Teen daughter - vent

[bsmcneil]

I’m sorry some of the replies are coming across as unkind.
A couple things: I get that she has a short list of where she wants to work. I suspect she wants to do what her friends are doing, even if it’s not practical. I’d let her try it. Be sure to let her know you won’t be able to get her there. See if she can figure it out. In the meantime, until she has a job, if she’s home she can get the brother off the bus. That’s certainly not too much to ask

It also might be that she knows what she's good at or feels called to do, vs. what's being forced on her. Again, I think most of us are saying how can you negotiate this with your 17-year old so that it's best for everyone (not just the mom/OP). If you're told, "the only job you can get is the one I decide on" - many people are going to have a knee-jerk reaction to that (let alone a 17 year old trying to figure out some form of independence at the naturally appropriate developmental stage). Why is a pizza place a better place than a childcare? What skills does it bestow on the daughter that she can't get at the day care? Or is it just, "This is what works for me - so that's how it has to be"? And sometimes that happens and makes sense but you can talk that through (and sometimes it happens and it doesn't make sense - it's just a form of control). As someone else mentioned, the difference between forced to work at 16 and wants to work at 17 is significant (plus, we're all different from our parents - and often as parents, we struggle to differentiate in that way).

Finally, as a former straight-A student because it came naturally - I find some of the discussion about grades weird. I do think that if the grades go downward markedly from when she starts working, there are ways to help her do better (but that should be about helping her learn the material as best as possible and not getting a certain grade). If they continue to be what they are - then, it doesn't seem like that should matter (and she's 17 - so what will very soon be far more important are work skills, budgeting, life skills, etc and not an A in Chemistry).

 

[butterscotchcollins]

One point that no one has brought up: “laying around” for hours on the couch is a classic symptom of depression.

PLEASE prioritize your daughter’s mental health. Being a teenage girl sucks enough without some of the issues highlighted here. I don’t think if 10 years from now when she’s an independent adult and doesn’t want to come home because she resents you that you’d be okay with that.

For the record my parents also made me get a job at 16 but I didn’t get a car, or have college paid for, because they couldn’t afford that. What they did was teach me work ethic and learning from the MANY financial mistakes I made when I was young, and now at 36 I run circles around my peers who had those things handed to them by their middle class parents. There really is something to be said for letting her earn and pay for those things herself.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Ours are linked to our security system. They only record when the alarm is tripped or proactively when the entry countdown starts. They are aimed at doors but are inside the house.

Because of the context in which the OP let it be known they have cameras I'm thinking the cameras are not facing the doors (at least exclusively) and they are making sure the 17 year old is actively take care of siblings.

Maybe not the original intent but the OP did say "Yesterday she had to watch the kids one day during Xmas break. DH and I split the rest with vacation time. She laid around all day while DS7 pretty much took care of himself and DD4. He got their cereal for lunch, snacks, drinks etc. (have cameras in living room and dining room). When DH and I were upset about it,"

The OP seems to be at least reviewing the footage and soon enough (maybe watching it live who knows) and the cameras at least pivoted at times (if not all the time) to be focused on the going ons of the interior of the house.

Unless the cameras are being used just for security purposes like in case of theft/burglary the OP appears to be using it to more snoop on their home life. Not entirely uncommon these days to do that but given all the other stuff feels more like waiting to find more fault.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Finally, as a former straight-A student because it came naturally - I find some of the discussion about grades weird. I do think that if the grades go downward markedly from when she starts working, there are ways to help her do better (but that should be about helping her learn the material as best as possible and not getting a certain grade). If they continue to be what they are - then, it doesn't seem like that should matter (and she's 17 - so what will very soon be far more important are work skills, budgeting, life skills, etc and not an A in Chemistry.

Honestly I was wondering if the grades part isn't a reflection of just how much stress the teen is going through at home. I'm not sure if the OP thought that. I mean sometimes you're just sorta goofing off grades slip, sometimes you just struggle with schooling or a particular class.

But is the school stuff as a result of a teen who is on the surface looking like she needs a talking to on how to take school more seriously or some extra help on schoolwork or is the school stuff a by product of all that is going on? That seems like a good question and conversation to have.

 

[hsmamato2]

Wow. I am grateful for the responses. I really am. Apparently, I am just a horrible mother.

Stop...you're not horrible. You asked a question on an open forum...you got responses. Your daughter is feeling a lack of independence with this arrangement. My advice is to talk to her about allowing her to get a job, either paying her for your childcare needs or someone else to do it,and letting her save up and pay for her own car and insurance etc. IMHO it gives her the chance to make her decisions, while probably saving you some $ overall anyway! I also think you need to make it clear that in general family still helps out when needed, but you're no longer tying her to a an unpaid job she has no choice over,that limits her ability to grow up and do these things she needs to do.

 

[DLgal]

You need to start paying your daughter for babysitting the kids you chose to have. If you didn't have a 17 year old daughter, you'd be paying for day care/nanny. Pay her the same as you would pay a nanny in your home, or send them to daycare and pay for that and let her get a job and contribute to her expenses. TBH, she is still a child and it is still your responsibility to pay her way. You chose to let her get a drivers license so it's on you to pay for her insurance until the has her own car. Don't buy her a car, make her do that herself. Don't pay her way through college. Make her help with that too. Since it doesn't sound like you guys sat down and hashed out a plan to pay for X,Y, and Z in exchange for child care, I hardly blame your daughter from being annoyed with the whole situation. You can't just obligate a 17 year old to care for younger siblings and then essentially hold her hostage by forcefully paying for things she never asked you to pay for.

What you are doing is hamstringing your 17 year old's development into an independent adult.

 

[robinb]

Another issue is grades. Her grades aren’t always the best. She barely maintains them now and doesn’t work. Not sure how she will manage not to fail if she starts working.

She may surprise you. My DD was a competitive swimmer through high school and practiced nearly 20 hours per week and swam meets 1-2 times a month. She had a very limited time to do homework so that's when she did it. She started college and we encouraged her to not work so she could dedicate more time to her studies. Instead, she dedicated more time to goofing off. My DD got a job the summer between freshman and sophomore year and it turned out that she *needed* a job to help focus her studies.

 

[robinb]

I'm confused about all the people that are saying the daughter shouldn't be expected to just watch her siblings for free all the time. It sounds like from the OP that Mom is paying her $40/week for 60 minutes of babysitting. That seems like pretty darn good compensation for me.

On a per hour basis, that does seem like a plum gig, but it's really not. I think the main problem is needing to be available for those 60 minutes. They fall right in the middle of when she wants to work with her friends at the day care. Because she needs to be home to babysit her younger siblings, she cannot take the other job she wants that will make her more money and provide a sense of independence.

 

[DisneyHardin]

Let's say over the course of the year the parents have saved $6000 toward the car and college. Why not instead of paying for those items FOR their daughter, pay her $500 per month to put into her own bank account and then expect her to pay for them herself? It's still the exact same amount of money for the same babysitting, but in the latter the daughter will feel that she has earned her "own" money and has the ability to pay for things herself.

You think the parents should pay her $500/month to watch her younger brother for 1 hour/week? Holy moly, I'll be glad to babysit for $125/hour - sign me up!!

 

[DisneyHardin]

On a per hour basis, that does seem like a plum gig, but it's really not. I think the main problem is needing to be available for those 60 minutes. They fall right in the middle of when she wants to work with her friends at the day care. Because she needs to be home to babysit her younger siblings, she cannot take the other job she wants that will make her more money and provide a sense of independence.

I was referring to all the people who were commenting that the mom was making her watch the younger brother for free. I was just pointing out that she wasn't doing it for free, she was doing it for $40/week.

 

[sk!mom]

From what you've written, I'm on your daughter's side.

Mom of 4.

The things you are providing are typical parent provided things. Yes, teens are expensive. But as you know, so is daycare.

She, in her own teen way, is asking you to give her the opportunity to grow up. She is looking for ways to be independent. As a senior in high school, it's time you allow her to get a job outside the house.

You and your husband have had it 'easy' by having an in home person to care for your younger kids.

the above is exactly what I was going to say. All you’re “giving” her OP, is what most parents provide.

I’d let her get a job and all I’d have her take care of at 17 is her own spending money. All the other
Costs are normal parent things and we’re paid for by us through college.

I do have one question, is she your biological DD? I just sense resentment on your part that I have seen on occasion in a step parent situation.

 

[DLgal]

You think the parents should pay her $500/month to watch her younger brother for 1 hour/week? Holy moly, I'll be glad to babysit for $125/hour - sign me up!!

No, the one hour is in the middle of a weekend day, which means she can never plan anything on that day, ever. AND, she is picking up the 7 year old from the bus stop 3 days a week which means she also can't ever have afternoon plans those 3 days a week. Which pretty much means she can't have a part time job outside the home. When I was in HS, I made FAR more than $40/week at my part time after school/weekend job.

 

[PinkPixel]

My heart goes out to you, @pinkxray. I have two daughters and we barely survived their teenage years. They are good kids but they put us through the wringer. Even now that they’re in their early 20s there are still some tough issues.
I don’t think you’re being unreasonable at all. You are a family, and family members help each other even when it’s not fun or convenient. Especially since you’re willing to let her work on the weekends.
I have a much younger brother, and I watched him all the time when my parents worked. It was just assumed that I would.
Best of luck to you, OP.

It goes without saying that family members help each other. But help is different than a long term specified commitment that you can’t get out of. Not being able to pursue an opportunity she’s interested in, because she has a commitment that’s routine childcare for her sibling is not the best for promoting her own independence and sense of autonomy as she’s on the edge of adulthood.

 

[wenrob]

I was referring to all the people who were commenting that the mom was making her watch the younger brother for free. I was just pointing out that she wasn't doing it for free, she was doing it for $40/week.

She says in the OP the $40 is not for babysitting. Then her later responses say that is is.

On that, OP when you talk about after school care are you talking about what the school provides? Here when my kids were little it was $7 which was a bargain. Wouldn’t that solve the problem? Dad picks up DS on his way home and DD can get the job she wants provided she finds herself transportation.

 

[DisneyHardin]

No, the one hour is in the middle of a weekend day, which means she can never plan anything on that day, ever. AND, she is picking up the 7 year old from the bus stop 3 days a week which means she also can't ever have afternoon plans those 3 days a week. Which pretty much means she can't have a part time job outside the home.

I was counting the 3-20 minute sessions as the hour - I had forgotten that she also babysits 1 weekend hour per month, so sorry - she would get getting $100/hr to babysit, not the original $125 that I stated in your scenario. My apologies.

I guess I grew up in a different time because I was expected to babysit my younger sister a lot when I was growing up and I was never paid for it, even when it interfered with something that I wanted to do.

 

[robinb]

I was referring to all the people who were commenting that the mom was making her watch the younger brother for free. I was just pointing out that she wasn't doing it for free, she was doing it for $40/week.

First of all, it seemed to me that the $40 per week was her weekly allowance and not a direct payment for childcare. Secondly, she could probably make 3-4 times as much at the day care job if she didn't need to be home for that short amount of time to watch her siblings three times a week.

 

[DLgal]

I was counting the 3-20 minute sessions as the hour - I had forgotten that she also babysits 1 weekend hour per month, so sorry - she would get getting $100/hr to babysit, not the original $125 that I stated in your scenario. My apologies.

I guess I grew up in a different time because I was expected to babysit my younger sister a lot when I was growing up and I was never paid for it, even when it interfered with something that I wanted to do.

Maybe that was wrong that you were expected to do that. I was PAID to babysit my younger sister when needed and I was also paid to babysit 2 kids after school 3 days a week for 2 hours until their dad came home from work. I was paid $10/hr for those 2 kids back in 1994. I did that the year before I started a fast food job.

Times have changed and I think this mother should be THRILLED that her teenaged daughter WANTS to get a real job. So many teens are unmotivated and happy to mooch off their parents forever. Embrace that independent drive!

 

[GreatLakes]

It goes without saying that family members help each other. But help is different than a long term specified commitment that you can’t get out of. Not being able to pursue an opportunity she’s interested in, because she has a commitment that’s routine childcare for her sibling is not the best for promoting her own independence and sense of autonomy as she’s on the edge of adulthood.

Is it long term though? We are in a pandemic and it seems like the extra hours mom and dad are working are due to that. Surely while we are in unprecedented times each member of the family should be stepping up until we get back to normal. It could be another few months, maybe another year, but we are all making sacrifices that we wouldn't otherwise due to the circumstances. If that means that the daughter of the OP needs to sacrifice a job for the family, like how many countless other people right now of all ages, that is what it means.

But that needs communicated rationally which is why I think a meeting is required

 

[lifesavacation]

You think the parents should pay her $500/month to watch her younger brother for 1 hour/week? Holy moly, I'll be glad to babysit for $125/hour - sign me up!!

I don't think it will be easy or cheap for the OP to arrange childcare. BTDT. Even if she does after school care, that still leaves the 4 year old needing a sitter three times a week. It's likely to add more money and more time (to/from, getting kid ready to go) to the OP's family budget and schedule. I definitely think that's what they should do, but it's not as simple as 1 hour a week.

 

[QueenIsabella]

I was counting the 3-20 minute sessions as the hour - I had forgotten that she also babysits 1 weekend hour per month, so sorry - she would get getting $100/hr to babysit, not the original $125 that I stated in your scenario. My apologies.

I guess I grew up in a different time because I was expected to babysit my younger sister a lot when I was growing up and I was never paid for it, even when it interfered with something that I wanted to do.

That's the thing--some kids love watching their siblings, some kids don't. It's been foisted on this particular teen, who resents it. I think the parents should make other arrangements for child care--maybe an after-school program? Local teen that enjoys kids? Then, let the teen DD figure out the logistics of the job (what hours to work, transportation, etc.) It would be a good experience for her.

As I mentioned earlier, we have 4 drivers--soon to be 5, DS15 has his learner's permit. We have 3 vehicles. I have one kid working at Fedex (start time is typically 3am--NOBODY wants to drive him in!), one working at Starbucks (work hours vary daily, from a 5am start to getting home close to 11 from closing), and DH has to go in to the office one day a week. We all work together to come up with a reasonable car schedule--you just need to be flexible and have a sense of humor. DS15 wants a job--I've tried to encourage him to look close to home (there are a few places that could be easy walking/biking distance). He's not interested in those so much. SO, whatever he finds, we'll find a way to work him in.

I thought Sk!mom had a good question about being a step-daughter. I still read a lot of resentment in the OP's posts. She may just be tired, frustrated burned out, and that's what's coming through. We're all struggling these days--I don't mean it as criticism so much as, the OP might want to see if her attitude is contributing to her frustration. It happens to the best of us.