University of California workers start largest academic strike in US history

[bcla]

About 48,000 workers (graduate student instructors, tutors, etc.) across 10 campuses, plus Lawrence Berkeley Lab (which is operated by UC). They're represented by the United Auto Workers and the negotiations aren't by campus but with the UC Office of the President.

https://abc7news.com/university-of-...-uc-berkeley-workers-wages-salaries/12452624/

 

[barkley]

so it's strictly the student workers correct? i couldn't read your article b/c a big old ad came and blocked it.

i don't understand a quote from one of the strikers i found on a sacramento news station website-

"Holding UC accountable for affordable housing in California is going to have ripple effects outside of the system," said Diana Sernas, teaching assistant graduate student researcher at UC Davis.

just how is the university system accountable for affordable housing-maybe they have some say about on campus housing but housing in general? davis, berkeley and the other u.c. towns have always had historically higher rent than the adjacent areas (that's why they had/have allot of commuter students).

 

[bcla]

so it's strictly the student workers correct? i couldn't read your article b/c a big old ad came and blocked it.

i don't understand a quote from one of the strikers i found on a sacramento news station website-

"Holding UC accountable for affordable housing in California is going to have ripple effects outside of the system," said Diana Sernas, teaching assistant graduate student researcher at UC Davis.

just how is the university system accountable for affordable housing-maybe they have some say about on campus housing but housing in general? davis, berkeley and the other u.c. towns have always had historically higher rent than the adjacent areas (that's why they had/have allot of commuter students).

I thought that it included a few categories on non-student instructors, but I'm not 100% sure. This claims that UAW 2865 represents student workers.

https://uaw2865.org/about-our-union/

I do remember once we had a campus wide graduate worker strike at UC Berkeley and a professor was showing solidarity by holding a lecture "off campus". It was kind of weird though, because it was at the Pacific Film Archives at the University Art Museum, which was still a campus building even if it was off the main campus.

 

[kdonnel]

so it's strictly the student workers correct? i couldn't read your article b/c a big old ad came and blocked it.

i don't understand a quote from one of the strikers i found on a sacramento news station website-

"Holding UC accountable for affordable housing in California is going to have ripple effects outside of the system," said Diana Sernas, teaching assistant graduate student researcher at UC Davis.

just how is the university system accountable for affordable housing-maybe they have some say about on campus housing but housing in general? davis, berkeley and the other u.c. towns have always had historically higher rent than the adjacent areas (that's why they had/have allot of commuter students).

I am guessing that the workers on strike are asking for a living wage.

https://livingwage.mit.edu/counties/06001

According to the above calculator an adult with no children living on their own needs to make just a bit over $50,000 to live in Alameda County.

One of the drivers of college tuition increases is the fact that colleges and universities need to employ highly skilled professionals to teach highly skilled degrees. The schools are competing with the private sector and each other for those professionals and the private sector has seen massive wage increases in engineering fields.

Luckily for the schools, similar wage increases have not occured for the humanities professions. As a result pay has remained low for college/university employees associated with humanities degrees.

Sounds like those employees who have not seen wage increases, are wanting wage increases.

Sounds like tuition is going to rise.

 

[barkley]

Sounds like tuition is going to rise.

that was my thought as well, and if this union that is striking represents student workers then even if they are successful it could end up in a net loss for them by virtue of a taxable pay increase gobbled up by a tuition and fees increase.

i get that the student workers feel that they need a living wage but unless there's been a tremendous mindset shift over the years those jobs were never considered back in the day by either the u.c. system or the students to be traditional employment-they were jobs students took while working on degrees and the lower wages were kind of a trade off for being able (for the most part) to either schedule work around your classes or get some hands on experience in a paid work environment related to your education and career path.

 

[MillauFr]

that was my thought as well, and if this union that is striking represents student workers then even if they are successful it could end up in a net loss for them by virtue of a taxable pay increase gobbled up by a tuition and fees increase.

i get that the student workers feel that they need a living wage but unless there's been a tremendous mindset shift over the years those jobs were never considered back in the day by either the u.c. system or the students to be traditional employment-they were jobs students took while working on degrees and the lower wages were kind of a trade off for being able (for the most part) to either schedule work around your classes or get some hands on experience in a paid work environment related to your education and career path.

I think they just need to suck more money out of the athletic programs. Didn't UCLA get into hot water asking Doctorate adjunct professors to teach classes for zero salary? They got reamed for that one.

 

[barkley]

I think they just need to suck more money out of the athletic programs. Didn't UCLA get into hot water asking Doctorate adjunct professors to teach classes for zero salary? They got reamed for that one.

theoretically the uc's could actually CHARGE students to work. all they have to do is tweak the curriculum for a given degree and create a requirement wherein a student has to do some type of 'lab' or 'practicum' or 'student teaching' to qualify for their degree-then it's a free labor base for the university that is also generating more income via the tuition/fees the university charges for the participants to take the classes.

 

[bcla]

I think they just need to suck more money out of the athletic programs. Didn't UCLA get into hot water asking Doctorate adjunct professors to teach classes for zero salary? They got reamed for that one.

I heard about that. One allegation was that it was narrowly tailored to a specific candidate who they wanted, and one who already had an outside grant that would pay for the work. in that case the "uncompensated" description was probably to dissuade other candidates.. But then that would have a problem in that there was a predetermined candidate, but they went through the public "recruitment" process that others might go through thinking they had a legitimate shot.

Heck - I've gone through job interviews where I could tell that there was probably a "preferred" (i.e. only going through the motions because of a requirement for X number of interviews/contacts). Once (when I was laid off) in an odd fit of truth telling, a manager literally left voice mail for me saying that he needed me as a phone interview because he had someone working for him on H-1B who they were looking to sponsor for a green card. I figured "What the heck." especially since I knew I wasn't really suited for the position, and I was thinking maybe he could refer me to someone who might be hiring for something more in my area of expertise. But we just ended up talking little about the job but about the situation they were in. And they otherwise had a hiring freeze, but they could keep this guy. However, as part of the requirements, they have to certify that they looked for a US national or permanent resident but couldn't find one suitable for the position.

 

[Kestryl]

SOLIDARITY!

(Disclosure- I was a graduate student at a Midwest college. Did a year as a teaching assistant and the rest of my PhD as a grad research assistant. We had a relatively strong grad student Union, which I was part of.)

UC is probably going to make it out that these are just students with part time undergrad jobs, but this is a significant chunk of their workforce. This is graduate student researchers, teaching assistants (generally grad students), postdocs, etc.

Graduate student researchers bring in grant money be performing the research. (You think profs are in the lab doing all the grunt work? Ha!)

Teaching assistants… I don’t know how every program runs, but at ours the TAs taught all lab classes and any smaller breakout sections. (Like the main class of 500 would meet 3 times a week with the prof, and this was broken into smaller 25 chunks that would meet with the TA once a week.) TAs also filled the tutoring help room and where the ones who provided office hour help. Our university would have ground to a halt if the TAs went on strike. (Where will they find people to cover those lab classes?)

Postdocs aren’t even students! They are people with doctoral degrees. Their positions are temporary (usually 1-3 years). They are routinely underpaid for the amount of work they put in, because the universities tend to think they can get treated like students. (You don’t get a degree or class credits for completing a postdoc, just experience.)

We were making around $30k as an RA/TA in a low cost of living area. And that was four years ago! And our health insurance was completely paid- just a $125 deductible, 5% copay til your out of pocket max. It cost $340 for the year to add a dependent to our plan. (This was written in our contract!) Plus tuition covered (which was really just the university paying itself did the classes we took).

These UC grad students are making $34k, based on the numbers I can find. Barely more than what I was making four years ago in the Midwest!

Fun story on contract bargaining when I was a student: when the grad student Union was asking for a living wage increase (2% each year), the university representative countered that maybe we just needed to tighten our belts and skip putting ground beef in our pasta sauce. Absolutely ludicrous negotiations.

 

[EACarlson]

The students are demanding a living wage in the highest cost of living state for part time work? The AP story I read this morning stated that the contract limited workers to 20 hours per week.

 

[The Mayor]

I think they just need to suck more money out of the athletic programs. Didn't UCLA get into hot water asking Doctorate adjunct professors to teach classes for zero salary? They got reamed for that one.

Actually the big school athletic programs bring in millions of dollars of revenue that the schools use in other areas of academics.

 

[MillauFr]

Actually the big school athletic programs bring in millions of dollars of revenue that the schools use in other areas of academics.

Actually the UCLA athletic department is $60m in the hole. No other department on campus can get away with that nonsense. University of Washington is finally getting its act together requiring donors to give an equal matching gift to an academic department for each dollar they give to the athletic department.

 

[kdonnel]

Actually the big school athletic programs bring in millions of dollars of revenue that the schools use in other areas of academics.

And use to subsidize so many other sports at the college.

Yet despite the huge amounts of money that College Football brings in, it is rare that a college football program does not need student activity fees to close the revenue gap.

The article is old so I imagine the numbers are bigger now but I assume the content is still true.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sports...ther-sports-at-college-level/?sh=224743ea71c2

 

[Kestryl]

The students are demanding a living wage in the highest cost of living state for part time work? The AP story I read this morning stated that the contract limited workers to 20 hours per week.

Again, this is also postdocs, which are full time jobs held by people with doctoral degrees, not students. Academic researchers may also fall into this- I’m less familiar with that position, but from what I read these are not necessarily student workers.

For teaching assistants, hypothetically they are capped at 20 hours, but reality is many go beyond that through office hours, help rooms, etc. (And then they still have to perform their own research, would be unpaid, but is still labor and benefits the university: research = grants. Grants = overhead cost to pay the admin.)

For research assistants, they’re putting in more than 20. Heck, they’re probably putting in more than 40. It’s just that 20 of those hours are “paid” and the rest is for “credit” for the student.

I don’t know about UC specifically, but I’d wager they also have a clause in their contracts that disallows TAs and RAs to have a job outside of their UC contract. For domestic students, that may be loosely enforced- a lot of ours were a “don’t ask, don’t tell” style where as long as it wasn’t blatant and the university doesn’t know, no one will care. For international students, taking something outside their contract could lead to visa problems.

So those may be 20-hour contracts, but they’re providing labor beyond that and they can’t seek employment elsewhere.

 

[tvguy]

I went to a private University and none of the TA's, RA's etc got paid anything, they worked in exchange for free or reduced tuition and room and board. Actually, TAs were rare except in the science department, the Professors were expected to teach all their classes and grade all their own papers.

 

[bcla]

I went to a private University and none of the TA's, RA's etc got paid anything, they worked in exchange for free or reduced tuition and room and board. Actually, TAs were rare except in the science department, the Professors were expected to teach all their classes and grade all their own papers.

I remember the sheer number of undergrad classes where we had TAs and lab assistants. Most classes had 1 hour per week discussion classes led by graduate students. Even my 4 unit English lit classes had only 3 hours per week of lectures, but then the TAs (who graded essays) also had optional non-classroom hours. They would often hold them in cafes.

For grad school I'm not quite sure how it worked. There were no TAs or RAs in my graduate level classes. However, I did take one undergraduate class. I needed to complete one last graduation requirement to transfer over, and they allowed me to start on the basis that I would finish up. The class didn't have TAs, but there was a computer component where there were a couple of lab assistants who directed the lab hours. However, that wasn't at a major research university, so I'm pretty sure that their use of TAs was limited. The majority of graduate students were part time, many had full-time jobs, and there were few Ph.d candidates.

 

[tvguy]

I remember the sheer number of undergrad classes where we had TAs and lab assistants. Most classes had 1 hour per week discussion classes led by graduate students. Even my 4 unit English lit classes had only 3 hours per week of lectures, but then the TAs (who graded essays) also had optional non-classroom hours. They would often hold them in cafes.

For grad school I'm not quite sure how it worked. There were no TAs or RAs in my graduate level classes. However, I did take one undergraduate class. I needed to complete one last graduation requirement to transfer over, and they allowed me to start on the basis that I would finish up. The class didn't have TAs, but there was a computer component where there were a couple of lab assistants who directed the lab hours. However, that wasn't at a major research university, so I'm pretty sure that their use of TAs was limited. The majority of graduate students were part time, many had full-time jobs, and there were few Ph.d candidates.

All my classes were taught and graded by the Professors. But that was what my University prided itself on......the Professors were there to teach, not publish.

 

[RangerPooh]

Some institutions lean on their work study/Graduate student/TA population to teach lower division classes, assist in grading , or leading tutoring programs. I think that the the Carnegie rating of an institution may play a factor into the frequency of which GAs are used. The higher the R1 or 2 rating the more research intensive the school is.

My husband and I both attended an R1 institution and were GAs while in graduate school. I worked in the civic engagement office, he as an instructor. We were capped at 20 hours/week. While the pay was ok at the time, the important part was the free tuition that were were provided. The downside was that your load could be very heavy as a GA. My husband loves teaching and his class sizes varied from small 30 student lecture classrooms to the 500 student auditorium for a 101 level course. He didn't teach just one class but might be teaching two or three, and depending on the class size did his own grading. Department budget could also impact whether you had additional TAs to assist with grading.

I don't think that the GAs striking is out of line. Free tuition is great, but you still need to pay for a place to live. If the amount that you're provided in your aid package is not covering your basic living expenses, then there is a problem. On-campus housing is limited. I do not know what the availability or pricing is in Berkeley, but know that it can't be cheap. Rental pricing has been increasing in the last few years, making on-campus housing more competitive to get into, as in some markets the prices are locked in to when you started at the university.

Another thing to keep in mind is that as a GA/work study student that you need to maintain eligibility for your position. Not just academically, but financially in that you do not make more than x amount. Making above a certain threshold can make a student ineligible for their GA/work study position or reduce their aid award package.

 

[bcla]

Some institutions lean on their work study/Graduate student/TA population to teach lower division classes, assist in grading , or leading tutoring programs. I think that the the Carnegie rating of an institution may play a factor into the frequency of which GAs are used. The higher the R1 or 2 rating the more research intensive the school is.

My husband and I both attended an R1 institution and were GAs while in graduate school. I worked in the civic engagement office, he as an instructor. We were capped at 20 hours/week. While the pay was ok at the time, the important part was the free tuition that were were provided. The downside was that your load could be very heavy as a GA. My husband loves teaching and his class sizes varied from small 30 student lecture classrooms to the 500 student auditorium for a 101 level course. He didn't teach just one class but might be teaching two or three, and depending on the class size did his own grading. Department budget could also impact whether you had additional TAs to assist with grading.

I don't think that the GAs striking is out of line. Free tuition is great, but you still need to pay for a place to live. If the amount that you're provided in your aid package is not covering your basic living expenses, then there is a problem. On-campus housing is limited. I do not know what the availability or pricing is in Berkeley, but know that it can't be cheap. Rental pricing has been increasing in the last few years, making on-campus housing more competitive to get into, as in some markets the prices are locked in to when you started at the university.

Another thing to keep in mind is that as a GA/work study student that you need to maintain eligibility for your position. Not just academically, but financially in that you do not make more than x amount. Making above a certain threshold can make a student ineligible for their GA/work study position or reduce their aid award package.

I don't know exactly how it works, but this is systemwide. I suppose there could be different payscales depending on cost of living. Riverside and Merced are probably less expensive in terms of housing.

 

[MillauFr]

o assist with grading.

I don't think that the GAs striking is out of line. Free tuition is great, but you still need to pay for a place to live. If the amount that you're provided in your aid package is not covering your basic living expenses, then there is a problem. On-campus housing is limited. I do not know what the availability or pricing is in Berkeley, but know that it can't be cheap. Rental pricing has been increasing in the last few years, making on-campus housing more competitive to get into, as in some markets the prices are locked in to when you started at the university.

How on earth can someone live on very little money at UCLA? They have some of the highest rent in the country in West LA.