Ticked off *vent*

[Coconut36]

He has gone about it in a selfish and patriarchal way. Why is that ok?

Are Minkys feelings and needs that unimportant to him? How would you feel if your husband did that to you? I'm guessing, not great.

Are his needs that unimportant to her? Do his feelings mean nothing. If it was a woman saying "no dog" would you say it was selfish and patriarchal? It's not patriarchal to not want something your spouse wants. In my cause I deliberately left the genders vague but it's MOM who doesn't want a dog and has shut down the possibility of a pet and my Dad who longs for another dog. However my Dad realizes that my Mom would bear the burden of pet care at this point (she is retired) and that they both have to be ready and committed for the pet to have a quality life. He hangs out with my pets whenever possible and finds other ways to enjoy animals in the meantime.

This isn't a new sofa..it's committing to bringing a new life into a home and if someone does not feel they are emotionally ready or have the time to meet those demands the RIGHT thing to do is say no. I know you seem to feel the rights to a dog somehow trump his feelings but I just can't understand why..especially when one can find other ways to enjoy time with animals where a spouse can not escape the emotions or stress associated with bringing a dog they didn't want into the home. Animals are WORK..they require time and effort and the OP DH is not up for that at this time. If they both worked it would indeed be different because the burden wouldn't be on him..but this burden WOULD be on him and that gives his feelings greater weight.

I feel for both of them..it's hard to have opposing feelings on something like this but as someone who worked in shelters the person who does not want the pet should ALWAYS win..this is a life and a serious commitment..if they are not ready or capable of dealing with it then it should not be done. No animal deserves to live in a home where their presences is resented and makes someone unhappy..that's cruel. No spouse should want to push something on their SO because it suits their needs knowing full well it will cause misery for them (not that Minky wants to do this at all..just going back to your continual point that her needs trump his needs). Someone who longs for a pet can find other ways to fulfill their needs temporarily..someone who does not want a pet in the home can not escape the burden of having a pet they don't want in the home.

 

[Nancyg56]

Yes, you're right. At least you read what I wrote. And didn't insult, like the poster above you.

I think that once you start insulting each other there is nothing left to be gained from the discussion. I am sorry it happened.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

Are his needs that unimportant to her? Do his feelings mean nothing. If it was a woman saying "no dog" would you say it was selfish and patriarchal? It's not patriarchal to not want something your spouse wants. In my cause I deliberately left the genders vague but it's MOM who doesn't want a dog and has shut down the possibility of a pet and my Dad who longs for another dog. However my Dad realizes that my Mom would bear the burden of pet care at this point (she is retired) and that they both have to be ready and committed for the pet to have a quality life. He hangs out with my pets whenever possible and finds other ways to enjoy animals in the meantime.

This isn't a new sofa..it's committing to bringing a new life into a home and if someone does not feel they are emotionally ready or have the time to meet those demands the RIGHT thing to do is say no. I know you seem to feel the rights to a dog somehow trump his feelings but I just can't understand why..especially when one can find other ways to enjoy time with animals where a spouse can not escape the emotions or stress associated with bringing a dog they didn't want into the home. Animals are WORK..they require time and effort and the OP DH is not up for that at this time. If they both worked it would indeed be different because the burden wouldn't be on him..but this burden WOULD be on him and that gives his feelings greater weight.

I feel for both of them..it's hard to have opposing feelings on something like this but as someone who worked in shelters the person who does not want the pet should ALWAYS win..this is a life and a serious commitment..if they are not ready or capable of dealing with it then it should not be done. No animal deserves to live in a home where their presences is resented and makes someone unhappy..that's cruel. No spouse should want to push something on their SO because it suits their needs knowing full well it will cause misery for them (not that Minky wants to do this at all..just going back to your continual point that her needs trump his needs). Someone who longs for a pet can find other ways to fulfill their needs temporarily..someone who does not want a pet in the home can not escape the burden of having a pet they don't want in the home.

You have completely misconstrued what I said.

 

[chicagodisneyfan]

I think I take your husband's side. He finally got rid of the dog, he finally got rid of his severely disabled son - he deserves some peace and quiet along with a time with no responsibilities.

You know the stress Christian put on your household and your other children. Give your husband some space to be selfish after so many years of giving and giving and giving.

 

[Nancyg56]

I think I take your husband's side. He finally got rid of the dog, he finally got rid of his severely disabled son - he deserves some peace and quiet along with a time with no responsibilities.

You know the stress Christian put on your household and your other children. Give your husband some space to be selfish after so many years of giving and giving and giving.

Is this really what you meant to say??

 

[Coconut36]

You have completely misconstrued what I said.

How did I do that?

 

[I loveStitchnippyjon]

I think I take your husband's side. He finally got rid of the dog, he finally got rid of his severely disabled son - he deserves some peace and quiet along with a time with no responsibilities.

You know the stress Christian put on your household and your other children. Give your husband some space to be selfish after so many years of giving and giving and giving.

Are you serious?!! You make it sound like the dog and HIS SON were such an inconvenience in his life that he needs "peace and quiet"?! I sure hope you are trying to be sarcastic, otherwise, I have no words for you.....

 

[cabanafrau]

Yes, you're right. At least you read what I wrote. And didn't insult, like the poster above you.

Idiocy, huh? Umm, ok. So that's what it breaks down to if someone's opinion differs from yours, cabanafrau? Dont pretend you couldn't have found another way to phrase that.

I apologize if you felt that was an insult to you, that was not my intention. I do however feel the advice was idiotic.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I apologize if you felt that was an insult to you, that was not my intention. I do however feel the advice was idiotic.

So you, who IIR works in human services, are going to deny that Minky's spiritual needs are not important in the marriage?

It is idiotic to suggest that a disagreement as deep as this one might bring a couple to a crossroads?

As a capable adult, SHE gets to make that decision for herself. If it comes to a crossroads in her marriage, then she'll have to deal with that. But wanting a dog and being told she can't have one will also put her at a crossroads. Perhaps this is a bigger sign of issues between them. But regardless, it's not ok for one person to squash the other's needs and desires.

I don't think it's a good idea to bring a dog into a home where it's not welcomed by everyone. What I am objecting to is one person making that decision for the whole household when another, fully equal member wants one, without any discussion at all. I would want to see Minky's DH want it for her, out of love and concern for her. It's possible that isn't within his capability, and perhaps understandably so where they've had so many really, really difficult years. But where does that leave Minky? Sad, angry, depressed, resentful, isolated, etc. Is that really in her best interest?

If you think this "advice" is idiotic, that's fine. I stand by everything I wrote.

 

[SaraJayne]

He has gone about it in a selfish and patriarchal way. Why is that ok?

Are Minkys feelings and needs that unimportant to him? How would you feel if your husband did that to you? I'm guessing, not great.

My DH did "do that to me" when I wanted a dog many years ago. And you know what? He was 100% absolutely right.

I was furious and pouted for about a day (and had the same indignant reaction as some other posters about how DARE he tell me no, his feelings aren't more important than mine, etc, etc etc), realized he was right, told him that and we moved on.

 

[SaraJayne]

So you, who IIR works in human services, are going to deny that Minky's spiritual needs are not important in the marriage?

It is idiotic to suggest that a disagreement as deep as this one might bring a couple to a crossroads?


If you think this "advice" is idiotic, that's fine. I stand by everything I wrote.

She can fulfill her "spiritual" need in lots of other ways that doesn't depend on her having a dog in THEIR house.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

She can fulfill her "spiritual" need in lots of other ways that doesn't depend on her having a dog in THEIR house.

You get to decide that for her, do you?

This is a vent...there is no one else that I can express myself to. So please don't be snarky. Everyone has a right to their feelings and these are mine...

I have been thinking about getting another dog. My beloved Minky died last year at age 11. He was a Standard Poodle, smart as a whip, and just about the best dog I have ever known. I miss him terribly. But now I'm ready to love a new dog. DH, however, does not. When the subject comes up, he shuts me down. No discussion. I have no say in the matter. I realize that if he really is against having a pet that I probably just have to honor that. Sort of like having children. He doesn't want the responsibility, doesn't want the issue of what to do with the dog when we travel. And it's not like we travel all the time. We take the camper up to the lake or up to the mountains about once a month. Dogs are welcome at both places and we used to take Minky with us. So I don't really get the problem with taking a new dog. But DH has said no and that's the last word on it.

I feel diminished. At the moment I am so mad I don't even want to talk to him. It feels unfair. Although maybe it's unfair to him for me to get a dog he doesn't want. I'm not talking about getting a dog RIGHT NOW. I'm thinking in a few months, when we can better afford it. Poodles have to be groomed. They need good food, and of course, there are vet bills. And God forgive me, I'm mad because I'm the one who is working. DH is on disability. And I feel bad for being mad at him. But I have a part-time job and I'm fixing to start a second one that I can work part-time from home.

Erg. My heart is hurting right now. Maybe I can bring it up with DH tomorrow, but right now I don't even want to look at him.

 

[SaraJayne]

You get to decide that for her, do you?

No, just like you don't get to decide for her the ONLY way she can fulfill her "spiritual" need is by having a dog in their house her DH absolutely does not want.

I've been where Minky is and it put a lot of strain on our marriage at the time. Did I want to have a dog that only I wanted and my DH would resent for the rest of our marriage or did I want to respect my husband's strong feelings about not having a dog? Since he rarely tells me no over anything, I decided my marriage was more important than a dog and let it go.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

No, just like you don't get to decide for her the ONLY way she can fulfill her "spiritual" need is by having a dog in their house her DH absolutely does not want.

I've been where Minky is and it put a lot of strain on our marriage at the time. Did I want to have a dog that only I wanted and my DH would resent for the rest of our marriage or did I want to respect my husband's strong feelings about not having a dog? Since he rarely tells me no over anything, I decided my marriage was more important than a dog and let it go.

Minky herself is the one who says she wants a dog. She has her reasons, and they're important ones to her. She gets to decide her own spiritual needs. If she chooses to let them go, that's for her to decide. But even if she does, it doesn't mean they're going to go away. Deep needs don't just go away because someone else says so. Maybe a dog wasn't as important to you as it is to her.

 

[SaraJayne]

Minky herself is the one who says she wants a dog. She has her reasons, and they're important ones to her. She gets to decide her own spiritual needs. If she chooses to let them go, that's for her to decide. But even if she does, it doesn't mean they're going to go away. Deep needs don't just go away because someone else says so. Maybe a dog wasn't as important to you as it is to her.

You're correct. Being happily married was more important to me.

Minky has said numerous times over the last year how overwhelmed, stressed and exhausted she is, due to many, many issues.

It's time for her and her DH to take some time and focus on themselves.

 

[phorsenuf]

You're correct. Being happily married was more important to me.

Minky has said numerous times over the last year how overwhelmed, stressed and exhausted she is, due to many, many issues.

It's time for her and her DH to take some time and focus on themselves.

Very wise words!

 

[Pea-n-Me]

You're correct. Being happily married was more important to me.

Minky has said numerous times over the last year how overwhelmed, stressed and exhausted she is, due to many, many issues.

It's time for her and her DH to take some time and focus on themselves.

As a grown, working, capable woman, this is for her to decide.

 

[cabanafrau]

So you, who IIR works in human services, are going to deny that Minky's spiritual needs are not important in the marriage?

It is idiotic to suggest that a disagreement as deep as this one might bring a couple to a crossroads?


If you think this "advice" is idiotic, that's fine. I stand by everything I wrote.

I did not say her "spiritual needs" are not important in the marriage. I do not recall anyone but you stating this was a spiritual need of hers. I do not recall anyone but you suggesting this issue was deep enough to bring anyone to a crossroads.

There are many ways this situation can be worked out. Get a dog, don't get a dog, wait until both are ready for another dog(hypothetically assuming they both will be), don't get a dog after waiting(hypothetically assuming OP adjusts to a new lifestyle & realizes she doesn't need another dog so both agree not to get a dog) .

I do think it's idiotic to suggest to two people trying to adjust to some rapid, major changes in their lives that OP get a dog, come hell or high water, because she needs one. My guess is she needs her DH more. I really think it's reckless to suggest that's the solution when I'm not convinced she's certain another dog is going to be the answer she's looking for.

It seems harsh he won't discuss it, but I have no idea of knowing what's behind that. First and foremost, he's male. IME they are not the best communicators in ideal situations as a rule. He's been through what OP has the past several months/years. Perhaps he's trying to hold a stiff upper lip to keep himself together & cannot face the emotional aspect of another dog. He may not be emotionally capable to even have the discussion right now, and if so probably cannot/will not express that either.

This sounds like a loving family. I bet the dog meant something to him too, despite OP having the tightest bond w/ the dog. I bet he's missing his son terribly, even though he's probably happy to know he has a home where he's lovingly cared for. Heck, my oldest left for college last week. We're proud of her. We're happy for her. It's a great opportunity for her. We're a little sad too.

It's a marriage. Where's the harm in taking some time to be able to work out the best way for both of them to move forward -- together? I think it's preposterous to suggest the OP cannot survive without a dog. The smart plan is finding a way for everybody to get their needs met. Unless it's life or death, only toddlers and teenagers go through life demanding immediate satisfaction.

I do not work in Human Services. I work heavily with them quite often through the court system, so I don't know if that's who you're recalling or not.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I did not say her "spiritual needs" are not important in the marriage. I do not recall anyone but you stating this was a spiritual need of hers. I do not recall anyone but you suggesting this issue was deep enough to bring anyone to a crossroads.

Just because I'm the only one that addressed them doesn't mean they don't exist. Spiritual needs are extremely important to one's well being. As a nurse, Minky knows this.

There are many ways this situation can be worked out. Get a dog, don't get a dog, wait until both are ready for another dog(hypothetically assuming they both will be), don't get a dog after waiting(hypothetically assuming OP adjusts to a new lifestyle & realizes she doesn't need another dog so both agree not to get a dog) .

As I have suggested since my first post on this thread. A compromise.

I do think it's idiotic to suggest to two people trying to adjust to some rapid, major changes in their lives that OP get a dog, come hell or high water, because she needs one. My guess is she needs her DH more. I really think it's reckless to suggest that's the solution when I'm not convinced she's certain another dog is going to be the answer she's looking for.

Your opinions re my posts have been similarly rigid to this one. As such, they are the ones that have been ridiculous. I have said that I hope the DH comes around for the sake and love of his wife. Nowhere have I said that come hell or high water she should get a dog. I am concerned for the DH as well as I am for Minky and for any dog brought into the household. You have attributed ridiculous notions to me like the drinking spiel and that I'm proposing they end their marriage or whatever. Not what I said.

It seems harsh he won't discuss it, but I have no idea of knowing what's behind that. First and foremost, he's male. IME they are not the best communicators in ideal situations as a rule. He's been through what OP has the past several months/years. Perhaps he's trying to hold a stiff upper lip to keep himself together & cannot face the emotional aspect of another dog. He may not be emotionally capable to even have the discussion right now, and if so probably cannot/will not express that either.

This sounds like a loving family. I bet the dog meant something to him too, despite OP having the tightest bond w/ the dog. I bet he's missing his son terribly, even though he's probably happy to know he has a home where he's lovingly cared for. Heck, my oldest left for college last week. We're proud of her. We're happy for her. It's a great opportunity for her. We're a little sad too.

It's a marriage. Where's the harm in taking some time to be able to work out the best way for both of them to move forward -- together? I think it's preposterous to suggest the OP cannot survive without a dog. The smart plan is finding a way for everybody to get their needs met. Unless it's life or death, only toddlers and teenagers go through life demanding immediate satisfaction.

I do not work in Human Services. I work heavily with them quite often through the court system, so I don't know if that's who you're recalling or not.

Yeah, all things I've said I'm aware of.

As to not surviving without a dog? Well of course one can survive without a dog. The question is, would one want to?

Dogs are not our whole life,
but they make our lives whole.
-Roger Caras

To each his own. Minky will let us know where she winds up with this.

 

[Andtototoo]

It seems harsh he won't discuss it, but I have no idea of knowing what's behind that. First and foremost, he's male. IME they are not the best communicators in ideal situations as a rule. He's been through what OP has the past several months/years. Perhaps he's trying to hold a stiff upper lip to keep himself together & cannot face the emotional aspect of another dog. He may not be emotionally capable to even have the discussion right now, and if so probably cannot/will not express that either.

Another pov:
For me, I am a good communicator and have no trouble telling people when I am angry and for what reason. However, I've encountered some situations with people who push me too far by repeatedly returning to the same argument and I feel badgered and as if the person is trying to browbeat me into surrender. At that point, a line gets crossed and I go silent as my way of controlling myself. I can talk, but I choose not to because I do not want to give ultimatums or make comments I might regret later. Sometimes I'm ready to talk again in a few minutes, sometimes a few days, sometimes it takes weeks.

But one truth is the more someone pushes me, the less likely they are to get what they want from me because the repeated pushiness indicates to me that they don't give a flying fig about my needs, only their own and that they're willing to try to browbeat me into compliance. Doesn't work with me.