WDW and Universal. Who wins?

[tjkraz]

It's ironic that many of the discussions about what makes WDW "bad" can be traced back to increased popularity--too many guests and too long of waits. Anecdotally, there are a lot more people visiting the parks than in the 90s and early '00s which some view as a golden age. Today, I'm not sure what Disney can reasonably to do make the parks less popular.

Building more attractions just brings in more people. The top tier rides will always draw crowds, with any potential benefit trickling down to old standbys like Star Tours and Soarin'.

The one thing that might help would be later park hours. But even that has limited demographic appeal. In my 2 decades of regular trips to WDW we went from "eh, our kids are too young for late nights" to "hey, late nights are pretty cool" to "I'm too old to stay out that late."

 

[Brian Noble]

Today, I'm not sure what Disney can reasonably to do make the parks less popular.

Raise prices. More.

Also, having spent a few nights at Universal hotels, you have to work pretty hard to see the outside world in a way that is jarring or intrusive. But, some people don't like fun I guess.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Raise prices. More.

Also, having spent a few nights at Universal hotels, you have to work pretty hard to see the outside world in a way that is jarring or intrusive. But, some people don't like fun I guess.

Hopefully you aren't trying to direct your comment at me..

 

[Jrb1979]

Raise prices. More.

Also, having spent a few nights at Universal hotels, you have to work pretty hard to see the outside world in a way that is jarring or intrusive. But, some people don't like fun I guess.

They also need to fill out the parks more. DHS, AK and Epcot need more Moana level attractions to fill out their parks.

 

[sipnride]

Universal is winning with my kids, 12 and 18 yo. For my wife and I we wouldn't even go if it wasn't for them, and even then it's a couple days tops at the beginning or end of a Disney trip. Universal is winning the thrill ride battle but Disney is starting to get it's head in the game on this front with Cosmic and Tron coming in with thrilling experiences, and I'd bet we'll be seeing a lot more of that over the next decade. I'll also add that Volcano Bay is a special place that's also extremely convenient to their resort hotels, while Typhoon Lagoon is neither of those. Add in HHN which Disney has no answer to and that's going to be how my teens decide.

But in every other category Disney crushes Universal. Dining, live entertainment, resorts, shopping, children's amenities, ability accommodations and accessibility, special events, international appeal, nostalgia, innovation, logistics, crowd management, park/resort media. And even when Universal tries to close the gap in some of these areas, Disney maintains an insurmountable edge in three crucial areas: IP, guest service, and the "bubble" infrastructure of reedy creek.

 

[jade1]

Truly don't get bogged down by my photos you don't need to preface what Universal's hotels offer.

I will say my current "Preferred View" at BWV is a bit weak. Pretty though.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I will say my current "Preferred View" at BWV is a bit weak. Pretty though.

View attachment 784927
View attachment 784929

It's really pretty with the flowers, gives a more garden feel but definitely obstructed for any sort of true view.

 

[drenalin'junkie]

Theming, landscaping and food have to go to Disney.

Universal and upcoming EU have IP sewed up. Marvel and Star Wars DOA on ideas. Historical Disney IP isn't faring well either.

SW/BG blow the rest away on thrill rides.

UO could match Disney with 4 parks on attendance but WDW is much more immersive currently.i
In any case I'm glad to be far enough away to miss the crowds and traffic but close enough for day trips to all of them with an occasional week thrown in.

 

[Brian Noble]

Hopefully you aren't trying to direct your comment at me..

To be honest, I have no idea who posted the cloverleaf photo, and I didn't bother going back to see who it was. I just remember seeing it and thinking "That's it? Really?" It might have been you, it might have been someone else, I don't remember and don't really care.

My comment was more to do with the incessant nit-picking of things on These Here Boards (and most other "enthusiast" sites). If I go looking for something to be wrong, I am sure to find it. If instead I go into things looking forward to them, sure enough I have fun, even when I am "not supposed to." Because everyone knows I'm Not Supposed to Like Universal if I like Disney. It's like freaking junior high or something--you can't like both Tommy and Billy, you have to choose.

I suspect this also overlaps in my mind with the discussion of the re-make of Top Thrill Dragster, which has had its fair share of problems. They are replacing the hydraulic cable launch with an LSM system. The cable could accelerate the train 0-120 in about four seconds, which is just whoah. Unfortunately, the cable here and at Xcelerator (same idea, half the height) also has a history of snapping or shredding and injuring guests, unrelated to the proximity flag plate the ride threw off a few years ago.

The LSMs can't deliver that much acceleration, so they are building a 400-foot back spike and doing a "one, two, THREE" forward/backward/forward launch to get the train over the top hat. What's a subset of the enthusiast reaction to all this? "They neutered the ride!" I mean, sure, it's not going to go 0-120 in four seconds, but it's not going to just lollygag around the infield either.

And I am really Not Supposed To Like regular old amusement parks (ick!) if I like Disney. That's like trying to hang out with both the Heathers and the burnouts at the same time.

(Edited: It took me a while to find the right counter-point to the burnouts, and I am probably showing my age here. Plus (spoiler alert!) they ended up blowing up the school, so there's that.)

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

To be honest, I have no idea who posted the cloverleaf photo, and I didn't bother going back to see who it was. I just remember seeing it and thinking "That's it? Really?" It might have been you, it might have been someone else, I don't remember and don't really care.

My comment was more to do with the incessant nit-picking of things on These Here Boards (and most other "enthusiast" sites). If I go looking for something to be wrong, I am sure to find it. If instead I go into things looking forward to them, sure enough I have fun, even when I am "not supposed to." Because everyone knows I'm Not Supposed to Like Universal if I like Disney. It's like freaking junior high or something--you can't like both Tommy and Billy, you have to choose.

I suspect this also overlaps in my mind with the discussion of the re-make of Top Thrill Dragster, which has had its fair share of problems. They are replacing the hydraulic cable launch with an LSM system. The cable could accelerate the train 0-120 in about four seconds, which is just whoah. Unfortunately, the cable here and at Xcelerator (same idea, half the height) also has a history of snapping or shredding and injuring guests, unrelated to the proximity flag plate the ride threw off a few years ago.

The LSMs can't deliver that much acceleration, so they are building a 400-foot back spike and doing a "one, two, THREE" forward/backward/forward launch to get the train over the top hat. What's a subset of the enthusiast reaction to all this? "They neutered the ride!" I mean, sure, it's not going to go 0-120 in four seconds, but it's not going to just lollygag around the infield either.

And I am really Not Supposed To Like regular old amusement parks (ick!) if I like Disney. That's like trying to hang out with both the Heathers and the burnouts at the same time.

(Edited: It took me a while to find the right counter-point to the burnouts, and I am probably showing my age here. Plus (spoiler alert!) they ended up blowing up the school, so there's that.)

No that was me but the thing is people read way more into that. It's like you're already on the defense. To be 100% clear I don't give a darn about that stuff, never have never will. BUT what I was talking about was the OTHER people on this Board who discuss the differences between Disney and Universal. So again do I care about seeing the real world? Obviously I don't, others do , the bubble never meant a darn thing to me, but it certainly does to a lot of die hard fans on this Board and that's what I was speaking to.

 

[sipnride]

Theming, landscaping and food have to go to Disney.

Universal and upcoming EU have IP sewed up. Marvel and Star Wars DOA on ideas. Historical Disney IP isn't faring well either.

SW/BG blow the rest away on thrill rides.

UO could match Disney with 4 parks on attendance but WDW is much more immersive currently.i
In any case I'm glad to be far enough away to miss the crowds and traffic but close enough for day trips to all of them with an occasional week thrown in.

How does Universal/EU have IP sewn up? Most of the highest grossing films the part decade are Disney IP. And that's the best predictor for where Disney can draw on to produce more attractions.

Meanwhile, Universal is making a third Harry Potter land, squeezing what they can out of the only comparable IP they have, one with no expectations of releasing relevant content in the future.

 

[Skywalker3]

I totally think there is a Universal bubble. Maybe not if you're staying in Endless summer, since those are across the highway, and can see/access stuff like Walgreens, etc, right there. But if I can easily walk, boat, bus to the parks, and I can just park my car and leave it, that's in the bubble for me. I do think the hustle and busle of City Walk kinda breaks the bubble. It would be like having to walk through Disney Springs every time you wanted to go from HS to Epcot. I love the Disney bubble too, and would always try to stay on site, over offsite/driving from off property. We make great use of Disney transportation, and except for the rare occasion, we park the car and leave it! We've been DVC since 2011, home is Boardwalk, and that's where we spend the majority of our time on property.
Another area I think Universal is making great strides, is in their festivals/special events/food booths. We've really enjoyed going at Mardi Gras, and they've added so much in the last few years. However, as much improved as they area, Epcot festivals still win for taste and value. We love F/W and F/G, and I'm good with festivals all year in Epcot.
Universal wins a bit for extra discounts. Kinda. We have DVC and AP discounts at Disney, usually 20%, but discounts are not taken at Quick services, and until this past June, never at the Epcot booths. Universal takes the discounts almost everywhere...but it's only 10 % (for our level of AP., higher level AP is 15.) and Universal often asks if we have a discount, which rarely happens at Disney for us. I do a lot more asking there.
We take a lot of busses at Disney, and Universal wins on this front too.
Resorts--hard to say, because we are DVC, and stay in 1 or 2 bedrooms, not studios. So we are greatly spoiled having all the extra room, full kitchen, washer/dryer, etc. We'd never pay for that type of room with cash, nor would we pay for a suite at Universal, too pricey. But I've never found the actual resort offerings at DVC better than Universal's premiers. Except Animal Kingdom Lodge. those savannah view can't be matched.
Either way, I love to see each of them upping their games. We all win!!

 

[Disneylover99]

I totally think there is a Universal bubble. Maybe not if you're staying in Endless summer, since those are across the highway, and can see/access stuff like Walgreens, etc, right there. But if I can easily walk, boat, bus to the parks, and I can just park my car and leave it, that's in the bubble for me. I do think the hustle and busle of City Walk kinda breaks the bubble. It would be like having to walk through Disney Springs every time you wanted to go from HS to Epcot. I love the Disney bubble too, and would always try to stay on site, over offsite/driving from off property. We make great use of Disney transportation, and except for the rare occasion, we park the car and leave it! We've been DVC since 2011, home is Boardwalk, and that's where we spend the majority of our time on property.
Another area I think Universal is making great strides, is in their festivals/special events/food booths. We've really enjoyed going at Mardi Gras, and they've added so much in the last few years. However, as much improved as they area, Epcot festivals still win for taste and value. We love F/W and F/G, and I'm good with festivals all year in Epcot.
Universal wins a bit for extra discounts. Kinda. We have DVC and AP discounts at Disney, usually 20%, but discounts are not taken at Quick services, and until this past June, never at the Epcot booths. Universal takes the discounts almost everywhere...but it's only 10 % (for our level of AP., higher level AP is 15.) and Universal often asks if we have a discount, which rarely happens at Disney for us. I do a lot more asking there.
We take a lot of busses at Disney, and Universal wins on this front too.
Resorts--hard to say, because we are DVC, and stay in 1 or 2 bedrooms, not studios. So we are greatly spoiled having all the extra room, full kitchen, washer/dryer, etc. We'd never pay for that type of room with cash, nor would we pay for a suite at Universal, too pricey. But I've never found the actual resort offerings at DVC better than Universal's premiers. Except Animal Kingdom Lodge. those savannah view can't be matched.
Either way, I love to see each of them upping their games. We all win!!

Yeah. Me too.
City walk is definitely part of that bubble for me.
I even feel like I’m in the Universal bubble when we stay offsite at The Drury.

 

[sipnride]

I totally think there is a Universal bubble. Maybe not if you're staying in Endless summer, since those are across the highway, and can see/access stuff like Walgreens, etc, right there. But if I can easily walk, boat, bus to the parks, and I can just park my car and leave it, that's in the bubble for me. I do think the hustle and busle of City Walk kinda breaks the bubble. It would be like having to walk through Disney Springs every time you wanted to go from HS to Epcot. I love the Disney bubble too, and would always try to stay on site, over offsite/driving from off property. We make great use of Disney transportation, and except for the rare occasion, we park the car and leave it! We've been DVC since 2011, home is Boardwalk, and that's where we spend the majority of our time on property.
Another area I think Universal is making great strides, is in their festivals/special events/food booths. We've really enjoyed going at Mardi Gras, and they've added so much in the last few years. However, as much improved as they area, Epcot festivals still win for taste and value. We love F/W and F/G, and I'm good with festivals all year in Epcot.
Universal wins a bit for extra discounts. Kinda. We have DVC and AP discounts at Disney, usually 20%, but discounts are not taken at Quick services, and until this past June, never at the Epcot booths. Universal takes the discounts almost everywhere...but it's only 10 % (for our level of AP., higher level AP is 15.) and Universal often asks if we have a discount, which rarely happens at Disney for us. I do a lot more asking there.
We take a lot of busses at Disney, and Universal wins on this front too.
Resorts--hard to say, because we are DVC, and stay in 1 or 2 bedrooms, not studios. So we are greatly spoiled having all the extra room, full kitchen, washer/dryer, etc. We'd never pay for that type of room with cash, nor would we pay for a suite at Universal, too pricey. But I've never found the actual resort offerings at DVC better than Universal's premiers. Except Animal Kingdom Lodge. those savannah view can't be matched.
Either way, I love to see each of them upping their games. We all win!!

I stayed Aventura last fall and it was really nice to walk to Volcano Bay in my flip flops. The other two parks were super easy to get to whether by foot or boat. There was a bit of a bubble feeling, I'll give you that.

I don't care about seeing a highway, etc, but it really is annoying to find that most restaurants at city walk are mediocre, that the other resorts have limited options, etc. I've had decent meals at Portofino and Sapphire Falls but by night three it's dawning on me that we're gonna have to go to international of we want to get something different. It's not that I'm a snob who will ever eat at toothsome or Hard Rock or Gump but damn by the time I get those bills and think to myself, I could have eaten at Sébastiens for less and gotten a better meal, or to Jiko and paid the same but had something extraordinary.

 

[mickeyluv'r]

I disagree with your disagree lol. But for real I spent a long time listening to people's rants because contrary to most on the board I hadn't ever stayed on site until 2017 so my perspective was different. Yes being in the bubble means not leaving the property but does not make what a bubble is to those adamant about why they stay at Disney's resorts and why they are willing to fork over the cash. And it's in direct opposition to what Universal offers.

Truly don't get bogged down by my photos you don't need to preface what Universal's hotels offer. The point will always be the same that you see the real world much more with Universal because it's property is not as protected compared to Disney's. And I clearly mentioned you'll see things with Disney, no magic can prevent awful views of roofs (have you seen the thread about awful room views it's kinda funny just in a commiserate way). But still that's not what we're talking about here.

And you may have gotten the incorrect assumption that I'm speaking poorly or negatively about Universal on the contrary I love Universal and loved their hotels but when you are talking about die hard Disney fans they will use the bubble as reason to either not try other resorts not with Disney or to explore other parks, namely Universal. The rest of us know better

No, I was just clarifying. It's all good.

With either WDW or Universal if you stay onsite, you can spend days fully within the onsite bubble. The bubble is lodging, dining, and all entertainment - sometimes bought as a package. Universal also offers similar package deals.

That's how most forum members have used the term. It has mostly been used to = staying onsite. Because you can stay for days and only spend Disney/Universal money/credits.

Staying offsite or eating offsite = outside the bubble.

It isn't all that important though.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

No, I was just clarifying. It's all good.

With either WDW or Universal if you stay onsite, you can spend days fully within the onsite bubble. The bubble is lodging, dining, and all entertainment - sometimes bought as a package. Universal also offers similar package deals.

That's how most forum members have used the term. It has mostly been used to = staying onsite. Because you can stay for days and only spend Disney/Universal money/credits.

Staying offsite or eating offsite = outside the bubble.

It isn't all that important though.

I'd still disagree with you though What I'm going to say is the comments you've seen=X, the comments I've seen are Y and neither of us are going to change the minds of our experiences

At Disney Springs you have onsite but not Disney owned properties and most die hards who discuss the bubble don't even consider those hotels period because they aren't Disney ones and in fact would rather Disney not extend perks to them as it dilutes the perks for Disney-owned properties. Although there is the hardcore lovers of Bonnet Creek.

I'd say it actually is important because one of the biggest reasons people discuss not being all that interested in Universal is their lack of bubble. I'd rather convince someone to go to Universal and try it out but trying to convince someone who doesn't want to be reminded of the real world and finds that solace in Disney's area has always been an uphill battle on the Boards. You don't have to convince me that there's an ambiance to Universal and I almost commented on someone's post about nostalgia because I always have that for Universal when I'm walking through the gates, but try to get a person who is willing to pay $1K for rooms over at Disney to move over to Universal and see what they say...

 

[notatallmagic]

My 2 cents. Former multi year Disney AP; became very frustrated with the "pay more and get less" changes and some DAS super snafus, so discontinued our AP and got Universal APs.

Had 3 great Uni trips; love the proximity of the resorts and the easy walk/boat to the parks; loved the Starbucks in the resorts, founds some dining we enjoy with super easy reservations. Their version of DAS also worked well earlier this year, and we enjoyed Express Pass too (when it came with our resort).

Teenagers also loved the thrill rides and the immersion of the Harry Potter areas. I loved the pace and the easy planning and ability to relax.

Then 3 weeks ago, found out on DIS that they are re-doing their DAS process. Long story short, our family cannot visit parks without it. So we are still waiting for a phone call with four trips booked in the next 4 months.

With airfare already paid, and me being a non-risk taker, we reinvested in Disney APS after a super experience with Disney. We have now pivoted all 4 trips to Disney, and will "waste" our last 6 months of our Uni passes.

Very disappointed after singing their praises earlier, but Disney has seemingly course corrected in that area that matters most to us; and Uni has screwed up royally.

So, wins to Uni on cost, resort proximity, thrill rides, and ease of the experience.

Wins to Disney on immersion, nostalgia, theming, and DAS process (at least for now).

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

My 2 cents. Former multi year Disney AP; became very frustrated with the "pay more and get less" changes and some DAS super snafus, so discontinued our AP and got Universal APs.

Had 3 great Uni trips; love the proximity of the resorts and the easy walk/boat to the parks; loved the Starbucks in the resorts, founds some dining we enjoy with super easy reservations. Their version of DAS also worked well earlier this year, and we enjoyed Express Pass too (when it came with our resort).

Teenagers also loved the thrill rides and the immersion of the Harry Potter areas. I loved the pace and the easy planning and ability to relax.

Then 3 weeks ago, found out on DIS that they are re-doing their DAS process. Long story short, our family cannot visit parks without it. So we are still waiting for a phone call with four trips booked in the next 4 months.

With airfare already paid, and me being a non-risk taker, we reinvested in Disney APS after a super experience with Disney. We have now pivoted all 4 trips to Disney, and will "waste" our last 6 months of our Uni passes.

Very disappointed after singing their praises earlier, but Disney has seemingly course corrected in that area that matters most to us; and Uni has screwed up royally.

So, wins to Uni on cost, resort proximity, thrill rides, and ease of the experience.

Wins to Disney on immersion, nostalgia, theming, and DAS process (at least for now).

I'm actually really surprised at the new process for Universal although reading from the thread it seems they are just now entering the game with the documentation when other parks have been using it.

However I will say Universal has always been stricter than Disney on their system for that. I completely understand your frustration with it (I was shocked reading the responses people were getting about their bathroom medical issues) but if talking about the process in general Disney has always been far more lenient and generally said to be easier to use in comparison to Universal, it just may have been it worked out well for you for both parks and now unfortunately it's not unless things adjust. For some the prior Universal process was already a "nope won't go to Universal" situation, I'm sure those individuals are really in the big "nope" camp now.

 

[0FF TO NEVERLAND]

I’ll sum it up pretty easily. Whens the last time you cried at Universal? I know people who cry the minute they hear the first few notes of HEA, or Certain Disney characters during nighttime shows.

Universal has some great rides and hotels, but there is no nostalgia. That is what’s missing and it always will.

I’ll wait till epic universe to really know what happens but for now, the Disney bubble and “ welcome home “ feeling can’t be touched

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I’ll sum it up pretty easily. Whens the last time you cried at Universal? I know people who cry the minute they hear the first few notes of HEA, or Certain Disney characters during nighttime shows.

Universal has some great rides and hotels, but there is no nostalgia. That is what’s missing and it always will.

I’ll wait till epic universe to really know what happens but for now, the Disney bubble and “ welcome home “ feeling can’t be touched

Well I don't cry at either Disney nor Universal so not sure why crying is the benchmark. Kinda odd if you ask me.

But you know what hearing Jurassic Park or Harry Potter themed music gives me the same goosebumps as walking into Haunted Mansion or hearing the sounds of Pandora. And come on E.T. you can't help but give a smile at it (and the smell sticks with you) and the PeopleMover is my silly must do.

Nostalgia is what you make of it, some get it for only certain things some get it for others. Most who get it for Universal grow up going, same as Disney. If someone only stepped foot in a Disney park at age 40 they have no nostalgia for the park itself. Same as for Universal but parts of it they can find themselves reliving based on the theming.