The Vaccine Discussion Thread

[sabrecmc]

At some point, we need to let those who have made the foolish choice to deny science and refuse to get the vaccine deal with that consequence and not hold up a return to normalcy in this country any longer. Ship the vaccines to Canada and other countries who have the demand right now and stop fooling ourselves into thinking we can market the vaccine to those who will never change their mind on it, no matter what education we can attempt to provide on it.

I'm of the mind that once it is available for all ages (truly available, not just ostensibly available), then after people have had a chance to fully vaccinate themselves and their families, if they choose not to, that's fine. There are always people who don't get vaccinated. That's their choice, and they can take that risk, but as you said, the rest of the country shouldn't be held hostage to that choice anymore than we are if they choose not to get the MMR or flu vaccines. Some people are waiting for full FDA approval, which Fauci said last week would be happening soon. The time when everyone can get vaccinated is a bit away, but I think it is coming pretty fast. I hope so.

 

[mevelandry]

I wonder how effective it is with that long of a gap. My understanding is that with Pfizer vaccine the study topped out at 45 days between shots even though they recommend 21 days now. I don’t know of any research done beyond a 45 day window.

From what I understand, the protection reduces of a few % with time but it remains reasonable.

 

[anricat]

I'm of the mind that once it is available for all ages (truly available, not just ostensibly available), then after people have had a chance to fully vaccinate themselves and their families, if they choose not to, that's fine. There are always people who don't get vaccinated. That's their choice, and they can take that risk, but as you said, the rest of the country shouldn't be held hostage to that choice anymore than we are if they choose not to get the MMR or flu vaccines. Some people are waiting for full FDA approval, which Fauci said last week would be happening soon. The time when everyone can get vaccinated is a bit away, but I think it is coming pretty fast. I hope so.

The unfortunate part of this is that there are those among us who, for whatever reason get the vaccine and have zero immune response (basically it doesn't "take") or cannot for whatever reason. I actually have two friends with kiddos that fall into these categories. The former has a daughter who literally has no immune response. She got chicken pox after getting the vaccines and they tested her later for other titers (is that the right word?) and she had nothing from any of the vaccines they tested her for. She's medically fragile with some really rare genetic disease (like 5 people in the world have it or something crazy) and they've pretty much been barricaded in their home for the past year. Their whole family's life just sucks and I feel so badly for them. People NOT getting vaccinated cause them anxiety. My other friend's daughter has cancer and they've been recommended to not vaccinate during treatment. Now, I think it remains to be seen how that will pan out once the age groups roll down to her because I have two other (adult) friends currently undergoing cancer treatment and both of them were told to get their Covid vaccines (and did).

 

[sethschroeder]

But if I want to go to Europe, I’ll have to play by their rules.

At some point it will reopen. Good amount of tourism dollars out of the US and no central vaccine repository will likely ever exist.

If they don't change the policy at some point I guess domestic travel will be up then in the US which is good for lots of places.

 

[Sykes]

At some point it will reopen. Good amount of tourism dollars out of the US and no central vaccine repository will likely ever exist.

CDC cards will likely be accepted. I’m betting that there will just be a number of high-profile incidents where unvaccinated individuals presenting known-counterfeit vaccine credentials will be put in a foreign jail and that will discourage 99% of people from doing it.

Of course, there are also enough states willing to play ball that a company working with states to provide verified vaccine credentialing would probably be able to serve 80% of the US population, which is probably good enough for most countries seeking tourism dollars.

 

[sethschroeder]

CDC cards will likely be accepted. I’m betting that there will just be a number of high-profile incidents where unvaccinated individuals presenting known-counterfeit vaccine credentials will be put in a foreign jail and that will discourage 99% of people from doing it.

Of course, there are also enough states willing to play ball that a company working with states to provide verified vaccine credentialing would probably be able to serve 80% of the US population, which is probably good enough for most countries seeking tourism dollars.

There is little ability for those cards to be verified unless I am missing something.

In addition even the State of NY was originally planning on withholding personal identity from vaccine infromation to the CDC.

So maybe I missed something but don't think it's something that can really be tracked when it comes to the US except for certain states.

Also unless I completely misremeber the only identifiers would be name and DOB anyways as state IDs are not collected for vaccination.

 

[Sykes]

There is little ability for those cards to be verified unless I am missing something.
…
So maybe I missed something but don't think it's something that can really be tracked when it comes to the US except for certain states.

A third party can’t just download the database, but almost every state will provide you with verifiable proof of vaccination if you request it (and most states will provide it to a third party with your explicit authorization). It’s pretty important to be able to retrieve your own personal health records, and it’s pretty easy to send them along if it’s required to gain entry to another country.

As far as CDC cards go, it’ll be hard to validate them directly, but I’m betting that some of the counterfeit ones will look pretty similar (some vendor will get lazy and use the same lot number or the same sticker orientation or something), and it only takes a few stories to create a cautionary tale.

Every country is solely responsible for looking out for its own citizens. If the additional risk from unvaccinated individuals is low enough (or the tourism impact from those individuals is high enough) then they may choose to take that risk, but I suspect that will be the exception rather than the rule for a fair bit of time longer.

 

[hrhdhd]

There is little ability for those cards to be verified unless I am missing something.

In addition even the State of NY was originally planning on withholding personal identity from vaccine infromation to the CDC.

So maybe I missed something but don't think it's something that can really be tracked when it comes to the US except for certain states.

Also unless I completely misremeber the only identifiers would be name and DOB anyways as state IDs are not collected for vaccination.

I was vaccinated at a FEMA site, and my driver license was collected and swiped for info. My card has stickers with QR codes that I assume lead to some information (I haven't tried to scan them myself).

 

[kathi]

There is little ability for those cards to be verified unless I am missing something.

In addition even the State of NY was originally planning on withholding personal identity from vaccine infromation to the CDC.

So maybe I missed something but don't think it's something that can really be tracked when it comes to the US except for certain states.

Also unless I completely misremeber the only identifiers would be name and DOB anyways as state IDs are not collected for vaccination.

My ID was checked and double checked when I got both my first and second shot in NJ. My 16 year old daughter had to show her passport since she does not have a drivers license yet. NJ should clearly know who we are and when we received our shots.

 

[princessmommyx3]

I received my vaccine at Walgreens and they did not check my ID. My 16 year old got hers at a different Walgreens and they did not ask for her ID, but did ask for mine (she doesn't have her DL yet).

 

[Princess Merida]

I was also vaccinated at a Walgreens in Virginia and did not show ID.

 

[Maggie'sMom]

Pfizer filing for full FDA approval for ages 16+.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/meliss...vid-19-vaccine-by-end-of-may/?sh=2247e3c924c0
So if Pfizer gets full approval, and I see no reason why they wouldn't, then will the people citing the vaccine only having emergency use approval as their reason to not get vaccinated now get the vaccine? Or will they just pivot to a different excuse?

 

[sullivan.kscott]

I received my vaccine at Walgreens and they did not check my ID. My 16 year old got hers at a different Walgreens and they did not ask for her ID, but did ask for mine (she doesn't have her DL yet).

I was also vaccinated at a Walgreens in Virginia and did not show ID.

Question for both, as you're probably in different areas: do you otherwise use Walgreen's for prescriptions? I worked for them many moons ago as a tech through college, and they had a pretty robust computer system then. You should be able to walk in to any Walgreen's in the US and have your vaccine (or any Rx) status pulled up pretty quick.

 

[Maggie'sMom]

In regards to the question about prividing ID for the vaccine, both my daughter and I were vaccinated at a mass vaccination site set up by one of the major health systems in our area. Both of us were required to provide ID. DD doesn't have a drivers license, so we used her passport.

 

[Princess Merida]

Question for both, as you're probably in different areas: do you otherwise use Walgreen's for prescriptions? I worked for them many moons ago as a tech through college, and they had a pretty robust computer system then. You should be able to walk in to any Walgreen's in the US and have your vaccine (or any Rx) status pulled up pretty quick.

I do not use them now but I have in the past so I’m sure they do have all of my information in their system.

 

[sethschroeder]

I was vaccinated at a FEMA site

Likely a reason because the feds want info and the states don't want to provide it.

Question for both, as you're probably in different areas: do you otherwise use Walgreen's for prescriptions? I worked for them many moons ago as a tech through college, and they had a pretty robust computer system then. You should be able to walk in to any Walgreen's in the US and have your vaccine (or any Rx) status pulled up pretty quick.

In Wisconsin as an example its a requirement that IDs NOT be required.

"DHS strives to promote health equity in Wisconsin’s COVID-19 vaccination efforts which includes minimizing barriers that prevent individuals from accessing the vaccine. Both ID and health insurance requirements create barriers for many underserved communities and may deter individuals that lack a valid driver’s license or state ID card. "

"Typically when a vaccinator asks for proof of ID, they are using that documentation to confirm the appointment or match health records with the patient. However, we have again reaffirmed to all of Wisconsin’s 2,000 plus vaccinators that they cannot require ID or insurance "

https://www.dhs.wisconsin.gov/news/releases/041221.htm

 

[lanejudy]

No ID required here of the vaccine recipient.

They do require an ID from the parent bringing a minor for a vaccine, because the adult has to sign authorization for the minor and they need to verify the person is who they claim to be.

 

[Princess Merida]

Pfizer filing for full FDA approval for ages 16+.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/meliss...vid-19-vaccine-by-end-of-may/?sh=2247e3c924c0
So if Pfizer gets full approval, and I see no reason why they wouldn't, then will the people citing the vaccine only having emergency use approval as their reason to not get vaccinated now get the vaccine? Or will they just pivot to a different excuse?

I will likely wait a while for my children. This is just simply due to the fact that this disease is not typically dangerous for them and these shots are no joke. I have a very very large family and about 50% of them have been vaccinated. Of the 50% not vaccinated half of them have had covid same with the 50% that is vaccinated half of them also had it. This opinion is based on my families experiences alone and there are about 46 of us. I find that reading news articles about these shots maybe don’t cover everything. Also most of us had side effects or reactions but because most of them were not severe they were not reported to VAERS. I’m sure there are tons and tons of these cases. Our reactions ranged from just achiness and chills which is common to severe vertigo and even migraines with vomiting and allergic reactions. Some lasting weeks. In two cases the persons doctors recommended not getting the second shot. It really seemed that the younger the person the worse the reaction. Age ranges for my family that had shots are from 23 to 65. I will wait on real life experiences from people around me who have their children vaccinated and quite some time of data before my children get the shot. Several peoples reactions to the shot were worse than their Covid case. I don’t mean for any of this to increase vaccine hesitancy as I think the shot can save you if you are an adult. Having long term lung or other issues from a case of covid is a terrible fate. I’m just not ready to sign my kids up for this and likely won’t be for a long time unless there are changes to the dangers for children from covid or to the side effects from these shots.

 

[jerry557]

This is already a disaster in the making. There is no way to verify the status other than those CDC cards. If another country wants to accept that as enough proof, fine. But some countries may not when they realize how easily they are counterfeited.

This is something that should have been looked at and agreed on by everyone many months ago before they even gave out the vaccine. Now it’s too late. States are all doing their own thing or some nothing at all. Many places don’t even check a person’s ID. Because technically in most states you don’t need a photo ID to get essential medical care. If you don’t have ID, they will give you the vaccine.

Everyone keeps thinking the US govt will eventually keep a database because Canada and EU is. No they won’t. They can’t because states aren’t even giving the feds access to the data. The White House has said straight up that the federal government will not issue a vaccine credential. Period.

 

[sethschroeder]

This is something that should have been looked at and agreed on by everyone many months ago before they even gave out the vaccine.

Depends how you look at it many don't want a vaccine credential issued by the state/feds in any manner. Some of those individuals are pro-vaccine as well. In addition various states are against any centralized vaccine database for various reasons.

There was nothing to decide since various states would never opt in and states were not going to allow a 3rd party tracking to be required to give out vaccines.