Tink Weekend Issues and Changes (LONG!)

[roxymama]

I think the hardest part about comparing splits on a DL half marathon is that the character stops are in the first 5k and beginning of the second 5k. So I can imagine there are many people who vastly improve their times on the back half of the course. So to me, I think Disney if they were gonna cut that course short (if that at all was in their plans) they should have had a mat in the big square that was skipped so everyone who did it would have a mat at mile 7.5 or whatever. You'd pretty clearly know who didn't run the 13.1 (through cheating or forced shortened course) by the skipped mat.
So to me this tells me that it was not a decision they made until after the race had already started or just before it did once they decided to delay the race.
If they knew the streets needed to be closed at X time and there was no wiggle room to delay the start, they should have just started the race on time and let people funnel into the corrals in the back. or let them funnel in at A or B or C as the race was starting (albeit they'd be mixed in with later people that moved up.)

Or maybe next time give yourself a bigger buffer before roads are opening. Or figure out the security thing!

 

[Anisum]

Or maybe next time give yourself a bigger buffer before roads are opening. Or figure out the security thing!

I agree with this whole post but the security thing is what really gets to me. This isn't their first time doing races. Security should not have been this big of a problem. I've stayed at a hotel that required me to go through security at Harbor in order to reach the corrals and it wasn't that big of an issue. Did a bunch of their security staff call out sick? Were they warned of a credible threat that caused them to filter everyone through metal detectors? What exactly was the issue that prevented them from figuring out security for a race when they hold 4 race weekends a year?

 

[CaliforniaGirl09]

I think the hardest part about comparing splits on a DL half marathon is that the character stops are in the first 5k and beginning of the second 5k. So I can imagine there are many people who vastly improve their times on the back half of the course. So to me, I think Disney if they were gonna cut that course short (if that at all was in their plans) they should have had a mat in the big square that was skipped so everyone who did it would have a mat at mile 7.5 or whatever. You'd pretty clearly know who didn't run the 13.1 (through cheating or forced shortened course) by the skipped mat.
So to me this tells me that it was not a decision they made until after the race had already started or just before it did once they decided to delay the race.
If they knew the streets needed to be closed at X time and there was no wiggle room to delay the start, they should have just started the race on time and let people funnel into the corrals in the back. or let them funnel in at A or B or C as the race was starting (albeit they'd be mixed in with later people that moved up.)

Or maybe next time give yourself a bigger buffer before roads are opening. Or figure out the security thing!

This was exactly the point I was going to make--the diversion of the course with the characters front loaded could have potentially affected a number of people who would have caught up with the 16 minute pace by the end of the race.

 

[sidrich]

I don't think they wipe out any results or flag them in any way. In the Facebook post I was following, someone had downloaded and analyzed the complete set of finishers and was using major discrepancies in the 10k and 15k split paces to confirm the redirection. There was no other indicator of the impacted runners mentioned. It certainly would have been much easier for him to confirm the redirection if there had been. I sincerely doubt that RunDisney will do anything about the times of those redirected. They most likely don't have any record of who was/was not since it was just moving the cones and saying "everyone go this way now". Plus, even when presented with concrete evidence of a BQ cheater at WDWMW, they have refused to DQ or alter results. I don't think they really care as long as the event is completed.

I wonder if any of the diverted runners happen to use Strava- that would be handy because if they logged the race Strava has a "Fly By" feature where it replays a run- or race- and shows you your progress along with any users you may have passed. I just started using it and imported my Fitbit data from the 2016 Princess Half and you can essentially play back the race at 60x speed. If anyone who was diverted is on Strava, you could see the path they took by when their little icon veers off the route everyone else was on.

 

[The Expert]

Damn. I just tried putting that activity into the Flyby on Strava, but it just gives me an error, saying it can't find it. Maybe someone else's will work?

 

[sidrich]

Damn. I just tried putting that activity into the Flyby on Strava, but it just gives me an error, saying it can't find it. Maybe someone else's will work?

I honestly accidentally found the feature when I uploaded my old run - set the activity kind to "race" and it asked "is this the Disney Princess Half Marathon". I tried searching for Tink but I don't think it works if you didn't run the race. Or maybe they haven't created an event yet. It was a long shot. It was really fun watching the old race on Fly By- you could definitely see where runners stopped for pictures!

 

[sidrich]

Damn. I just tried putting that activity into the Flyby on Strava, but it just gives me an error, saying it can't find it. Maybe someone else's will work?

I found it. http://labs.strava.com/flyby/viewer/#986018004?c=9qh0ku03&z=E&t=1P654b
There's a lot of Strava runners! Go fairies, go!

 

[The Expert]

I found it. http://labs.strava.com/flyby/viewer/#986018004?c=9qh0ku03&z=E&t=1P654b
There's a lot of Strava runners! Go fairies, go!

That's really interesting! Not a single runner on that flyby experienced the course cut/deviation. The last runner in did finished in 3:38 with an average pace just over 16 minutes per mile.

 

[pigletliz]

I agree with this whole post but the security thing is what really gets to me. This isn't their first time doing races. Security should not have been this big of a problem. I've stayed at a hotel that required me to go through security at Harbor in order to reach the corrals and it wasn't that big of an issue. Did a bunch of their security staff call out sick? Were they warned of a credible threat that caused them to filter everyone through metal detectors? What exactly was the issue that prevented them from figuring out security for a race when they hold 4 race weekends a year?

None of the past Tinks have had a security problem because they were held prior to the current security set up. LS didn't have this issue because that race starts in a different location than Tink. Re-checking bibs next to the tiny gate next to the Earl of Sandwich seemed like a poorly conceived idea, but they were definitely looking at every single bib. DL weekend should be (hopefully) much less of a hassle. Having runner only/no bags lines would be wonderful!

 

[roxymama]

That's really interesting! Not a single runner on that flyby experienced the course cut/deviation. The last runner in did finished in 3:38 with an average pace just over 16 minutes per mile.

I have no basis in facts, but just an idea that maybe there is a correlation between being a Strava user and being properly trained to complete the half prior to the Balloon Dude (at least past that part of the race.) Not saying every Strava user is automatically fast, but perhaps trained enough to know how to get to the minimum pace?
Or perhaps only someone who "knew" they could make it at the min. pace would want to post up on Strava to begin with?

I would like to see someone post their garmin map who did the shortened course just because I'm nosey and want to look at it.

 

[Anisum]

None of the past Tinks have had a security problem because they were held prior to the current security set up. LS didn't have this issue because that race starts in a different location than Tink. Re-checking bibs next to the tiny gate next to the Earl of Sandwich seemed like a poorly conceived idea, but they were definitely looking at every single bib. DL weekend should be (hopefully) much less of a hassle. Having runner only/no bags lines would be wonderful!

Ah, I hadn't realized DL changed their security set up. I don't get out there that often.

 

[trackgam]

Its interesting. I have only ran 2 DL races, I am east coast so WDW is more accessible. I actually like the courses better at DL, you arent running on so much highway at DL.... I did the kids race, 5k, 10k, and half and will say the kids race was the worse with regard to no one knowing anything.
1. 5k minus the fact that my 7 year old and I ran it with no character experiences, we had fun. We were in the parks so much that we entertained ourselves with taking photo ops in random places along the course. during the WDW 5k, you run the first mile or so outside of the park and with no "view"
2. 10k I ran and I loved the course. Again, used to WDW, you run the first 4 miles outside of the parks, granted there are a few character stops but still, its highway with views of the road... my issue with the 10k is I was in a back corral (love that its a smaller race so I think it went to F) but being in E, we didnt even get a start, it was a "hey you are here, keep going, its a rolling start"
3. half while I do love running through angel stadium, I did enjoy not having gravel in my shoes here again, even when not in the parks, which did seem like more miles were spent in the park at DL, when not in the park, you have people sitting outside of their home drinking coffee and cheering you on, you had people lining the streets cheering you on. I get there may come a time that its a safety thing but still... at WDW you again run over 5 miles on highway before entering MK to leave just after mile 6 to run highway again until mile 12. While you do have some people cheering you on, its boring. again with this, there were less people (corral F as opposed to corral P)... the last princess was essentially shoulder to shoulder the entire race (and I was in corral G for the princess).

All in all, I do get why people are complaining BUT so many gripes I heard while there were the amount of people, lack of organization, and security.... I will walk through security 20 times if it helps protect myself and other runners. the crowds are nothing compared to WDW, and the organization for run disney in general, no matter which location, leaves much to be desired.

 

[Chasing Dopey]

Its interesting. I have only ran 2 DL races, I am east coast so WDW is more accessible. I actually like the courses better at DL, you arent running on so much highway at DL.... I did the kids race, 5k, 10k, and half and will say the kids race was the worse with regard to no one knowing anything.
1. 5k minus the fact that my 7 year old and I ran it with no character experiences, we had fun. We were in the parks so much that we entertained ourselves with taking photo ops in random places along the course. during the WDW 5k, you run the first mile or so outside of the park and with no "view"
2. 10k I ran and I loved the course. Again, used to WDW, you run the first 4 miles outside of the parks, granted there are a few character stops but still, its highway with views of the road... my issue with the 10k is I was in a back corral (love that its a smaller race so I think it went to F) but being in E, we didnt even get a start, it was a "hey you are here, keep going, its a rolling start"
3. half while I do love running through angel stadium, I did enjoy not having gravel in my shoes here again, even when not in the parks, which did seem like more miles were spent in the park at DL, when not in the park, you have people sitting outside of their home drinking coffee and cheering you on, you had people lining the streets cheering you on. I get there may come a time that its a safety thing but still... at WDW you again run over 5 miles on highway before entering MK to leave just after mile 6 to run highway again until mile 12. While you do have some people cheering you on, its boring. again with this, there were less people (corral F as opposed to corral P)... the last princess was essentially shoulder to shoulder the entire race (and I was in corral G for the princess).

All in all, I do get why people are complaining BUT so many gripes I heard while there were the amount of people, lack of organization, and security.... I will walk through security 20 times if it helps protect myself and other runners. the crowds are nothing compared to WDW, and the organization for run disney in general, no matter which location, leaves much to be desired.

True, there's still a lot of good. But it's not as good as the same thing was before, and it was cheaper back then. I think that is what's rubbing people the wrong way. As I have to travel far to race DL, the value has to remain high for the cost. They've taken away enough to keep me away for now.

 

[roxymama]

True, there's still a lot of good. But it's not as good as the same thing was before, and it was cheaper back then. I think that is what's rubbing people the wrong way. As I have to travel far to race DL, the value has to remain high for the cost. They've taken away enough to keep me away for now.

I'm still super happy with my very first half marathon at tink this year. However...I still get a little bit (sometimes a lot) jealous of some of the on course entertainment and other "extras" that previous years received. So I totally get what you are saying about value vs cost.

 

[trackgam]

True, there's still a lot of good. But it's not as good as the same thing was before, and it was cheaper back then. I think that is what's rubbing people the wrong way. As I have to travel far to race DL, the value has to remain high for the cost. They've taken away enough to keep me away for now.

I agree... for the cost, there should be more than just the bling....

 

[Ariel484]

True, there's still a lot of good. But it's not as good as the same thing was before, and it was cheaper back then. I think that is what's rubbing people the wrong way. As I have to travel far to race DL, the value has to remain high for the cost. They've taken away enough to keep me away for now.

Yep. If I hadn't run Disney races before these ones, I'm sure I would have felt differently. For what I paid for these races, travel, hotel, etc., some of what happened during the weekend was unacceptable to me. The negative feedback on the organization, how security was done, etc. IS valid.