.

My guess is that SSR would be easy since its such a big resort, which means there are a lot of contracts out there getting foreclosed upon.