Urgent help needed on Visa query

[Miffy2003]

Once they enter your passport details into their little spy thing it does provide them with a lot of info and of course you run the risk of being locked in a cell till they can deport you back to the UK with little or no chance of returning to the US.

I would just like to say I agree with Debbie. They simply do not have this information.

OP - I would not be inclined to worry if I were you; I think the chances of you not being admitted entry are slim to non existent.

 

[Boss Hogg]

They've no need to, they'll just let you get there and lock you up for a day or so then ship you back.




30 May 2006
The European Court of Justice has annulled an EU-US agreement requiring airlines to transfer passenger data to the US authorities.
The court said the decision to hand over the data, including addresses and credit card details, lacked an "appropriate legal basis".

Am a little confused by this. Do they have information or don't they? Are you saying that the US immigration service has sufficient information to "lock you up for a day or so", or not, as your post seems to suggest both?

The transfer of passenger information is a totally different issue. As far as I am aware, the criminal justice system in this country is under no obligation to disclose criminal convictions to 3rd parties (including airlines) unless there is a threat to national security.

Luckily, with 2 speeding convictions (fixed penalty ones) I've managed to slip under their radar so far, but I am thinking of buying a false moustache and glasses outfit next time I travel.

But it does occur to me that Spotlight and his wife (or Bonnie and Clyde as I shall now be referring to them ) may well be up to no good. Let's hunt 'em down. I've got some night-vision goggles which may help and a cutlass

 

[UKDEB]

The truth is out there! Mulder was at MCO last time I was there, but, strangely, he seemed more intested in whether I'd ever been abducted by aliens than my criminal history. Natually, I told him all about the anal probe...

 

[UKDEB]

Me again. This thread has really got to me. My viewpoint is that the OP is, like me, a regular person just wanting to enjoy their Orlando holiday without worry. My interest is in helping the OP, and I do have some insider knowledge on this topic (hence my angst, I guess). I have real issues with those who would rather say something rather than say nothing about which they know nothing.

 

[patdavies]

Am a little confused by this. Do they have information or don't they? Are you saying that the US immigration service has sufficient information to "lock you up for a day or so", or not, as your post seems to suggest both?

The transfer of passenger information is a totally different issue. As far as I am aware, the criminal justice system in this country is under no obligation to disclose criminal convictions to 3rd parties (including airlines) unless there is a threat to national security.

Luckily, with 2 speeding convictions (fixed penalty ones) I've managed to slip under their radar so far, but I am thinking of buying a false moustache and glasses outfit next time I travel.

But it does occur to me that Spotlight and his wife (or Bonnie and Clyde as I shall now be referring to them ) may well be up to no good. Let's hunt 'em down. I've got some night-vision goggles which may help and a cutlass

1. The US does NOT have access to UK criminal records. They do have access (and links to passport numbers) to US records (including the infamous watch list) and Interpol

2. The passenger data referred to by the EU judgement is all the data in your PNR. A PNR is created when you buy a ticket. It lists all the tcket details, the API information and further information regarding linked flights, group travel, method of payment, etc,

This information is still being passed to the US. The authorities have been given until September to find a way of passing the information without contravening EU data protection statutes. If they don't find a way and the US will not back down on the requirement, then all carriers including US carriers will not be able to carry EU citizens to/from the US after that date.

 

[UKDEB]

1. The US does NOT have access to UK criminal records.

Precisely what I have been saying all along and which is all that matters to the OP who is due to go on holiday in two weeks. Folks, this is not about making a point, it's about helping spotlight.

 

[homerdog]

The sharing of information between different agencies, even within the UK, is strictly controlled under RIPA 2000 (Regulation of Investigatory Powers Act 2000). To even suggest that the US Authorities have routine access to information about UK citizens, specifically that relating to alleged criminal activity, is laughable.

The US authorities may have noble intentions regarding refusal of entry to known felons, but a cynic might just suggest that it's an easy way to make a few quid (or should I say dollars?) from well-meaning, but gullible, British tourists. I'll leave everyone to make up their own minds which one it is.

Yo-ho-ho and good night!

 

[alisonbestford]

Whatever the US customs have info about, DH has travelled, on the visa waiver form, 5 times now after being arrested,and given a conditional discharge, for ABH (22 years ago)

You take your own chance when deciding whether you need to apply for a visa or not but this is our personal experience

 

[yo-ho-yo-ho]

Some travelers may not be eligible to enter the United States visa free under the VWP. These include people who have been arrested, even if the arrest did not result in a criminal conviction, those with criminal records, (the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act does not apply to U.S. visa law), certain serious communicable illnesses, those who have been refused admission into, or have been deported from, the United States, or have previously overstayed on the VWP. Such travelers must apply for special restricted visas. If they attempt to travel without a visa, they may be refused entry into the United States.


Under United States visa law people who have been arrested are not eligible to travel visa free under the Visa Waiver Program(VWP); they are required to apply for visas before traveling. If the arrest resulted in a conviction, the individual may require a special restricted visa in order to travel. The Rehabilitation of Offenders Act does not apply to United States visa law. Therefore, even travelers with a spent conviction are not eligible to travel visa free; they must apply for visas.



Now if anyone wants to break U.S Law thats up to you. I for one wouldn't want my vacation ruined for the sake of a few pounds.


And you only have to do a quick search to see they have deported travellers for using the VWP when they shouldn't have.


Interesting reading !!!


Somewhere in central Los Angeles, about 20 miles from LAX airport, there is a nondescript building housing a detention facility for foreigners who have violated US immigration and customs laws. I was driven there around 11pm on May 3, my hands painfully handcuffed behind my back as I sat crammed in one of several small, locked cages inside a security van. I saw glimpses of night-time urban LA through the metal bars as we drove, and shadowy figures of armed security officers when we arrived, two of whom took me inside. The handcuffs came off just before I was locked in a cell behind a thick glass wall and a heavy door. No bed, no chair, only two steel benches about a foot wide. There was a toilet in full view of anyone passing by, and of the video camera watching my every move. No pillow or blanket. A permanent fluorescent light and a television in one corner of the ceiling. It stayed on all night, tuned into a shopping channel.


Her crime signing the VWP when she should have had a Visa.


So you take your chance but don't say you weren't warned !!!

 

[wicket2005]

It goes without saying that if you cannot tick all the boxes on the visa waiver form you need to get a visa. However, what is said on the visa waiver form is different to what the embassy says you need a visa for. From what I remember the visa waiver form lists crimes as ones being against the person and ones involving drugs. It does not say have you ever been arrested. I think arrested means something else in USA, I think they are arrested when we are charged for something after we have been arrested. The visa waiver form has been in place for many years, if they were going to exclude you because of being arrested or for crimes not against people surely the form would have been reworded by now.

Logically I don't think the USA does have access to all our criminal records, international records of people to watch yes. Otherwise why do people who have criminal records have to go to the trouble of finding all their memorandums of convictions, etc to supply to the USA. Surely if the USA had that much access the database would just pull up all your records on their computers.

I think going back to the original question I would just take the chance because there is nothing much else you can do now in any case. However, if I had a criminal record I think I would be off down to London to get a visa. I just could not handle the stress of the thought of being turned away at immigration.

 

[patdavies]

You quote from a US immigration website/

However, nowhere in you example did you say why she should have travelled on a visa and whether her crime only existed in UK criminal records.

There are many reasons for being arrested and deported. The commonest ones for VWP is that the subject was arreted on a previous visit to the US or is liable to arrest on entry (unpaid speeding/parking tickets spring to mind here)

The fact is that the US authorities do not have access to UK criminal records and, furthermore, calling the US Embassy to ask about even the most trivial brush with the law will always result in advice to obtain a visa - it makes them money.

 

[UKDEB]

yo-ho-yo-ho, I'll repeat what I've already said - this thread should be about helping the OP, not about making some kind of dubious point. Spotlight is a new poster who is asking for advice about an issue which has the potential to ruin his holiday. He is due to leave in 2 weeks and has no time to apply for a Visa. Again US Immigration will not have access to records of this nature. That's a fact which spotlight can use to make his own decision about how to proceed. If your petty point scoring causes him to cancel his holiday, will you be satisfied then?

 

[yo-ho-yo-ho]

Deb i gave my advice to the poster but i'll repeat it incase you missed it.

"Four weeks isn't enough time to get a Visa, my advice is unless your crimes "involved moral turpitude" i'd use the VWP this time and apply for a visa on your return."


wicket2005 i agree with most of what you've said, i even argued this with the U.S Embassy and they agreed i was right.

If you use the VWP and you've been arrested or convicted of a crime if you are then stopped at immigration you can argue that you weren't arrested or convicted for crimes involving moral turpitude.

But what i have already stated is why put yourself in that position for the sake of a few pounds. If you've been arrested or convicted of a crime just apply for a Visa and save yourself the worry.

 

[Miffy2003]

. My wife and I were both in trouble with the police over 16 years ago (only the once) on minor things.

spotlight - please do not worry.

The posts you see here which in my opinion are trying to frighten people quite needlessly are to do with crimes of "moral turpitude". I forget exactly what moral turpitude is exactly but it inclues crimes such as murder. I really truly do not think that a minor crime you might have been involved in sixteen years ago will be a problem. The US simply will not know about it.

Please do not worry.

 

[Miffy2003]

I'll repeat what I've already said - this thread should be about helping the OP,

Quite.

 

[florida sun]

spotlight - please do not worry.

The posts you see here which in my opinion are trying to frighten people quite needlessly are to do with crimes of "moral turpitude". I forget exactly what moral turpitude is exactly but it inclues crimes such as murder. I really truly do not think that a minor crime you might have been involved in sixteen years ago will be a problem. The US simply will not know about it.

Please do not worry.

I agree with Karen and Debbie here. Scare mongering at its worse.

 

[yo-ho-yo-ho]

Crimes Involving Moral Turpitude


Crimes Against The Person

Murder/Intentional Homicide
Voluntary Manslaughter
Homicide by Reckless Conduct
Involuntary Manslaughter w/ Reckless Disregard
Attempted Murder
Kidnapping Mayhem
Assault or Attempted Murder Upon Government Officers
Carrying a Concealed Weapon w/ Intent to Use Against the Person of Another
Assault w/ a Deadly Weapon
Assault w/ Weapon Likely to Produce Bodily Harm
Interfering w/ a Law Enforcement Officer
w/ Use of Deadly Force
Attempting to Obstruct/Impede the Progress
of Justice
Aggravated Assault Against a Peace Officer

Crimes Against Property

Attempted Arson
Blackmail/Extortion
Forgery
Uttering a Forged Instrument/Forged Prescription
Making False Statements of Financial Condition
Robbers'
Embezzlement
Larceny/Theft
Grand theft
Petty Theft
Receiving Stolen Property
Concealing Assets in Bankruptcy
Encumbering Mortgaged Property w/ Intent to Defraud
Fraudulently Issuing Check w/ Insufficient Funds
Fraudulently Issuing Worthless Check
Illegal use of ATM or Credit Card
Passing Forged Instrument
Attempted Fraud
Using Mails to Defraud
Making False Statements in Acquisition of Firearm
Securities Fraud
Welfare Fraud
Transporting Stolen Property
Obtaining Money by False Pretenses
Bribery
Malicious Trespass


Sexual and Family Crimes

Assault w/ Intent to Commit Abortion
Attempted Assault w/ Intent to Commit Carnal Abuse
Statutory Rape/Rape
Indecent Assault/Sexual Battery
Adultery
Bigamy
Prostitution
Sodomy
Gross Indecency
Contributing to the Delinquency of a Minor/Sexual Acts
Taking Indecent Liberties w/ a Child
Incest


Crimes Against the Government

Falsely Issuing a Narcotic Prescription
Offering a Bribe
Making, Passing, or Possessing Counterfeit Coins
Securities Fraud
Counterfeiting
Smuggling Merchandise
Impersonating Federal Officer
False Statements/Firearm
False Statements or Entries
Harboring a Fugitive
Using False Names & Addresses to Violate Postal Laws
Uttering/Selling False/Counterfeit Immigration Documents
False Statements to Obtain a Passport
False Statements in LPR Application
Perjury
Theft from U.S. Mail
Taking Kickbacks
Receiving Funds by False Statements
Trafficking in Narcotics
Failing to Report Income
Union Official Unlawfully Accepting a Loan
Kickbacks on Government Contracts
False Statements/Selective Service
Falsely Representing Social Security Number
False Statements/Unemployment Benefits



I'm not trying to frighten anyone, all i was saying is you know the requirements to enter the U.S and if anyone choose to ignore that then thats up to you.

In this posters case she doesn't have enough time to apply and recieve a Visa, so i would go ahead with the trip and if stopped point out if applicable that the arrest or conviction wasn't on the grounds of Moral Turpitude.


Also remember if you been caught speeding and have had to go to court and lost you'll need a visa as you now have a crimnal record. Fixed penalty notices are ok.

 

[yo-ho-yo-ho]

This is the important question on the back of the I-94W form

The I94-W asks:
“Have you ever been arrested or convicted for an offense or crime involving moral turpitude or a violation related to a controlled substance; or been arrested or convicted for two or more offenses for which the aggregate sentence to confinement was five years or more“


If you can answer NO then you have a good case of entering without a Visa and it will be up to the Officer at immigration to decide.

 

[homerdog]

I'm not trying to frighten anyone

You could have fooled me...

I'm afraid your wrong, most info is now shared... Once they enter your passport details into their little spy thing it does provide them with a lot of info and of course you run the risk of being locked in a cell till they can deport you back to the UK with little or no chance of returning to the US.

Also remember if you been caught speeding and have had to go to court and lost... you now have a criminal record.

Rubbish! Technically, minor speeding violations are a criminal offence, but are non-recordable, so you won't have a criminal record.

Can I ask where you got your facts from? Unfortunately, some of them are plain wrong and only serve to cloud the issue and cause confusion. It is not in question that the US Embassy take a hard line when giving advice on visas and I am glad to see that you agree that it doesn't seem to tie-in with the questions on the visa-waiver.

My advice is as follows:
If you can fill in the visa-waiver with a clear conscience, bearing in mind the kind of offences they ask about, that's all you should be worried about. I certainly wouldn't get involved in any conversation with US Immigration about minor brushes with the law; if you are asked, just say no and stay calm and collected!

 

[patdavies]

One additional point that I would make.

If you decide to travel on VWP then don't ever try applying for a visa because of an issue in your past that took place before your VWP trip.

They will, of course, know about the trip on VWP and will refuse a visa on the grounds of previous illegal entry.