TWILIGHT vampire book!!!!!

[Lintasare]

A friend of mine just finished with Eclipse and she has some interesting observations. I should mention she is going for her PhD in Psychology so she has a more unique perspective on things than I do. 1. Because she is way smarter than me and 2. because she is way better educated than I am.

So here are her observations on Carlisle and Jacob.

Carlisle: So Carlisle turns Edward because he's lonely. All the other reasons? Merely excuses. So now Carlise is That Guy, the guy who's too old to be Edward's friend and too young to be his father figure, but the perfect age to be That Creepy Guy Who Befriends Teenagers for Nefarious Purposes. If the Volturi had "To Catch a Predator," he'd be the guy with the bagged blood wine coolers.

Jacob: While the entire series could be subtitled How to Have an Abusive Relationship Without Even Trying, the fact that a Team Jacob exists at all kind of horrifies me. Completely inadvertently, Meyer has crafted a perfect portrait of an abusive boyfriend because at the end of it all, you're still rooting for him when you should be praying he just stays the hell away. It blows my mind that this is an unintentional byproduct of the story she wants to tell because I don't understand how she doesn't see the kinds of messages she's sending. There just aren't words.

I would link back to her original Livejournal entry but she friend locks everything so you can't read it unless you have an LJ and you are on her friendslist.

 

[RUDisney]

So here are her observations on Carlisle and Jacob.

Carlisle: So Carlisle turns Edward because he's lonely. All the other reasons? Merely excuses. So now Carlise is That Guy, the guy who's too old to be Edward's friend and too young to be his father figure, but the perfect age to be That Creepy Guy Who Befriends Teenagers for Nefarious Purposes. If the Volturi had "To Catch a Predator," he'd be the guy with the bagged blood wine coolers.

Jacob: While the entire series could be subtitled How to Have an Abusive Relationship Without Even Trying, the fact that a Team Jacob exists at all kind of horrifies me. Completely inadvertently, Meyer has crafted a perfect portrait of an abusive boyfriend because at the end of it all, you're still rooting for him when you should be praying he just stays the hell away. It blows my mind that this is an unintentional byproduct of the story she wants to tell because I don't understand how she doesn't see the kinds of messages she's sending. There just aren't words.

I think she's right about Carlisle, though he was already 200 years old when he'd met Edward, so it may have been more of a grandfatherly relationship before he realized that they boy was too old to be his DS and too young to be his friend.

As for Jacob, she's got him dead on. I think that's what I was trying to say a page or two back. I just don't get the team Jacob. He's just dangerous for her both physically and emotionally.

 

[KarenB]

.....about 50 pages left of the book. I am loving it!!

 

[Terry36]

.....about 50 pages left of the book. I am loving it!!

Which Book??

 

[moppety]

As for Jacob, she's got him dead on. I think that's what I was trying to say a page or two back. I just don't get the team Jacob. He's just dangerous for her both physically and emotionally.

I agree completely! I also don't get the Jacob thing. He's only marginally human, jerks her around a lot, has the potential to maim or kill her(permanently) at a seconds notice, any kids they might have would be obligated to wolf out if vampires live nearby; but the real deal-breaker for me is the fact that he can imprint on another person at any time and just walk away from Bella. Talk about setting yourself up for sure heartbreak...

 

[MomofKatie]

I agree completely! I also don't get the Jacob thing. He's only marginally human, jerks her around a lot, has the potential to maim or kill her(permanently) at a seconds notice, any kids they might have would be obligated to wolf out if vampires live nearby; but the real deal-breaker for me is the fact that he can imprint on another person at any time and just walk away from Bella. Talk about setting yourself up for sure heartbreak...

Oh, I don't know... I really like Jacob. I can't say I like him better than Edward, but I don't think he's a totally awful choice, either. Take a look at Edward-
-He's not human at all
-He jerks her around, too, in his own way (tries to shield her from everything, won't let her do what she wants because "you don't know your own mind")
-has MAJOR potential to maim or kill her (permanently)
-they can't have kids, so she would be shutting that part of her humanity down
-the (theoretical) deal breaker for me is despite the fact that he LOOKS her age, he is really much, much older than her. He acts like her father (or Grandpa) most of the time. There isn't an equal partnership with Bella and Edward. He's the doting older father figure, and she's the sweet young "up on a pedestal" damsel he saves.

I like Jacob because he is alive and vital. He is her age and seems to accept her just as she is. He has never lost control around her, even when sorely tested- even in wolf form, he has never hurt her. He did kiss her in a kind of jerky way, but other than that, I just don't see "abusive boyfriend". And, Bella is not innocent in the feelings he has for her. She regularly cuddled, held hands, and told him she had feelings for him. She even admitted she loves him, and not just as a friend. I think he has a pretty good case for being angry and devastated when he finds out she is engaged to Edward.

I am not a total Team Jacob person, but I can't totally buy into the Team Edward mania, either. I guess I just don't like the "protector" type.

 

[RUDisney]

Oh, I don't know... I really like Jacob. I can't say I like him better than Edward, but I don't think he's a totally awful choice, either. Take a look at Edward-

-He's not human at all
But he's promised to change her, too; if not him, Carlisle.

-He jerks her around, too, in his own way (tries to shield her from everything, won't let her do what she wants because "you don't know your own mind")
He shields her to protect her from herself. She is a bit clumsy and ill-thinking sometimes.

-has MAJOR potential to maim or kill her (permanently)
And, yet, he's always protected her from himself.

-they can't have kids, so she would be shutting that part of her humanity down
I chose not to have children of my own. I chose to adopt. I don't see what breeding has to do with anything.

-the (theoretical) deal breaker for me is despite the fact that he LOOKS her age, he is really much, much older than her. He acts like her father (or Grandpa) most of the time. There isn't an equal partnership with Bella and Edward. He's the doting older father figure, and she's the sweet young "up on a pedestal" damsel he saves.
But, once changed, she'll catch up with him in a maturity sense. The difference between 18 and 40 is great but the difference between 40 and 60 isn't. They can have an equal partnership when she is a vampire, too. He also won't have to keep his guard up for her all the time since she'll have super-human powers, too.

I like Jacob because he is alive and vital. He is her age and seems to accept her just as she is. He has never lost control around her, even when sorely tested- even in wolf form, he has never hurt her. He did kiss her in a kind of jerky way, but other than that, I just don't see "abusive boyfriend". And, Bella is not innocent in the feelings he has for her. She regularly cuddled, held hands, and told him she had feelings for him. She even admitted she loves him, and not just as a friend. I think he has a pretty good case for being angry and devastated when he finds out she is engaged to Edward.
But every time things stop going his way, he disassociates himself from her. He also hangs with a crowd that is not looking to protect her. With the exception of Jasper and his thirsts, all of the Cullens look to protect Bella, too. One small altercation with Paul and Bella could be dog food. It seems to me that she's safer with the vampires, over all.

I am not a total Team Jacob person, but I can't totally buy into the Team Edward mania, either. I guess I just don't like the "protector" type.

My responses are in red.

 

[Jennasis]

I just think that JAcob is a manipulative jerk. This is PROVEN in Eclipse when he outright lies to Bella to make her kiss him. He basically lies and says either you PROVE you are in love with me or I'm going to kill myself (or allow myself to be killed).

MANIPULATIVE. JERK. Hope he imprints on a dung beetle.

 

[PrincessDeb]

Jacob elicits such strong emotions! I actually got kind of attached to him in New Moon but I think only because I was sure Bella wouldn't end up with him. I swear I heard SM say something that BD will have a happy ending and Bella will not be with Jacob. I'm not sure if Bella will be a vampire or not though. Maybe I'm attached to Jacob because I just think Taylor Lautner is so cute. The interview that the Lexicon posted with him last week was adorable. Then again, Taylor Lautner doesn't seem like a very "dark" version of Jacob. I guess time will tell!
Deb

 

[Terry36]

Oh, I don't know... I really like Jacob. I can't say I like him better than Edward, but I don't think he's a totally awful choice, either. Take a look at Edward-
-He's not human at all
-He jerks her around, too, in his own way (tries to shield her from everything, won't let her do what she wants because "you don't know your own mind")
-has MAJOR potential to maim or kill her (permanently)
-they can't have kids, so she would be shutting that part of her humanity down
-the (theoretical) deal breaker for me is despite the fact that he LOOKS her age, he is really much, much older than her. He acts like her father (or Grandpa) most of the time. There isn't an equal partnership with Bella and Edward. He's the doting older father figure, and she's the sweet young "up on a pedestal" damsel he saves.

I like Jacob because he is alive and vital. He is her age and seems to accept her just as she is. He has never lost control around her, even when sorely tested- even in wolf form, he has never hurt her. He did kiss her in a kind of jerky way, but other than that, I just don't see "abusive boyfriend". And, Bella is not innocent in the feelings he has for her. She regularly cuddled, held hands, and told him she had feelings for him. She even admitted she loves him, and not just as a friend. I think he has a pretty good case for being angry and devastated when he finds out she is engaged to Edward.

I am not a total Team Jacob person, but I can't totally buy into the Team Edward mania, either. I guess I just don't like the "protector" type.

I like Jacob better than Edward! Jacob is only acting his AGE which is a teenager! Edward is how many years older, please! IMHO I do not think she should be with either of them; they are both a hazard to her.

Crazy that I still like the books, huh!

 

[Gina]

I just think that JAcob is a manipulative jerk. This is PROVEN in Eclipse when he outright lies to Bella to make her kiss him. He basically lies and says either you PROVE you are in love with me or I'm going to kill myself (or allow myself to be killed).

MANIPULATIVE. JERK. Hope he imprints on a dung beetle.

Thank goodness I'm not the only person who feels that way! I know most people keep saying that Eclipse is way better than New Moon, but Eclipse really left me angry -- at both Jacob and Bella. Jacob, for just being an all-around a$$, and Bella, for being a brat who gives all teenagers a bad name by having this incredibly powerful love in her life that most never see the likes of, and yet still ALSO loves master manipulator Jacob?? I was cheering for the vampires who took him down. I can't wait for Breaking Dawn, just to get the angry taste out of my mouth left by Eclipse. LOL

 

[marciemi]

Oh, I don't know... I really like Jacob. I can't say I like him better than Edward, but I don't think he's a totally awful choice, either. Take a look at Edward-
-He's not human at all
-He jerks her around, too, in his own way (tries to shield her from everything, won't let her do what she wants because "you don't know your own mind")
-has MAJOR potential to maim or kill her (permanently)
-they can't have kids, so she would be shutting that part of her humanity down
-the (theoretical) deal breaker for me is despite the fact that he LOOKS her age, he is really much, much older than her. He acts like her father (or Grandpa) most of the time. There isn't an equal partnership with Bella and Edward. He's the doting older father figure, and she's the sweet young "up on a pedestal" damsel he saves.

I like Jacob because he is alive and vital. He is her age and seems to accept her just as she is. He has never lost control around her, even when sorely tested- even in wolf form, he has never hurt her. He did kiss her in a kind of jerky way, but other than that, I just don't see "abusive boyfriend". And, Bella is not innocent in the feelings he has for her. She regularly cuddled, held hands, and told him she had feelings for him. She even admitted she loves him, and not just as a friend. I think he has a pretty good case for being angry and devastated when he finds out she is engaged to Edward.

I am not a total Team Jacob person, but I can't totally buy into the Team Edward mania, either. I guess I just don't like the "protector" type.

I agree with this post totally! After Eclipse, I have to say I'm not totally a Team Jacob person, but I really liked him in New Moon. I really liked that book overall (unlike everyone else) and was kind of disappointed when Edward came back (although of course it wasn't a surprise!).

 

[moppety]

-has MAJOR potential to maim or kill her (permanently)

-they can't have kids, so she would be shutting that part of her humanity down

-the (theoretical) deal breaker for me is despite the fact that he LOOKS her age, he is really much, much older than her. He acts like her father (or Grandpa) most of the time. There isn't an equal partnership with Bella and Edward. He's the doting older father figure, and she's the sweet young "up on a pedestal" damsel he saves.

He has never lost control around her, even when sorely tested- even in wolf form, he has never hurt her.

Edward also has never lost control. And after NM seems like he never will.

Not having kids doesn't take away from her humanity. It just makes her have no kids. If someone chooses to knowingly marry an infertile or "fixed" person, does that make them less "human"? I hope not.

As a PP mentioned, she'll catch up with Edward. But also of note is that this is Edwards first ever experience with dating, he's acting and reacting like a 17 year-old guy just as much as Bella is acting her age. So they're on almost equal footing there.

The "kiss me or I'll kill myself" and constant guilt trips pushed me over my personal line with Jacob. I don't hate him, but I wouldn't want to be romantically involved with him.

 

[nkjzmom]

We just watched 10,000 BC again this weekend and I am even more convinced that Steven Strait NEEEEEEEEEDS to play Jacob in the next movies. I think he was on Stephenie's old list of "maybe's" to play him...I can't find the link anymore. Wow...I just kept watching him and imagining him as Jacob. I think he would make the transition perfectly, from Taylor Lautner as young Jacob to him as the older more mature Jacob.

 

[PrincessDeb]

Speaking of old links, does anyone have the link to amy16's fan fiction? I keep hearing how great it is but there are so many fan fiction sites that I can't find it. I really don't want to weed through over 900 pages.
TIA!

 

[golfgirl3613]

I am 100% Team Edward! I liked Jacob in NM, but he jumped overboard in Eclipse, although I realize that he is only a teenager, and Bella is portrayed as being a middle aged teen.

Bella knows exactly what she is getting with Edward and his family, while Edward may not share specific incidents and knowledge, I think she has gained a broad look at the overall vegetarian vampire lifestyle, courtesy of the rest of the Cullens.

Can't wait until BD!

 

[KarenB]

Okay-I just finished Twilight. I wanted to see what all the hype is about. Plus, I am a 4th grade teacher and although my students probably won't pick up this book, I like to know what kids (and obviously adults) are reading. I REALLY enjoyed this book. I heard it was about vampires, and I immediately was turned off by it. I don't really know what changed my mind, but I am really glad I decided yo read it.

I have been posting short, quick replies on this thread and not reading anything else because I didn't want to read any spoilers. I am SO ready to read this thread and see what everyone's thoughts are but I am afraid there will be too much info about New Moon. What do you think? Is this thread safe to read from the beginning? Will it spoil the second book for me?

Let me know SOON!!!!
Karen

 

[spongemommie05]

Speaking of old links, does anyone have the link to amy16's fan fiction? I keep hearing how great it is but there are so many fan fiction sites that I can't find it. I really don't want to weed through over 900 pages.
TIA!

http://rex1616.blogspot.com/
i hope this is what you are looking for .

 

[PrincessDeb]

spongiemommie-you rock!!!! That is exactly what I was looking for

Deb

 

[PrincessDeb]

Karen B-I would not read through this thread unless you are okay with spoilers. There are not that many but there are enough that you will know the main plot of New Moon if you read all 76 pages. Glad that you enjoyed Twilight!!! Welcome to our world
Deb