Tim Tebow

[rotlex]

Christianity is very offensive to many people today.

Lots of things are to Christians too, yet we get to have them shoved down our throats and have to put up with it. Why are non Christians so special that they don't have to be offended? Seriously, I would like to know.

Every time I wonder this, I simply refer to our Lord. Not only did He tell us to go forth and preach the Gospel to all nations; He knew we would be hated, prosecuted, tortured and even killed in the process. I always figure if I'm not offending someone, in a pleasant manner of course, I'm not doing my job as a devout Catholic\Christian.

Just always remember, He never said it would easy....

Oh, as far as Tebow? Love him for more than a few reasons.

 

[FireDancer]

It might be that some folks want to exercise separation of church 'n state.

The issue is with the interpretation of what that means. Does it mean that god can't be mentioned on money (even generically as he/she/it is now) or does it mean that no state religion can be formed? Of course we can't have that discussion here since it hits on both of the banned topics but so far the courts haven't ruled that it is as literal as some would like it to be.

 

[Uncle Remus]

The issue is with the interpretation of what that means. Does it mean that god can't be mentioned on money or does it mean that no state religion can be formed? Of course we can't have that discussion here since it hits on both of the banned topics but so far the courts haven't ruled that it is as literal as some would like it to be.

Might be why some folks use the court system to question/challenge it, huh?

 

[bunkkinsmom]

I've just been surprised by how deep the resentments seem to run towards Christianity. Is it really that bad? I truly don't understand . (I was directing this at you at first, and then realized I read you wrong - sorry). Anyway, maybe someone else wants to answer that?

Yep, it's really that bad. But we have it easy:

http://www.compassdirect.org/english/country/nigeria/article_123658.html

http://chinaview.wordpress.com/2007/09/04/report-3000-chinese-christians-killed-since-2000/

..... and Christianity is actual illegal in N. Korea.

Here in America it's not illegal, but we are looked at as ignorant and closed minded.

 

[skater]

Yep, it's really that bad. But we have it easy:

http://www.compassdirect.org/english/country/nigeria/article_123658.html

http://chinaview.wordpress.com/2007/09/04/report-3000-chinese-christians-killed-since-2000/

..... and Christianity is actual illegal in N. Korea.

Here in America it's not illegal, but we are looked at as ignorant and closed minded.

All very true. Of course, North Korea is bad for all but the very elite no matter the religion.

 

[Oreo Cookie]

I like Tim Tebow. From all that I've seen, he is a good person. He's grounded by his faith, and I have never taken that as being preachy. He knows who he is, and he walks in his truth. Good for him.

The beauty of our country is that you have the right to free speech and expression. We are all entitled to express our views and opinions.

As for his football career, one of the best college careers ever at QB. He's got great talent. His pro career is just starting, so it's way too early to tell.

 

[skater]

I like Tim Tebow. From all that I've seen, he is a good person. He's grounded by his faith, and I have never taken that as being preachy. He knows who he is, and he walks in his truth. Good for him.

The beauty of our country is that you have the right to free speech and expression. We are all entitled to express our views and opinions.

As for his football career, one of the best college careers ever at QB. He's got great talent. His pro career is just starting, so it's way too early to tell.

Well said.

 

[Uncle Remus]

Yep, it's really that bad. But we have it easy:

http://www.compassdirect.org/english/country/nigeria/article_123658.html

http://chinaview.wordpress.com/2007/09/04/report-3000-chinese-christians-killed-since-2000/

..... and Christianity is actual illegal in N. Korea.

Here in America it's not illegal, but we are looked at as ignorant and closed minded.

It's hard to not see some Christians as somewhat ill informed when they profess the belief that the earth is 4,000-5,000 years old. Course, I do understand all Christians don't share the same beliefs, it might be that the good book is quite contradictory.

 

[Kelsie]

I remember the same 'hype' over John Elway and I say....bring it on! Look what it got us with Elway!

I love Tebow and what he has done to revive the football frenzy in Denver! We haven't had this much excitement since Elway left.

 

[FireDancer]

It's hard to not see some Christians as somewhat ill informed when they profess the belief that the earth is 4,000-5,000 years old. Course, I do understand all Christians don't share the same beliefs, it might be that the good book is quite contradictory.

While I've heard of people on TV talk about man walking with dinosaurs and a flat Earth that is the center of the solar system I have never met anyone in real life that thought that way. I went to a private Catholic school for 1st through 8th grade and we learned about evolution, the bing bang, and the proper history of the world. We weren't taught that the bible was literal in every story, especially in the old testament. The bible is also not a single book, it is a collection of many books which themselves are only a subset of early Christian writings and teachings. Different books won't always have the exact same message. It is more a guide than a schematic in my opinion.

I think often people (not necessarily you Uncle Remus) forget that there is no single Christian doctrine. There are core concepts but even many of those aren't agreed upon. When people talk about Christians usually they take the most extreme like the Westboro church or people paying for the Prop 8 ads in California but that just isn't what many if not most Christians are about. I think it is like looking at every Muslim as an extremist who will stone a woman to death for being raped. While extremes exist in both religions, and the rest too I'm sure, they aren't really what should be used as an example of what the religion stands for as a whole.

It is when the extremists are used as an example for any religion that all of a sudden religion in general gets a bad rap or gets persecuted.

 

[skater]

It's hard to not see some Christians as somewhat ill informed when they profess the belief that the earth is 4,000-5,000 years old. Course, I do understand all Christians don't share the same beliefs, it might be that the good book is quite contradictory.

Respectfully, Uncle Remus, I'll disagree that the good book is contradictory. But that is a discussion for another forum . Too bad though - I truly love to discuss religious and philosophical issues .

 

[Uncle Remus]

While I've heard of people on TV talk about man walking with dinosaurs and a flat Earth that is the center of the solar system I have never met anyone in real life that thought that way. I went to a private Catholic school for 1st through 8th grade and we learned about evolution, the bing bang, and the proper history of the world. We weren't taught that the bible was literal in every story, especially in the old testament. The bible is also not a single book, it is a collection of many books which themselves are only a subset of early Christian writings and teachings. Different books won't always have the exact same message. It is more a guide than a schematic in my opinion.

I think often people (not necessarily you Uncle Remus) forget that there is no single Christian doctrine. There are core concepts but even many of those aren't agreed upon. When people talk about Christians usually they take the most extreme like the Westboro church or people paying for the Prop 8 ads in California but that just isn't what many if not most Christians are about. I think it is like looking at every Muslim as an extremist who will stone a woman to death for being raped. While extremes exist in both religions, and the rest too I'm sure, they aren't really what should be used as an example of what the religion stands for as a whole.

It is when the extremists are used as an example for any religion that all of a sudden religion in general gets a bad rap or gets persecuted.

Oh, I totally agree, but it would be more appropriate if the religious realized it's their own that are their worst enemies rather than those who profess no religion or have different beliefs. I'm always thankful for those who live the golden rule 'n actually mean it regardless of religion.

Respectfully, Uncle Remus, I'll disagree that the good book is contradictory. But that is a discussion for another forum . Too bad though - I truly love to discuss religious and philosophical issues .

And respectfully back at ya, skater, it's a contradictory book or maybe a trick to see how one uses it.

 

[skater]

Oh, I totally agree, but it would be more appropriate if the religious realized it's their own that are their worst enemies rather than those who profess no religion or have different beliefs. I'm always thankful for those who live the golden rule 'n actually mean it regardless of religion.




And respectfully back at ya, skater, it's a contradictory book or maybe a trick to see how one uses it.

But Uncle Remus, you could say that about any group. There are "bad eggs" in any group or sub-culture that make the rest of them look bad. If we could discuss religion further here, I would get into why the Bible is not a contradictory book (and I'm sure you could tell me why you believe it is ). We can agree to disagree though . I enjoy your posts a lot (even if I don't always agree with your pov), and I certainly don't want to make an "enemy" of you.

 

[bunkkinsmom]

It's hard to not see some Christians as somewhat ill informed when they profess the belief that the earth is 4,000-5,000 years old. Course, I do understand all Christians don't share the same beliefs, it might be that the good book is quite contradictory.

Why is my post quoted for this? Did I miss something? My quotes were regarding persecution?

Oh, I totally agree, but it would be more appropriate if the religious realized it's their own that are their worst enemies rather than those who profess no religion or have different beliefs. I'm always thankful for those who live the golden rule 'n actually mean it regardless of religion.




And respectfully back at ya, skater, it's a contradictory book or maybe a trick to see how one uses it.

Most Christians realize that the Westboro folks are radicals, and we know that they are our enemies!

For the rest, I'll try my best to take Skater's stance

 

[Uncle Remus]

Yep, it's really that bad. But we have it easy:

http://www.compassdirect.org/english/country/nigeria/article_123658.html

http://chinaview.wordpress.com/2007/09/04/report-3000-chinese-christians-killed-since-2000/

..... and Christianity is actual illegal in N. Korea.

Here in America it's not illegal, but we are looked at as ignorant and closed minded.

Why is my post quoted for this? Did I miss something? My quotes were regarding persecution?



Most Christians realize that the Westboro folks are radicals, and we know that they are our enemies!

For the rest, I'll try my best to take Skater's stance

I was addressin' the bolded above.

Yeah, I have to plead skater's response too coz we can't really discuss religion here.

 

[Goofyluver]

Has Tebow come out and say he was anti-gay marriage? He might have. While I do know the organization you speak of is that is only one of their stances on one of many issues. I am not a fan of that organization but there are organizations I support without being behind 100% of their message. It is kind of like politicians. I agree with none on every issue but find the one whom I agree with on the issues I think are most important. Of course that is getting harder and harder to find but that is topic for a different thread that isn't allowed anyway.

Playing Devil's advocate perhaps the gay marriage issue isn't a big deal either way to Tim but other issues that they support are.

I'm not inclined to care one way or another whether Tim is a supporter of equal rights or not since he specifically partnered with Focus on the Family. What's his excuse if he's a supporter of equality? Maybe the folks here on this thread who are touting him as a man of integrity can explain why someone like him partnered with a hate org?

And no, it's not comparable to supporting a politician at all.

Maybe you should choose the organizations you support more carefully.

Thank you, and I have several gay friends that also agree with you.

Again, what's a gay agenda?

 

[Buckalew11]

It's hard to not see some Christians as somewhat ill informed when they profess the belief that the earth is 4,000-5,000 years old. Course, I do understand all Christians don't share the same beliefs, it might be that the good book is quite contradictory.

6,000, I believe--not 4 or 5,000, is the number given by many. That comes from them counting back to Adam, I think.

Of course, before the beginning of the OT, who know how many years the earth was around. Maybe in another form. Or a prior form. Who knows, certainly not man.

It is all very interesting--too bad it is a banned topic.

 

[PeterPan09]

I don't have to agree with 100% of what other people do or say or believe in order to like them. I can find things to admire in people even when I disagree with them on core values. I have a lot of friends in my RL that I don't march in lockstep with, but that's fine. I respect that the journey their lives have taken may have led them to different conclusions than mine did. It's what makes the world interesting.

 

[FireDancer]

I'm not inclined to care one way or another whether Tim is a supporter of equal rights or not since he specifically partnered with Focus on the Family. What's his excuse if he's a supporter of equality? Maybe the folks here on this thread who are touting him as a man of integrity can explain why someone like him partnered with a hate org?

And no, it's not comparable to supporting a politician at all.

Maybe you should choose the organizations you support more carefully.

I know some people who support Focus on the Family but don't agree with their stance on gay marriage. They just like their stance on other issues and think those are more important on the balance. I don't really care for them personally but whatever.

The reason I make the political comparison is that I am completely for equal rights and if it was on the ballot I would vote for same sex marriage to be legal in any state I live in but I have voted for politicians that were opposed to it before. It wasn't because I agreed with their stance on that issue but because I agreed with their stance on other issues that superseded it. It would be unfair to claim that everyone that votes for a candidate is voting for every stance they take and I think it is unfair to do the same with an organization.

Look at all the furor over Target endorsing a candidate that was against same-sex marriage. People wanted to boycott and picket but nothing I saw indicated that that issue was why they contributed to him. His stance was better for business and publicly traded companies make their political contributions based on business issues, not social issues.

I don't know Tebow and I rarely even watch the NFL but I won't personally attribute his affiliation with FotF as his supporting every single one of their agendas. I don't think every person that is in or supports the boy scouts agrees with their stance on homosexuality but they find that the good they do outweighs it.

Just my opinion of course, I'm not trying to change any minds.

I don't have to agree with 100% of what other people do or say or believe in order to like them. I can find things to admire in people even when I disagree with them on core values. I have a lot of friends in my RL that I don't march in lockstep with, but that's fine. I respect that the journey their lives have taken may have led them to different conclusions than mine did. It's what makes the world interesting.

Same with me. I have friends who I don't agree with politically but we are still friends. I guess I am just saying the same goes for an organization. You don't have to agree with 100% of their views to support them if on the balance you agree with more than you don't. I am just giving Tebow the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Uncle Remus]

6,000, I believe--not 4 or 5,000, is the number given by many. That comes from them counting back to Adam, I think.

Of course, before the beginning of the OT, who know how many years the earth was around. Maybe in another form. Or a prior form. Who knows, certainly not man.

It is all very interesting--too bad it is a banned topic.

Geology is a banned topic?!

just teasin' ya, Brenda.