The things we do for our spawn...

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

So you're just yanking my chain. But there is still a digital divide. And no, not ALL my former co-workers who had no internet at home were under 30. At least one was 68.

I said the majority of your coworkers which you've told us many times..just the last page you said:

Yes, most are under 30.

I'm not really yanking your chain, we're just not talking about public school districts. You brought up the prior coworkers with internet access with remote working. It would be hard to believe, unless due to financial reasons, someone in that age group, that you've told us many times is who comprised of your prior coworkers the most, wouldn't have internet. We know you like to tell us all sorts of stories about your prior coworkers it's hard to believe some of them could get dressed in the morning by your descriptions

 

[RangerPooh]

The no tv in the kids room. Ha! Our oldest would wake up in the middle of the night which meant we didn't sleep. So a tv airing Nick at Night and Nick Jr or Disney Jr in the morning was the solution. Kept her quiet until we got up. Also allowed us to get work done.

I'm not going to shop for my kids clothes at Walmart. When that's your budget or only shopping options in rural America, then that's where you shop.

I will not have every weekend booked with kids activities. lol
Scouts BSA for three or all four kids almost EVERY weekend. Some months it is every weekend. Not always close either. Nothing like driving 3-6 hours after work for an overnight cave/camping/canoe trip. Our oldest also does Colorguard/Winterguard, so we have had plenty of 1am, 2am, 4am return times from completions. Thankfully on some of those she'll drive herself home instead of us picking her up at an ungodly hour.

 

[tvguy]

I said the majority of your coworkers which you've told us many times..just the last page you said:


I'm not really yanking your chain, we're just not talking about public school districts. You brought up the prior coworkers with internet access with remote working. It would be hard to believe, unless due to financial reasons, someone in that age group, that you've told us many times is who comprised of your prior coworkers the most, wouldn't have internet. We know you like to tell us all sorts of stories about your prior coworkers it's hard to believe some of them could get dressed in the morning by your descriptions

Welcome to the real world.

 

[prestoncaldwell]

We still don't allow TV in bedrooms, including our own.

 

[belle032]

We don't have kids, but this thread is very enjoyable!

I have to give so much credit to all of you sports/theater/dance/etc parents out there, including mine. I was on the rowing team all 4 years of high school. And that meant traveling pretty much every Friday-Sunday to different states. Hours and hours away. There was no indoor seating or getting warm & dry or cooling down in the A/C. You were completely at the mercy of the elements from very early morning until the sun went down to watch (maybe) half of a race. But I swear at least one, if not both, of my parents made it to almost every regatta we had and I respect and love them so much for that.

So just know - even if your kids don't say it to your face, they absolutely appreciate you showing up to that game/show/match/competition whenever you can. It makes such a difference.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Welcome to the real world.

Listen I'm a "get off my lawn" kind of person too at times but the amount of times you've spoken about your younger employees leads to a different sort of reality you're living. One that usually more focused on what them young whippersnappers can and can't do or are capable of (something of which if we do generational speaking would be "Ok boomer" and I cringe even writing that lol). I could write a book (as I'm sure you could) on my coworkers but you probably don't want to hear about my observations of the older age group of which there were many. I tend to focus less on age based generalities and go more for individual and personality based stuff anyways

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I'm not going to shop for my kids clothes at Walmart.

Walmart's quality is leagues away from what it used to be. I used to have the hardest time shopping there because their sizing but have been shopping consistently there for the past 7,8+ years.

Have you been to Walmart lately? They have some high end stuff (for them if you're talking about name recognition). Our locations vary in what they get but the one a few miles north of me gets Sofia Vergara's line for Walmart. We're not talking like super real nice, it's stuff designed for Walmart customers but still. Our location that is closest to me gets more NFL stuff than Sofia Vergara or Free People (another brand that can get up there in cost) and it's not exactly the cheapest in price. I remember seeing a puffy vest for like $40 and a full jacket for $60.

This reminds me of shopping at Costco. Costco has some great stuff when it comes to apparel for everyone.

 

[Lilsia]

I saw how my older employees struggled with navigation on the computers I was even paired up with one on trying to help her learn better on looking and looking quickly for the answers. These things came naturally to me because I had been working on computers since my elementary school days and just evolved over time with faster internet, with knowing how to google, etc. There will always be some people who pick things up quickly. Your husband's story does not mean it's the same for everyone.

That is a completely different thing. Some people just can't see how to do some things. It is like math, we all have had the same math our whole lives, but some people's brains just can't comprehend it. There is no reason to think that this woman would be better with computers if she was exposed earlier. There are a lot of people who can't do a lot of things, we are all made different. And you all are still missing my point. Someone stated that they wanted to expose their child to computing early because they believed that if they didn't that the child would be behind their whole lives. And I am saying that that is not the case at all. There is no evidence for that anywhere. And my husband's company is full of people his age and older that are so much better at their job then any young person coming in because this job takes years to learn. Knowing computing and programming is not an age specific skill, it is a how your brain processes things type of skill.

 

[Lilsia]

Its the opposite here. We only have school sponsored or parks and recs sports

You are extremely lucky. Where I live, unless your child starts playing sports as a toddler and becomes really good, they are pretty much shut out of all sports. The kids have to try out to get into one of these private sports leagues in little league. Not to mention the ridiculous costs of them. And since they are private and want to earn money by sponsorships, they have these little kids practicing almost every day. It is too much and gets in the way of any kind of normal life. Even the school sports is so competitive and you have the same really good kids play for the schools that do for the private leagues. Sports should be a fun activity that everyone has a chance at.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

That is a completely different thing. Some people just can't see how to do some things. It is like math, we all have had the same math our whole lives, but some people's brains just can't comprehend it. There is no reason to think that this woman would be better with computers if she was exposed earlier. There are a lot of people who can't do a lot of things, we are all made different. And you all are still missing my point. Someone stated that they wanted to expose their child to computing early because they believed that if they didn't that the child would be behind their whole lives. And I am saying that that is not the case at all. There is no evidence for that anywhere. And my husband's company is full of people his age and older that are so much better at their job then any young person coming in because this job takes years to learn. Knowing computing and programming is not an age specific skill, it is a how your brain processes things type of skill.

There are a lot of the articles out there that have discussed this content (some in fun some in seriousness). Generally speaking there is an edge given to the younger generation when it comes to tech because of how they've grown up around it (my age group and younger being the ones talked about). This has played out in workplaces, in everyday conversations and in schooling over time. Even I can be behind in times, I remember the first time I heard of Venmo I'm like "huh??" But it's just another thing like PayPal.

I think the poster discussed foundational and building off that. I don't think they were saying their kid was destined to fail in life but that they wanted and gave an earlier exposure to things (aside from what basic things they would learn in school like MS word and how to save files) which enabled differences to show up as their child progressed through their schooling. The poster started out by saying having various electronic devices was to compete with her generation which is generally true given how earlier and earlier kids have exposure to cell phones, to iPads, to tablets. Just the ability to navigate on these devices can make things easier when it comes to schooling. 1st and 2nd graders at the school where my aunt taught had iPads. Issues with responsibility of these devices is a good conversation but the fact is they had them that early.

The poster you initially engaged with was seemed to just want to prepare their kid more for what they would be likely to be surrounded by and that doesn't seem bad to me at all. Your response to them was that it seemed too early to start computing skills but teaching computer stuff has been taught in schools for decades, maybe not where you lived but that's not a parental judgement call such that you were making, that's usually a school resource issue, unless you're from an area that parents petitioned to not allow computer learning in elementary school. I guess point being it's hardly too early if it's been done for the last 30-40 years.

Maybe the wires got crossed in the conversation with the other poster but they didn't say their kid would be left behind, I think they actually said that was too strong and loaded term. Looking back you were the one who first said left behind. The other poster just talked about how in their opinion exposure could enhance (when it came to the educational experience) or help excel (that was said in response to early exposure to STEM).

 

[sam_gordon]

You are extremely lucky. Where I live, unless your child starts playing sports as a toddler and becomes really good, they are pretty much shut out of all sports. The kids have to try out to get into one of these private sports leagues in little league. Not to mention the ridiculous costs of them. And since they are private and want to earn money by sponsorships, they have these little kids practicing almost every day. It is too much and gets in the way of any kind of normal life. Even the school sports is so competitive and you have the same really good kids play for the schools that do for the private leagues. Sports should be a fun activity that everyone has a chance at.

I totally agree with the bolded. We are fortunate. I know our moderately small town has city league football, baseball, soccer, and softball (possibly others, these are just what I'm familiar with). There is also club/select based elements of all of those sports. There are <100,000 in our county. The next larger city in the adjacent county has all of that also.

My suggestion is if you feel strongly enough about it and can find some other parents to help, get with your town and start your own league. I'm sure there's national organizations in all of those sports that will help guide you at least.

 

[NotUrsula]

FWIW, as a person who works in the profession most likely to deal with lack of personal internet, I can offer some info on the whole computer use issue. (I'm a librarian, and in most places we are the go-to internet access provider for those who don't have their own.) What we see is that most Americans under 40 use phones as their primary point of access to the internet outside of work duties. If they are poorer, that means that home internet can sometimes only be used on a phone, because cheaper pay-as-you-go phones often restrict use as hot spots. The situation of kids unable to do remote schoolwork partly reflects this; there were lots of families where the household access was via one of the adult's phones, but when they took that phone to work, the kids could not connect.

BTW, as to computer skills, we teach those, too. Most task-type skills are fairly easily learned when you're older as long as you make it a point to practice, but that's less true with coding. Coding is essentially a second language, and like any language, it's *much* easier to learn when you start in early childhood.

 

[RangerPooh]

Walmart's quality is leagues away from what it used to be. I used to have the hardest time shopping there because their sizing but have been shopping consistently there for the past 7,8+ years.

Have you been to Walmart lately? They have some high end stuff (for them if you're talking about name recognition).

This reminds me of shopping at Costco. Costco has some great stuff when it comes to apparel for everyone.

I don’t go very often because the store is usually dirty with rude customers and employees. Instead I drive an additional block and go to Target. Last summer I did buy five pairs of shorts at Walmart from their Truly Me line and love them! Bought a pair of capris too. Great quality, definitely an improvement.

 

[Luv Bunnies]

We aren't quite there yet, but I've got a theater kid....practices all hours of the day and night. He's a techie, too so even if he isn't in the show, they still want him. He played a couple of sports over the years - theater is just as bad.

You have to watch those theater kids! They can be very passionate about what they do. I currently cannot enter my bedroom because the DH's closet door is the best blank wall for filming video auditions. I can't say I mind, though. I love listening to his beautiful voice!

 

[Forevermarypoppins]

Ahhhhhh....been there, done that, and doing it again, kinda sorta. Our GS7 lives with us. My daughter works 45hrs a week. But we are dependable to get him to all the sporting events he wants to play. Whether is sports, music, theater, etc, I'm a true believer that these social participations are important - AS LONG AS THEY HAVE FUN!!!

 

[dez1978]

You are extremely lucky. Where I live, unless your child starts playing sports as a toddler and becomes really good, they are pretty much shut out of all sports. The kids have to try out to get into one of these private sports leagues in little league. Not to mention the ridiculous costs of them. And since they are private and want to earn money by sponsorships, they have these little kids practicing almost every day. It is too much and gets in the way of any kind of normal life. Even the school sports is so competitive and you have the same really good kids play for the schools that do for the private leagues. Sports should be a fun activity that everyone has a chance at.

While I don't disagree with most of that, those kids in your area will have a MUCH better shot at scholarships to big colleges, the kind that go on to be professional athletes than the kids here. Our kids can't compete with those kids and aren't going on to play for Notre Dame or Alabama or Georgia. Our kids will be lucky to get to play on a no name, unranked community college team if they are lucky. I'd LOVE for my kids to have that kind of opportunity to play on those types of teams because I think they would excel at it but those teams don't exist here. And when my kids get to their Senior year here, college scouts aren't coming to schools like mine. So while I see your point about it being a lot, and that everyone should have the chance to play and have fun, those teams will always exist and kids will always get pushed out for those kids who lived in the areas that had those teams and whose parents had the time and $ to pay for it. Heck, the bigger town near me, they have a youth football league that plays in the same league as ours. They have 90ish kids so they split it into 3 teams. those 3 teams are stacked. team A is the kids who will go on to play at their high school level and might have a chance to go to a big college, because the school is huge. Team B will be the back up players on that team. And Team C are the kids who likely won't make it on to the team at all or will be 3rd string at best. We dont live there tho bc while the sports are better, the school sucks.

 

[dez1978]

Walmart's quality is leagues away from what it used to be. I used to have the hardest time shopping there because their sizing but have been shopping consistently there for the past 7,8+ years.

Have you been to Walmart lately? They have some high end stuff (for them if you're talking about name recognition). Our locations vary in what they get but the one a few miles north of me gets Sofia Vergara's line for Walmart. We're not talking like super real nice, it's stuff designed for Walmart customers but still. Our location that is closest to me gets more NFL stuff than Sofia Vergara or Free People (another brand that can get up there in cost) and it's not exactly the cheapest in price. I remember seeing a puffy vest for like $40 and a full jacket for $60.

This reminds me of shopping at Costco. Costco has some great stuff when it comes to apparel for everyone.

I've had great luck lately with Walmart online. Currently they are having a fantastic clearance sale on kids stuff. I got 52 items for just over $100. The quality has gotten much better in the last 5 years or so. When my 10 yr old was a baby/toddler their stuff was still pretty awful and cheap feeling, and I could get better quality at old navy for about the same price. I've noticed Reebok and some name brands there too. But locally, in store, our Walmarts are horrible. I bought things online for $1-2 each that were still 12 in store. And there isn't much of a selection in our stores, even with Walmart brands. I know I see a ton of stuff on my crafting groups where people have gotten the shirts from walmart and I've never been able to find them. When we go to Denver for football games, I do always make sure to make a trip to a Walmart there and buy my Broncos stuff instead of buying it at or near the stadium.

 

[sam_gordon]

While I don't disagree with most of that, those kids in your area will have a MUCH better shot at scholarships to big colleges, the kind that go on to be professional athletes than the kids here. Our kids can't compete with those kids and aren't going on to play for Notre Dame or Alabama or Georgia. Our kids will be lucky to get to play on a no name, unranked community college team if they are lucky. I'd LOVE for my kids to have that kind of opportunity to play on those types of teams because I think they would excel at it but those teams don't exist here. And when my kids get to their Senior year here, college scouts aren't coming to schools like mine. So while I see your point about it being a lot, and that everyone should have the chance to play and have fun, those teams will always exist and kids will always get pushed out for those kids who lived in the areas that had those teams and whose parents had the time and $ to pay for it. Heck, the bigger town near me, they have a youth football league that plays in the same league as ours. They have 90ish kids so they split it into 3 teams. those 3 teams are stacked. team A is the kids who will go on to play at their high school level and might have a chance to go to a big college, because the school is huge. Team B will be the back up players on that team. And Team C are the kids who likely won't make it on to the team at all or will be 3rd string at best. We dont live there tho bc while the sports are better, the school sucks.

There's a lot that goes into where a kid will play in college. My son has been on a travel soccer team since he was 7 (now 18). He's now looking at colleges and will probably end up at a small (DIII or NAIA) school. While yes, starting early will help, and being a member of a travel system will help, more important is the desire and willing to work hard is equally as important. If a child is skilled enough, even if their family doesn't have money, most of these programs will have some kind of scholarship opportunity for deserving kids.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I've had great luck lately with Walmart online. Currently they are having a fantastic clearance sale on kids stuff. I got 52 items for just over $100. The quality has gotten much better in the last 5 years or so. When my 10 yr old was a baby/toddler their stuff was still pretty awful and cheap feeling, and I could get better quality at old navy for about the same price. I've noticed Reebok and some name brands there too. But locally, in store, our Walmarts are horrible. I bought things online for $1-2 each that were still 12 in store. And there isn't much of a selection in our stores, even with Walmart brands. I know I see a ton of stuff on my crafting groups where people have gotten the shirts from walmart and I've never been able to find them. When we go to Denver for football games, I do always make sure to make a trip to a Walmart there and buy my Broncos stuff instead of buying it at or near the stadium.

I have ones in my area I don't really like and so I avoid them at all costs but have been fortunate to usually live near a good one most times. The one up north is usually a hot mess when it comes to their clothing layout like they don't have enough space so they cram things in but they have Sofia Vergara and more Free People and their dressing room is laid out better but it can be messy in that area (usually the clearance stuff).

The one near my house focuses more on NFL and state-related stuff (I can find a lot of stuff that have either the KS state shape or the word or phrase to do with Kansas) as well as I find a lot more collegiate things (mostly KU) but it's less messy. I think overall at least in the womens/juniors they get less clothes overall than the one just up north.

There is one location that I do not like at all the people who go there but thankfully I'm not really located near it and only go there when I'm in that area.

I've seen some of the kids stuff they have; they are cute!

 

[NotUrsula]

Since someone brought up college, it's time again to do the annual athletic-scholarship-quest reality check, LOL. (I'm qualified to talk about this because despite the fact that we pour an obscene amount of money into DD's sport, and she's one of the best in the US at it, she won't be getting an athletic scholarship or a shot at Olympic fame, because this sport doesn't have NCAA scholarships or an Olympic presence. We do it purely because she loves it.)

If the reason you are pouring a ton of money into your kid's sport is that you think that you will recoup the investment in the form of a free college education, I strongly urge you to develop a Plan B, because that almost never happens.

You can pour all the money you want to into youth sports, but unless your male child plays basketball, baseball, or football, or a child of either gender plays golf, or is willing to play soccer long-term outside the US, the odds are vanishingly small that any scholarship he or she gets will pay more than what you would have made had you just invested all that money into low-risk investment accounts and paid for college out of pocket with it. The sports I named are the primary ones that have the potential (notice I didn't say the certainty) to actually be profitable enough as a profession to make all that development money a good investment. In most other sports, turning pro means having about the same lifestyle as a struggling actor -- meaning you get to do what you love, but unless your real day job is teaching, you live on the edge of poverty if you live in the US. (There are also a few other sports where endorsements alone are the real payday, but most of them don't have a big youth sports infrastructure that demands that parents put a ton of money into youth development -- competitive fishing comes to mind.)

Also, FWIW, I used to work for the athletic dept at an SEC Div1 college as a football tutor. I can promise you that in football, at least, at least half the guys who got scholarship offers did not come up through club sports. They played for their podunk town's school teams starting in elementary school, and they got noticed because they had just that much natural talent for the game that they attracted the attention of sportswriters and the coaches' grapevine, and often had an older relative who had also played college or pro football, and had been at least moderately successful. They did summer camp programs in high school, but that was usually the only special development they got before college. I had a job because the schools they attended were sub-par, but they graduated because their football prowess was the pride of the whole town, and flunking them out of school was simply unthinkable. They ended up with me because they could play football like Yo Yo Ma plays the cello, but they could barely read Cat in the Hat.