Tipping suggestion on receipt

[LSUmiss]

If it's not on the same level then why bring it into a conversation about employees having personal responsibility for agreeing to take a job? We aren't talking about abuse victims. We are talking about people willingly accepting the employment terms. Those people are 100% responsible for their choice to do that.
You can either agree with that statement or not, no need to make ridiculous comparisons.
If you respond, don't expect an answer, I'm way too tired to engage in such dramatics.

It’s called an analogy. Pp seemed like he was talking about vulnerable populations being exploited. That’s not the same as ppl willing accepting a job.

 

[RamblingMad]

If it's not on the same level then why bring it into a conversation about employees having personal responsibility for agreeing to take a job? We aren't talking about abuse victims. We are talking about people willingly accepting the employment terms. Those people are 100% responsible for their choice to do that.
You can either agree with that statement or not, no need to make ridiculous comparisons.
If you respond, don't expect an answer, I'm way too tired to engage in such dramatics.

Let’s say I automate or offshore your job. You picked your education and career choice, but now I have someone or a machine doing it for a fraction of the cost. And let’s say the other employers you would go to for work have done the same thing. You’re personally responsible for picking a career that was automated away or off shored. I guess, you’ll just have to deal with it.

Servers get paid low wages because folks won’t write laws to raise them. They’re paid really low wages and depend on the mercy of others. I can just not tip, especially if I’m on vacation. I’m never going to see that person again.

At the end of the day, we need to guarantee living wages to people because stuff happens outside their control.

 

[disneychrista]

At the end of the day, we need to guarantee living wages to people because stuff happens outside their control.

And what is a living wage? Does it mean that the person can afford that basics on their own with that salary? Even not traditionally considered low wage jobs don't pay enough for that.

 

[Skywalker]

I consider being particular saying "you are worth this $13 tip and not this $15 tip." It's handwringing over such a minimal amount that I really don't get the point. But I generally think this is entirely generational or even perhaps regional as pretty everyone I know rounds up to the nearest $5 increment.

Nearest $5 ? I know people that tip much better than that, especially one guy I work with. He probably rounds up to the nearest $10 or $20 lol. He would call YOU a cheapskate. His line in the sand is far past where yours is. Guess you better stay home until you can up your game. Where does he pick up his prize?

So there are no vulnerable populations that get exploited especially when recruited from poorer foreign countries? Not the same level, but that’s like telling an abuse victim to take personal responsibility for allowing herself to be abused. It’s much much more complicated than that.

What if those same people you are SO concerned about can't afford to pay 20% or more on top of their food bill if THEY want to eat out as a special treat? I guess your vulnerable populations and exploited foreign workers better just slink away and eat ramen noodles in their basement.

 

[meggiebeth]

From what I’ve been told, servers in the US get taxed on the assumption that they make 15% in tips. Because of this, unless service is bad I will tip a minimum of 15% for OK service and 20% for good service. To ask for a 30% tip seems absolutely ridiculous to me.

In the U.K. servers are paid the same minimum wage as everyone else and there’s no expectation to tip and usually not even a suggested tip on receipts. Even if we do tip, 10% is generous here. Why are people so happy to tip so high in the US? I’m just curious as surely it would save the customer money if servers were paid a proper minimum wage and tipping wasn’t such a lucrative business.

 

[disykat]

I dont get those saying we're haggling over a dollar or two on a meal. No, were haggling over hundreds of dollars throughout the year. Many people just can't afford a lot of extras and for those people, tips going from 15 to 18 to 20 percent in a matter of years is alarming. If people stop going out to eat because we can't afford the increases, those tipped workers will really be in trouble.

I have waitressed. I'm way more likely to tip generously for a cup of coffee in an empty section than for someone who is turning over 5 tables an hour at 5 to ten bucks or more a pop. Tipped positions suck when there are no customers. ( though I think they have protections in place for that now so you make at least minimum, don't they?) I tend to do the math in my head and sometimes consider changing careers. Waiting tables is difficult, but it wasn't any more difficult than working fast food or any of my other jobs I've held and I made more per hour. I literally made three times as much per hour most hours when I waitressed.

Way back when I waitressed I had two jobs. A gift shop for around $3 an hour and then several evening shifts at a restaurant where I averaged over $10 an hour (in a state with a lower tip wage) after tipping out the bussers, hostess, wine stewards, etc. That was back in the day when tipping was usually percent. The tipped positions were highly coveted and I considered myself lucky to get a few shifts.

 

[LongLiveRafiki]

From what I’ve been told, servers in the US get taxed on the assumption that they make 15% in tips. Because of this, unless service is bad I will tip a minimum of 15% for OK service and 20% for good service. To ask for a 30% tip seems absolutely ridiculous to me.

In the U.K. servers are paid the same minimum wage as everyone else and there’s no expectation to tip and usually not even a suggested tip on receipts. Even if we do tip, 10% is generous here. Why are people so happy to tip so high in the US? I’m just curious as surely it would save the customer money if servers were paid a proper minimum wage and tipping wasn’t such a lucrative business.

The first paragraph of yours is not exactly true. The way it works is the IRS knows that despite the law that servers must declare and pay taxes on ALL of their tips, many servers do not. If a customer leaves a tip on a credit card, then the restaurant knows how much is tipped, but with cash tips, only what the server claims can actually be reported. A large number of servers under report their tips to avoid paying taxes on them. As a way to lessen this tax evasion, the IRS requires that restaurants report 8% of their sales as tips across their tipped employees. Basically, it means that when the restaurant reports the tips for the employees, it needs to equal at least 8% of the restaurant's sales.

The way it worked at the restaurant I served in (and I'm sure its's the same or similar for most places) was when we claimed our tips each night, it was programmed into the computer that if we reported less than 8% of our total sales in tips, it would flag it. The manager would then ask us if we were sure that was all the tips we had made. At that point, the server would either fess up that they had made more and the amount would be changed in the system or they'd say, "No, that's all I made," and that would be it. Nothing further happens unless the total tips reported by ALL employees for the entire restaurant through the month were less than 8% of total sales. At that point, the restaurant would have to allocate tips.

If a restaurant has to allocate tips because their employees did not report earning at least 8% in total sales as tips, then the restaurant will determine what the difference is in reported amount and the 8% and split it up among the tipped employees based on number of hours worked. To put it very simply, if the total sales for a month were $100,000, 8% or $8,000 would need to be reported in tips. If only $7,000 were reported, then $1,000 would need to be allocated. If there were 10 tipped employees that worked the same number of hours, each employee would be allocated $100 in tips for that month. That would then show up on the W2 in a box for allocated tips. If the employee has documentation that they did not earn that extra $100 in tips that month, then they are good and only pay taxes on what they reported. If they cannot prove their earnings, then they will pay tax on those allocated tips.

There was exactly one time when I was a server that at the end of the night the system flagged me for not reporting 8% in tips. That was the night that I had legitimately made $9 in tips after being stiffed on a large check. Nothing ever came of it because over the course of the month the reported tips for all servers still exceeded 8% of the restaurant's total sales. My manager said that she had never had to allocate tips before and as long as servers are properly reporting their tips, it's incredibly rare for a restaurant to need to do so. Even accounting for customers who don't tip/ tip low, servers are still generally averaging far more than 8% of total sales in tips.

It is federal law that those making tips are supposed to keep a written log of their daily tips. Most don't, but the purpose is it will help if this sort of situation ever arises. You are also prone to IRS audit if you report low amounts in tips since the IRS knows that most servers tend to earn far more than 8% of their sales in tips and again, many try to cheat the system by under reporting cash tips. The point is, as long as a server has these records, they will only ever pay tax on the amount of money they actually earn.

though I think they have protections in place for that now so you make at least minimum, don't they?

Yes, if what the server makes in tips + base pay averaged for the pay period per hour does not equal the higher of federal or state minimum wage, then the employer must make up the difference. Even if all customers tip nothing, a server is guaranteed to make minimum wage.

 

[kaytieeldr]

Though I give 20 at times, I think listing a 20% minimum is ridiculous IMO. When did 18% go away?

When did 18%(+) start?

Applicable for me if the ride was maybe under $8-10.

Like a $1 tip (50%) on a $2 cup of coffee. (can we still get $2 coffee? )

Sure. Cumberland Farms all day. McDonald's, at least at breakfast. Dunkin' Donuts iced latte from 2-6...

I’m so old it was 10% when I was a kid.

I'm older than you. It was 15% by the time I was 12 or 13.

 

[EveDallas]

See, I try to do a good job because I want to do a good job.

Right? What happened to taking pride in your work - no matter what that work is?

 

[kaytieeldr]

I completely disagree that managers should not get tips for doing the same job as a server or bartender.

if a manager only gets paid $2.13 (or whatever your state's minimum wage for servers is) per hour, ok. But they don't.

Because I'm from UK and if you look on the Disney UK boards you'll see the general consensus is that the tipping culture is now out of control and this is totally unacceptable and someone must make a stand. At least annual if not bi annual visitor to USA, and 26+ state visitor over the last 29 years, and I've seen how it's changed. This is trying to push the envelope further.

The business should just pay the employees more and pass along the increase in price, rather than guilting customers with escalating tip amounts.

Sure, they should. But they mostly don't. Minimum wage laws in, I think, 39 states allow really low server wages because they are expected to earn at least the standard minimum wage by combining pay plus tips.

Talk to your state legislators. Get one to introduce a bill to pay servers the same minimum wage as everyone else.

 

[kaytieeldr]

And there will be those that will then tip MORE THAN the 30% suggested so that they very important/special.

And there will be those that will then tip MORE THAN the 30% suggested so that they very important/special because they choose to for a wide range of reasons.

fixed it for you.

 

[kaytieeldr]

If you take a job as a cashier you agreed to a certain amount of pay. It’s

.
Wait. Where are cashiers tipped, and are they hiring?

And if any of you visit us here in Alberta, be aware your waitstaff may already be earning more than you do.

I'm retired and living on Social Security. I just calculated my hourly earnings based on a 40 hour week. You're darned right the wait staff there makes more than satisfied do!

It already costs a fortune to eat out. It wasn't long ago when I could take the family out for $50.

Heck, I remember when McDonald's use to advertise, "change back from your dollar"!

90% of the time any more, you have to ration your 10 ounces of ice and 2 ounces of drink during the whole meal because you're not getting any more.

Start ordering your drink with no ice (or straight up, if it's alcohol) and a separate glass of ice.

The owners have tried to spin it like it's how great they think their staff are, but it's still had an negative impact.

.
since the owners feel their staff is that great, they can start paying them above minimum wage.

 

[kaytieeldr]

But the only way you would know who doesn't tip on decent or good service is if you're in their party.

Or if they post their tipping strategy online...

 

[kaytieeldr]

I'm not sure how I feel about a service charge, I think it leaves room for an employer to not give it to the server.

I agree. I just have this sense that the service charge goes to payroll, instead of the restaurants raising prices.

I can't even recall a time that I have though I'm sure I've done it a handful of times in my lifetime.

I did it once (similar to a PP, my mom was a restaurant bookkeeper for years.) A group of us from work used to go out to eat once a month, different places. One meal, our waitress had three tables: the four of us (middle-aged* women), a table of men in suits, and a table of either regulars or her friends. She spent a great deal of time with the other two tables, and almost ignored us. oh, except when she removed an appetizer plate while my co-worker was bringing a cocktail of food to her mouth.

I regret this now, but we tipped her 15% to the penny.
*except me, I was young.

 

[Hikergirl]

It’s called an analogy. Pp seemed like he was talking about vulnerable populations being exploited. That’s not the same as ppl willing accepting a job.

It's a very poor analogy.

Vulnerable or not, a person is still making a choice, they still have the option to say no to a job. If they feel they can't, then that is their decision. Don't blame a company for paying people what they are willing to work for, the company is not a caregiver, it isn't there to make sure you can do anything outside of your contracted work hours with the money the pay you. It is there to compensate you, whoever you are for the job you do with the salary you agree too.

 

[LSUmiss]

I dont get those saying we're haggling over a dollar or two on a meal. No, were haggling over hundreds of dollars throughout the year. Many people just can't afford a lot of extras and for those people, tips going from 15 to 18 to 20 percent in a matter of years is alarming. If people stop going out to eat because we can't afford the increases, those tipped workers will really be in trouble.

I have waitressed. I'm way more likely to tip generously for a cup of coffee in an empty section than for someone who is turning over 5 tables an hour at 5 to ten bucks or more a pop. Tipped positions suck when there are no customers. ( though I think they have protections in place for that now so you make at least minimum, don't they?) I tend to do the math in my head and sometimes consider changing careers. Waiting tables is difficult, but it wasn't any more difficult than working fast food or any of my other jobs I've held and I made more per hour.

Way back when I waitressed I had two jobs. A gift shop for around $3 an hour and then several evening shifts at a restaurant where I averaged over $10 an hour (in a state with a lower tip wage) after tipping out the bussers, hostess, wine stewards, etc. That was back in the day when tipping was usually percent. The tipped positions were highly coveted and I considered myself lucky to get a few shifts.

The standard here has been 18%-20% for years. It has always been then standard since I was an adult old enough to pay for myself to eat out.
That’s still the standard here. I don’t know if it really is changing that rapidly other places or if 15 years seems to pass you by quicker when your older. But, I don’t think that’s a short period of time especially since it shows no sign on changing yet in this area. Perhaps that’s why I don’t see it as such a big deal. I honestly think a lot of the complaining is generational along the lines of “back in my day you could get 2 loaves of bread for a nickel”.

 

[LSUmiss]

It's a very poor analogy.

Vulnerable or not, a person is still making a choice, they still have the option to say no to a job. If they feel they can't, then that is their decision. Don't blame a company for paying people what they are willing to work for, the company is not a caregiver, it isn't there to make sure you can do anything outside of your contracted work hours with the money the pay you. It is there to compensate you, whoever you are for the job you do with the salary you agree too.

Normally, in most cases, yes. But that’s not the scenario it seemed the pp was describing. There are exceptions. Everything is not black & white. “Personal responsibility” is sometimes used as a way to excuse a company’s exploitive practices.

 

[ronandannette]

The standard here has been 18%-20% for years. It has always been then standard since I was an adult old enough to pay for myself to eat out.
That’s still the standard here. I don’t know if it really is changing that rapidly other places or if 15 years seems to pass you by quicker when your older. But, I don’t think that’s a short period of time especially since it shows no sign on changing yet in this area. Perhaps that’s why I don’t see it as such a big deal. I honestly think a lot of the complaining is generational along the lines of “back in my day you could get 2 loaves of bread for a nickel”.

OK, but for those of us that have seen it creep up over time - why has it changed at all? There’s really no reason. The actual tip dollar amounts have gone up as the menu prices have gone up and the nature of the work hasn’t changed.

I guess you’ll just have to take our word for it that the tipping defaults on payment machines in lots of places are now 20/25/30%. How will you react when you do see them and all of a sudden your previously generous-seeming 18% now classifies you as a dead-beat?

 

[ronandannette]

Normally, in most cases, yes. But that’s not the scenario it seemed the pp was describing. There are exceptions. Everything is not black & white. “Personal responsibility” is sometimes used as a way to excuse a company’s exploitive practices.

So in the case of servers, it’s more appropriate that the responsibility for paying them falls on the customers?

 

[LSUmiss]

OK, but for those of us that have seen it creep up over time - why has it changed at all? There’s really no reason. The actual tip dollar amounts have gone up as the menu prices have gone up and the nature of the work hasn’t changed.

I guess you’ll just have to take our word for it that the tipping defaults on payment machines in lots of places are now 20/25/30%. How will you react when you do see them and all of a sudden your previously generous-seeming 18% now classifies you as a dead-beat?

It seems like the 20-30% were isolated incidents & the consensus was that it was ridiculous. When was it below 15-18%? I’m 40 & in my lifetime, I can’t recall it being less than that. Everything goes up so I’d say holding steady for 40 years is pretty ok.