This just really annoys me!

[jenny13]

On the first bolded part: Wow! I can't imagine how much more data you would want. I assume the same research done by doctors like McDougall, Ornish, Benard, etc aren't enough to convince you either?

On the second bolded part: I am forever thankful to drug companies. I am so glad we have medications for bacterial infections and pain management. I am happy we have vaccinations to prevent some horrible diseases. I am even thankful that they have medications that will reduce things like cholesterol and BP. I truly am. However, those medications DO NOT CURE THE DISEASE. All they do is placate the person until the ticking time bomb inside of them erupts.

On the third bolded part: I agree that 100% of the cases are not reversible. All of those doctors mentioned above would say the same thing. However, the percentage that can't be reversed is minuscule. But in true Dis board fashion, those people that can't get complete reversal happen to all post here on the Dis!

Finally, I agree, it is time for me to say we will have to agree to disagree. I won't post anymore on these doctors or reversing anything. The information is out there for those that want it.

The problem is most of the people here don't want to hear the truth. There is so much information available to help people. If they were to look up information then they wouldn't be able to use the excuses...it's genetic, it doesn't work for me, etc. That's a big problem that I see with patients on a daily basis. The patients that claim they've been following their diet yet nothing is improving. Then my dh ends up seeing them in the hospital after they've had a medical problem. Those same patients that claim they are following the diet my dh provides them and not losing any weight all of a sudden lose weight in the hospital on the same diet plan while laying in bed doing absolutely nothing.

People like to have excuses for why they can't do something, rather than try. I've had patients say they don't have time to exercise, or they aren't able to because it takes too much out of them. I say make time to exercise. For the ones that say they can't, start out just walking daily. Any little bit helps.

I don't see anyone here willing to listen to suggestions and they aren't going to change their minds. It's easier for them to say I can't because......


Sorry had to edit: I don't mean everyone here isn't willing to listen. I'm referring to the ones that are making excuses. Others here are working on getting healthy and to them I say great job, keep up the good work.

 

[jemmouse]

Happy St.Patricks Day everyone. Agree to disagree. I am overweight, am dieting, because I want to be healthier for ME! plus my extra weight is constantly felt on my knees. I am 39' yikes, and want to start my 40's with 50 less pounds. That would make me feel better mentally and physically. So wish me luck

Right now I am watching my 2011 Disney DVD with my son and enjoying life. I can't change overnight but I can change one day at a time. And today was a good one. Gotta love brown rice and chicken....

 

[AustinTink]

Marilyn Monroe was a 14 wasn't she? Then we went through the Twiggy era. The "in" look changes often. But it has no bearing on what makes a woman "real".

I guess very often the word "real" is substituted incorrectly for the word "majority"?

With today's vanity sizing, Marilyn would be a 10 at the most.

 

[jenny13]

With today's vanity sizing, Marilyn would be a 10 at the most.

Actually all of the information online says she was a size 8. Which by todays standards would indeed be smaller, maybe 4 or 6.

 

[princessmom29]

The problem is most of the people here don't want to hear the truth. There is so much information available to help people. If they were to look up information then they wouldn't be able to use the excuses...it's genetic, it doesn't work for me, etc. That's a big problem that I see with patients on a daily basis. The patients that claim they've been following their diet yet nothing is improving. Then my dh ends up seeing them in the hospital after they've had a medical problem. Those same patients that claim they are following the diet my dh provides them and not losing any weight all of a sudden lose weight in the hospital on the same diet plan while laying in bed doing absolutely nothing.

People like to have excuses for why they can't do something, rather than try. I've had patients say they don't have time to exercise, or they aren't able to because it takes too much out of them. I say make time to exercise. For the ones that say they can't, start out just walking daily. Any little bit helps.

I don't see anyone here willing to listen to suggestions and they aren't going to change their minds. It's easier for them to say I can't because......


Sorry had to edit: I don't mean everyone here isn't willing to listen. I'm referring to the ones that are making excuses. Others here are working on getting healthy and to them I say great job, keep up the good work.

No, the problem is that you want people to buy wholesale in to your version of " the truth" and cannot accept that what works for you does not work for everyone. There is no magic formula that will "fix" everyone if they just work hard enough and follow the diet. If there was we would not have the issues we have. Not everyone's body works that way. It is not as cut and dried as you are painting it.

 

[Planogirl]

No, the problem is that you want people to buy wholesale in to your version of " the truth" and cannot accept that what works for you does not work for everyone. There is no magic formula that will "fix" everyone if they just work hard enough and follow the diet. If there was we would not have the issues we have. Not everyone's body works that way. It is not as cut and dried as you are painting it.

It might be more fair to say that some are making excuses. I agree that not everyone can do the same thing to get the same results. I do believe that many could do more though. I know that I could particularly when it comes to exercise.

 

[disfan07]

Never once said PCOS can be reversed. Never. What I said is no one will die from PCOS. They will die from the complications like diabetes, high BP, etc. Those are the things I am talking about reversing.





Have you read the book? This isn't some quack. This is a doctor on the board at the Cleveland Clinic. It is as solid of science as you can get. He was given the worst patients the clinic had and the least amount of money for his grant because nobody believed in him. He has studied these same patients for 30 + years not a few weeks. What would the harm be in reading the book? It includes pictures of their arteries when he first took them on as patients and how they look after changing their lifestyle. There isn't any Kool Aid involved. He isn't waving a magic wand or doing some voodoo ritual. It is common sense. The only Kool Aid is in the form of Big Pharmaceutical.

I don't care how "solid" the science is or who the doctor is, nothing works for everyone. I am living proof of that. My case refutes "solid" studies done on eczema, asthma, IST, allergies, pineal cysts, etc. All of the studies that have said this or that should have worked....it didnt. My doctors had to get creative and we are using treatments that are extreme or only been tried in case studies. NO TWO people are the same. Eveyrone's bodies work differently. Just because it worked on the "worst" patients, doesn't mean it will work on everyone. Someone's condition might not be as severe but their body might respond differently. Severity is not the only thing to consider. There are so many other factors which is why you can't say that just because it worked for one person it will work for someone else. It doesn't work that way.

 

[luvsJack]

why are some of you so dead set against believing what these posters are telling you?

I mean, I certainly hope that the posters saying it didn't help are still eating healthy foods and are still exercising regularly; but they ought to know what is going on with their own bodies, don't cha think?

 

[disfan07]

Who says these conditions can not always be reversed? Pharmaceutical companies? Doctors that are tied in with them?

Have you read what Dr. Esselstyn did with the worst of the worst patients? The patients that were all sent home by their cardiologists and were told that there was absolutely nothing else that they could do for them. It is a fascinating read but maybe it is just me.

Not everything can be reversed. And phramaceutical companies are not evil. My asthma and IST would have killed me by now if it wasn't for my medications. No amount of exercise or weight loss is going to change that. I will be on my asthma meds for the rest of my life and if my IST doesn't resolve itself in the next 5 years, I will be getting a pacemaker. Nothing besides medication will help my asthma, IST, PCOS, Endo or Eczema. It's not possible. We've tried. I weigh 135lbs, size 8 and I am at the gym 4 times a week and EVERYTHING is getting worse...not better. So no, losing weight and exercise is not a magic pill either.

 

[kwelch10377]

why are some of you so dead set against believing what these posters are telling you?

I mean, I certainly hope that the posters saying it didn't help are still eating healthy foods and are still exercising regularly; but they ought to know what is going on with their own bodies, don't cha think?

I have been trying to figure out the same thing.

I wish people #1 wouldn't look at everything so black and white and #2 understand everyone isn't alike and people don't react the same to things both physically and mentally.

 

[jenny13]

Not everything can be reversed. And phramaceutical companies are not evil. My asthma and IST would have killed me by now if it wasn't for my medications. No amount of exercise or weight loss is going to change that. I will be on my asthma meds for the rest of my life and if my IST doesn't resolve itself in the next 5 years, I will be getting a pacemaker. Nothing besides medication will help my asthma, IST, PCOS, Endo or Eczema. It's not possible. We've tried. I weigh 135lbs, size 8 and I am at the gym 4 times a week and EVERYTHING is getting worse...not better. So no, losing weight and exercise is not a magic pill either.

Your right everything can't be reversed, but that's no excuse for anyone being overweight which is what was being discussed. Do you think your the only person that suffers from asthma? Do you think everyone uses oh I have asthma as an excuse? No one ever said anything was a magic pill only that it helps. Do you believe your asthma or IST would be the same if you were 200lbs? It would obviously be much worse.

As for the IST, how are you even at the gym 4 days a week? If it's as bad as you claim it is you wouldn't be able to follow that type of exercise routine.

Many people here probably don't know what IST is, so basically it means your resting heart beat is greater than 100. It increases with any exercise, to the point of being dangerous. It's not something that someone exercises 4 days a week with.

 

[jenny13]

why are some of you so dead set against believing what these posters are telling you?

I mean, I certainly hope that the posters saying it didn't help are still eating healthy foods and are still exercising regularly; but they ought to know what is going on with their own bodies, don't cha think?

I think the main reason is because they are trying to say that exercise and diet don't help.

I've seen way to many patients claiming the same things and things don't end well for them. People need to stop making excuses and start doing things to take care of their health.

 

[luvsJack]

I have been trying to figure out the same thing.

I wish people #1 wouldn't look at everything so black and white and #2 understand everyone isn't alike and people don't react the same to things both physically and mentally.

Exactly!

I haven't read the books that the pp was talking about but I know there are doctors that have done amazing things with patients having all types of disease and disorders. Does that mean that they would have the same results with ALL patients with those diseases and disorders? No, of course it doesn't and those doctors would be the first ones to tell you that.

My aunt is forever giving my mom some book that says Dr. XXX says do xxxx and you will be cured of old age. Usually the thing it tells them to do is beneficial but it doesn't give this miracle cure that makes old age go away. (using old age as a silly example here).

I am not a medical professional of any kind, but I sort of always thought that IF being overweight is CAUSING high blood pressure and diabeties, for instance, then losing weight would reverse them. But if these things were being caused by something else then, while losing weight would help, it would not make it away.

I am in no way saying that someone should just give up and remain overweight. Nor am I saying they should just stop eating healthy and exercising. But that it stands to reason that with every person on this planet being an individual with individual reactions to different things that not everyone is going to suddenly be cured of everything because they lose a few pounds.

 

[luvsJack]

I think the main reason is because they are trying to say that exercise and diet don't help.

I've seen way to many patients claiming the same things and things don't end well for them. People need to stop making excuses and start doing things to take care of their health.

Ok, maybe I need to go back and re-read. Did she say that she wasn't going to lose weight (heck, at this point I am not even sure she is overweight)?

If she is saying it doesn't help HER then maybe it doesn't help HER. That doesn't mean it doesn't help others. And why are you so flippin' sure it DOES help her? Again, don't you think she shoud know what is going on with her own body?

I don't know that saying "losing weight is not helping my bp" is the same thing as saying "I am not going to lose weight because its not helping my bp".

I love it when someone that isn't overweight looks at those who are and says things like "stop making excuses". It really is not helpful to the overweight person. And everytime an overweight person says "I can't go to the gym because of xxxx" its not necessarily an excuse, sometimes it really is a reason.

 

[kwelch10377]

I think the main reason is because they are trying to say that exercise and diet don't help.

I've seen way to many patients claiming the same things and things don't end well for them. People need to stop making excuses and start doing things to take care of their health.

Unless you are their doctor and have access to their medical history and are with them on a daily basis to see what their lifestyle is like then I don't think you are in a position to say that they are just making and excuses and not doing what they are saying they are doing.

With the bolded part you basically sound as if you are saying that a patient is lying that they are dieting and exercising if they end up dying from a weight related condition. I'm not sure if that is what you mean to say, but that is how you are coming off.

 

[jenny13]

Unless you are their doctor and have access to their medical history and are with them on a daily basis to see what their lifestyle is like then I don't think you are in a position to say that they are just making and excuses and not doing what they are saying they are doing.

With the bolded part you basically sound as if you are saying that a patient is lying that they are dieting and exercising if they end up dying from a weight related condition. I'm not sure if that is what you mean to say, but that is how you are coming off.

That is exactly what I'm saying. Patients that say they are following a diet and not losing anything. Then they end up int the the hospital and are following the diet and lose weight while laying in bed doing nothing.

Many people here are making excuses for why things won't help them.

 

[jenny13]

Ok, maybe I need to go back and re-read. Did she say that she wasn't going to lose weight (heck, at this point I am not even sure she is overweight)?

If she is saying it doesn't help HER then maybe it doesn't help HER. That doesn't mean it doesn't help others. And why are you so flippin' sure it DOES help her? Again, don't you think she shoud know what is going on with her own body?

I don't know that saying "losing weight is not helping my bp" is the same thing as saying "I am not going to lose weight because its not helping my bp".

I love it when someone that isn't overweight looks at those who are and says things like "stop making excuses". It really is not helpful to the overweight person. And everytime an overweight person says "I can't go to the gym because of xxxx" its not necessarily an excuse, sometimes it really is a reason.

Eating right and exercising are always a benefit to the body. It is only going to have a positive affect on the body. Yes it's not going to cure all ailments but it does help.

FYI I've dealt with my share of weight struggles. I was up to almost 200lbs at one point so I have personal experience. Your assuming that I don't understand how hard it and your wrong

 

[princessmom29]

Your right everything can't be reversed, but that's no excuse for anyone being overweight which is what was being discussed. Do you think your the only person that suffers from asthma? Do you think everyone uses oh I have asthma as an excuse? No one ever said anything was a magic pill only that it helps. Do you believe your asthma or IST would be the same if you were 200lbs? It would obviously be much worse.

As for the IST, how are you even at the gym 4 days a week? If it's as bad as you claim it is you wouldn't be able to follow that type of exercise routine.

Many people here probably don't know what IST is, so basically it means your resting heart beat is greater than 100. It increases with any exercise, to the point of being dangerous. It's not something that someone exercises 4 days a week with.

There are several documented medical conditions that lead to weight gain you can do NOTHING about. Organ tansplant and the resulting medications is one of the most readily recognizable. I know a 16 year old that was transplanted 3 weeks ago, has gained 35 lbs and been told by his doctor that he will likely keep it as long as he is on immunosuppressants combined with steriods. I had a hormone cascade when I had my DD ,the effects of which still sabatoge weight loss efforrts and mess with my basal metibolic rate. Couple that with several injuries that make it difficult to exercise, and you have a recipe for disaster. Sometimes I literally consume less than 500 calories per day, exercise for an hour, and still put on weight.

I think the main reason is because they are trying to say that exercise and diet don't help.

I've seen way to many patients claiming the same things and things don't end well for them. People need to stop making excuses and start doing things to take care of their health.

I don't see anyone saying diet and exercise don't help. Can you point me to where someone says that??? What I am saying is that diet and exercise cannot magically fix everything for everyone all the time.

 

[kwelch10377]

That is exactly what I'm saying. Patients that say they are following a diet and not losing anything. Then they end up int the the hospital and are following the diet and lose weight while laying in bed doing nothing.

Many people here are making excuses for why things won't help them.

Well I must say that I am glad I am not a patient of yours. As a patient I wouldn't think very highly of a practice that was going on a message board calling their patients liars. Maybe they think they are following the diet, but you just aren't doing your job effectively explaining it to them. My mother works at a heart and lung hospital and she has seen many cases where she knows for a fact that people are following the diets given and they still end up in the hospital.

I am not saying that there aren't people that don't makes excuses, I am just trying to say that everything isn't as black and white as you make it out to be and you can't judge whether or not someone is lying and making excuses just based on what you are reading on a message board.

 

[princessmom29]

Eating right and exercising are always a benefit to the body. It is only going to have a positive affect on the body. Yes it's not going to cure all ailments but it does help.

FYI I've dealt with my share of weight struggles. I was up to almost 200lbs at one point so I have personal experience. Your assuming that I don't understand how hard it and your wrong

yes, but did you have other factors keeping you from loosing that weight, or did diet and exercise do it for you? If you haven't been through doing all the right things and NOT losing the weight, then you dfon't understand, and becuase you are saying over and over that diet and exercise works for EVERYONE no I don't think you get it.