Table Manners....

[usnuzuloose]

....are feet okay?

How did you get on there with the pole....? Did you wash your feet?


Now back to the topic at hand , which seems to be many.

 

[goofy!]

I couldn't resist. The snooty attitudes in some posts just made it too hard.

It is just as wrong to call those who happen to be more informed of etiquette as "snooty" as it is for those who are more cognizant of the etiquette rules to call those who do not know them as well as 'infantile' or "low class.'

-just saying. There is plenty of name calling and 'snootiness' on both ends of the spectrum.

 

[sunshinehighway]

It is just as wrong to call those who happen to be more informed of etiquette as "snooty" as it is for those who are more cognizant of the etiquette rules to call those who do not know them as well as 'infantile' or "low class.'

-just saying. There is plenty of name calling and 'snootiness' on both ends of the spectrum.

It had nothing to do with posters simply knowing more about etiquette rules. There were some posts that were oozing with a snooty attitude. I highly doubt anyone that posted something I'd consider snooty could care less that I think their post was snooty. Its really not a big deal.

 

[cornflake]

The knife usually comes in the basket WITH the bread

Ok, I now think you're messing with me.

Completely seriously, I have been eating in restaurants since I was tiny - of all varieties from diner to Michelin starred. I've seen bread baskets with everything from basic rolls to homemade grissini to breads that are meant to go with a cheese and wine flight. I have never, ever seen a bread basket with a knife in it.

If someone put a bread basket on the table with a knife I think I'd like, discreetly tell the busboy someone accidentally dropped a knife in it or whatever because it'd never occur to me it was meant to be in there.

I have seen a small spreader or spatula in a butter crock but... a knife in the bread basket? You're messing with me.

 

[Missy1961]

Good heavens.

Remind me to never accept dinner invitations to most of your houses. You would be horrified by my family and our simple "country" (and apparently infantile) ways.

Please understand, first of all, that my house is small. We don't have a formal dining room, and our "dining area" is open-plan with our kitchen. Hence, meals are served family-style. When the food is ready, grab a plate, and dish up. When you get to the table, start eating; otherwise by the time we all get there the first person's food is cold.

The great all emcompassing bread debate. Ok, most of the time, bread is served one of two ways in my house. First would be sliced, usually buttered and toasted on a sheet pan in the oven, maybe with a little garlic on it. If there is a loaf of bread that we don't want to toast that night (french bread, etc) I pre-slice it ahead of time. Second would be rolls. Either way, they are over on the counter/stovetop with all the rest of the food and that includes the butterdish. When you serve yourself, grab a roll or a piece of bread. If it needs butter, slap some on... the whole thing!!! Finally, know what that piece of bread is really there for?? Sopping up all the gravy/spaghetti sauce, soup broth etc so it doesn't go to waste!

Napkins. Please use them. This is not debatable. But paper is just fine, and please don't put it in your lap. In fact, if you do, the puppy will probably run off with it. Setting it down beside your plate is just fine, in my book.

Burping at the table annoys me too, but if you can figure out a way to make my DH stop doing it, I will personally reward you.

Some foods are meant to be finger foods, and until someone proves otherwise, I will keep eating them with my hands. Whenever I see someone daintily cutting up a piece of fried chicken with a knife and fork I want to bop them over the head with a nice crispy drumstick.

What it comes down to is this. Dinner at my house is family time. Time when we all sit down together with no TV, no phones, no texting, etc. We have conversation, talk about eachother's days, and generally reconnect. I try to gently remind my children about table manners basics (don't talk with your mouth full, swallow one bite before shovelling in another, don't wipe your hands on your shirt, etc) but if we spend the entire meal obsessing about how we butter our bread or some of the other silly things I have read on here, we would totally lose the benefit of that family time.

Emily Post and I have never been really that close anyhow. She got all bent out of shape a few years ago when I decided that thanking people by email was OK in my book, and hasn't spoken to me since. I don't miss her at all.

Can I come to dinner at your house? Because it sounds like dinner at my house!

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Ok, I now think you're messing with me.

Completely seriously, I have been eating in restaurants since I was tiny - of all varieties from diner to Michelin starred. I've seen bread baskets with everything from basic rolls to homemade grissini to breads that are meant to go with a cheese and wine flight. I have never, ever seen a bread basket with a knife in it.

If someone put a bread basket on the table with a knife I think I'd like, discreetly tell the busboy someone accidentally dropped a knife in it or whatever because it'd never occur to me it was meant to be in there.

I have seen a small spreader or spatula in a butter crock but... a knife in the bread basket? You're messing with me.

Nope - best example I can think of that I know you'd be able to find easily is Outback Steakhouse. They actually stab the loaf with the knife so the bread is served on a small cutting board, knife already inpaled in the bread.

Now, probably more common than the knife with the bread is the loaf being pre-sliced or the loaf pre-sliced 95% of the way through. But, I can't honestly say I can ever remember a loaf of bread being served that wasn't pre-sliced or that wasn't served with its own bread knife.

Rolls? Yeah, no knife in there. But small French style loaves? Either with a knife or already pre-sliced. Never whole w/o a way to cut them.

edit: Outback Steakhouse loaf:

 

[cluvsdisney]

Ok, I now think you're messing with me.

Completely seriously, I have been eating in restaurants since I was tiny - of all varieties from diner to Michelin starred. I've seen bread baskets with everything from basic rolls to homemade grissini to breads that are meant to go with a cheese and wine flight. I have never, ever seen a bread basket with a knife in it.

If someone put a bread basket on the table with a knife I think I'd like, discreetly tell the busboy someone accidentally dropped a knife in it or whatever because it'd never occur to me it was meant to be in there.

I have seen a small spreader or spatula in a butter crock but... a knife in the bread basket? You're messing with me.

The Outback closest to me sticks the knife in the bread. I have seen other places like that which serve small loaves of unsliced bread include a serrated knife with the bread on a small cutting board.

But I haven't seen a knife included with or in an actual bread basket.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

The Outback closest to me sticks the knife in the bread. I have seen other places like that which serve small loaves of unsliced bread include a serrated knife with the bread on a small cutting board.

But I haven't seen a knife included with or in an actual bread basket.

Yeah, more I think about it, it's always been on a board, rather than in a basket. I probably mispoke on that one. In the basket is typically pre-sliced if it's a loaf, or not if it's rolls.

 

[goofy!]

Ok, I now think you're messing with me.

Completely seriously, I have been eating in restaurants since I was tiny - of all varieties from diner to Michelin starred. I've seen bread baskets with everything from basic rolls to homemade grissini to breads that are meant to go with a cheese and wine flight. I have never, ever seen a bread basket with a knife in it.

If someone put a bread basket on the table with a knife I think I'd like, discreetly tell the busboy someone accidentally dropped a knife in it or whatever because it'd never occur to me it was meant to be in there.

I have seen a small spreader or spatula in a butter crock but... a knife in the bread basket? You're messing with me.

You need to broaden your horizons

This is how outback bread is served:

 

[Gumbo4x4]

You need to broaden your horizons

This is how outback bread is served:

Your google would beat my google....... if they fought

 

[cornflake]

Ok, as everyone gave the same example - I'm going with that this is a thing particular to Outback Steakhouse, where I have never been. I accept you were not messing with me. And that Outback Steakhouse is odd.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Ok, as everyone gave the same example - I'm going with that this is a thing particular to Outback Steakhouse, where I have never been. I accept you were not messing with me. And that Outback Steakhouse is odd.

It's not uncommon in other restaurants, it's just that Outback is the most obvious example since it's a popular chain. Maybe they're the ones who started the trend, but either way it's not odd around here

 

[Coconut36]

Ok, as everyone gave the same example - I'm going with that this is a thing particular to Outback Steakhouse, where I have never been. I accept you were not messing with me. And that Outback Steakhouse is odd.

I would disagree with that. As the pp said..Outback is the easiest to find example but I have see it in a lot of steakhouse type establishments and can say comfortably it is NOT limited only to Outback (or only to steakhouses..they are most likely to do it though).

There was a higher end establishment here we used to go to for special events and they also did a loaf of bread and knife..no napkin or basket and they were not affiliated with Outback in any way but they absolutely served their bread with a knife similar to the picture shown.

 

[leebee]

Bugaboo Creek also sticks the knife in the small loaf of bread and serves it on a cutting board. My tweaky little brain always gets a chuckle out of knowing that my bread is well dead and pinned to the board... I know, sick sense of humor, but then again, I'm in a restaurant where the dead animal heads on the wall talk and sing...

 

[Northstar]

Wow, this thread covers a lot of ground! Now the question is which restaurants serve bread on a cutting board with the serrated knife?

East Side Mario's. (I'm sure about this, I cut myself with the knife. I need more than etiquette lessons to survive a meal out)

 

[joviroxx]

Its not that its odd but it is obvious that there are different levels of etiquette. I know table rules at my house a more lax then when we are out t and are much more stringent in a fine dining establishment. And Ive taught my kids the same way. They also know to pull out the top tier manners when at friends homes. While at home Im fine with them eating their bread any way as long as they aren't shoving it in their mouths like an animal, at a restaurant they know differently. There is relaxed and there is formal and then there is the non-negotiable everywhere.

Call me pretentious, but I LOVE when people comment how well mannered and what great table manners my kids have

As far as the salad/knife thing. It was considered rude because knives were made of silver and the vinegar from the dressing would stain the knives. It was rude to ruin your hosts silver. Now it doesn't matter so much.

Oh, and another one.. When asked to pass the salt, the salt and pepper should be passed as a set! YEP, as a set!

 

[DeaverTex]

I'm confused about this tearing a large slice of bread in half by grasping one side of it with the napkin. Who holds the other end? Should someone else grab that end and then you pull until the bread tears in half?

And don't forget -- first you make a wish!

 

[cornflake]

Its not that its odd but it is obvious that there are different levels of etiquette. I know table rules at my house a more lax then when we are out t and are much more stringent in a fine dining establishment. And Ive taught my kids the same way. They also know to pull out the top tier manners when at friends homes. While at home Im fine with them eating their bread any way as long as they aren't shoving it in their mouths like an animal, at a restaurant they know differently. There is relaxed and there is formal and then there is the non-negotiable everywhere.

I think this is what most of us on the 'manners' side, for wont of a better word, are saying.

A poster upthread said that in her house, people know napkins aren't to be placed on laps because the puppy will think it's a game to grab them. That makes sense. I'd think her kids know that in a restaurant, napkins go on laps, either placed there by the waiter or by them.

No one is saying everyone should have a giant formal place setting and State Dinner manners at the breakfast table on the way to school; there are gradations.

It's not uncommon in other restaurants, it's just that Outback is the most obvious example since it's a popular chain. Maybe they're the ones who started the trend, but either way it's not odd around here

I've never seen it anyplace, ever. So... it's certainly odd around here. Yes, I believe there may be an Outback someplace here, I think, though I'm not positive, but I've never been in it, nor is it likely I would be, heh. I've never seen it at a restaurant I've been in.

Bugaboo Creek also sticks the knife in the small loaf of bread and serves it on a cutting board.

Never heard of that place.

 

[Kathi OD]

The posters explaining the proper way to butter/eat a roll or cut one's meat are providing these descriptions (not lectures) on this thread. The thread about table manners pet peeves. Nobody is lecturing anyone about poor table manners "live".

Sure they are. hose who don't know how to eat their bread properly were called infants and creepy. IMO, that's equivalent to a lecture.

 

[Sorsha]

Can I come to dinner at your house? Because it sounds like dinner at my house!

You bet! Tomorrow night is taco/burrito/taco salad night - finger food. You bring the paper napkins.