SW making changes to EBCI?

[thanxfornoticin]

It’s so upsetting to see posts like yours when I am someone who has had to use the pre- boarding and feel horrible doing so…I also pay for the EBCI out of guilt In addition to tipping who ever has to push me in a wheel chair through security and to the gate which is usually either at the very end of concourse B or C at BWI airport. I use a cane and can walk short distances but slowly. I never take a bulkhead seat or sit in exit rows and although I can board early I always depart from plane last so as not to hold others up. I’m embarrassed at using the pre boarding but more uncomfortable waiting in the regular que and then hobbling down to the plane with other passengers piled up behind me. I’m not sure how many people who don’t need to would even want to pre board with everyone looking at them and knowing what they must be thinking.

No need to be upset, or even bothered. Calling the pre boarders 'fake' is rude. I understand why they do the pre boarding and respect the process. I also know that if I continue to travel and fly after retirement, there's a really good chance I'll get to a point I'll need extra time and pre boarding myself! We just need to have a little respect for those who need an extra minute or 2 to get on the plane safely.

 

[Lewisc]

Part of the problem I also believe is the fake preboarders. Which now you will see even more of.

Probably not as many fake preboarders as you think. Walk around the gate area. Flights to FL, particularly MCO, appear to have a lot more preboards then other destinations.

Disney is a popular destination for intergenerational trips. Disney is.scooter friendly. Its a good destination for people with issues.

Some people who don't appear disabled have issues standing during the boarding process. Some may delay boarding if they have to walk to the back of the plane.

I'm sure some pax are taking advantage, not as many as some assume.

 

[keishashadow]

They should just move to assigned seats and be done with this ridiculous boarding system. It's stressful for "some" and just not necessary. What does it really add?

It’s how they’ve rolled from day one. Part of their corporate culture.

Even with: their elite customers, pre-boards & the addition of higher priced tix that allow earlier boarding; they will still give people the opportunity to pick from a certain number of seats.

Part of the problem I also believe is the fake preboarders. Which now you will see even more of.

I’m sure they wish they had that super power of weeding out “fake preboarders”. Sigh

one often co-joined issue, that is also one of their traditions, should absolutely addressed:

Grandma & Pap, both medically pre-board, along with their eligible assistant person (a total of 4 people)

then, each of those 4 people proceed to hold down a full set of 3 seats for their extended family (12 seats)

As one who generally does manage to board early, it’s not uncommon to see it on MCO flights.

IMO should be limited to the pre boarded, their facilitating person and any young child who is booked on their reservation…not those on Mom or Dad’s who are also along on the trip.

If it’s so much better why is it the only airline in the world that boards this way? We’re in a copy cat world and if it brings in extra revenue then all airlines would do it. Like charging for luggage, it started with American airlines then caught on to just about every other airline.

It’s been part of their policy from day one, don’t see them ever abandoning it completely

I think family boarding is a big issue at MCO and I know that affects where you end up

Very true, doesn’t appear to be a major factor on flights to other touristy areas.

It would be a very unpopular move with those with small children

a compromise to meet the intent of this policy:

why not modify that “family board after A policy” with seating to be restricted to a certain %/zone of seats on the plane.

One initially that is devoted to families…as in the back 1/4 of Said plane.

once that group boards, it would be opened back up to all guests Starting with zone B

 

[SkyGuy]

It’s how they’ve rolled from day one. Part of their corporate culture.

Even with: their elite customers, pre-boards & the addition of higher priced tix that allow earlier boarding; they will still give people the opportunity to pick from a certain number of seats.

I’m sure they wish they had that super power of weeding out “fake preboarders”. Sigh

one often co-joined issue, that is also one of their traditions, should absolutely addressed:

Grandma & Pap, both medically pre-board, along with their eligible assistant person (a total of 4 people)

then, each of those 4 people proceed to hold down a full set of 3 seats for their extended family (12 seats)

As one who generally does manage to board early, it’s not uncommon to see it on MCO flights.

IMO should be limited to the pre boarded, their facilitating person and any young child who is booked on their reservation…not those on Mom or Dad’s who are also along on the trip.

It’s been part of their policy from day one, don’t see them ever abandoning it completely

Very true, doesn’t appear to be a major factor on flights to other touristy areas.

It would be a very unpopular move with those with small children

a compromise to meet the intent of this policy:

why not modify that “family board after A policy” with seating to be restricted to a certain %/zone of seats on the plane.

One initially that is devoted to families…as in the back 1/4 of Said plane.

once that group boards, it would be opened back up to all guests Starting with zone B

I commented this earlier, but I fly quite often to both MCO for both Disney and with my husband for business and to MIA with my husband for business. The family boarding to and from MIA is out of control because of the cruise industry. It’s way beyond what I witness on my flights to and from MCO. I’m not lying when I say family boarding will leave those with B groups hoping to sit together out of luck. Inevitably some will line up with the preboarders and hold up that entire process as well.

 

[keishashadow]

but I fly quite often to both MCO for both Disney and with my husband for business and to MIA with my husband for business. The family boarding to and from MIA is out of control because of the cruise industry.

Interesting, we fly into FLL when cruising from the area. Last time early May, didn’t notice a large amount of kids. Could be as school generally still in session for my area then.

 

[SkyGuy]

Interesting, we fly into FLL when cruising from the area. Last time early May, didn’t notice a large amount of kids. Could be as school generally still in session for my area then.

Ironically, the last time I flew with my husband into MIA was May! I didn’t go with him in July, and naturally he doesn’t remember the family boarding situation .

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It’s so upsetting to see posts like yours when I am someone who has had to use the pre- boarding and feel horrible doing so…I also pay for the EBCI out of guilt In addition to tipping who ever has to push me in a wheel chair through security and to the gate which is usually either at the very end of concourse B or C at BWI airport. I use a cane and can walk short distances but slowly. I never take a bulkhead seat or sit in exit rows and although I can board early I always depart from plane last so as not to hold others up. I’m embarrassed at using the pre boarding but more uncomfortable waiting in the regular que and then hobbling down to the plane with other passengers piled up behind me. I’m not sure how many people who don’t need to would even want to pre board with everyone looking at them and knowing what they must be thinking.

I realize you are reacting to the general vibe but you have to understand people aren't talking about you, they aren't meaning those with mobility issues such that they actually rely on wheelchairs or other devices so I don't think you need to feel outrage or sadness. I'd point your outrage towards the fellow passengers who make it more difficult for you because they take advantage of the situation.

 

[georgina]

A few years ago, I saw a dad sitting in aisle and baby in car seat in window. Later mom came on, got middle.

I don’t see any problem with this at all.

 

[Lewisc]

A few years ago, I saw a dad sitting in aisle and baby in car seat in window. Later mom came on, got middle.

Posters on flyer forums generally think its ok to save a middle seat.

I realize you are reacting to the general vibe but you have to understand people aren't talking about you, they aren't meaning those with mobility issues such that they actually rely on wheelchairs or other devices so I don't think you need to feel outrage or sadness. I'd point your outrage towards the fellow passengers who make it more difficult for you because they take advantage of the situation.

It's more then ok to have contempt for people who try to judge which preboarders are worthy and which are scammers.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

It's more then ok to have contempt for people who try to judge which preboarders are worthy and which are scammers.

Eh...not when someone is saying they find sadness in a post clearly not aimed at them which is what happened. Someone who uses a wheelchair and a cane is obviously not the subject of that other person's post. So sure if you want to get mad at them I guess you can but is that really the one to get upset at? I'm speaking practically here, not on an emotional level because of course I wouldn't advocate for people to just judge away at everyone they possibly can.

Most who have service animals, majority of the time they point their anger, their frustration at others who attempt to take advantage because it makes their lives harder. When there's so many that take advantage in various places of our society unfortunately people get caught in the fray.

Rhetorically speaking but I'm pretty sure most of us can envision that if airlines were very strict about things such as pre-boarding it would make the experience for passengers who subsequently qualify for it better. When half your plane lines up as pre-boards in wheelchairs but 80% of them get up and walk with ease down the jetway I'm not sure you can blame the collective groan from the remaining passengers. People want to give compassion (at least I'd like to think that way) but in recent years it's just gotten so far out of control the situation passengers are finding themselves for various airlines.

 

[Jimsig]

One thing people forget is that not all disabilities that require pre-boarding can be seen. For example some autistic people may get anxious, have breakdowns, and just can not handle waiting in line. Some might say then they should just wait an be the last ones on, but that same person could also have anxiety that they are going to miss the plane and that being on the plane in the early stages of boarding is what calms them down.

I was surprised a couple weeks ago that on my flights to and from DC had no one get in line when they announced pre-boarding. The gate agent on the way back looked around and, almost in disbelief, announced it again and then when no one moved she started the next group to board.

Unfortunately there are people who take advantage of the pre-boarding as the airlines can not require any proof and when a passenger does line up for pre-board they can not question a passengers need for it.

In the late 90's we were on a charter flight to Jamaica and from what I remember boarding was similar to SWA in that you got a boarding card with a number but they boarded in groups of 10, ie. they would call out numbers 1-10, 11-20 etc. so even if you had number 1 you could be the 10th person boarding but they did a pre-boarding for those needing assistance. On the outbound flight the only pre-boarder was one middle aged woman in an airport supplied wheelchair and her group of about 5 others and they took the bulkhead seats. Well when it came time to exit the plane in Montego Bay she walked right off the plane, some flight attendants call those flights Miracle Flights, they needed help to get on but a miracle happened mid-air and they could walk on their own. She was at the same resort as us and we never saw her use a wheel chair all week while walking all around the resort, dancing on the dance floor, or even on her excursion to Dunn's River Falls where she climbed the falls with no issues. Guess what happened at the airport on the way back? Yep, you guessed it, she needed the wheel chair to get on the plane. Things came to a little bit of a head when back in Boston when she again walked off the aircraft but showed up at baggage claim with a wheelchair. Others already had their spots in front of the belt and she made an announce to those at the front of the belt that they needed to move for her because she was in a wheelchair. Needless to say that did not go over well as no one moved and she started to say it again. 2 people cut her off and said just because she was in a wheelchair she was not entitled to the front of the line and she could wait her turn. She started to complain and 2 others cut her off again this time calling her out for not needing a wheelchair all week and that if she continued to complain they would call the travel agency that bragged about working for all week to let them know what she was doing and it was not a good look for that agency to have an employee like her. She and her party quietly slinked away and went to the end of the belt.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

One thing people forget is that not all disabilities that require pre-boarding can be seen.

No one actually forgets this, they don't and the unseen part always makes its way into discussions despite the fact that we all really do know these things. Unseen needs will always exist.

There is also a different category that can be used depending on one's issue which is just additional time to board. For SWA that is between A and B but before Family Boarding.

My aunt is autistic and she wouldn't need pre-board, but she'd probably appreciate more time to get situated and the only way you'd know she was autistic is if you heard her talk, she's 71 though but has no need for a wheelchair. On the other hand an autistic member of my husband's family absolutely would need pre-boarding. My cousin's child who gets anxious but is not autistic would absolutely need pre-board.

I'm just saying that if there was a reduction in the abuse you wouldn't see as many looks as people get now.

 

[DebbieB]

I wonder if it’s related to this:

https://simpleflying.com/southwest-airlines-changes-family-boarding/

 

[londonderrydisneyfan]

I wonder if it’s related to this:

https://simpleflying.com/southwest-airlines-changes-family-boarding/

If Southwest allowed families with children under 6 to preboard before the A group I would most likely swith to another airline at that point. We typically use Southwest to fly to Orlando and Fort Lauderdale and those flights are always packed with small children. We would never be able to sit together if they adopted that policy.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I wonder if it’s related to this:

https://simpleflying.com/southwest-airlines-changes-family-boarding/

SWA is always piloting things, adjusting things. They did for some airports the "families board first but sit in the back", they've tested different types of music for the jetway to try and see if that impacts boarding time (it can when playing more upbeat or so their trial found out).

It's entirely possible they look to the Federal guidelines (and that's what they are) released however long it was now for the age 13..that's the only reason that age would even be in there. However, until SWA announces any sort of change to Family Boarding qualifications just treat it like it was them piloting potential things. That article is also 6 months old and we have not heard anything about changes to their Family Boarding. Several years back they adjusted to allow 2 adults instead of just 1, they do changes to their products as they see fit but they also test many other things that never make it further than that.

 

[DebbieB]

The Department of Transportation has been pushing airlines to make it easier for families to sit together. So I wouldn’t be surprised if changes are coming.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

The Department of Transportation has been pushing airlines to make it easier for families to sit together. So I wouldn’t be surprised if changes are coming.

That's what I was referring to, however the source you used doesn't really point to anything as it's discussing trialing (as SWA is often doing at various airports around the nation) increasing the age from 6 and under to 13 and under from 6 months ago. Reducing EBCI availability doesn't make it easier for families to sit together as there's still only 45 slots available period before Family Boarding. But reducing EBCI availability can provide a better customer experience for those who purchase it if Family Boarding is used heavily as it reduces the amount of people who can get EBCI.

 

[DebbieB]

That's what I was referring to, however the source you used doesn't really point to anything as it's discussing trialing (as SWA is often doing at various airports around the nation) increasing the age from 6 and under to 13 and under from 6 months ago. Reducing EBCI availability doesn't make it easier for families to sit together as there's still only 45 slots available period before Family Boarding. But reducing EBCI availability can provide a better customer experience for those who purchase it if Family Boarding is used heavily as it reduces the amount of people who can get EBCI.

Last time I bought EBCI, I was like B23. With family boarding and couples taking window and aisle, the first window seat was 2 rows from the back. So if they expand family boarding, EBCI could be a waste of money.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Last time I bought EBCI, I was like B23. With family boarding and couples taking window and aisle, the first window seat was 2 rows from the back. So if they expand family boarding, EBCI could be a waste of money.

Yeah def. agree with you there. I think they are seeing it however an issue now already with just the program as is but it's a combination of things. Like I said in my first comment on this thread I think the Fed guidelines/push for family boarding stuff in general is impacting it, I was responding to the difference in age from their test they did for your comment.

The last part of my first comment on this thread was mentioning how EBCI used to be which was much less utilized. Right now you have A-listers and Anytime Fare getting EBCI/Checked in at 36 hours. Add in how over time people have steadily been purchasing EBCI in much greater numbers. People have gotten extensions of A-list due to the pandemic, then promotions for increasing your points to get you to A-list faster or even just promotions granting A-list for a time.

IMO it's all basically like so many people have it or are getting it these days BUT because they do Family Boarding in between A and B this aspect of more people having it pushes you further and further back in Boarding positions and yes if you increase the age you further add to it...but it's already bad right now and I think SWA is seeing that with the gripes and complaints plus they can sell Upgraded Boarding fast now with it being available on the app.

Your B23 is actually very good according to the official SWA thread. A notation is because every flight is different with an open seating policy your purchase of EBCI doesn't equate to what the seating arrangement ends up being like on any given plane. Personally I've rarely seen couples separate themselves, I'm not saying it's not happening, I know it is, but I don't see it as if it's the norm behavior on flights. And no matter what there's only 1 seat that will be available in the row with a couple. EBCI may not even be the reason those couples are Boarding together. For instance my husband is A-list (and will maintain it now through 2024), SWA adjusted their A-list policy and now so long as I'm on the same reservation they give me a sequential boarding position. We would never take window/aisle personally speaking as I'm well used to middle seats when I travel with my husband but just to say that's adding one more person that several years ago wouldn't have been up there in Boarding positions.

So I'm not fully disagreeing with you and hopefully that comes across

 

[Wood Nymph]

I’ve never actually witnessed anyone asserting their right to any open seat yet but I can easily see an argument or worse happening.

We were seated in row 8 and the young couple in front of us was trying to save a seat for a friend. The plane was filling up when an older man made the young couple give him the saved seat. It was the first time we have ever seen that happen.