The Liberal Thread #2 - No Debate Please

[chris1gill]

Well, I admit it, when I'm out, given a choice, I go for Starbucks for myself, DD if it's DH & I or if there is no Starbucks in site.... Currently however, I have in the house, DD, Starbucks & Churchill's Blue Nile... if I must say, I like the Blue Nile BETTER, OMG, so who does that leave me voting for??

 

[robinb]

Sure, but you live in Madison and I live out in the middle of nowhere. I'm lucky if I can find decent coffee beans at the store much less free trade or organic. Most people around here drink Wal-mart brand There isn't a Starbucks or a Dunkin Donut for at least 60 miles.

You poor thing! You can't swing a dead cat without hitting a coffee roaster here in Madison. Heck, there is one just 4-5 blocks from where I live ... their Tanzanian Peaberry is delish!

I pay $10 per 12-oz for the Revolution Roast through my DD's middle school PTO.

 

[KikiFan]

Check this pic of Mccain in front of the Conservative convention...

Does he seem a bit uncomfortable (to say the least) to you? that smile couldnt be any more fake.

Ever since 2001 When he started sucking up to Bush everything about that man has been fake.

I think a united Clinton\Obama ticket is the only way to go for this election. They really compliment each other and balance the positive and the negatives of each. Just my two cents.......... The past is littered with failed predictions of the future!!

I agree with you. I really want Hillary. But I think there are a lot of good things about Obama as well. And we certainly don't want to lose the amazing support that Obama has, not the support that Hillary has. I think that the best solution is to pull them together. In a lot of ways it would be a dream ticket and it would certainly be the most progressive ticket to ever run.

No. I do not. She is only 9 years old and I am very proud that she has a political opinion that, frankly is a lot better thought out than many adults I know. I do tell her my opinions and why I am voting for Hillary, but I will not in any way denigrate her opinions. My job is to raise an independent thinker, not a Mama clone.

Yay for you! It's hard isn't it? My daughter loves Hillary. But really hates Obama. She cannot understand that I will vote for him if he wins the nomination.

Wanna know crazy-I gave $$ to BOTH of them!!!

Don't feel too bad, I gave money to Edwards, then after Super Tuesday gave money to Clinton and if Obama wins the nom I'll throw some his way. Granted it's not a lot but It's a lot for me, I've never given to any candidate other then Gore.

(hmmm maybe I better stop giving money to candidates I like... they seem to do better without my $$$)

 

["Got Disney"]

Does anyone watch the view...i was on HillaryClinton.com and saw sthis...

I've Switched to Hillary: On Wednesday on "The View," former Sen. Obama supporter Whoopi Goldberg announced that she voted for Hillary. On Thursday, the video of Whoopi's announcement was YouTube's single most watched news and politics clip. More than 200,000 people watched Whoopi explain that Hillary was the first candidate to propose taking tax breaks away from companies that ship jobs overseas. Watch.

 

[chris1gill]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";23076030]watched Whoopi explain that Hillary was the first candidate to propose taking tax breaks away from companies that ship jobs overseas. [/QUOTE]

But the flow of the jobs started with NAFTA which started under the First Clinton Presidency... does she see the error of her Husbands ways? To try and right the wrong they started? If I recall, NAFTA came into effect somewhere around '94 and has led to our trade to be completely out of balance... it was the impedes for many of these global economy issues we have.

 

["Got Disney"]

But the flow of the jobs started with NAFTA which started under the First Clinton Presidency... does she see the error of her Husbands ways? To try and right the wrong they started? If I recall, NAFTA came into effect somewhere around '94 and has led to our trade to be completely out of balance... it was the impedes for many of these global economy issues we have.

That I don't know all I was referring to was did anyone see the view when she was talking about it and that Whoopi seemed to change her mind fairly easy....and that like many of us either Obama or Hillary will be fine with them/us.

 

[chris1gill]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";23077627]That I don't know all I was referring to was did anyone see the view when she was talking about it and that Whoopi seemed to change her mind fairly easy....and that like many of us either Obama or Hillary will be fine with them/us.[/QUOTE]

I guess it's a sore spot with me when she mentions getting the jobs BACK that we lost in large part to her Bill's policy's <sorry, but it's really a sore spot>

 

["Got Disney"]

I guess it's a sore spot with me when she mentions getting the jobs BACK that we lost in large part to her Bill's policy's <sorry, but it's really a sore spot>

No problem and I cant debate you on it because in all honesty I dont remember all that happened from when Bill started it and where Bush took it

Is it possible that in the last 8 years it has been ransacked by Bushy baby. I have no dought that he would have.

 

[chris1gill]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";23077773]No problem and I cant debate you on it because in all honesty I dont remember all that happened from when Bill started it and where Bush took it

Is it possible that in the last 8 years it has been ransacked by Bushy baby. I have no dought that he would have.[/QUOTE]

He didn't exactly ransack it, he just didn't control it, which was the whole problem with it in the first place. It relied on our government to ensure we didn't export more than we imported or import more than we exported.... unfortunately that just never happened and once it took off, well, it just took off. One failed policy led to another.... BLECH... makes me sick to think about our trade deficits and what we've lost in personal wealth for those Americans who lost their jobs due to it all.

 

["Got Disney"]

He didn't exactly ransack it, he just didn't control it, which was the whole problem with it in the first place. It relied on our government to ensure we didn't export more than we imported or import more than we exported.... unfortunately that just never happened and once it took off, well, it just took off. One failed policy led to another.... BLECH... makes me sick to think about our trade deficits and what we've lost in personal wealth for those Americans who lost their jobs due to it all.

True but also Americans were getting(businesses) so greedy that the only way also for us to save some money was to deal with import export....

Why we were being charged here compared to there was a huge difference.
Even still here it is all about making the mighty buck and it does not matter who you rip off to get it.

 

["Got Disney"]

Soory that I cant answer your next post I have to go get my kids and my son has a Orthodontist appt but I will be back later.....

 

[disneyfan67]

But the flow of the jobs started with NAFTA which started under the First Clinton Presidency... does she see the error of her Husbands ways? To try and right the wrong they started? If I recall, NAFTA came into effect somewhere around '94 and has led to our trade to be completely out of balance... it was the impedes for many of these global economy issues we have.

It was one of Bill Clinton's first Presidential achivements and was considered a victory for him at the time. I remember Ross Perot warning in the 92 debates about the sucking sound that would be heard in this country, due to all the jobs leaving America. He wasn't too far off in that prediction. I also remember hearing that all of the former Presidents at the time, endorsed NAFTA as well. I wish that bill would have never been signed into law.

 

[chris1gill]

It was one of Bill Clinton's first Presidential achivements and was considered a victory for him at the time. I remember Ross Perot warning in the 92 debates about the sucking sound that would be heard in this country, due to all the jobs leaving America. He wasn't too far off in that prediction. I also remember hearing that all of the former Presidents at the time, endorsed NAFTA as well. I wish that bill would have never been signed into law.

I remember back then it was just going to apply to manufacturing jobs, and was supposed to bring in as many as it sent out, unfortunately, it brought NONE in, and all the company's over the year's stinking left... as my husband says, we make nothing here anymore, it's true! Yeh, we have intellectual property, but how long until India has the hold on that? We have scientists, they could be doing important stem cell work, only can't with Federal funding, so leaves only the riches institutions to do it, now we're on the bandwagon for renewable energy. Well, I'm all for that, course the machinery we'll use or implement won't be made here... Balance needs to be brought back in line with the rest of the world. Don't import more than we export, unfortunately everyone loves buying cheaply made Chinese goods... it's a problem of our own making, but it started right here under Clinton's watch. I remember watching Perot during this timeframe, what he said would happen has happened, even though he's still a bit of a nut job, he was completely right. Even at the time as a white collar professional, I thought it was a terrible idea.... and back then it supposedly wouldn't apply to me, well, now it applies to all of us.... I don't know if all the previous presidents approved of NAFTA, I'd be surprised if they all did, but there were plenty of economists saying it was a bad idea, and a lot of special interests saying it was a good idea... the good idea won the battle....

 

[chris1gill]

[QUOTE="Got Disney";23078204]
Why we were being charged here compared to there was a huge difference.
Even still here it is all about making the mighty buck and it does not matter who you rip off to get it.[/QUOTE]

I just couldn't even agree more on that one.

 

[eclectics]

It was one of Bill Clinton's first Presidential achivements and was considered a victory for him at the time. I remember Ross Perot warning in the 92 debates about the sucking sound that would be heard in this country, due to all the jobs leaving America. He wasn't too far off in that prediction. I also remember hearing that all of the former Presidents at the time, endorsed NAFTA as well. I wish that bill would have never been signed into law.

I never got NAFTA and still don't. It was one of the things I disagreed with the Clinton administration on. Our entire trade strategy is inbalanced, imho. Other countries, especially China, are benefiting unfairly.

 

[JARNJ3]

Ok, first of all...

Now that I can breathe again

I dunno...maybe it's just me, but I don't have the least little problem with knowing that Obama's biggest support is coming from those with the most education. I mean..."The more you know, the more likely you are to vote for Barack" really can't be seen as a bad thing, can it? I mean that in terms of how he would govern, obviously, not in terms of votes.

If given two options and knowing that the most highly educated people are on one side while those that didn't graduate high school heavily favor the other side...well, site unseen, I'm usually gonna choose the former.

I don't think anyone was trying to imply that Obama's more educated supporters are a "bad" thing - its just there are distinct groups supporting each candidate.

That's why we really need a unified ticket........

I chose her because she's got more federal govt experience, her health care plan proposal covers all.

Oh and Ps - there are no absolutes - I am college educated and make more than the $50K they use as a ceiling.

I also work with an African American who can't stand Obama - feels he's all talk, no substance - she goes against the groups as stated.

And as an aside - she was so proud today - she told me she convinced a friend that he was really more a Hillary man than an Obama one by debating and discussing the issues!

 

[JARNJ3]

I was deeply troubled to read that article about the coffee drinkers. You see, I have a serious Starbucks habit.

And that means I'm secretly for... Obama??!!

YOu may now return to your regularly scheduled thread...

LOL - no it means you aren't a democrat - silly!

 

[JARNJ3]

I never got NAFTA and still don't. It was one of the things I disagreed with the Clinton administration on. Our entire trade strategy is inbalanced, imho. Other countries, especially China, are benefiting unfairly.

Actually - it was Al Gore who sold me on Nafta. Remember that debate on Larry King?

"Larry, can I finish, can I finish?"

I thought Gore presented the pro argument for it fairly well.

It was supposed to open borders and free trade - and was supposed to create jobs - wasn't it?

 

[eclectics]

Actually - it was Al Gore who sold me on Nafta. Remember that debate on Larry King?

"Larry, can I finish, can I finish?"

I thought Gore presented the pro argument for it fairly well.

It was supposed to open borders and free trade - and was supposed to create jobs - wasn't it?

I saw it. I'll admit, it sure sounded good and I was for anyone who could shut Ross Perot up, but I never really understood how it could be implemented fairly, especially with Mexico...and I was right.

 

[chris1gill]

I saw it. I'll admit, it sure sounded good and I was for anyone who could shut Ross Perot up, but I never really understood how it could be implemented fairly, especially with Mexico...and I was right.

BINGO! At the time I saw this as an opportunity for us to lose a lot of jobs, knowing that jobs would be shipped across borders.

Initially this was "supposed" to create jobs, it didn't, just took them. Look at just our imbalance with China at the moment, it's simply disgusting.... What is it 1 to 10 now?